Counsellor repeatedly takes days off for her own hobbies and family gatherings

OP. I think your concerns are valid. I encourage you to talk with her about it to let her know how you feel.

SarahSweden, is it possible for you to work part-time and get disability assistance. You can meet people while earning some money.

Time is a precious gift, Sarah. Use it to create the life you want. Wanting our situation to be different than what it is just creates a whole lot of unnecessary suffering.

That is an awful situation to have such difficult access to a therapist. Too bad that you can't easily move to the United States to get help. I mean it is awful that the situation is like that where you are. There are a lot of psychologists and psychiatrists here in the states.

There are a lot of therapists and psychologists and psychiatrists in Sweden too but when it’s free government funded service, it has limitations how long and how much you can see a therapist. I had health insurance that only covered 10 visits a year in the US. The rest was out of pocket. And even those ten visits I had to pay high copay. Then there is a high deductible! And premium!

Sara had quite a few therapists before too but at some point they impose limitations how much and how often and how many of them state is willing to pay for. It’s government funded, everything government funded has limits. If she moved to the US she still would not have unlimited free access to unlimited mental health help. Not at all.

I don’t want people in other countries think that US provides free and unlimited mental health service to everyone. Not at all. People pay through the nose for it. And it’s quite hard to obtain government assistance here

If a person suffers from depression, it can be very difficult to get motivated to do things, even things that seem simple to others. While I think it's definitely important for people to focus more on how to improve their own lives than on analyzing someone else's—I'm not sure if it is helpful to say things like "get some hobbies, make some friends, get a job" as if these are things that anyone can easily do?

I agree. It’s not easy. But it’s important to know why it’s not easy and what could be done to make it better? That’s why I keep encouraging Sara to seek a diagnosis and treatment (not sure if it needs to be medication or something else). She continues suffering unable to truly function but nothing is happening. One therapist suggested possible diagnosis but there was no follow up. No help or true treatment took place and as she stated before she has no real diagnosis of anything. This situation has been going on for years and all this therapy and supportive chats seem to be making it worse. I know it’s hard to diagnose and hard to find proper treatment but there has to be something someone could try. Even general practitioner could suggest things.

Sweden is civilized country. Countries with socialized government run health care still get people diagnosed and treated etc I have family in different countries with state run public health system. People get diagnosis and treatment and meds. They don’t all just suffer with no help and no ability to work or do things

Unfortunately, even in the US and even if you get a thorough diagnosis finally, and pay well-qualified private therapists, depression and other conditions can be treatment-resistant. That is, the professionals really have no treatment that reliably works, and they don't tell you that, they just take your money. At least in Sweden they aren't taking clients' money for their ineffective or harmful services, but they can probably still be ineffective or harmful anyway, unfortunately. And it sounds like nobody is noticing or counting there, ,just like they aren't in the US.

I absolutely know how hard it is; I have been living with chronic depression for FIFTY FIVE years.

But I've also been reading SarahSweden's posts for many years. They never change. Her feelings are always the same. I wish that she could see that SOMEthing has to change. "If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always gotten." I didn't mean to suggest that she make a BIG change. Baby steps. I want only good things for her.

"SOMEthing" has to change? But WHAT? And HOW?

It's great if you have found some relief -- even small -- for your treatment resistant depression. What has made a difference for you?

Some people respond to medication. I don’t believe Sarah ever was on any. If she was, I don’t think it was mentioned (of course sorry if it was previously discussed). I don’t think she was ever evaluated to see what’s the real diagnosis. We don’t know if hers is treatment resistant if there never was much treatment, she saw few therapists but that never lasted and wasn’t helpful

My husband has severe OCD, at some point he had hard time leaving the house and if he did he’d have to leave work and go home (his is safety related) and due to that his Tourettes was through the roof. Maintaining career was nearly impossible. He had to go on meds. And after trying few different ones he is very successful.

Sure it will never go away but symptoms are manageable with medication and he has a great life. He also sees a therapist on and off. He sees therapist to talk about things (his things, not therapists’) and help with strategies managing his symptoms. Of course there are people who don’t get better but one has to try things to call it treatment resistant.

I don’t think coolibrarian said that something has to work, I think she meant that people could try something in hopes that something changes.

Maybe things have already shifted for SarahSweden, perhaps things do look differently now than they did 10 years ago. Perhaps SarahSweden's process is very slow and she needs to repeat things many times before things take on a different complexion. This is true for me and I also know that the pressure from others suggesting that I do something! do different things! be socialable! work! develop a hobby! do, do, do!!! is overwhelming.

There is a kindness in allowing different paces. Projecting individual values of progress versus stasis doesn't seem helpful. SarahSweden doesn't sound happy and she seems sad and frustrated with her counselling relationships, but don't we all post the same dirge about our therapeutic relationships? I know I rarely deviate from my script of push/pull in my therapy relationship. I have been reading other posters repeating their posts for many years: I am so attached; I am so afraid of abandonment; I hate therapists; my therapist is perfect; I need my therapist; I am leaving my therapist; I am going back to my therapist. So what? We are seeking comfort by sharing these repeated sentiments in this environment otherwise we wouldn't continue to do so. We stop saying the same thing when we finally reach some kind of completion. It seems to me that none of us have achieved that yet and I hope we all go on saying the same stuff until we uncover new stuff, including Sarah.

There is nothing wrong with venting about same thing or progressing at their own pace. No one said people shouldn’t share the same thing. If it’s strictly a vent (and not a question if it’s ok for therapists to have vacation days to pursue hobbies and family obligations) then it needs to be specified that people aren’t allowed to answer or make suggestions and for example are only allowed to give hugs. It would be fine. But it needs to be specified.

Otherwise people would answer questions and share their opinions and likely suggest things. Baby steps. Different approaches. I don’t see anyone saying she should not complain and should get full time job tomorrow and immediately pursue PhD. That would be unreasonable

This is a description of what you would like posts to look like and how you want to respond to posts - and that is fine. SarahSweden is doing things differently. In turn, I am suggesting that there are alternative ways to consider one's situation which don't include change (be that via baby steps or dramatic leaps) as the primary goal.

I don't consider repetition and describing stuckness as meaningless vents which only require superficial hugs as a response. I think repetition and stuckness are (often unconscious) strategies in themselves. They serve a function and we illicit meaning from these stuck states. A repetition is never a true repetition, especially relationally. I might say the same thing but depending on the listener, the expected or unexpected response, the environment, my resources, etc I might feel slightly differently than the previous time I said it.

I think I am describing something like The Paradoxical Theory of Change:

This theory can be summarised as: change happens when a person becomes what they are, not when they try to become what they are not. In other words, we can’t make ourselves or anyone change in line with some ideal, but we will naturally change in an organic, meaningful and orderly way if we only allow ourselves and others to be as we and they truly are.

The Paradoxical Theory of Change • Counselling Tutor

This is long, deep work and it doesn't sound like Sarah has the support to engage with this kind of exploration - perhaps this explains why she doesn't feel able to take baby steps despite encouragements from others.

There are different ways to be supportive. Saying whether you think one way is right or wrong is just as much an opinion as any other opinion posted on these forums.

All we could do is suggest what we think might be better. You make your suggestions, other members made theirs. You think perhaps Sarah needs XYZ, it’s not more valid than suggesting perhaps her issue is ABC. None of the suggestions are better than others because there’s no criteria to measure validity of responses on this or any other threads. You express how you see things, others expressed their opinions. No approach is more valid than the other as this isn’t exact science.

PS I don’t recall anyone stating that repetition is meaningless

Excellent point. That’s what I was trying to say as well. No one has a monopoly on what’s the right way to post on the forum (except OPs who might request for people not to mention certain things)

... The irony. I am also saying that there are other options and other valid opinions. If I offer an alternative to the change/progress approach, I am not invalidating other suggestions or stating that I am right or anyone else is wrong. I find it interesting to stop and think, "Hang on, something else might be happening here", but within that I am not wrestling anyone else for the "I am right" crown.

I never said who I agree with. I agree with you AND Divine. I don't agree with fighting over who's right in the OP's thread. That's all I was trying to say.

PTC is not about blindly or passively accepting the person's stance. This is enabling the person to stay mired in their 'stuckness'. PTC is about accepting where the person is at whilst also 'challenging' them to consider other choices. It is about raising awareness so they can consider and make different choices. This is what I see posters doing here i.e. offering different alternatives.

Some posters try to help and take the time to write and offer such replies but the OP ignores all these responses.

In this case, it might be better for the OP to specify: 'I only want to vent' or 'I only want replies that will *not* offer anything different than my own beliefs'.

Yes, that's cool I wanted to make it clear that I wasn't being a knob about differences of opinion because I know I can often be argumentative and agitating.

This is exactly what I have attempted to do - to try and raise the possibility of alternatives and make a bit of room for a different analysis. I am not passively accepting Sarah's position or supporting the pushes for change, this isn't really a binary discussion. For me, understanding the stuckness (instead of skipping to "do something different") is itself a very challenging undertaking and one which can lead to some kind of movement.

And it isn't really up to you to prescribe what PTC is about, we can all contribute in the ways we feel have value.

I know this as I pay dearly for my visits. Now where I live, if one is disabled or at the poverty line, they are entitled to a lot of govt. assistance. Food stamps and medicaid are obtainable if one is at the poverty line. Medicaid is very obtainable to get if you can't work and are at the poverty level. There are tons of people around that are on these programs. Those on medicaid are getting FREE HEALTHCARE and FREE MEDICATION. So, I know what I am talking about. I actually live with someone in this situation.

Lol. Far be it from me to prescribe anything. This is the theoretical definition of PTC. You were the one who brought up the theory, so at least give the factual definition of it, not one that suits your arguments.

What is PTC?