Couch 251: The Matrix Recovered

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Scarlet. I agree about things not being secure, especially as I use email with Dr. T. I think he uses a more secure Zoom version now, but still, I imagine it could be hacked into.

I realized it was more about the second part, the computer interpreting a human. I fear that it would come up with a different summary of the session than what Dr. T would have come up with on his own. And I feared that what the AI would summarize would influence how he felt about me. As I said to him in the email, he's known me for years; the AI does not. And I had no idea how it would process more complex things like transference. Or even if I were, say, talking about my daughter, how would it know who that was? (As I refer to her by name in sessions.)

The more repetitive and automatable a job is, the greater the threat of AI. It already does stuff like basic customer service. But a complicated customer situation will still need a human.

Have to say, my students, with their gaps in critical thinking and problem solving skills, plus their inability to communicate effectively, are at a really high risk.

I suspected this might be your response. Do you know if it's used much in the legal profession? Just thinking that has similar confidentiality concerns, but also a need for documentation.

For me at least it's not security per se. There are plenty of unsecure things. I email all kinds of private things to my therapist. For the most part, I don't think anyone cares enough to go digging through my email correspondence.

It's two things. Firstly, I don't want an actual audio recording of my session floating around out there unless it was under my control. I don't know, but that feels like too much. If the therapist doesn't want to write notes, why can't they record themselves giving a summary of the session and let AI summarize that.

Second, I don't think every word I utter is important enough to record for posterity. Maybe I said something that I regret saying. A real therapist might have the judgement to know I didn't mean something literally or I'm dissociated and something came out wrong. Maybe I'm angry and said something rude about someone. Maybe I wished harm upon someone. Does AI understand that I'm obviously not going to actually harm anyone, that I'm just voicing my anger and frustration? Any number of things that there are nuances to that I don't think an AI is going to understand or comprehend.

AI in general, I think we, as a society, have just flung ourselves head first into using it for any and everything we can think of without fully understanding the consequences.

One thought I had recently upon reading that some company was wanting to replace a bunch of workers with AI: if we replace everyone's job with AI, who is left to buy the stuff that companies are selling?

i am not a huge fan of AI, but a T using it as notes for a session?! that’s insane to me. takes out the human component of therapy, which is what therapy is.

Humans are more advanced in other areas we cannot handle as well - medicine, for example, is another area where the technical far surpasses our capacity for kindness or even competence.

So far in law it is more in using it for research and writing - which is a terrible idea = our students try to use it and it always comes out badly

My H's job in part involves writing and sending out messages to providers (I won't go into the details). Some people at his work have suggested they use AI. But H has said that it would lead to the same amount of work for them (if not more) because they'd have to read through and correct whatever AI came up with.

Have you suspected students of using it before?

For the first part of what you said, Dr. T said the program would delete the audio recording immediately after. But is it still technically floating around somewhere?

And your second part is similar to my concerns. AI doesn't have the judgment or knowledge of a particular client that a therapist has. And I tend to use dark humor--would it get that and realize I was joking and didn't mean whatever I said seriously?

It just seems too risky. I suspect I brought up some issues that Dr. T hadn't even considered, though he also said he's in the early stages of considering such a program. I can't believe I'm the only client who might have an issue with it (though I don't know--I tend to be an outlier in many ways, from what he's said).

I agree!

Out of curiosity, if it's obvious they used it, do they get penalized in any way? Would it be considered plagiarism at all, with it not being their own work? Especially for the writing part.

In school different profs have different rules so it is really up to us as to penalty. But trusting ai to do legal research is much more problematic at this point. Trusting anyone else to read a case you have to present is a bad plan - ai is an even worse plan -more and more lawyers are being caught citing cases for things the case did not say because they relied on some form of ai.

I don't think that the notes part is where the human component comes in. I mean I can understand that some people want a human in the chair across from them - that is the human component I see. The client doesn't even usually see the notes.

I guess I'm forming my opinion on the platform I first looked at. They had an example of the notes it would produce. It was very complete. It seemed like it summarized everything that was said. I don't think that's necessary for notes. Especially if someone, say an insurance company, is reading these notes. They don't need that level of detail. It would feel like an invasion of privacy.

Note Examples

Thanks for sharing the link. Yeah, that is very detailed. I don't like how (in the individual SOAP example) it had things about the client seeing resistant to change, in part because they were saying "I don't know" to some questions. (But then, for all I know, Dr. T is writing something similar in his notes.) I wonder if some of the comments were the AI's interpretation or if whether the therapist was mentioning some of that in session.

I’m never here when you all come out from under the couch cushions to chat. I was here when the couch was mostly just dead for like 2 days. I have terrible timing when I check in here. Hahaha.

LT- The confidentiality/security part of it definitely wouldn’t be a factor for me. You email Dr. T a fair amount-you or him could have been hacked at any moment. Nothing is really all that secure when it comes to the use of technology. When I took the job at the school (almost 2 years ago) all my background checks were submitted electronically and I just got a letter recently in the mail saying my social security number may be compromised from that background check because their system was hacked.

As far as the program’s interpretation of what was said? I assume Dr.T would read it over to make sure the summary of the session is accurate? (I don’t remember if any of the comments suggested that already). You still have a human there with you in the room. Let me know if that changes. I’m curious if T’s will eventually be replaced by robots.
(In my head I have a vision of the maid robot from that 80’s show Small Wonder-except a T).

Omg! I missed the transcribe part of it! I thought Dr. T would put his notes in the program and it summarizes it. I totally missed that.

First, if I’m not allowed to record my sessions, then L or AI can’t either. Second, I don’t want my sessions to be recorded. I don’t want my voice and words out there. Like I don’t even like talking on recorded lines if I don’t have to. And third, yeah, what if the AI summarizes wrong and they just trust the summary. He’ll have to review the summary anyways. He might as well write it himself at that point.

Right? I wonder what time he would be saving by using it? None really unless I’m misunderstanding what the program does.

Cool Whip!

I don’t need anything, just want to make sure we are still here. It’s been super quiet.

Hey Jersey,

How are you doing?
Hope the new job is going well.

I've been around, just unable to find words.

It's been a weird time.

Lost

I’m still here. This week is a tough week. Last week with L. I don’t know how good I’ll be at giving back for the next 3+months. I’ll try, of course. But if all I can do is “thanks” and “hugs”, please know it’s nothing personal and that I do care about you all.

Hugs, Lost.

I get it. You have to do your best to take care of you.

Hey couch. My spouse is facing a big deal health issue, and I'm super stressed, and my new therapist is very rudely and inconveniently on vacation. The thing is, my spouse says that the health issue is her news to share, and she doesn't want me telling people. This is fair. But ALSO it is MY NEWS TOO. It affects me! I need an outlet. Can anyone relate? And yes I see the irony of posting on a public forum about my problem, but no one knows me here and I'm not giving details.