Yesterday's Sesh

I've mentioned my co-workers frequently before. I love them to pieces. But I recently got a new job and had to leave them all behind. My last day was Thursday. First day at new job was Monday.

On our last day working together, co-worker guy (super close friend) said his goodbyes by propositioning me about six different ways. When I declined sex in the back of my car (cuz I'm not 16), he just held me and kept murmuring, "I love you... I love you... I love you..." over and over.

The more I thought about it, the more I kept obsessively thinking about it. It was all I could do to not text him to hook up. So I'm using every bit of MY self control to stay away when HE starts texting me over the holiday weekend. I just told him he had to stop because I was trying so hard.

So I tell T because I need her to tell me, "Hey great job not ****ing your friend!"

But her response is, "Whatever you do, do it with intent."

HUH? So it's fine to go have sex with my MARRIED ex-co-worker? (Also his wife is 7 months pregnant. Just sayin'.) Maybe she's saying take responsibility for my actions? Probably that, huh?

She wants to talk about CSA. She wants to talk about my uh... marriage issues.

Meanwhile, I just started this new job. I can't stop thinking about co-worker guy.

All my new co-workers are so nice and happy and NORMAL. I'm terrified they're going to find out I'm not like them. One too many self-deprecating jokes. One too many snarky comments. I need to be sunshine and bluebirds and I don't think I can keep it up. God I'm trying so hard.

T asked when I wanted to come back and I said I don't know. She said how about a week and a half, "that way you have time to cancel and run away."

I'm freakin' dyin' over here... I just want to be normal.

Yes, I think she's saying "don't do something without thinking carefully through the ramifications". This dude is clearly in the wrong and so I will say "Good job for not taking him up on his offer! Good job for keeping strong and doing what you know is right!"

My t won't overtly say don't have an affair! He just always says., every behavior has a consequence!

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I don't think they are supposed to make moral judgments for you. Or at least I would be greatly offended if the therapist congratulated me on any decision I made. Or if she showed disdain or disapproval. Not her position to do so in my opinion.

Yeah a t is not usually going to overtly give an opinion on your actions, since it isn't really their job to place judgement. They are there to guide you through changes that you've expressed the desire to make. So if you are happy for yourself, then might say they are glad for you. But otherwise every decision should be yours so a lot of Ts hold off on letting their opinions be known.

That is why I try not to think too hard about the "set up" that the T relationship is.. I mean really, most people if they aren't saying it, are indeed screaming in their head.. Don't do it!!! But, the nature of the T/client relationship is, the t just shuts the hell up and watch their client probably make a big mistake. That just really bothers me for some reason!

Exactly! I told my t i need him not to be so freakin objective! I already have family that prods me along the wrong path. I need a human.

But back to the OP - hey, even i have looked good to coworkers with excessively pregnant wives. Stay away!!

I can understand the "do what you do with intent" sentiment.

I can think of many situations in my life where I just "went with it" and in retrospect I think I did those things because it was easier than making a conscious decision. If things "just happen", it lets one off the hook in terms of accountability.

Doing things without intent usually end up in regrets.

This is so true! And I also think that statements like these are objective ways of expressing a judgement in a sense. Or that's how I always read into statements like these. Whenever people, whether a T of a friend, holds off on giving outright express a direct opinion, I can pretty much figure out what their opinion is. I think many people know that we only truly learn from our own experiences and not from what other people tell us to do. It drives me crazy too though, since I tend to need a lot of reassurance before making a decision!

My T said if I shagged another guy, it would create a few complications. Ha ha. He's all about ethics and values.

My T usually focuses on how it will affect me if I make a do something despite knowing it is the wrong thing to do. She usually says something along the lines of "I am worried you will get hurt", "I am concerned about how this will affect your well-being", or reminds me I have a tendency to self-sabotage and asks if this is what I am doing.

I know it's tough, but try to be yourself. Maybe they have issues to and are also feeling as if they have to put on an act. You never know, right?

To me it sounds like your T was saying to be mindful of your intentions going into this, if it is something you decide to do. What will the outcome be? How will everything change if this happens? Is it all worth it? etc.

Thank you.

LOL! But yes, stop being so objective, T! Jeez.

Yep, yep, I totally go with the flow when it comes to this stuff. Totally get it.

My boss came in late this morning, so I was sitting alone for a few hours. In that time, my mind was swimming. At my old job, I had all these dudes I was all wrapped up in. I was in love with one guy. Propositioning co-worker was more of a friend, but we also had that blurry "will they/won't they" thing going too. Plus there was a third dude I was emotionally invested in.

The guy I was in love with mostly consumed my mind all the time. He was so wishy washy. And an alcoholic. So if I wasn't concerning myself with whether or not he loved me back, I was busy worrying if he would get home safe that night.

All these dudes are GONE. Gone from my life. Except Propositioning Dude. He calls and texts every day.

So I was sitting there alone. Without my dudes, and I swear, I started going over all the new dudes at the new job and who I should engage with first, and who I thought might reciprocate and how far I was going to take things and and and and and.... I. HAVE. TO. STOP.

I don't know what it is. If I have to be busy constantly in my mind. If I have to be emotionally wrapped up in multiple guys. If I just need constant attention/flirting. I DON'T KNOW.

But I made myself STOP. Think about it. What is wrong with me?! I'm THISCLOSE to sabotaging my brand new job. **** **** ****.

So I'm googling stuff about needing attention or something, trying to figure it out. I'm pretty sure this is a Daddy Issues thing. Like no matter how much attention, IT IS NEVER ENOUGH. If I don't have 3+ dudes I'm wrapped up in, it isn't enough.

So I centered myself. Chilled out. Was crying a little when boss came in. I'm so tired now, I'm not sure if I'm expressing this accurately.

So I pushed them all out of my mind. Went skateboarding at lunch time. Felt better. A bunch of dudes were even talking to me about my skateboard and I was like whatever. I'm boarding. Not interested. Zero flirting. Ok, maybe a little. But almost zero.

Then on the way home, Propositioning Guy is texting me again and I almost told him IT IS ON, let's do this!!!! But I resisted. But I was cryptic, so I think he may try to get it out of me tomorrow.

I don't have another sesh until next Weds. Ugh. I'm about 90% sure I'm meeting up with Propositioning Guy tomorrow or Friday. I have to go back to my old office (maybe) to pick up some stuff I forgot. He'll be there. We'll see.

I keep thinking, well if it's just the ONE guy, it's ok. But it ISN'T. But I don't want to cut him off entirely, and really... he's mostly interesting as a **** buddy. So I don't know what I want. I just know I'm tired and I don't know what I should do.

You know what you should do. But it's hard. He's married, his wife is pregnant. You know what you should do. Try to focus on those details.

It makes me sick to think of it. He has a pregnant wife. I think you should stay the f*%# away from him. Not out of moral duty, but because it will make you feel bad about yourself.

Explore why you are thinking about engaging. What is tempting about this? Keep writing here!!! Keep posting!!

Has this happened to you before with bosses or other authority figures? Many of my former bosses fell in love with me. Most jobs consisted of or ended with a confession that they were in love with me and/or wanted to date me or sleep with me; usually they were married. I never had an affair with any of them although I've flirted and/or bordered on it in different ways.

I never told either of my therapists about it yet and never figured it out, but I think it was transference and related to an oedipal complex. You'll probably laugh....but really. If it's a pattern, I think it takes 2, but one of the 2 is the dominant motivator. You're young, so maybe you haven't had a chance to experience this to it's fullest extent yet?

PLEASE don't go there!

But here's the thing, I don't think I will feel bad at all. Not at all. It might be disappointing, but I don't think I'll feel bad. I rarely feel bad about this stuff. Maybe I'm a horrible person. Fine.

Dominant motivator you think? See, with my guys there isn't really a dominant motivator. I pick guys (typically) who are my contemporary. (Or they pick me.) And neither of us are really ever motivated to make a move. It's a lot of talk. I think with me leaving, the talk ramped up because he was afraid of losing me. T thinks because I was leaving, he was motivated to share his true feelings. I dunno. Shrug.

I think he operates on a fear basis and just didn't want to lose me. Wanted to keep me close. And what's closer than sex, right?

The people I "collect" as friends and lovers are typically broken. Prop. Guy and I are broken in the same ways. (CSA) So lots of relating on that level. Alcoholic co-worker.... also broken. My two best girlfriends... broken. I tend to collect "lost boys".

Maybe this isn't the right way to handle it... but why couldn't I talk to him about it? Just lay it out. "Hey, I want to jump you... but what's up with that? And why are you trying to **** me? And while we're on the topic, why haven't you ever even tried to kiss me? What is that about? Who goes right to hot and steamy sex anyway???"

PS I'm not that young. I just type in a "String of Consciousness" way. It's the way I speak and I don't bother to edit myself in text.

I think it has to do with availability and risking it. You know he's married, which means he's unavailable. Most of the guys you've mentioned who are broken have been emotionally unavailable.

It's a safety thing, and a familiarity. You would settle for familiar and predictable over unfamiliar and unpredictable because even if it hurts you, you expect it to. It's confusing and scary when you don't know what to expect.

If you don't think it would harm yourself, then think of his wife. Put yourself in her place. She might be really hurt. The only reason I mentioned before to think of yourself is because I overcompensate for having had a mom that would guilt me almost to death..uggg so I end up trying to not make other people guilty (overcompensating because it's perhaps not necessary)..ughh

But you still might feel bad about it later. What if he totally ignores you after it happens and his wife has the baby?

I think what HazelGirl wrote is an important concept. I thought people get offended when I brought this up here before, so I quit mentioning it. But if you are open to it Korian-this is some good stuff.

The story of my life is being chased by unavailable men. Hazel, how is it different when the unavailable person does the pursuing vs. pursuing unavailable men? Do you think someone like Korian or I might do it unconsciously ?

I know you directed this piece at Hazel, so I hope you don't mind if I offer my 2 cents for what it's worth. I've been separated and dated some guys while separated, and while I didn't find the man of my dreams (and ultimately am back with my hubby), I had some really cool conversations. My pdoc is also divorced and on the scene and I've learned from him too.

Basically if a man is not having sex on a regular basis at home, and he meets you and you are attractive, bright, flirtatious and available...they are going to be interested. If they get the impression that you might be interested too, then they'll may even pursue you and if you reciprocate they will get into an affair. I've learned that most of the time people don't go out looking to cheat, it's simply a matter of opportunity.

While I was single I went on dates with about 7 different guys and 5 out of the 7 cheated. The others were cheated on by their wives. None admitted to cheating on a pregnant wife, but in my case, they never would have admitted that until later

What I learned is that most of these unavailable men are missing something at home, usually affection and/ or any sex at all. A guy with a pregnant wife might be terrified of this new phase. Either they don't feel ready, or don't really want it. They are looking to experience the way things were before there was a baby on the way. And if the marriage was on shaky ground beforehand, it's even worse...a pregnancy puts much more stress on an already troubled marriage. I don't know this man's situation, but if he's this interested in you, I would not doubt that his home life is not good.

If you are pursuing unavailable men, then I'd say you are avoiding real intimacy. You know it won't go far, since most men don't ultimately leave their wives. The men I dated were kicked out after getting caught. Or tried to go back after leaving for a brief time. So in the back of your mind it might be a safety thing, a way to feel attractive but to not have to commit yourself fully to sharing yourself as a human and getting deeply intimate. This way you can keep the real interactions on the surface, and anything else as a fantasy. I might be way off but that is how I'd see it.

I don't know for sure. Maybe? Or maybe they're messed up and recognize you as another messed up person? It's familiar to them to chase someone they know they can't have as well? Those are my guesses.

Yeah. My dad was basically unavailable for most of my life. It freaks me out that my husband is such a good, loving, doting person. Basically, I don't accept it. These other dudes who kinda come and go feel more "right". When they're around I'm super engaged, doting on them, basking in their attention. When they go, I can't stop thinking about them.

The wife: Yeah, he's painted her as such a *****, I really have no compassion for her. Obviously, this is his doing and the truth is somewhere between ***** and angel (I'm pretty sure), but all he shares is her *****iness. He and I actually used to argue about it constantly because I thought he should get a divorce. Then one day, I realized I think he LIKES it. He likes someone telling him what to do and treating him like crap. I don't know why, but he likes it. So I don't even weigh in when he complains, just tell him, "You know how I feel about it." End of discussion.

I think I'm pretty fine with this guy ignoring me (after the baby comes). I'm pretty much comfortable with him coming and going from my life. I was in love with him years ago, but not anymore. Now he's like... a friend I want to have sex with. It's just comfortable, familiar. I don't even get jealous of the wife. It's like an understanding or something. He's mine during the day. He's hers at night. Something like that.

I'm pretty sure we do unconsciously persue the unavailable. It's safer that way. No real commitment. Easier to run away if the intimacy gets to be too much.

Yeah, I don't want them to leave their wives. I have a husband.

Guy friend and his wife have a two year old and planned this baby. There was some possible birth defect stress early on, but they feel pretty safe now that the baby is fine.

I think this was mostly predicated by my leaving. T thinks that pushed him to speak his true feelings. I think maybe he was just trying to hang onto me. Maybe it's a little of both.

Actually, he has been married for about 3 years, but lied to me about it for 2 years. A co-worker kept telling me he was lying but she couldn't prove it. I didn't care. Makes no difference to me. Co-worker thought he didn't want me to know he was married because he thought it would close the door between him and me. I dunno... maybe. But it didn't. He should have known I don't care about that. Shrug.


Yep, I think we broken types spot each other a mile away.

Also...

I objectively pushed down my impulses the other day regarding my new co-workers. I just decided I wasn't going to persue any of these shenanigans at my new place of work. Fine. Done.

Today we had this long *** meeting. Mind started wandering. Co-worker next to me is super goofy and silly. (I love this.) He's reasonably attractive. (Does not matter. No shenanigans!) He chews. (Disgusting.) But at one point, I was bored. He opens his chew can (Gross), but it smells amazing! Like really really minty. Like if you were in a mint factory and turned up the smello-vision. So minty. So good.

Then he made a joke that was so effin funny I died laughing. He totally has my identical sense of humor. Love him.

In the second that I put the yummy mint together with the hilarious joke, I started imagining touching him. It was a reflex. I didn't try to do it. In my mind I was caressing his head and neck. He was sketching on a pad of paper and I wanted to reach over and touch him, get him to draw on my arms.

Ack ack ack!!!! This is not a conscious choice I'm making. It's all just there. Viscerally.

That's how Propositioning Guy is. Visceral. It's not like I try to feel how I feel. I just jumps out and I have to stifle the impulses.

Whoa, you're married and considering cheating on your husband as well? No. No, don't do that to him. You don't need to.

I realize I have to be better than this and have to stop. At this point, it is totally an addiction. I'm certain. But until I decide I want to be different, it won't stop.

I talked to him about it today and told him the truth. That there were all these new dudes I was trying to NOT be hot for. I told him I wanted to avoid getting involved with them. But I didn't want to stop with him. But that T probably wouldn't find that to be a very solid plan. I asked him what I should do. What were we. How should I file him? What box does he fit into???

He said, "Probably the off limits box, I think..."

But then I brought up all of our boundary crossing and things. He didn't have an answer. Just agreed we do cross boundaries.

Then I decided to stalk his wife a little on facebook. She's adorable of course. Their daughter is beautiful. It hurts my heart a little that they aren't enough for him, or he wouldn't be messing with me. He really needs therapy as much as I do.

I think it's really good that you talked to him like that. Could you talk to your husband, too, and be honest with him about what has been going on? It sometimes helps obsessions to lose their power once you start talking about them.

I can't talk to my husband, no. It would just upset him and make him feel like there was something wrong with him. He really doesn't understand what goes on with me, but for some reason he seems to love me unconditionally, even when I hurt him. I totally don't get it and I totally don't deserve it.

But I need to fix this by myself. So I am.

Yesterday, we were out at dinner and this dude was full on staring at me. Old Koro would have made eye contact and given him a few "come hither" looks. I just let my eyes skim over him and went back to talking to my friends.

A few minutes ago, my friend hit me up on Facebook and started trying to flirt. This is the friend that asked me to run away with him about a year ago. I was kind, but didn't encourage him. I think I handled it ok... once it was clear I wasn't "engaging" in the same way I used to, he kinda moved on. We'll see how that goes in the future...