Hot-Cold, Pursuer - Distancer, Rescheduling

Ugh, I think I already know the answer to my own question. However, I am in a confused state (which is an obvious red flag). Please set me straight!

I met this woman in May. We had a great day together! We spent about 4 hours and all went very smoothly. We were both sort of pleasantly surprised.

Date 2 was even more amazing. We took a walk and had lunch. We locked eyes and dropped in the moment with each other. Time flew by on both dates.

3rd date she blew me off 3 times in 1 night! It's a long story.

Then we were going to go to a concert together. It was loosely planned. At the end of the day, she canceled due to scheduling conflicts.

It's now July 11th. Last week we scheduled to meet up this Saturday. Guess what? She can't make it and wants to reschedule for next Thursday.

At this point I don't feel so great about her. It's obvious my time isn't a consideration for her. Sure she apologizes and all, but it things don't feel right. No doubt I feel she is making power plays, in her insecure and unconscious kind of way.

But when we are together, it's absolutely smooth and it feels right. I really like this woman. When we are together I feel really alive with her. Even when we text, we laugh our asses off all the time! It's quite fun.

But man, making a date with her is daunting! I mentioned to her that I feel we are in a hot-cold, push-pull like situation and would like to transcend it. She came back with that she feels like we are in a pursuer - distancer like situation; me being the pursuer.

I really like this woman. I like spending time with her in person. Why is it such a cluster**** just trying to make a date with her? Ugh!

Please shed light on this for me! Thank you!

Is she enjoying this set-up? And doing it intentionally? I might've dabbled in the occasional mind game for the sake of amusement, but what she's doing seems childish and annoying. I'd get some clarification first on what she means by the above statement and why she's playing distant, but I'd be wary of this statement and of her.

No doubt I'm very wary of her and it sucks; thus the confused state I am in.

I'm not sure she is aware of what she is doing? According to her the pursuer-distancer is an old story of hers with her ex. When she blew me off for the concert her explanation was she felt pressured from me. I have never told her, but there was a lot going on behind the scenes, regarding the kind of tickets we would get, who we would sit with, rides etc. She said when I said, "ok, take care" and let go of the idea of us going to the concert; she felt like a weight had been lifted off her.

She is a spiritual person, so I can discuss anything with her. I'm mindful of not placing blame on her and share the responsibility that we are co-creating this situation. So I take ownership of my part, which feels pretty much like a doormat.

How about just meeting up with her and seeing where the day goes, rather than making concrete plans? That might be less stress for both of you. Just ask her to come for a walk.

Do YOU think your time is valuable?

Let her choose the date. Maybe she'll feel more comfortable if she has a sense of control.

No doubt it feels like a control thing. But there seems more to it. She's never expressed her feelings to me. I feel like simply asking her, but that probably be too much pressure? There also seems to be a lack of empathy and moreover, it feels like a lack of interest.

I'm an open person and when I tell her a little bit how I feel. It seems like she becomes less interested or she becomes distant! So confusing!

I'm just wondering if I am dealing with bigger issues here?

Since you are not officially boyfriend/ girlfriend, is it possible that she is exploring her options...meaning, the reason behind her rescheduling is because she has other dates to juggle?

The way I see it, you only had 3 dates. She isn’t that interested to continue dating you, which isn’t uncommon. She is not a direct person and wouldn’t say it to you directly, instead she is vague in hopes you get a message.

It could be also that she has other options and trying to navigate bunch of dating options. She makes plans with you but when someone else asks her out, she cancels on you. But she doesn’t want to completely drop you yet just in case.

If people are interested in you, they have no issue with planning dates and honoring commitments. They can’t wait to see you. Not the case here. I’d stop pursuing her. She just isn’t interested.

Trust me I have thought about that too, dating others. But I keep coming back to when we spend time together. It just feels right. And I know she is feeling it too. And of course, when I pull away, she pulls me back.

I guess it's time to let go. What would be a mature way of breaking this off.? Admittedly, I am very poor at making breaks.

edit - First 2 dates were effortless. Now I feel exhausted.

Avoid phone conversation, as it is easier to be pulled back in this way than via text. Next time she texts you, let her know that you really enjoyed the time together but you wish to move on for personal reasons and you wish her the best.

After that, you don't need to respond to her whatever she writes. If you respond, you would end up in an endless back and forth. As long as you show her the courtesy to be upfront rather than ignore her, that's enough. You don't owe her an explanation because nothing was official and you barely know her, having met her a couple of months ago and gone on three dates.

You don’t know what she is feeling. If she is being social and friendly etc it doesn’t mean she wants to continue dating. I’ve been on dates when men thought it will be happily ever after just because I was nice to them and polite, they were surprised I wasn’t interested in another date. It takes more than just having good time

Dating is also a number game. If she goes on dates with several people she might be just choosing more suitable options.

There is no need to make breaks. It’s not a relationship.

You went on couple of dates quite awhile ago and she wasn’t interested in meeting since. So stop pursuing her. If her other plans fall through and she starts pursuing you, just tell her you moved on.

I recommend treating first few dates as just getting to know someone, don’t treat it as “meant to be dream come true” etc Give it time

Well, actually, she put out a lot of mixed signals. We talked a lot about taoist sex and more so Karezza. And of course, that kind of conversation would pull me in. She was into push - pulling but had zero awareness of it; no thank you.

Sorry, no, "she's the one" bs fantasies here. I'm long over the Walt Disney version of "romance". I feel she wanted me to pursue her. That's an old story for me. I'm very good at it, but it never ends well. I basically now have an acute awareness of when my primal self takes over. I can turn it off now. I no longer want to have unconscious "mating" sex. I want to be conscious now. I want to bond with someone. While she talked a good game about this with me. Her unconscious actions spoke more loudly. I simply wanted to transcend the bs we were co-creating. Simply put, she couldn't see it.

I told her I was bowing out of the chase. She seemed confused and moreover pissed. Truth be told, I feel so much better!!! Relieved!
As much as I like her; I feel I dodged a bullet.

I think this is the first time I simply walked away. It feels good to make a mature decision. Thank you all for your input and wisdom.

@divine1966 thanks again for your input on these forums. I find social, friendly, polite often gets interpreted as interest also. Your post reminds me that it's important to say out loud, "I am not interested in having another date". Ack, so simple and I don't know what blocks me from communicating correctly! Note to self once again.
I guess actually what stops me is that once all the hormones and love stuff start flowing I become ambivalent even when I know that I am not interested.
There is also ambivalence if we have common interests so I might want to carry on a friendship in future but not a date.

I have a load of work to do on friendships, relationships, boundaries and such yes/ no communication issues. Ack, and double ack, but thanks for the useful pointers .

Am I the only one who thinks this is strange? I've seen guys like this and I wonder if women in their daily lives treat them like garbage because it's like they've never seen simple etiquette before.

I think it's more likely that they see what they want to see. If two different women showed them the exact same behavior, the one they're attracted to would be expressing her undying love to him, while the one they're not attracted to they barely even noticed.

Sounds like you did.

Im glad you are finding it helpful! Sending you hugs

I have to say that sometimes being direct could be unsafe so there are times when it’s better to say something via electronic communication.

I once was on a very bad date and when I responded to him asking me on a second date politely declining, he behaved in a very aggressive manner. Luckily we were in a public place. But for a moment I thought “dang it I wish I didn’t endanger myself like this”.

When it’s not a relationship but just few dates it might be ok to say nothing since it could be unsafe to be direct! Especially if the other person is adamant they have some kind of feelings for me after just a date or a few! That could be scary

I don’t think it’s that. I think that many men and women lack insight, ability to reflect and basic observation skills. They just don’t know what they are looking at: basic courtesy or a meaningful connection.

I’ve met women who thought a man is about to propose when he just wanted booty call or maybe not even that and he was clear and honest about it. And they still thought he is about to buy a ring. when people are desperate for love, they become blind to common sense and are in complete denial of what’s really going on.

Desperation is a sure way to a disaster. And it happens to the best of us. Men and women. Clarity escapes us when we only see what we want to see because we want something so badly.

Interesting. I've done the entire spectrum of "No," from white lying my way out of the situation - yes, I have a boyfriend, yes, I have somewhere I need to be, yes, you can have my number *gives fake number* - to threatening someone with a shovel.

In my experience, there has been no "correct" response to such aggressive advances. They understood the "soft no" perfectly fine. They merely refused to accept it and hoped that escalation would wear me down (it didn't).

I hear you. I can write a book about people pursuing me after I was very very clear that I have zero interest. And I am not ambivalent or unclear. I am blunt to a fault and still quiet significant number of people refused to get the message. And it’s not generational or age or location. My daughter had identical experiences and we obviously not same age lol and don’t live in the same area

I also think some people have hard time with rejection and can’t accept that someone just isn’t interested. They are convinced that they just have to do or say something and people will change their mind.

I get it. It's tough being a beauty and having men chase you all the time. I'm sure for those women that possess great beauty; men are a damn nuisance! Moreover, you tell them flat out "no!" and they want you even more! To me this is all about the primal chase; "The mating game", if you will. It's all very unconscious and driven by the hard wiring of our DNA. It's like if I never had a choice. But now I feel I do.

I guess I should have prefaced this in my original post. I'm 54 and have had some awakening around this topic. Thankfully my testosterone is no longer raging like it use to and I can finally think with my head and heart vs the little head in my pants!

I got lucky, another women came into my life. Let's call her A. A is simply a considerate, kind and thoughtful person. She doesn't get my juices flowing like the woman who is the topic of this thread, let's call her R.

R and I hit it off and took off like a rocket ship. I personally think this scared her as it did me! For me it was the typical pattern of lust; of the fall in love then fall out of love pattern. Which to me is not love at all. For the most part, R is a somewhat aware and evolved woman. She is also very beautiful on the outside. But I think she had zero awareness that we were in a push-pull situation. Especially after I mentioned it, immediately she deflected any co-responsibility and squarely placed the blame on me. It was the last red flag for me.

Sorry, don't have a lot of time to write this. I'll cut to the point. In short, A was simply considerate and mindful of me and my feelings. After dealing with R I was sooooo thankful for A's kindness and moreover thoughtfulness. It made me aware of how I would like to be treated. Which I wasn't getting from R, but boy was she beautiful! I feel I make lots of excuses for beautiful women. I believe this is caused by my primal drive to want to "mate" with them. Initially, I was not nearly as attracted physically to A as I am to R. But once I released myself from R and walked away. It gave me more space to appreciate A as a person. And as each day goes by I become more and more attracted to her, because of her personality or essence of being, if you will. In short, A is a really sweet person and it really turns me on! Am I finally growing up?!

In conclusion, I am trying to move to more of a bonding situation sexually. In short, sex without the goal of orgasm. So the whole primal, autopilot thing is about the chase and mating with someone. To me, a lot of that happens unconsciously. And at some point, we awaken and ask ourselves. "What am I doing with this person?"

I'm simply trying to go another direction.

Edit: Just realizing I was feeling attached to certain projections I had made regarding being with R. So of course I own that! I did that to myself. And then I un-did it! Once again, so relieved, energetically feel so much better now that I have freed myself. Letting go and surrender is now my go to when I get hung up. And, yes, I got myself hung up. It's so much easier when you own your stuff.

I most certainly not a beauty. Just ok. Plus am quite older. I don’t think it matters though. It takes more than looks

I think you might want to reflect on falling for women whom you don’t even know. If after 3 dates (and only two were good) you are that crazy about a woman, what’s really going on? Are you focusing on lust rather than other aspects?

I’d also look into reasons behind your assumptions that a woman is crazy about you and is head over heels and just doesn’t want to see you for some other reasons. That’s why I brought up examples of many men convinced that I am just as interested as them when it was not the case at all.

I feel you really didn't understand what I was trying to say. (Feeling attacked)

1) Never said I was "falling" for this woman. "Crazy" yes, like I was doubting my intuition. Again, a major red flag. I walked away after 2 dates. Very proud of that!

2) I felt manipulated. This wasn't an, "I'm in love what do I?" post.

3) When a woman talks about sex with me and looks me directly in the eyes and says. "I don't think I've ever really made "love" before." and the topic at hand is conscious loving. I guess when a woman talks like this and looks me directly in the eyes; I assume she is interested in me. Perhaps I was being too assumptive?

Furthermore, she did make future plans with me for this Thursday. "I've saved this day just for you." I just felt like I was being jerked around. After she canceled this Saturday on me. When I was rearranging my schedule (once again) that's when realized I had done this before; only for her to change plans. Due to another woman treating me fairly. I awoke to how I was being manipulated and moreover devalued.

4) Lastly, lust is not driving me anymore and for that I am very grateful. Thus, I was able to walk away and feel GREAT about it! I feel so much better now that I am no longer involved with her.

I feel perhaps you are projecting some of your own experiences with men onto me and my situation.

zeninfinity, good for you for walking away from her. Her behavior was a red flag, and her saying that she felt you guys were in some sort distancer / pursuer situation, where she's the distancer, was also a red flag as well as very telling of who she is and what she's like in dating. The fact that you feel much better now? That's your gut saying thank you.

Thank you so much for your vote of confidence! It means a lot to me!

In my last conversation with her she revealed that she is just 7 months out of a relationship. I thought she hadn't dated in 3 years, just like me. We talked about how cool it was that we were in the same situation (not dating in 3 years). I guess she forgot that conversation! Lol! She went on to say she dated they guy "on and off" for 2 years, she said it was really volatile. "On and off"? "Volatile"? Then the major reveal, she has been married twice. "This was the first guy I felt love for."

....and off I ran. Again, dodged a bullet.

I guess the major accomplishment is that I finally listened to my intuition.

Instead of my primal self (lust) overriding red flags. I was finally able to hear my intuition and CHOSE to go with it.

Again Ptak, thank you so much for your encouraging words! Really appreciate it!

No. The "primal self" narrative is a load of evo-psych nonsense. If I tell you "no," you better back off, or you're going to see what a real social predator looks like.