[Partless]

I had a bad dream today so it made me think back to one of my therapists. In the dream I was arguing with T. I remember now that when I first started to see her, I was feeling extremely invalidated in life. I had tried to fit in with people, and I had tried it over and over again and I was sick of it all. I had felt I did not fit with my family, with my school, at work, I was always wrong, too shy, introverted, then we had moved and did not fit in within the culture, I had no friends in school, all these thoughts of not fitting in and me then trying to fake it and try to force myself to like things I did not like so I could fit in but a strong anger remaining behind it because it would be a reminder of me not belonging anywhere by nature, being wrong to my core.

So when I had met with this therapist, it all poured out, and transference was in play. I think what happened was that this therapist at first was fairly accepting and validating but I reached her limit way sooner than expected. She became vengeful in some ways and after a couple of months of validating me and me invalidating her (I did not like therapy, I did not like her, I told her she did not understand me and did not care about me and was just going by the book, not willing to make herself vulnerable enough to get closer to my world), she started to actively invalidate me, like criticize some stuff about what I believed or liked.

This shook me up. It also brought up tremendous anger. I started cancelling appointments quite frequently but several months later, with some improvements with my life at home at the time (early 20s) and with the return of a wonderful summer, I felt better and stuck it out and changed my way and started saying good things about her even though I did not really mean it and somehow we went back to "normal" cause it seemed she felt appreciated again. And I eventually came to like her more and accept her for who was a little more and more.

I saw her for several years and once I accepted her limitations (that she could not give me unconditional positive regard), things worked okay. But I was never able to forgive her for how she treated me those months and for not being able to be more patient and understanding with me. I had thought if you pay someone to give you regard, they won't need you to validate them too but apparently everybody has a limit and some people's limits you reach much sooner. It was like my mom all over again, but in her case it was not money but blood ties which did not seem to work either.

I still don't understand how that T did part of her training dealing with severe drug addicts. I highly doubt they were more understanding or validating towards her than I was. Or perhaps they were, perhaps they were so miserable that anything she said or did they appreciated. Maybe I was a spoiled child from her perspective, maybe I triggered something in her, maybe she thought my problems were not big enough, like she just saved a heroin addict from suicide, I was a spoiled kid with anxiety and depression saying to her you don't understand. She probably thought, I understand really well you ****ing unthankful idiot!

But none of that mattered. The one thing I learned from that experience is that I can't really trust anybody. She had told me in the beginning that I can say anything I want to her, nothing is off limits, and this is a safe place, only that I can't swear at her or hit her or break things, and I did none of those. Instead I disagreed with her method, did not like her, and resisted her suggestions. But after that experience, when I went for other therapy, whenever they said I can be myself and say whatever's on my mind, I did not trust them because I did not want to become so invalidated again. Anything but that! I would say a few things, then watch T's reaction. I did not want to experience the kind of rupture I experienced with previous T. I had even brought it up with her later but she just shook her head as if what I said made no sense, like she had no memory of it, or like it was only in my imagination that she had invalidated me.

[sideblinded]

Well, I also go to a T and he has invalidated me more times than I can remember. I don't think all T's understand that what most people want is to be validated. No one is going to validate my feelings if I want to harm someone of course. A lot of the things that I need validation for are pretty innocent. I got pretty irked at my T a bunch of times. Then I found myself trying to validate him as you were doing. This is not right on my part. I am not in therapy to validate my T. I am there to learn trust. If I don't trust my T how am I going to learn to trust others?

I see your point here. I am learning that my life has made me pretty strong willed and it has been for a purpose but I am now realizing that I need to accept the things that I cannot change and try my best to take in that what makes sense to me. I am still going to put myself out there and say what I need to say and if it gets a response I do not like, I will weigh it and continue to learn how to trust until my last breath. I have decided that I don't need a perfect T or one who is going to agree with me. I need to extract what help he can give me so I can grow.

I feel like I am selling myself a little short but I do not think I am going to find a mental health professional who can really care to the extent that would be optimal so I am settling for learning what I can.

I am sorry if I couldn't be of much help. Thank you for making me think about my own experience with my T.

I have forgiven my T, yes. It doesn't mean that I like his behavior, but yes.

I haven't forgiven the last one. In fact, now that I have what appears to be a good therapist, I'm kind of even more angry about it and glad that therapist moved away. It felt like she was in competition with me or something. Like, if I shared something painful, she would shrug and share something similar about her own life--or something she thought was similar but never was. It was just a way for her to talk about herself under the guise of helping me, while at the same time invalidating me for having strong feelings about something she has been able to put aside for herself. I didn't really see how blatant this was until after she moved away and I could evaluate why I felt so s***ty.

I'm not sure about forgiveness, but for me just accepting that therapists lie about lots of things and it's best to not put much trust in them has helped me tremendously. I lowered my expectations down to pretty much nothing and now I know I won't get hurt again.

[Partless]

Originally Posted by sideblinded

I am sorry if I couldn't be of much help. Thank you for making me think about my own experience with my T.

Oh you've been tremendously helpful. By sharing your own experiences you have validated my experiences. Not only that, you're even thanking me for making you think about your experiences. This kind of consideration only goes to show me how considerate you must have been with your T and how hurt you must have been when you did not feel that validation back from your T. Validation is important for all people but for some people and in some stages in life, it's exceptionally important. And I feel you understand that.

[Partless]

Originally Posted by puzzle_bug1987

I lowered my expectations down to pretty much nothing and now I know I won't get hurt again.

That's pretty much what I decided to do, it hurt that I had to do it but I felt it's protective not to make myself vulnerable.

Originally Posted by licketysplit

Like, if I shared something painful, she would shrug and share something similar about her own life--or something she thought was similar but never was. It was just a way for her to talk about herself under the guise of helping me, while at the same time invalidating me for having strong feelings about something she has been able to put aside for herself. I didn't really see how blatant this was until after she moved away and I could evaluate why I felt so s***ty.

Isn't that awful though? It can seem to be an attempt at validation but pretty soon you start to feel invalidated because you realize what's really happening here. I think validation requires both knowledge and technique that are simple enough but also a real willingness to allow yourself vulnerability to get closer to the patient's emotional world. That's what makes being a therapist so easy and being a great therapist so difficult.

[Gavinandnikki]

Gaslighting.

[divine1966]

I had a t years ago who invalidated me (whAtvever i shared she said it wasn't s big deal) and then she said I don't need therapy as I am perfectly fine. That was years ago, I was never perfectly fine and issues I had were a big deal. My current t doesn't say this nonsense

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Originally Posted by puzzle_bug1987

I'm not sure about forgiveness, but for me just accepting that therapists lie about lots of things and it's best to not put much trust in them has helped me tremendously. I lowered my expectations down to pretty much nothing and now I know I won't get hurt again.

That's a pretty sad commentary on T's. If all they do is lie and we can't trust them, why bother to see them at all? Maybe some of us are better off without.

I don't necessarily think they all lie, but I would never fully put my trust in one again. The trauma I got from trusting one has caused major damage to me. When you've lived with severe trauma most of your life and you find a therapist and pour your heart out to them and believe they are trustworthy and will help you, but they betray you and lie and damage you it makes it hard to trust anyone. I will never put myself in the vulnerable position of trusting like that again. Never. And therapy isn't successful until there is a good termination.

I also think termination should be discussed from the start and there should be very clear guidelines about how it will happen. And I do think some are better off not seeing a therapist because of the severe trauma it can cause.

[Lauliza]

Originally Posted by Simmering

That's a pretty sad commentary on T's. If all they do is lie and we can't trust them, why bother to see them at all? Maybe some of us are better off without.

I agree. If this is how one feels I don't really understand the point of bothering with even thinking about therapy. Most people don't stick with it for much time at all, so clearly it isn't for everybody. Sometimes there are other options that are just a better fit.

I think the title should be "how can I forgive a person who invalidated me".
A skilled T wouldn't. It goes against their code of effects. Plus they help you with your issues that often times comes out as an attack on a T.
A T doesn't have a certain limit of humanity. They are humanity.
Find a skilled therapist

Originally Posted by Lauliza

I agree. If this is how one feels I don't really understand the point of bothering with even thinking about therapy. Most people don't stick with it for much time at all, so clearly it isn't for everybody. Sometimes there are other options that are just a better fit.

There are many reasons to see a therapist and many of them don't involve trusting and attachment. I think you can see one and stay away from being too deeply involved in the attachment. And it can be helpful. People should just know that sometimes you do end up worse when you allow yourself to be in a dysfunctional relationship with a therapist.

Originally Posted by _Mouse

I think the title should be "how can I forgive a person who invalidated me".
A skilled T wouldn't. It goes against their code of effects. Plus they help you with your issues that often times comes out as an attack on a T.
A T doesn't have a certain limit of humanity. They are humanity.
Find a skilled therapist

It's very different when a therapist invalidates someone vs a non-therapist. There are other layers of betrayal and violation. I have a great therapist now, but have had many more who were incompetent and harmful.

Sometimes, I get the sense that when someone is hurt by a therapist and shares it here, they're reminded that not all therapists are like that. To me, that's no different than a rape or abuse victim being told not all men are like that, or not all parents. No, they are not all like that, but that's not the point. The point is someone who is hurt needs support, just like anyone on here who gets validation when it's a family member or non-therapist who's done the harm.