So I know a lot of you have read my posts about my recent online relationship with a guy I've known for quite a while. And some of you may even know that we have been in a bit of a downward spiral since Monday (well, longer if I really look back on it). We tried to communicate, but it just wasn't working, and I finally said last night that I didn't think it was a good idea to continue as I felt I was rationalizing and making excuses, which was what I said I wouldn't do not 24 hours prior to that conversation. He overreacted and blocked me from, I believe, everything.

I just happened to have an appointment with my T this morning and pretty much arrived crying, as I have been all day. I mean, though it was ultimately my choice, no one likes being blocked, and no one likes the disappointment of losing someone you've had contact with for almost 12 years...and I had to pause when I typed that, because it's not losing him as a potential partner which hurts so much. It's losing my friend, and his constant presence on my FB feed, when he'd comment here and there and even check in via message every so often before we tried to make this thing work. I spoke to him over the phone today and he admits blocking was a knee-jerk overreaction, but I told him I just can't rationalize the last 24 hours and I just can't have him in my life anymore. While I care so much for him, I love myself more. I told him I wasn't mad, just very sad. He said, "I know. I'm sorry, honey."

As it turned out, he was just another in a long, long line of emotionally unavailable men that I seem to attract. He didn't seem emotionally unavailable in the beginning, being that he pursued me, and for a long time. But it was as though he needed me to be elusive. The minute he caught me, he stopped trying. And I think, no, I know, I pushed too much. I read some articles today on why I might be attracting unavailable men, and it mentioned that people with a fear of rejection attract those with a fear of engulfment, and vice-versa. Well...that was JD and I to a T. He knew I feared relationships. I knew he did as well. I just didn't realize that his fear didn't stem from rejection, but from losing himself. And all of the pulling away as I pushed, and attempted to get my needs met, and even as I tried to show him affection was just to attempt to maintain his ground and not lose JD. And I feel badly about it, like if I had recognized it earlier, I could have done something differently, changed my behavior, come at things a different way. But that's probably not the case. I could have been less needy (though when invalidation is a trigger, and the man is not validating you at all, I don't know if that's possible), but just as fear of rejection is a dysfunction, so is fear of engulfment. Regardless of if I could have changed my tactics, he is still unavailable.

I'm very sad right now. I miss my friend. I miss having hope that maybe, maybe I'd found my person, because things were pretty good in the beginning. And I feel badly and maybe a little sorry for myself that I am still fighting this stupid rejection demon which will probably never die. And I fear maybe a relationship is just not in the cards for me.

[Artchic528]

I'm sorry you were hurt. I can totally relate. I had a good thing going and I asked for some advice on here and it all fell apart. Maybe I, too, am not meant for a relationship.

Originally Posted by Artchic528

I'm sorry you were hurt. I can totally relate. I had a good thing going and I asked for some advice on here and it all fell apart. Maybe I, too, am not meant for a relationship.

I read that advice, and it was all pretty good, in my opinion.

JD and I had been in contact with each other for 12 years, and we had started talking relationship-wise on 3/17. (Well, actually, we started talking in 2012, but I wasn't into it.) The point is that we knew each other reasonably well before we started talking, just last week, about what we considered the other. We weren't yet necessarily boyfriend/girlfriend, even though we've been talking for almost 2 months. And we weren't planning on meeting until July/August, and I was going to get an AirBnB rental just to take the pressure off. Heck yeah, JD and I flirted via text...now. And yeah, if we had made it until I went down there, he would have probably spent the night and/or vice versa. But we had the option not to. And when he flirted in the beginning, if I didn't like it, I said so, and he would apologize, back off, and begin talking about something more benign.

I guess what I'm saying, with respect, is that I'm really sorry you're feeling badly and that the guy wasn't the one. But the advice was spot on. I would tuck it into your mind and use it going forward.

[Artchic528]

He isn't necessarily out of the question, he texted me today. People here just judged me too quickly. I hate being judged. It's why I don't trust anyone anymore. Not even my own mother.

Now excuse me while I go cry into a pillow.

Originally Posted by Artchic528

He isn't necessarily out of the question, he texted me today. People here just judged me too quickly. I hate being judged. It's why I don't trust anyone anymore. Not even my own mother.

Now excuse me while I go cry into a pillow.

No one is judging you. They are advising you.

I'm sorry if this comes off harsh, but I noticed you posted your own thread about this. Could we keep your issue about this over there, and let my thread be about mine, please?

Thanks.

[divine1966]

I know it's cheesy but oh well. You know that phrase " one day somebody will come to your life and you'll know why it never worked with anyone else". It's going to happen. Maybe later than what we would like but it will. With somebody you won't need to pursue or push or struggle through but rather just be content . Sure maybe it would be nice to have that at 25 not at whatever age it happens but it will happens nonetheless. Hang in there ruari.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Originally Posted by divine1966

I know it's cheesy but oh well. You know that phrase " one day somebody will come to your life and you'll know why it never worked with anyone else". It's going to happen. Maybe later than what we would like but it will. With somebody you won't need to pursue or push or struggle through but rather just be content . Sure maybe it would be nice to have that at 25 not at whatever age it happens but it will happens nonetheless. Hang in there ruari.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Nah, it's not cheesy. It's just that's the way it looked with JD in the beginning. I know, rationally, that it wouldn't have worked between us, not with our current issues (and the fact that he is not currently in therapy). But I'm beating myself up tonight thinking that it's all my fault. If I had just acted this way, if I had just done this, if I had just not done that, if I had just been less available overall (even though he texted me constantly). I know beating myself up is silly. But I have had many times where I've been in this pattern with an afraid of entanglement man who went from me right to the woman he ended up marrying (or in a committed relationship with because they had a kid). It would hurt so much if that happened, here. Though, I guess I wouldn't know it, hey?

I'm 38 damn years old, haha. I want to get married and still have a good chunk of life left to spend it with a good man. Maybe the ship has sailed on children, but I do want to be someone's wife at some point. Maybe it will happen, maybe it won't. I am not losing hope, per se, I'm just getting very weary, and my heart is worn out.

[Confusedinomicon]

My SO can be emotionally unavailable, too, but it has more to do with fear of vunerability, communication styles and growing up in a world where there is stigma for men to be vulnerable in that way.

A lot of the way people communicate in relationships is learned and expectations are the same.

And Art, I fully disagree with that statement and am sorry you feel that way. :/

Originally Posted by Confusedinomicon

My SO can be emotionally unavailable, too, but it has more to do with fear of vunerability, communication styles and growing up in a world where there is stigma for men to be vulnerable in that way.

A lot of the way people communicate in relationships is learned and expectations are the same.

I agree with this.

My friend says that all men are emotionally unavailable, to some degree. (Sorry, guys, that's just her opinion.) I think what she means is that boys are raised to be more withholding when it comes to feelings. And I do agree with that. Girls are encouraged to talk about feelings, to cry it out, to express. Boys aren't. So they feel the same things we feel, have the same vulnerability...they just don't express it like we do. And since I didn't grow up with men, at all, none, I don't really know how to approach the differences. I almost think that I'm dead in the water, so to speak, when it comes to relationships, because of this.

Ugh. Really. I'm not hopeless. I do think there is someone out there. Every heartbreak, every disappointment, I am learning and growing. I just wish it didn't have to be so hard, and I didn't have to lose people I really like (and who were actually my friends) along the way. This sucks.

[eskielover]

I think 12 years of only connecting on FB & messaging isn't a good thing to hang one's hopes on for marriage. You need someone REALLY "in your life" on a daily basis. I learned that the void of the unknowing between the knowing are true indicators that there is really nothing there as far as real relationship goes.

Learned that in high school back in 1970 long before Internet to give me false hopes...lol..I created my own via snail mail. I met this nice guy on the train trip from Ca to Kansas when I was in junior high. He lived in Ohio. We wrote to each other all the time & then in fall of my senior year in high school the Christian music group he played in came to Ca & we got to get together. Lol....I even took a day off from school & spent a rainy day at Disneyland together. He was as nice as he had been on the train & we had such a wonderful time together. I went to their concert & spent good time connecting. Hmmmm, back in those days, we talked about going steady long distance Ca-Ohio really long distance. We wrote & had plans for getting together safer we both graduated from high school that next summer.

Lol..the beginning of the summer...after prom & all the other things it would have been nice to have a real bf to do the activities with....I got a dear John letter from John telling me that he was getting married & that he had met this girl in school. I wrote him back wishing him a nice life kicking myself for having been so gullible & naive. Determined then that I was going to be my own successful person & never allow myself to ever be defined by who I got married to. Lol...I got a letter from him a few months later whining at how bad his marriage was & what a mistake he had made. I wrote him a "poor baby" letter telling him that he made his choice he needed to learn how to live with it....so glad that it wasn't me in that girls place.

The point is that without close contact with a person & the ability to connect with their body language....we really don't know them. Sometimes guys we live with we never really get to know if there is no real emotional connection. Found that out the hard way also. ASD (Asperger's ) wasn't even known about in 1975 & parents marriage never had emotional connection to learn what normal was. I spent 33 years in that marriage. Only after I finally escaped that I was able to learn what was missing. If we constantly wonder about the person & continually place our assumptions into the picture....there IS SOMETHING WRONG with the relationship & it's best to not waste time on it. Sadly being alone is so much better than being in a relation where REAL connection doesn't exist.

Know you want to find someone to share life with...that is a NORMAL feeling....but honestly, being alone is a lot less stressful (even when you can't get jar lids open) than living in a marriage where there is no emotional connection or staying in a relationship where there is constant questions about where it stands & placing our own assumptions in there to make us feel better about it.

If you don't find that right person, learn how to live a happy life on your own, finding activities that fill your need for being needed & for giving to others.

Originally Posted by eskielover

I think 12 years of only connecting on FB & messaging isn't a good thing to hang one's hopes on for marriage. You need someone REALLY "in your life" on a daily basis. I learned that the void of the unknowing between the knowing are true indicators that there is really nothing there as far as real relationship goes.

Learned that in high school back in 1970 long before Internet to give me false hopes...lol..I created my own via snail mail. I met this nice guy on the train trip from Ca to Kansas when I was in junior high. He lived in Ohio. We wrote to each other all the time & then in fall of my senior year in high school the Christian music group he played in came to Ca & we got to get together. Lol....I even took a day off from school & spent a rainy day at Disneyland together. He was as nice as he had been on the train & we had such a wonderful time together. I went to their concert & spent good time connecting. Hmmmm, back in those days, we talked about going steady long distance Ca-Ohio really long distance. We wrote & had plans for getting together safer we both graduated from high school that next summer.

Lol..the beginning of the summer...after prom & all the other things it would have been nice to have a real bf to do the activities with....I got a dear John letter from John telling me that he was getting married & that he had met this girl in school. I wrote him back wishing him a nice life kicking myself for having been so gullible & naive. Determined then that I was going to be my own successful person & never allow myself to ever be defined by who I got married to. Lol...I got a letter from him a few months later whining at how bad his marriage was & what a mistake he had made. I wrote him a "poor baby" letter telling him that he made his choice he needed to learn how to live with it....so glad that it wasn't me in that girls place.

The point is that without close contact with a person & the ability to connect with their body language....we really don't know them. Sometimes guys we live with we never really get to know if there is no real emotional connection. Found that out the hard way also. ASD (Asperger's ) wasn't even known about in 1975 & parents marriage never had emotional connection to learn what normal was. I spent 33 years in that marriage. Only after I finally escaped that I was able to learn what was missing. If we constantly wonder about the person & continually place our assumptions into the picture....there IS SOMETHING WRONG with the relationship & it's best to not waste time on it. Sadly being alone is so much better than being in a relation where REAL connection doesn't exist.

Know you want to find someone to share life with...that is a NORMAL feeling....but honestly, being alone is a lot less stressful (even when you can't get jar lids open) than living in a marriage where there is no emotional connection or staying in a relationship where there is constant questions about where it stands & placing our own assumptions in there to make us feel better about it.

If you don't find that right person, learn how to live a happy life on your own, finding activities that fill your need for being needed & for giving to others.

Oh, no no. I wasn't hanging my hopes on him for marriage. I am looking forward to being married someday. I think that one should know what they want out of a relationship, especially at a certain age. I went into this telling him that I was past the age where I was dating just to fool around and have fun, that my intentions were more pointed. I told him that I wasn't looking for commitment from him day one, but I told him what I wanted out of relationships in general and said that if this is something he felt he never could do, then we probably shouldn't waste each other's time. I think this is fair, and he felt that he wanted to continue. There's more to the story, but it doesn't really matter so I won't go into it.

One of my friends/coworkers and her husband had that discussion on their second date. They sat down and said this is what I want, this is what I don't want, okay, me too, and they chose to continue. They are in their 30's. I'm 38. I don't know, maybe I'm wrong, maybe people disagree with me. I think it just makes sense. I don't feel like guessing at another person's expectations regarding that at this point in my life. If that scares a man off, he's definitely not the one, haha.

PS I have a very happy and full life on my own! I learned how to live this life years ago. Thanks for the advice.

[bluekoi]

This is a gentle reminder asking all to please stay on topic and post supportively, or this thread may risk future closure.

[LiteraryLark]

Originally Posted by eskielover

I think 12 years of only connecting on FB & messaging isn't a good thing to hang one's hopes on for marriage. You need someone REALLY "in your life" on a daily basis. I learned that the void of the unknowing between the knowing are true indicators that there is really nothing there as far as real relationship goes.

Learned that in high school back in 1970 long before Internet to give me false hopes...lol..I created my own via snail mail. I met this nice guy on the train trip from Ca to Kansas when I was in junior high. He lived in Ohio. We wrote to each other all the time & then in fall of my senior year in high school the Christian music group he played in came to Ca & we got to get together. Lol....I even took a day off from school & spent a rainy day at Disneyland together. He was as nice as he had been on the train & we had such a wonderful time together. I went to their concert & spent good time connecting. Hmmmm, back in those days, we talked about going steady long distance Ca-Ohio really long distance. We wrote & had plans for getting together safer we both graduated from high school that next summer.

Lol..the beginning of the summer...after prom & all the other things it would have been nice to have a real bf to do the activities with....I got a dear John letter from John telling me that he was getting married & that he had met this girl in school. I wrote him back wishing him a nice life kicking myself for having been so gullible & naive. Determined then that I was going to be my own successful person & never allow myself to ever be defined by who I got married to. Lol...I got a letter from him a few months later whining at how bad his marriage was & what a mistake he had made. I wrote him a "poor baby" letter telling him that he made his choice he needed to learn how to live with it....so glad that it wasn't me in that girls place.

The point is that without close contact with a person & the ability to connect with their body language....we really don't know them. Sometimes guys we live with we never really get to know if there is no real emotional connection. Found that out the hard way also. ASD (Asperger's ) wasn't even known about in 1975 & parents marriage never had emotional connection to learn what normal was. I spent 33 years in that marriage. Only after I finally escaped that I was able to learn what was missing. If we constantly wonder about the person & continually place our assumptions into the picture....there IS SOMETHING WRONG with the relationship & it's best to not waste time on it. Sadly being alone is so much better than being in a relation where REAL connection doesn't exist.

Know you want to find someone to share life with...that is a NORMAL feeling....but honestly, being alone is a lot less stressful (even when you can't get jar lids open) than living in a marriage where there is no emotional connection or staying in a relationship where there is constant questions about where it stands & placing our own assumptions in there to make us feel better about it.

If you don't find that right person, learn how to live a happy life on your own, finding activities that fill your need for being needed & for giving to others.

Awww, that sounds like a Nicolas Sparks/The Notebook movie that went sour. It started out so beautifully, so sorry that it ended the way it did. Hugs!

As for the OP, if I can place my input I have had two heartbreaking endings to two very close friendships of both my best friends within days of each other. I cried for weeks, then became very angry, then very sad and lonely. One best friend I had known since middle school, and the other friend was the first person I had been intimate with.

I don't know your full story, but my advice is to breathe and let your feelings out. Write down your feelings on pen and paper. I think that's the best way. Try some meditating as well. But let yourself grieve, don't force it inside.

[FeelingHopeful]

Ruari , I'm sooo sorry In in a similar situation where my friend/ possible more maybe sutation? Of 15 yrs , doesn't speak to me �� I'm here if you need to talk im soo very sorry , hang in there, I'm here if you need to talk!

Thanks.

I'm devolving a little bit. I was holding it together pretty well for most of the day, breaking down a little bit here and there. When I spoke to him this afternoon, I felt a little better. Just hearing his voice and hearing him say he overreacted, and the "I know. I'm sorry, honey," felt like closure. Because I knew he meant it. But then I overthought it and my brain is like, well he was probably just humoring me, he's probably so glad to be rid of me, he probably actually has another woman on the sidelines giving him what he really needs, what I didn't, what I couldn't because I wasn't there...so much stuff that doesn't really make sense in light of everything. Except for his relief; he probably is relieved. I know I am, in a way. That shyt was getting stressful. I miss him, but I don't miss the anxiety.

I do miss feeling wanted, liked, and desired. But if I'm honest, I haven't consistently felt that from him in a while.

I'm just sad.

I am going to a Garth Brooks/Trisha Yearwood concert tomorrow with some friends, though, and I'm trying to focus on how fun that will be. And I am eating a pint of ice cream (yes, a pint, do not judge ) and it is yummy.

[LiteraryLark]

Originally Posted by Ruari

Thanks.

I'm devolving a little bit. I was holding it together pretty well for most of the day, breaking down a little bit here and there. When I spoke to him this afternoon, I felt a little better. Just hearing his voice and hearing him say he overreacted, and the "I know. I'm sorry, honey," felt like closure. Because I knew he meant it. But then I overthought it and my brain is like, well he was probably just humoring me, he's probably so glad to be rid of me, he probably actually has another woman on the sidelines giving him what he really needs, what I didn't, what I couldn't because I wasn't there...so much stuff that doesn't really make sense in light of everything. Except for his relief; he probably is relieved. I know I am, in a way. That shyt was getting stressful. I miss him, but I don't miss the anxiety.

I do miss feeling wanted, liked, and desired. But if I'm honest, I haven't consistently felt that from him in a while.

I'm just sad.

I am going to a Garth Brooks/Trisha Yearwood concert tomorrow with some friends, though, and I'm trying to focus on how fun that will be. And I am eating a pint of ice cream (yes, a pint, do not judge ) and it is yummy.

awww (((hugs)))

I would be very cautious until you feel comfortable with how the relationship is going. Don't be so easy to accept the apology...He should know how much you've been hurting, and he very well should prove to you that he is serious about your friendship.

Originally Posted by LiteraryLark

awww (((hugs)))

I would be very cautious until you feel comfortable with how the relationship is going. Don't be so easy to accept the apology...He should know how much you've been hurting, and he very well should prove to you that he is serious about your friendship.

We're not friends; I don't want a friendship, as I only see a cycle of us both being sucked into something more emotional and then pushing each other away, repeatedly. It was for a different reason that I spoke to him this afternoon.

I told him I wished we could have parted on more amicable terms, but I didn't think that was possible right now, and I couldn't rationalize the behavior of the last 24 hours. His reply to that was just, "I know."

[eskielover]

And I am eating a pint of ice cream (yes, a pint, do not judge ) and it is yummy.

oh my gosh....how could anyone judge eating ice cream????? That is the solution to everything when I feel bad. It's about the only thing I feel like eating at times like that.

It is sad when you are in a friendship with hopes for maybe more & then even the friendship is ended when the "even more" doesn't work out.

I did date a guy in college who was way too controlling but I enjoyed horseback riding with him (met in the college equatation class I took for 2 years), enjoyed a movie/play & dinner once in awhile. I made it clear up front I didn't want a bf/gf relationship....just friends. I think he wished for more, but we stayed friends after I got married & after he got married, divorced, & remarried again.

I do understand how you would miss his friendship & just his presence in your life after being there for that long. It leaves a hole & empty feeling of being cared about even at the friendship level.

Enjoy your concert & keep your focus on your present while there to enjoy your experience....eat a pint of ice cream for me. I ran out last weekend & haven't had time to go to the store to shop for my ice cream. I made pudding but it's just not the same.....

[LiteraryLark]

Originally Posted by Ruari

We're not friends; I don't want a friendship, as I only see a cycle of us both being sucked into something more emotional and then pushing each other away, repeatedly. It was for a different reason that I spoke to him this afternoon.

I told him I wished we could have parted on more amicable terms, but I didn't think that was possible right now, and I couldn't rationalize the behavior of the last 24 hours. His reply to that was just, "I know."

Enjoy your ice cream and watch a good movie (not sure whether or not tearjerkers are good, but if you feel like crying, you watch that tearjerker!) I'm watching Wizard of Oz and it makes me sad, because it's a movie my former best friend and I would watch over and over, but too great a movie to avoid watching. But alas, it's not the same.

[divine1966]

Originally Posted by Ruari

Oh, no no. I wasn't hanging my hopes on him for marriage. I am looking forward to being married someday. I think that one should know what they want out of a relationship, especially at a certain age. I went into this telling him that I was past the age where I was dating just to fool around and have fun, that my intentions were more pointed. I told him that I wasn't looking for commitment from him day one, but I told him what I wanted out of relationships in general and said that if this is something he felt he never could do, then we probably shouldn't waste each other's time. I think this is fair, and he felt that he wanted to continue. There's more to the story, but it doesn't really matter so I won't go into it.

One of my friends/coworkers and her husband had that discussion on their second date. They sat down and said this is what I want, this is what I don't want, okay, me too, and they chose to continue. They are in their 30's. I'm 38. I don't know, maybe I'm wrong, maybe people disagree with me. I think it just makes sense. I don't feel like guessing at another person's expectations regarding that at this point in my life. If that scares a man off, he's definitely not the one, haha.

PS I have a very happy and full life on my own! I learned how to live this life years ago. Thanks for the advice.

It's not wrong to discuss early on what people want. We discussed what we want out of a relationship after first few dates ( as a general idea of course, not marrying each other), if either one of us said that marriage is out of the question then we wouldn't continue. I think it's perfectly fine thing to do and is very different than proposing to each other right away.

I don't believe it scares anyone off unless they aren't seriously inclined. Most men who want to be in
a committed relationship are up front about it too.

[healingme4me]

One thing that comes to mind is there's no need for you to be in a position where he plays the upper hand and gets to just put you on ignore as he feels fit.

The hemming and hawing wasn't necessary.

Perhaps his not being involved in therapy along with even not stopping himself from conversing while intoxicated plays a bigger role than imagined?

I've had someone bring past baggage, won't tolerate from me what they tolerated from another, albeit a once or twice thing from me whereas an all the time thing from others. So keep in mind this might not be about you, as much as unresolved issues from previous relationships.

[eskielover]

I actually spelled out all my expectations I had going into marriage after recognizing the red flags (think in hopes he would want to back out) he agreed to everything with a "no problem". I asked him to spell out all his expectations & got absolutely nothing..."no idea". I should have added that to the red flag pile.

Every expectation I had was challenged by him after we got married. When I finally left I asked him why he had agreed to everything. He said he thought I would change my mind after we were married.

So you don't always get honest answers when things are brought up initially.....BUT I had no idea that he had serious communication problems due to limitations that even a high IQ didn't fix & he was incapable of emotionally connecting for the same reason.

Sometimes unknown mental conditions can make a huge difference & there is no way of knowing these things when they are rather subtle until more problems arise over time (years)

Originally Posted by divine1966

It's not wrong to discuss early on what people want. We discussed what we want out of a relationship after first few dates ( as a general idea of course, not marrying each other), if either one of us said that marriage is out of the question then we wouldn't continue. I think it's perfectly fine thing to do and is very different than proposing to each other right away.

I don't believe it scares anyone off unless they aren't seriously inclined. Most men who want to be in
a committed relationship are up front about it too.

Thanks for this.

I do remember the conversation vaguely. It was way back in March or the beginning of April. He didn't expressly say "I, too, am looking to get married," and maybe that should have been my indication that I was headed down the wrong path. But I also didn't ask him to say that. I said how I felt, and he said, "I understand," which he said a lot, come to think of it, and I told him if that wasn't something he felt he could jive with, he shouldn't continue with me, and he said, "Okay," then said he wasn't leaving. The conversation continued on to vaguely talking about the fact that I had vascillated between wanting children and not, and that it wasn't an absolute for me, at this point, but I still consider it. He said, hesitantly, that he'd thought of having another child over the years. His only one is 13, heh, that'd be a big change. At the time I didn't see any red flags. I think, in those early stages, I was the more unavailable one. Which, again, looking back, was what worked for him: someone who wasn't as...much...as I got to be.

Did I tell you that what really ended it was that I found out he had blocked my calls? Even as we were in a good place? The reason I called this afternoon was (go ahead and call me crazy; I just had to know) because I wanted to confirm that suspicion. I called from my cell--it rang and then said it was disconnected (just as it had when I called right during our jovial text discussion. When I said something about it, he played dumb). Then I called from a landline. He answered. With the area code, he knew it was me. And I confronted him on what I suspected, and he confirmed it. He said he had turned off voicemail to me at some point and just forgot to turn it back on. When asked why he said, "I just didn't want to be bothered." So he previously admitted to pausing notifications on our texts and FB messages, but that was, I thought, only when I was going through the shyt with work and could get super anxious and excitable. But now he admitted to turning off voicemail (which I've actually never, ever left)...so, even though he messaged me of his own accord all day sometimes, I wonder how much he actually muted me. It really was everything on his terms, and as long as I fit into his box. And I do believe that he felt strongly about me, or he wouldn't have kept coming back (for a man who isn't getting sex or much other gratification, there is no reason to do so). And I do believe he felt badly about hurting me, because I heard it in his voice today. But I also felt badly about pushing him; it made me feel awful sometimes. Sometimes, as I was doing it, I felt a certain sort of self-loathing. Doesn't mean I'd ever have stopped. So I guess it doesn't really matter what he felt for me, or vice versa, our demons are bigger.

Anyway. Sorry. I'm chattering too much. I'm probably purging a little bit. Maybe I should journal more. Typing is just easier.

[divine1966]

My t says it's pointless to try to figure out why people do what they do. We might never get the answer. We can only try to understand ourselves and what and why we do.

She also said that some people are so unhealthy and unwell that whatever they are doing is indication of them being unhealthy not indication how they feel about us. And guessing why they do this or that is a waste of time. It totally made sense to me. I used to ponder why so and so did this or that.

This conversation with her started because someone I knew for awhile ( in real life but not in romantic capacity), started very actively pursuing me asking to date me. I wasn't sure if I was ready as I just left my ex of 9 years and moved out but I knew the person being nice so I thought maybe I'll consider it slowly. But something was off.

He would call and text all day but if i called him he wouldn't pick up the phone. Hm and often will not call back until next day. He only wanted to have weeknight dates never weekend. He always wanted date by my house which was fishy to me.

But he repeatedly told me how excited he was of possibility dating me and how awesome I am and how gorgeous and smart etc and pretty much professed his feelings all day long.

I decided against it as something felt off and actions speak louder than words plus I worked too much to be able to have weeknight dates. And wasn't reAlly ready

He was first begging to not write him off and then got nasty with me.

Fast forward I found out shortly after that he had a long term girlfriend the entire time, like a serious one. Probably still does. I was glad I didn't end up dating him but what an a....so I didn't want to date him and he got nasty but he already had a gf!!! So he wanted 2?

That's when my t told me to not bother figuring out why he does what he does. People do all kind of things. We can only focus on ourselves. I was so glad i never started dating him and especially getting intimate because what a mess would that be!

I know it's irrelevant but he said " I understand" a lot too. Whenever he didn't want to down right lie or say something what would caused me to run, he said " I understand".

Bottom line is don't worry why he did what he did. Do what's right for you.


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You know, I have been feeling pretty good about everything...except I've had this nagging suspicion in the back of my mind that there was someone else this whole time.

I think that suspicion may have been correct.