[pegasus]

Having read quite a few posts recently of people being abused by theirs T's, I had to spend some time discussing this issue with my T.

Here in the UK all psychologists/pychotherapists, if they are members of The British Psychological Society have to abide by the rules, code of ethics and conduct. There is a discipline commitee that deals with allegations and bad therapists are thrown out.

My T has been a Chartered Clinical Psychologist for over 30 years and he has never met any therapist that has abused a patient in this way. Of course there are rotten apples in any profession. Both T and I have read transcripts of bad T's that have been unethical and have been chucked out or reprimanded by the ethics commitee as it is published in The Psychologist magazine.

I wanted to do this post because it truly makes my blood boil to think that any psychologist/psychotherapist would take advantage of a patient in this way. Most T's are caring and have their patients wellbeing at the forefront of their mind.

I don't want new patients thinking that all psychotherapists are sex-crazed maniacs waiting to jump every patient that walks in the door!

Just my opinion.

[debbie_tabor]

[ClaireB]

Pegasus, you are correct. Most therapists do NOT abuse their patients. Most fathers and mothers don't abuse their children. Most teachers don't abuse their students. Most clergy don't abuse people. However, some do. It's important that those who have been through this be able to process it.

I don't feel that people who have been through this should have to be silent simply out of concern that people won't seek therapy. That's not right. (And maybe that's not even what you're saying.) But, that is an added burden that isn't ours to carry. It is important, as with any type of abuse, to remind people that this is not the norm but that it does happen. By talking about it, those who have been through this or are currently going through it don't feel so alone.

I'm not surprised that there are therapists who have not treated this type of abuse. A lot of patients/clients never go back into therapy for obvious reasons. However, my therapist has treated one other person (and I lived in a city of <200,000 at that time) who was abused by a different therapist. She has also treated women abused by clergy. Thank goodness the majority are ethical.

[pegasus]

I am NOT saying that people who have been abused should stay silent. It is very important that people who have been abused have a voice.

My post was to assure people that it is very very rare to be abused by a psychotherapist. There are many safeguards in place. Indeed it is their job to help people who have been abused. I don't want people not seeking therapy because they fear they may be abused again.

Again, I'll state it is extremely rare for a T to abuse a patient in this way.

why is it so important for your to state that it is 'rare'

What if it wasnt as rare as your thought?

[ClaireB]

I know I'm really sensitive to this topic, and it may be that I'm overreacting here. But I don't understand this double standard. If people talk about domestic violence or any other type of abuse, people don't immediately jump in and start saying it's rare or talk about who initiated it, etc. All of which I have read on this forum. It's true that it's not the norm. It's true that most therapists are ethical. I have a therapist who would never, ever think of doing of doing this to a client. Her husband is also a therapist and I know he would not do it either. Most don't do it, but some do. In fact The walk-in clinic in Minnesota specializes in treating patients who have been through this. Unfortunately, those therapists that work there are not without clients.

[wanttoheal]

I didn't read what you are seeing Claire. I took the post Pegasus wrote to be more of an encouraging post, not one that was meant for reprimand. There are some Ts out there who are abusing. But, there are a lot of good Ts out there and that's worthy to note too.

[Rapunzel]

It is important to be able to feel safe with your therapist. Maybe the most useful direction for this conversation would be how to know that you are safe with your therapist. Talking to him or her about it, like Pegasus did, is perfect if you are concerned. Also observe the boundaries that your therapist keeps, and how easily or how far they will bend the rules. Quite a lot of us as clients have a wish to be "special" and to have more than a clinical relationship with our therapists. If you wish that you could do something with your therapist outside of the office, or be friends, or anything outside of the usual, you could talk about those wishes, hypothetically. There might sometimes be a legitimate reason to adjust a boundary if there is a clear benefit to the client, but not often, and never so far as to violate the boundary. You can feel confident if your therapist maintains strong boundaries.

I have had two past therapists (and maybe one more I thought I heard something about) who at some point in their careers had their licenses revoked for having an affair with a client. They didn't do anything wrong with me, although both of them had looser boundaries than other therapists. Both of them came to my house, one when I was alone. He offered to help me learn how to decorate (I had never considered that idea before), and he asked for a tour. It did make me uncomfortable, but I would have been able to say no if he had tried something weirder than that, at least I hope.

I'm still able to trust my current T because she behaves in an ethical way at all times, and has never given me any cause to think she wanted anything from me that isn't right. It is important to be able to trust your T, and to trust yourself. If you feel that you might give in to something that you will regret later, you need to recognize that and keep yourself safe. Make sure there is someone else you trust, and that you can check things out if you are uncomfortable. You can always come here.

Therapists don't set out to hurt people, but they are human too, and can make mistakes. Even if that happens, it's not likely to be by force, but more likely by persuasion, or simply giving in to something that should be recognized instead for what it is. They have more responsibility in the relationship, but if we are able to say no, and recognize appropriate boundaries, we can keep ourselves safe.

[FloweringHope]

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pegasus said:
Here in the UK all psychologists/pychotherapists, if they are members of The British Psychological Society have to abide by the rules, code of ethics and conduct. There is a discipline commitee that deals with allegations and bad therapists are thrown out.

My T has been a Chartered Clinical Psychologist for over 30 years and he has never met any therapist that has abused a patient in this way. Of course there are rotten apples in any profession. Both T and I have read transcripts of bad T's that have been unethical and have been chucked out or reprimanded by the ethics commitee as it is published in The Psychologist magazine.

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Having a dreadful experience with my T - sleeping with him, has shaded my experience of life!

I don't feel talking about what happened to me in therapy will impede upon others choosing to undergo treatment. However, as a result of this situation, I do find it difficult to trust and find the help I need - if it happened again, for me, there will be no turning back!

I felt the tone in your first note was very harsh and strong - maybe because of what occurred to me. I also feel upset that you feel you need to place a % on what you claimed - being a researcher in academia, I can attest to the fact that you cannot empirically equate that percentage to non occurrence of abuse/nor limited occurrence - many go unreported!

To place a percentage on this record of abuse, makes me wonder why you felt you needed to. Does it lessen WHAT REALLY OCCURS IN "SOME" THERAPY SESSIONS? <font color="red"> </font>

[FloweringHope]

To clarify what 99.9% would mean statistically:

only 1 in a 1000 would suffer this abuse!

Both my other two friends are having similar experiences (still in the situation).

Reading discourses on this topic - knowledge/power nexus and abuse, these journals are indicative that there are more plp abused that only 1 in 1000.

[pegasus]

This post was not meant to reprimand anyone but to point out that there are far more good ethical therapists than there are bad.

I think Rapunzel said it better than I could, it is up to the T to create and maintain the boundaries, I am lucky in that I can talk with my T about absolutely anything and have no fear of my T breaking those boundaries.

SleepingSacredRose- I am NOT an academic researcher, the 99.9% was put in the title of my post to make the point that MOST therapists are ethical and would not abuse a patient.

[FloweringHope]

'Most' is very different from a %!

I do understand your point: there are good, ethical Therapists - to which I agree with! That being said, as soon as you place a % on something, it can seem to change the true intent of ones statement!

Hope I can find one that is ethical!

SSR

[ClaireB]

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wanttoheal said:
I didn't read what you are seeing Claire. I took the post Pegasus wrote to be more of an encouraging post, not one that was meant for reprimand. There are some Ts out there who are abusing. But, there are a lot of good Ts out there and that's worthy to note too.



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I get what you're saying, but if this post had been about any other type of abuse I think it would be easier to understand why it is hurtful. Imagine how people who have suffered domestic violence would feel if they logged on to read a post where someone said there have been a lot of people talking about domestic violence lately and I am afraid that women won't want to date anymore so I just want people to know that X% of people do not abuse their partners. Even though I know it's not the intent, the result is that it minimizes the problem.

Most therapists don't abuse their patients, most parents don't abuse their children, most teachers don't abuse their students, and so on. Some do, however. Dr. Gary Schoener, a psychologist in Minnesota, who I've personally spoken with in the past has consulted on over 3,000 cases of professional misconduct. That makes me really, really sad because while it's the minority of professionals who do this, it's still way too many.

And please, I don't want anyone to misunderstand me. I am not by any means attacking therapists or mental health professionals. I will not do that. I could not have asked for a therapist more caring or more ethical than the person I am blessed to have in my life now. I know that I'm ultra-sensitive to this topic. I guess in a way I also feel kind of protective of others who have been though this because I don't them to shoulder any guilt that is not theirs to carry. And now I'm babbling so I'm going to be quiet.

Perhaps instead we should concentrate on welcoming and comforting those who have been hurt since this thread could be taken both ways.

[april15]

i know you have good intentions posting that most therapists don't have sex with their patients. However, it happens way more than you would think. My therapist told me she is treating several people who are recovering from a therapist who had a sexual relationship with them.

Most wouldn't do it, of course. But how often it happens is something no one can know.

think about how many people do not report. It's the therapist against the patient. Very difficult for the patient, who already is vulnerable to begin with, to report it.

If there were 93 thousand Ts and only 1 abused his patient, that would still be 1 too many.

There are ethical guidelines for a reason. In my legal and ethical books, I have exact percentages for a number of ethical standards based on a survey report that was done to a sample of Ts. It covers everything from accepting gifts to being physicall attracted to a patient, to admitting physical attraction, to actually sleeping with a patient. Not everything is an ethical violation in the report. For example, the percentage of therapists admitting to being physically attracted to a patient is higher than you'd expect... but that is not a violation of ethical standards, to be physically attracted to someone. The disturbing number is, of course, those who have either admitted it to a patient or who have acted on it. It also covers a lot of unethical things that have nothing to do with sex. In class, my professor had us to an exercise called "What where they thinking?!" where we had to discuss what we thought the rationale could be for violating some of these ethical standards.

You see, the sad part is not that the code of ethics exists. It's important. But the sad part is why.... because everything in it has been violated at one time or another by some therapist out there. The beginning statement in the code of ethics for doctors and therapists alike.... first of all, do no harm. That pretty much sums up everything. It is so, so sad that any therapist, doctor, or professional could violate this.

There are so many great therapists out there. Of course the good out-numbers the bad. But 1 bad is too many.

[Nikki2000]

good post, Pink

[wanttoheal]

Ok. Understood too. I have DID. That results from a lot of horrible things from when I was a child. But I am not offended if someone says DID is rare and that the majority of people don't have DID because of it, or even if they say the majority of the people don't have horrible things happen to them when they are children.

It's all good. This seems to be a trigger for you and I completely understand triggers, and if you've gone through abuse by a T, it's completely understandable that you would feel this way.

I only responded because I didn't think Pegasus was meaning to upset anyone with her post.

Off Topic, sorry Pegasus...

[amuseable]

Wow this is a hot potato. I have had some really traumatic (including sexual contact) experience with a past therapist as an adult and several questionable incidents with mental health professionals as a kid. I NOW have a wonderful therapist who has stuck with me through thick and thin trying to undo some of the %#@&#! that was done to me. But it has taken a lifetime to find him. My T thinks it is actually much more common (though horrible) than people think. He mentions that he sees lists of physicians who have lost their licenses due to that kind of abuse in every bulletin of the professional association he is a member of. Even his beloved mentor, which really hurt him.
Keep in mind there are many ways therapists can harm and taking advantage sexually is only one of them. I had a psychologist, for instance, who had me repeat again and again "The reason I think I am a %#@&#! is because I am a %#@&#!." I was 16. Not a reportable abuse but it really affected my life I can tell you even though it seems very minor.
I add again that the therapist I am with now is the best I have ever had. The problem is that if you are extremely unwell,mentally, and you are being abused by a therapist you may not realize it and terrible long-term damage can be done to your soul. Therapists have a position of power and it takes a healthy individual to use that power for overall good not bad. It is not a job for everyone. If my adult child asked for my advice about a therapist or therapy I would encourage them to go for it ... but be aware of how the therapist is dealing with boundaries and the potential for harm mixed in with the healing

[FloweringHope]

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april15 said:
i know you have good intentions posting that most therapists don't have sex with their patients. However, it happens way more than you would think. My therapist told me she is treating several people who are recovering from a therapist who had a sexual relationship with them.

Most wouldn't do it, of course. But how often it happens is something no one can know.

think about how many people do not report. It's the therapist against the patient. Very difficult for the patient, who already is vulnerable to begin with, to report it.

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My T made it very clear to me: "it's my word against yours and I will say it's all in your head, your FANTASY! It's very hard to prove, the boys look after there own"

My other two friends are in a relationship with their T (sexual), they don't have much to do with me anymore, because I see it as ABUSE!

I felt I needed to respond to this thread, because:

1) It does occur - more often than REPORTED OR ACTUALLY DISCUSSED!
2) Gives me a voice
3) I feel I have some power in the fact I can talk about the situation and be heard and BELIEVED!!!!!

For me I want to move on and not be a victim of his actions - I do find it very difficult to do so!

SSR <font color="red"> </font>

[(JD)]

If anyone has a therapist who has been sexual with them, male-female psychologist, social worker, therapist, psychiatrist - please report them to their licensing board. So what if they state it's all in your mind? It really won't matter for you in the long run, imo. BUT if enough people report the same T, then someone will notice and won't have to go by just your account, they might even set up a sting to catch the pervert.

Now, on to some harder statistics? Studies (self reports) prior to 1979 I think, revealed that 12% of male therapists and 3% of female therapists engaged in sexual activity with a client. Later studies said that even up to year 2000, nothing had really changed if the same parameters were measured. That's really sad. There was another study from the 1990s that stated 7% overall, but I'm wondering if they measured in the same way as previous (as the 2000 one said the stats were basically the same.)

This means there are more people out there who shouldn't be therapists, imo. (I assume this is not counting any sex therapists who might have been counted in as engaging, even though they rarely engage in any such act themselves, etc. You know?)

Now WHY do you think there are so many of them continuing to do this? One, they shouldn't be therapists, and two, patients/clients aren't reporting them. The profession knows of the problem, but they can't solve it if the people aren't being reported. One patient might be able to get out before they are harmed further (I say further because anyone who's had someone like this make an advance already has the relationship harmed) but another, future patients might not be.

IF you are strong enough to report...just report simply what happened, not using name calling or assumptions... just report the facts.. then please do so. Though it will be difficult, you will feel better about yourself later.



PS I would report.

[ECHOES]

It is not unsual for an abuser of any kind in any situation to attempt to control even the reporting of the abuse with the threat that the abused won't be believed.

Don't fall for it.

[FloweringHope]

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wanttoheal said:
I have DID.
That results from a lot of horrible things from when I was a child. But I am not offended if someone says DID is rare and that the majority of people don't have DID because of it, or even if they say the majority of the people don't have horrible things happen to them when they are children.

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Before i address some of this statement - what is DID?

SSR <font color="red"> </font>

[(JD)]

Dissociative Identity Disorder http://psychcentral.com/disorders/

[pegasus]

Unfortunately I've not been able to get on line.

Just wanted to say thank you to those that were supportive of my post.

I am aware that there are bad T's out there but wanted to celebrate the good T's, it's a shame some people couldn't see that was my intent.