There is room for everybody on Couch 72

how awesome wiki . have you looked further into this as a career change

chopin i really am wondering how do you feel this is directed personally to you . i see it as just responding to the issue you brought up . you said the couch has changed .people have been expressing there experiences and why they have pulled away. there have been many who have jumped on MKAC . i don't see this comment at all personal to you . but you seem to have taken it on .as well as others and seem to need to defend yourself when it doesn't seem to be needed again. i don't understand ware it is coming from . if it matters maybe i can tell you how i see it . out of the blue you say you feel the couch and pc has changed ,you don't like how it has changed. people are not responding to you and it must be because of how they feel about you . then say it doesn't matter how people feel about you that you are secure in how you feel about yourself(that is great ) but i have not seen anyone say they thought this way about you .but are now responding to your thoughts about others that you have put out there . sorry you seem to be struggling .i get the feeling like everyone hates me thing .it is powerful for me. i try very hard to not try to read how people are feeling and ask right out these days . not throw blanket feelings on to everyone. it is nice to see you back and i am sorry you are feeling so bad about it

I'm not trying to get into the middle of other people's conversations. I'm also not trying to mind read or assume people are talking about me. So hopefully I can put this into words so I can learn from this because I know sometimes my social cues do not function well.

So I'm going to try to be brave here.... There have been times that I have posted on the couch when I have been profoundly sad and lonely and people have not responded to my posts... which only led to me feeling worse. I don't know if I ever called people out for not responding but I know I wished people would respond.

I'm think now that it would have been more productive during those times if I had told people on the couch that I was really sad and lonely.... or had started a thread to ask for support...

I don't know I guess I've been thinking to how I have acted in the past and I wondered.... have my behaviors on the couch been manipulative so as to get my needs met instead of telling people my needs and asking for support and risking that they would not be met?

Please respond if you are so inclined and no pressure if you have nothing to share.

Dude - topamax gave me "little gravitational challenges"! I was falling over or falling down just getting undressed. Im not sure a flying squirrel costume was covered in the roommate agreement (sorry im watching big bang theory)

omg i can read back to my posts about how everyone hates me and being so out of control . i could never promise that i wouldn't return to that painful place here or in my life. it is something i have struggled with big time as i am sure most of my peeps here have stuck with me through it . all this brings those times up for me. it has not been so long ago i had an episode of eating worms around my T and you guys were here for me to remind me that maybe it just isn't the way it really is but how i may be seeing it .i just want to thank you all here for that .i kind of depend on it when i am so convinced and promise to listen to in in the future when im going through it AGAIN

It's OK we are all here for you.

I've always been so impressed with your openness and honesty Granite. Not everyone is brave enough to say how they are feeling..

Ha!

I dont always know if youre asking or just telling.

RTS - I never know if I make things better or worse when I respond sometimes.
It would make it easier if I knew you were lonely when you post - then I would better know how to respond.

Wikid - Does green hide the goo better?

RtS - I hear you. Personally I fnd it easier when someone says "hey, I'm feeling kind of left out and lonely and I need to hear you all care". Then I don't feel like I'm being accused of ignoring someone on purpose or feel manipulated. I think when someone says something like " I know you're mad and you hate me Nd you're ignoring me on purpose...etc" it does feel manipulative and kind of feels accusatory. There is no possible way I can resond to ever post, nor can I respond to posts I don't understand, but I'll gladly post a hug or let you know I care if you ask.

Ok...wiki out. Good night all, and I mean ALL! Lol

Thanks guys. I've been posting on my phone lately so cant do that multi quote thing...but everyone's responses have been helpful...

Its good to hear how I am perceived by others... And I can learn from that... In some ways I think Hankster is correct that the couch is like group therapy... I am going to try to be more open about my feelings when I need support and try to be direct about it....

Btw Stopdog I appreciate your posts, replies and perspective...

I am sincerely and honestly begging for help.
I don't deserve help and I do not expect it.
I am asking a favor and I will be very grateful for any response I might receive.
I don't expect this post to change anything, but I hope it does.
I am deciding to be extremely honest and open about myself.
I am deciding to lay myself bare in an attempt to understand.
I am taking responsibility and will accept any consequences of doing so without violating others.
I am trying to think and write very logically and carefully, so I'm hitting the enter key every time I write a sentence.
I am not insulting anyone else's intelligence, I doing this for my benefit because I admit I'm feeling pretty stupid right now.
No one else has made me feel stupid, it originates from within me.
I am bolding things I am trying to understand or explain very emphatically.

To Wiki:
I don't believe I said that anyone else made me feel like I should hide, cower, or feel unworthy.
I might be wrong.
This is how I reacted in the past based on my own issues and fears.
I don't understand why you think I'm bullying MKAC.
I have absolutely nothing against MKAC.
MKAC has barely been here since I've returned and I stated that fact.
I have no doubts that MKAC is an intelligent, caring person.
I wouldn't blame MKAC for avoiding me, based on past issues, although I do not understand it.
I did take your post discussing that you back off when you perceive people are demanding attention personally.
I became defensive and reacted inappropriately.
For that, I apologize.

To MKAC:
Do you feel like I am bullying you?
I felt terrible about how I treated you when we had our falling out.
I apologized at the time and moved on.
You were not in my mind when I wrote my "f**k everyone" post last night.
I did take your post discussing that you back off when you perceive people are demanding attention personally.
I took it personally because I assumed you returned based only on what I said.
I assumed that because of my past actions and the thought hurt because I don't like the person I was when that happened.
I take personal responsibility for my own hurt.
I became defensive and reacted inappropriately.
For that, I apologize.

To Granite:
Yes, I took Wiki and MKAC's posts personally.
I assumed they were directed at me because they seemed to be directly related to what I said.
I became defensive and reacted inappropriately.
I know my post last night was wrong and inappropriate.
I apologized for that.
You said, "out of the blue you say you feel the couch and pc has changed ,you don't like how it has changed"
My statement appears out of the blue because it is the first time I've mentioned it.
That doesn't mean it hasn't been bothering me.
It's been bothering me since December.
I chose not to say anything until yesterday.
You said, "people are not responding to you and it must be because of how they feel about you . then say it doesn't matter how people feel about you that you are secure in how you feel about yourself(that is great ) but i have not seen anyone say they thought this way about you"
I am secure in how I feel about myself now 99% of the time.
1% of the time, I fail and think everybody hates me.
You are right; no one has said they hate me.
I should have just asked for feedback instead of writing my "f**k everyone" post last night.

To RTS:
You asked in your post if you were being manipulative because you haven't asked for what you needed from the couch.
Was this based on any of my posts?
Do you perceive me as being manipulative?
I have used manipulation in the past.
I am no longer intentionally manipulative, but people sometimes accuse me of it.
I am not aware I'm doing it.
T has said it is because in childhood I had to manipulate others to get any attention.
I want to stop doing it.

To everyone else:
I believe I have done nothing but disrupt the couch.
I take personal responsibility for that and I am sorry.
I believe I have only further alienated people from me.
That thought generates fear within me.
I want to run away so that I am no longer a problem to others.
Am I now a pariah?

A couple of people have asked me what is going on with me.
I am dealing with the issues in my marriage.
I am very afraid of my marriage ending.
I am very afraid of being alone.
I don't want to accept that I might end up alone.
My cognitive distortion is that I deserve to be alone because I am a horrible person.
My cognitive distortion is that I am a horrible person because I treated people very badly in the past.
I acted on those distortions because they were triggered yesterday in my therapy session.
That is not an excuse and I take personal responsibility for my actions.
I take personal responsibility for the hurt I caused others through my actions based on my cognitive distortions.
I apologize for the disruption and hurt.
I accept any consequences for my actions.
I want people to respond to this post, but I do not expect it.

Chopin - I am sorry to hear you and your husband are having difficulties.

I don't think anyone is a pariah. I think some clashes might be better hashed out in pms, some better walked away from (meaning the clash - not the forum or the thread), and some are inevitable. I don't think the clashes are usually a big deal, but rather how people manage to get through them is a better focus.

There are some tactics I do not respond to well, so I try (and sometimes fail) to do something else for awhile before coming back and going on to a different place. I tend to not respond to what I consider manipulative posts for reassurance. I do not mind clear requests for reassurance or support. I suspect we do not all find the same things manipulative - which is a good thing.

Chopin - good post. We ALL (i dont mean that in southern!) have come such a long way in these few years.

Finaly got to see Robocop tonight, pretty good film, I am planning on seeing Son of God tomorrow night (early 10 PM screening) and Non-Stop on Friday.

Chopin,

Manipulating people to get needs met has been topic of conversation on the couch, in threads and PMs many times over the years I've been on PC. I have yet to figure it for myself let alone be able to tell someone else they are being that way.

If anything in your posts led to this topic it would be your "disappointment" that your posts were not responded to .... That is a feeling that I have shared in the past.

Everyone has reasons for coming on to PC...originally for me it was because I had no one to talk to about therapy in my RL...but when I finally became brave enough to post on the couch it was because I was lacking female companionship in my RL and I havent figured out how to do the whole female friends thing...so I could sort of learn by watching and jump in when I felt comfortable....and then when I went through my low times I needed emotional support and understanding from people who had been there...

If you me and everyone else could be honest with ourselves and each other about what we need from each other... And risk not getting it and accepting peoples limitations.... We would have an easier time in life....but we arent all there yet... Especially me....

Thanks for your feedback SD. I appreciate your feedback, which was done respectfully (which you usually do). While I truly wasn't trying to attack anyone, I could have approached the individuals in question privately. I did not. That was an error.

Not everyone is going to get along. I know that as well as anyone else. I truly have nothing against anyone here on the couch. I can understand anyone not reacting well to manipulation...intentional or not, perceived or real.

Thanks again.

Yes we have. And I mean that in southern.

Your post really resonates with me, RTS, and I also appreciate your very honest and personal feedback. I also arrived here originally seeking support. I didn't understand what was happening in therapy and wanted to learn more from those who were further along than me in my therapy journey.

I do "okay" with female friendships, but prefer to be in the company of males because most are more straightforward. Maybe we should take a cue from that and be more straightforward in asking others for help. I know it is very hard for me sometimes. I still fight that "OMG I'm vulnerable" feeling a lot. I am afraid of rejection and being alone.

One of the biggest lessons I've learned in therapy is what I am about to say and if everyone wants to know a "big secret" of therapy, here goes. Most of us go into therapy wanting to be cured or healed. We assume that's the endpoint...we desperately want it to be the endpoint...but that expectation is unrealistic. The horrible beliefs about ourselves never completely go away. Things that were imprinted on us as far back as infancy will always be there. There's no magic pill. We have to choose to fight them every single day. I have to wake up and decide to fight my cognitive distortions and feelings. Sometimes I fail. I've certainly failed over the past couple of days. Sometimes we need help from others to stay on track but we have to have courage to ask because we risk rejection and judgment. No one likes to be rejected or judged, but we have to learn to take that risk. It is not easy.

Thanks again for your respectful feedback. Don't be so hard on yourself. Most of us are in the same boat.

((Chopin))

I am sorry to you are having such a rough time. I hope tomorrow will be better.

Thanks (((((CE))))). You are very kind and supportive.

Tomorrow will be better...it is finally tomorrow where I live after all! I bounce back much more quickly than I used to. A lot of that has to do with choice. I made a mistake. I apologized and attempted to make amends with everyone here. There is nothing more I can do. I cannot affect or control anyone else's beliefs, thoughts, or words (and that is not directed at anyone...it is a statement of fact). Now, I choose not to flagellate myself or worry what others think...I just move on. I appreciate the feedback given to me so far and I will appreciate whatever anyone else has to say, if anything. Now I'm going to bed.

Thanks again for your support.

Hugs, Chopin-- Sorry if I'm confused.I'm sorry if you are hurting too. And everyone else hurting as well.

Lots of posters refer to fallings out, miscommunications, head butting of various sorts.

But I go and read 10 pgs back and I just don't see it. No one seems mean. No one is saying anything aggressive. I'm like "huh? what happened." Everyone seems apologetic but for what it beats me.

I like the couch, and I miss LC and others, but when I post I feel disruptive to the flow of conversation. But I do care, I just try to say something useful or not at all these days.

Hugs to all!

Thank you to those who rode in my pocket this morning. I think my T just had a bit of an off day on Tuesday. I told him how I've felt since then, and he was completely supportive and explained what he meant, and admitted that he probably had expressed himself badly. T doesn't do abject apologies (and I wouldn't like it if he did!), but he certainly takes responsibility for his mistakes. In a way I think he appreciated me letting him know by txt how I was feeling yesterday.

One main issue here is that whenever the subject of my marriage comes up, I become defensive, full of shame, and fearful, and I think it's hard for T to know how to get past that. He has to push pretty hard to get past my defenses, and I don't have a problem with that as such... but sometimes he does it too roughly, and I am no good at telling him (or anybody else) when a conversation makes me feel miserable.

Completely different topic: does anybody have a suggestion for a title for me?

chopin I have a big morning today but will respond to your post a bit later but I did read it

same to you mast yay for T being a bit more on target today

I don't always post on the couch but when I do it is read.

POST AWAY MY FRIEND