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  #26  
Old May 02, 2016, 03:13 PM
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Cinnamon_Stick Cinnamon_Stick is offline
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I can really relate to this. I am very painfully attached to my therapist and I have less than two weeks with her before she closes her practice. I was so afraid of termination with her that I brought it up all the time and was always so worried about it (more so her changing jobs or moving, not just dumping me off to someone else) and now its happening and its destroying me. This pain I feel from loosing her I would not wish on anyone. Therapy and the relationship is very confusing and sometimes I am not sure if its all worth it. You get so attached and spill your guts to someone and then (sometimes) you get transference and you love them so much and they are all you think about and then one day you walk into there office and they say they are changing jobs and closing there practice and thats it. Its over. Its very cruel and messed up and I still don't understand a lot about therapy. Its supposed to help you to get better and feel better. Not to get worse and feel worse.
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  #27  
Old May 02, 2016, 03:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Cinnamon_Stick View Post
I can really relate to this. I am very painfully attached to my therapist and I have less than two weeks with her before she closes her practice. I was so afraid of termination with her that I brought it up all the time and was always so worried about it (more so her changing jobs or moving, not just dumping me off to someone else) and now its happening and its destroying me. This pain I feel from loosing her I would not wish on anyone. Therapy and the relationship is very confusing and sometimes I am not sure if its all worth it. You get so attached and spill your guts to someone and then (sometimes) you get transference and you love them so much and they are all you think about and then one day you walk into there office and they say they are changing jobs and closing there practice and thats it. Its over. Its very cruel and messed up and I still don't understand a lot about therapy. Its supposed to help you to get better and feel better. Not to get worse and feel worse.
I'm so sorry. Reading this hurts me so badly. I know how horribly painful this is. I wish I could make it go away for you.
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  #28  
Old May 02, 2016, 05:43 PM
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I just wanted to say that even though I doubt the relationship and at times I wish I had never started therapy, I know that I cant go back to who I was before because that would hurt more. I really believe that this relationship and all of our relationships with our ts are trying to teach us something. I am learning that there are good people in the world but there are also some very bad people and I am learning to trust myself in getting to know these people and to trust my instincts around them.
Today my sadness has been unbearable and when I think of t it gets worse because I am grieving the loss of never having someone reliable and as caring as my t in my life and that hurts. Endings and loss hurt and in some way therapy is like life once we are born and enter therapy we start to die and to begin the process of eventual termination.
who says therapy is supposed to help us feel better? Is that the point of it, or is it to make us suffer and grieve all of our losses and to come out stronger, I am not even sure anymore. The uncertainty hurts.
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  #29  
Old May 02, 2016, 05:51 PM
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[QUOTE=1stepatatime;5045336]
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Originally Posted by monalisasmile View Post
I sometimes wonder why it has to be so painful to be attached to a therapist. I have no plans to stop seeing my t but I know the day will eventually come when we will terminate. Sometimes I think that this relationship has stopped me developing more intimate relationships but then I look back and see how much the relationships I do have have flourished because of my relationship with t.
I am feeling very sad this week because you are away and it's when you go away I realise I am alone. I sometimes wonder if it's possible to go back in time when I wasn't in therapy and didn't have the awareness I have now, I was somewhat happy then and now I feel so desperately sad. Sometimes we don't understand each other t but most of the time we do and then that's when I fall part because I can never know you outside of our hour a week together and that's when I feel that this is false. I need more from you t, I need real connection. Can anybody relate or am I falling apart here?

Hi Mona
I'm sorry that your going through intense difficulty .. The therapist/client dynamic is so difficult ( especially for the client,and I can only speak as a client). I can relate to what you said about being more aware now vs before being in therapy. But that awareness comes at a price. We suffer from what sometimes feels like the most insatiable desire to be closer to our therapists, to want more from them, and to know the cruel reality that we only know what little they share and they know ALL about us.We (usually) only see them once a week. It is the most unbalanced relationship ever!!
That's exact how it has been for me. I would obsess thinking about my therapist. I would get angry with her, for just about anything that she did wrong. Sometimes it was justified and sometimes maybe it was my own stuff. About a month ago ( maybe a little less) I had posted that my therapist came off rather uncaring after my surgery. Well, since then I've had some sort of epiphany. I realize that I have expected too much from my therapist. It still hurts like hell but I know that she will never care for me the way I wish she would. I am her client. I kind of feel like I have given up on her ( wanting more than she can give me) . Maybe it is healthy that I have come to this realization. It still hurts though! I've even thought that maybe I need a break, but that's for another post😊 I guess what I'm saying is that I don't know if this therapist/ client relationship is a bad thing or a good thing.. it just is. We take what's beneficial and learn from it, even if it hurts. We learn what is our stuff and in some instances, what is not our stuff. I hope that I didn't ramble on too much..and that you find the clarity that you need. : )
You didnt ramble on at all 1step and I thank you for your reply. I remember your post about your t not caring after your surgery and sometimes it ties like these when we realise how much our t means to us and how little we mean to them. I think it is healthy that YOU came to this realisation, perhaps this is a way of protecting yourself and that is always worth listening to. I think it hurts more when we idealise them and develop strong transeference, sounds as though you go from having positive to negative transference 1 step, I do too, depending on how t is with me. I remember a tutor saying how the negative transference is so much easier to work with. I hope that you decide to do what is best for you
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  #30  
Old May 02, 2016, 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by monalisasmile View Post
who says therapy is supposed to help us feel better? Is that the point of it, or is it to make us suffer and grieve all of our losses and to come out stronger, I am not even sure anymore. The uncertainty hurts.
I think most Ts would say it should make you feel better, and would then begin talking about metrics and progress markers etc. My last T cut me off specifically because I was suffering too much and there was no obvious progress. All she could think about was clinical outcomes, and whether therapy was "working", and preserving her self image as a competent fixer of people's lives.

Sometimes I do think that if she had just said "i really have no idea what i'm doing, I am as confused as you are, but I'll do my best to help you if want it"… I might have survived it.

I understand your point about the possible purification and strengthening that comes from grieving and suffering, but if someone comes in already under the weight of grief and loss, that is a pretty dangerous place to go. Seems too much like russian roulette.
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  #31  
Old May 02, 2016, 09:31 PM
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Originally Posted by monalisasmile View Post
I sometimes wonder why it has to be so painful to be attached to a therapist. I have no plans to stop seeing my t but I know the day will eventually come when we will terminate. Sometimes I think that this relationship has stopped me developing more intimate relationships but then I look back and see how much the relationships I do have have flourished because of my relationship with t.
I am feeling very sad this week because you are away and it's when you go away I realise I am alone. I sometimes wonder if it's possible to go back in time when I wasn't in therapy and didn't have the awareness I have now, I was somewhat happy then and now I feel so desperately sad. Sometimes we don't understand each other t but most of the time we do and then that's when I fall part because I can never know you outside of our hour a week together and that's when I feel that this is false. I need more from you t, I need real connection. Can anybody relate or am I falling apart here?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I meant to post sooner but didn't have a chance to. I relate very much to what you wrote, especially the end about falling apart when you realize you can only know T for that hour, and it feels false. I feel the exact same way, and it hurts deep inside of me. My T always says I can ask her questions about herself, and she will answer, but that's not what I want. I think what I want is not what I really want from T. It's the transference that makes it so painful. I want to know more about T than I know about some of my friends. But it's not the not knowing. It's the wanting T to be someone else, someone who cares more than T cares, whom you get to see more than 1 hour a week for money. The attachment sets us up to long for what we missed. It's false because it's therapy, and not real in the way we would like. That's where the pain comes from.

I can't help my attachment to my T even though I see the reality. She said "I love you" to me in one session but it's fake though she means it sincerely. She probably wants me to terminate at some point but we haven't discussed it lately. If she would stop practicing, or move away, I would be in the same boat as many posters. T and I wouldn't have that close relationship anymore. She has her private life but I would still have the attachment. There's no way around it and yes, it's very painful. It's shown me what I've been lacking in my life, so the attachment has served a purpose.

I feel like I've been rambling in this reply but wanted you to know how much I relate to what you're feeling.
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  #32  
Old May 02, 2016, 09:36 PM
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I meant to post sooner but didn't have a chance to. I relate very much to what you wrote, especially the end about falling apart when you realize you can only know T for that hour, and it feels false. I feel the exact same way, and it hurts deep inside of me. My T always says I can ask her questions about herself, and she will answer, but that's not what I want. I think what I want is not what I really want from T. It's the transference that makes it so painful. I want to know more about T than I know about some of my friends. But it's not the not knowing. It's the wanting T to be someone else, someone who cares more than T cares, whom you get to see more than 1 hour a week for money. The attachment sets us up to long for what we missed. It's false because it's therapy, and not real in the way we would like. That's where the pain comes from.

I can't help my attachment to my T even though I see the reality. She said "I love you" to me in one session but it's fake though she means it sincerely. She probably wants me to terminate at some point but we haven't discussed it lately. If she would stop practicing, or move away, I would be in the same boat as many posters. T and I wouldn't have that close relationship anymore. She has her private life but I would still have the attachment. There's no way around it and yes, it's very painful. It's shown me what I've been lacking in my life, so the attachment has served a purpose.

I feel like I've been rambling in this reply but wanted you to know how much I relate to what you're feeling.
The part I bolded. This. Very much. For me too.
  #33  
Old May 02, 2016, 11:22 PM
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The part I bolded. This. Very much. For me too.

Its rare in life that ANY relationship lasts indefinitely. Spouses, siblings maybe.... Parents if they are good ones, but many good parents pass away while their kids are still relatively young. Friends move. Kids get jobs overseas. Lovers break up with you...I mean really ALL relationships are like that.

I'm sure in many cases Ts will still stay in touch in some way such as email.

But more importantly all those positive , intimate interactions and feelings grow to live inside you. Excepting if the relationship ends traumatically, you always have that. If my T moved to Japan or something, the connection we've shared will always live on in both our hearts. I will always have the words she has said and things she has done in .my heart.

I guess to me that is as "real" as it gets.
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  #34  
Old May 02, 2016, 11:34 PM
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Its rare in life that ANY relationship lasts indefinitely. Spouses, siblings maybe.... Parents if they are good ones, but many good parents pass away while their kids are still relatively young. Friends move. Kids get jobs overseas. Lovers break up with you...I mean really ALL relationships are like that.

I'm sure in many cases Ts will still stay in touch in some way such as email.

But more importantly all those positive , intimate interactions and feelings grow to live inside you. Excepting if the relationship ends traumatically, you always have that. If my T moved to Japan or something, the connection we've shared will always live on in both our hearts. I will always have the words she has said and things she has done in .my heart.

I guess to me that is as "real" as it gets.
Thanks for this BayBrony. Beautifully said.
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  #35  
Old May 03, 2016, 11:22 AM
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Its rare in life that ANY relationship lasts indefinitely. Spouses, siblings maybe.... Parents if they are good ones, but many good parents pass away while their kids are still relatively young. Friends move. Kids get jobs overseas. Lovers break up with you...I mean really ALL relationships are like that.
Yes but in these real life examples people are typically not living in perpetual fear of the other person disappearing, the way many therapy clients are. Also in those relationships contact is not limited to small and intense doses that leave one person reeling and longing much of the time, like a junkie waiting for a fix. Some clients withhold primary feelings for fear of driving the T away. These are not the signs of a healthy relationship if you ask me.

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Originally Posted by BayBrony View Post
I'm sure in many cases Ts will still stay in touch in some way such as email.
In my case she cut me off completely even though i was clearly in acute distress. I sent many emails looking for a lifeline. No response, just cold hard silence.
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  #36  
Old May 03, 2016, 12:59 PM
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Yes but in these real life examples people are typically not living in perpetual fear of the other person disappearing, the way many therapy clients are. Also in those relationships contact is not limited to small and intense doses that leave one person reeling and longing much of the time, like a junkie waiting for a fix. Some clients withhold primary feelings for fear of driving the T away. These are not the signs of a healthy relationship if you ask me.


In my case she cut me off completely even though i was clearly in acute distress. I sent many emails looking for a lifeline. No response, just cold hard silence.

I can only speak to my own experience. To me, it does not seem any different from many other relationships. I've had intense friendships that last a short time. I had a whirlwind romance with an amazing women that lasted only a few months. It wasn't going to work. Together we were like fire and gasoline-- too intense.... But it was also the most intense romance, the most passionate love making, and one of the deepest connections I've ever had( no offense to my wife who I love incredibly and is perfect for me. I could not coexist long term with someone else as intense as me but for a few months it was unforgettable)..... She broke my heart into a million pieces at the end and that romance is gone from my life forever...but the magic and joy we shared also live on inside me... To me the pain doesn't negate the stuff we shared.

My T and I have shared a lot in a very intimate way . of course I would grieve that if it was gone. But the connection remains just like in every other relationship.

Of course I am in a position where I long deeply for my Ts love and she gives it to me
After 4 years she remains the same person, we only grow more closely connected. She sets clear boundaries about what she can and can't handle but EVERY relationship has boundaries ( I say I can call my best friend any time but in reality is I called her at work every day shed get pissed and tell me to stop it)
To me our relationship can exist ONLY within the boundaries of the T relationship. It's too.intense for a normal friendship. It awakens too much need, too much grief and that would demolish a relationship that wasn't carefully structured and supported. But the need and the grief,for me at least, isn't REALLY from the T relationship. That pain, loneliness, grief--- that's mine. *I* bring that to the T relationship. I have ALWAYS had huge unbearable pain inside me. That's why I have an eating disorder, it's why I SI, its why I have PTSD....the T relationship brings those feelings into a place where I can safely access and wrestle with them without feeling obliterated. The fear of total destruction is what has always left me hiding behind self destruction instead of facing my deep old pain.

I don't think any of that has its CAUSE in the T relationship. I ALWAYS had that pain inside me. I've ALWAYS longed for a mother who wanted me. None if it came from my T. She just made it safe enough to face.

Obviously not everyone has good therapy experiences. But not everyone has bad ones either. I feel.for people who.have been hurt by Ts but I can only speak.of my own experience.
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  #37  
Old May 03, 2016, 01:31 PM
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Yes but in these real life examples people are typically not living in perpetual fear of the other person disappearing, the way many therapy clients are. Also in those relationships contact is not limited to small and intense doses that leave one person reeling and longing much of the time, like a junkie waiting for a fix. Some clients withhold primary feelings for fear of driving the T away. These are not the signs of a healthy relationship if you ask me.


In my case she cut me off completely even though i was clearly in acute distress. I sent many emails looking for a lifeline. No response, just cold hard silence.
Therapy is NOT a healthy relationship for so many people. It's very dysfunctional.
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  #38  
Old May 03, 2016, 05:54 PM
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I'm so sorry. Reading this hurts me so badly. I know how horribly painful this is. I wish I could make it go away for you.

Thank you for your kind and compassionate words pink. My T did not abandon me in the literal sense. She told me ahead of time, has given me two months to try and deal with it. Has done everything she can to support me and help me through her leaving. So she has done everything ethically right. I do however feel emotionally abandoned because I loose one of my biggest supports and a space I feel so safe in even if for only an hour.

I genuinely wish I could take away all of your pain pink. You don't deserve it. You deserve all the love and healing there is. I hope you find it someday. I think of you often.
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  #39  
Old May 03, 2016, 07:18 PM
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Its rare in life that ANY relationship lasts indefinitely. Spouses, siblings maybe.... Parents if they are good ones, but many good parents pass away while their kids are still relatively young. Friends move. Kids get jobs overseas. Lovers break up with you...I mean really ALL relationships are like that.

I'm sure in many cases Ts will still stay in touch in some way such as email.

But more importantly all those positive , intimate interactions and feelings grow to live inside you. Excepting if the relationship ends traumatically, you always have that. If my T moved to Japan or something, the connection we've shared will always live on in both our hearts. I will always have the words she has said and things she has done in .my heart.

I guess to me that is as "real" as it gets.
I am in the most happiest of ways. that was so beautifully put, BB. Thank you. So much.
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  #40  
Old May 03, 2016, 08:44 PM
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I can only speak to my own experience. To me, it does not seem any different from many other relationships. I've had intense friendships that last a short time. I had a whirlwind romance with an amazing women that lasted only a few months.
Comparing therapy to a love affair or friendship strikes me as odd and rather offensive, because it trivializes the sort of trauma and pain that can get exposed or induced in therapy, not to mention the power disparity and the potential for emotional dependency that can be so very hard to break. People who are hurting and seemingly in great peril because of therapy attachment, or like me have been traumatized by it, probably aren't gonna be helped by being told it is just another relationship with the same pitfalls, etc.
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  #41  
Old May 03, 2016, 09:01 PM
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I don't think that's what she meant at all....
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  #42  
Old May 03, 2016, 09:01 PM
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Thank you for your kind and compassionate words pink. My T did not abandon me in the literal sense. She told me ahead of time, has given me two months to try and deal with it. Has done everything she can to support me and help me through her leaving. So she has done everything ethically right. I do however feel emotionally abandoned because I loose one of my biggest supports and a space I feel so safe in even if for only an hour.

I genuinely wish I could take away all of your pain pink. You don't deserve it. You deserve all the love and healing there is. I hope you find it someday. I think of you often.
I wasn't technically abandoned either, it was me who chose to walk away technically, but emotional abandonment hurts just as much. It's really hard, especially since there's nothing to do but brace through it. And you'll be okay. Parts of me feel better without that constant fear of loss... The way you are ending is painful too and I would have found that really hard to deal with as well.
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  #43  
Old May 03, 2016, 09:20 PM
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Originally Posted by BayBrony View Post
Its rare in life that ANY relationship lasts indefinitely. Spouses, siblings maybe.... Parents if they are good ones, but many good parents pass away while their kids are still relatively young. Friends move. Kids get jobs overseas. Lovers break up with you...I mean really ALL relationships are like that.

I'm sure in many cases Ts will still stay in touch in some way such as email.

But more importantly all those positive , intimate interactions and feelings grow to live inside you. Excepting if the relationship ends traumatically, you always have that. If my T moved to Japan or something, the connection we've shared will always live on in both our hearts. I will always have the words she has said and things she has done in .my heart.

I guess to me that is as "real" as it gets.
Thank you for this. I needed to hear/read this right now. Its sad but the truth and it also should make people cherish every moment with people (not just a T) because you never know how much time you have with someone.
Thanks for this!
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  #44  
Old May 03, 2016, 09:34 PM
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For me, even after leaving or terminating with a bad therapist there was greater fear of future loss. Why trust? The feelings of abandonment heightened. I shut down and trusted no one. I wanted to act out, destroy myself. A second and last suicide attempt of 100 extra strength Tylenol refused to do the job, so I shut down instead. I lucked into the right therapy situation, and she saw me through to the other side. My life is not perfect, but it sure is better than what I ever thought it would be.

Healing is possible.
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  #45  
Old May 03, 2016, 09:41 PM
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Comparing therapy to a love affair or friendship strikes me as odd and rather offensive, because it trivializes the sort of trauma and pain that can get exposed or induced in therapy, not to mention the power disparity and the potential for emotional dependency that can be so very hard to break. People who are hurting and seemingly in great peril because of therapy attachment, or like me have been traumatized by it, probably aren't gonna be helped by being told it is just another relationship with the same pitfalls, etc.
I said I can only speak to my own experience. To ME it is EXACTLY like any other relationship. Do you think a divorce is not unbelievably traumatic? Or losing a friend forever?

I am not going to compare tte pain of different losses. Loss is painful. Relationships can be painful. The end of any sort of significant relationship can be horribly traumatic and I'm not judging.the likelihood of one or another being traumatic.

My point was we are always going to lose people in life but that doesn't change the sweetness of the relationship.

I was NOT specifically addressing your issue. The OP has NOT been abandoned by her T. She is struggling with the desire for a closeness she feels like she can't have and struggling with the awareness that the relationship will some day end

My words are addressed to that issue, the issue of whether the T relationship feels "real" when factors like it being finite are in play.

And I'm saying that IMO, every thing ends, and that doesn't change what we gain from those experiences or the love we feel.
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  #46  
Old May 03, 2016, 09:45 PM
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And actually I don't think it trivializes anything. It would be very painful if my T abandoned me. But it would be far, far, far worse for me if my spouse or my best friend of many many years did the same.
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  #47  
Old May 03, 2016, 10:36 PM
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BayBrony, I just want to thank you for your posts in this thread. I basically agree with you about loss. What I have with my T will never go away even if she goes away. The memories will remain in my heart as long as I live. Likewise, I will never forget the good memories of my marriage even though my husband is gone. Loss in life is inevitable but we don't have to lose the love we gave and/or received from those we were close to.
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  #48  
Old May 03, 2016, 11:26 PM
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Originally Posted by PinkFlamingo99 View Post
I wasn't technically abandoned either, it was me who chose to walk away technically, but emotional abandonment hurts just as much. It's really hard, especially since there's nothing to do but brace through it. And you'll be okay. Parts of me feel better without that constant fear of loss... The way you are ending is painful too and I would have found that really hard to deal with as well.
Thank you again. It is so hard and so painful. I am sorry you went through it. Your strength has inspired me.
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  #49  
Old May 03, 2016, 11:30 PM
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Originally Posted by BayBrony View Post
I said I can only speak to my own experience. To ME it is EXACTLY like any other relationship.
That makes no sense to me at all. Lumping all relationships together totally negates and dismisses what therapy in particular can do to someone whose past makes them vulnerable to abuse or exploitation by a person in a position of authority and emotional power, with close associations to primary caregivers. People are just not vulnerable in that way in other relationships. If you haven't been on the wrong side of a traumatic therapy rupture, you cant possibly understand, and that's fine. Not trying to bring the discussion down, I just feel some obligation to give some idea of what happens when it goes wrong, because in my experience that is often missing from the discussion.
  #50  
Old May 04, 2016, 12:42 AM
Anonymous50005
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People are vulnerable to hurt and abuse in all relationships. We encounter authority figures in the form of parents, employers, even older siblings and spousal relationships. Early abuse by one authority figure absolutely can make us vulnerable to similar abuse by other authority figures. Therapy relationships are not unique to that phenomena. Many of us here can attest to abuse by more than one authority figure over the course of our lives. We can possibly understand because we have experienced multiple incidences of vulnerabilty and abuse in our lives.

But, yes, not all relationships are alike, but the pains we suffer are more similar than they are different. We suffer trauma and abandonment and are left in pain. We can also experience terrible traumatic loss in our most positive relationships. Those losses can often be abrupt and traumatic and life-changing.

For myself, I have to keep relationships in perspective because I have lost too many people, torn from my life through sudden accident, acute or terminal illness, suicide, and outright abandonment. I do my best to appreciate every day with the people in my life, and I grieve deeply when their lives are torn away from mine. In some cases I can't make sense of why that person I loved and trusted chose to abuse me and leave me in the wake of their dreadful actions. In other cases, I can't make sense of why we were celebrating the graduations of our students one day and the next day that friend blew his brains out. In others, they were simply taken much too young and too soon by painful and traumatic illness. There are all sorts of traumatic ruptures in people's lives, so yes, many of us understand having been vulnerable in relationships and having dealt with the aftermath of traumatic endings.

The circumstances and relationships vary widely, but the trauma and pain is all too closely the same. You may not nave personally experienced the individual circumstances of my traumatic abuse and/or loss, but I believe you do understand that the depth of my pain is very real. I may not have personally experienced the individual circumstances of your trauma and/or loss, but I do respect and understand how clearly painful it has been for you.
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attentionThis is an old thread. You probably should not post your reply to it, as the original poster is unlikely to see it.




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