Co-existing with Extroverts at Work - Got Tips?

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Originally Posted by Tart Cherry Jam The manager is crazy when she says that being efficient is less important. Her ideas about what constitutes a healthy work culture are bizarre.

Would be interesting to see what all the other people think about the work culture. If it works for the majority & they are good with it & only the OP has a problem then who are we to judge someone's ideas bizarre. If everyone is having problems that would be one thing but if they are all ok with the company environment.....the "new kid on the block" has no right to change what has been working for them before she was hired. Don't like the environment, don't participate but don't expect to fit in within the established company norms either.

If no one likes the way the company socializes within the work environment then you all need to get together & talk about it & change it.

Sometimes landing in the wrong work environment is a learning experience for what we want to interview a company about in the future. Interviews are not just about whether they want us to do the job but also for us to know if we want to work for them. You now know what doesn't work for you.

If her management style works for that company & they are a successful company & the long time people working there are happy & get the work done then who are we to judge the management style. If not successful then the company will replace her because profit is always the bottom line with the owners of the company.

Thanks again everyone. I've already re-activated my profile on some freelance sites. I know that "engagement" is the corporate buzz word right now, but there seems to be a lack of diversity here. The concept seems to focus solely on collaboration, team building, and recognition... all of which don't matter much to me. I'm happiest when I can get into my creative bubble and crank out some work... at home... alone. Remote work was a godsend.

While I understand that some people need interaction and recognition, I don't think I should have to be forced into that box. If asked what motivates me at work, I'd answer: getting the job done above and beyond the call of duty and getting compensated well for me. Wanna recognize me? Put it in my paycheck!!!

"Work Culture" still seems to be a thing here and it's time to have the "It's not you, it's me.... things aren't working out...." conversation. Too bad. I enjoy the work when I can do it without the "hug it out" BS.

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Originally Posted by ZenZeta Thanks again everyone. I've already re-activated my profile on some freelance sites. I know that "engagement" is the corporate buzz word right now, but there seems to be a lack of diversity here. The concept seems to focus solely on collaboration, team building, and recognition... all of which don't matter much to me. I'm happiest when I can get into my creative bubble and crank out some work... at home... alone. Remote work was a godsend. While I understand that some people need interaction and recognition, I don't think I should have to be forced into that box. If asked what motivates me at work, I'd answer: getting the job done above and beyond the call of duty and getting compensated well for me. Wanna recognize me? Put it in my paycheck!!! "Work Culture" still seems to be a thing here and it's time to have the "It's not you, it's me.... things aren't working out...." conversation. Too bad. I enjoy the work when I can do it without the "hug it out" BS.

Now you know what environment you need. So often we don't end up in an environment that doesn't fit us so we don't even think that one exists until we run across being hired in a company like that.

My career was a computer design engineer & I worked for many different companies. Sometimes even different departments within the same company didn't do well.

My ex who was also a computer engineer is ASD & he also had a hard time working at companies where teamwork was required. Learned early on in my career to interview the company as much as they interviewed me.

Sounds like freelance is really a better option for you.

She’s in the autism spectrum.
I think there must be flexibility to understand that not all people are the same but equally efficient or even more at work.
Not everyone is a social butterfly or an extrovert.

I’m not gonna say which way of work dynamic is the correct but I know for sure that each worker counts and we are not all the same.
At least, I expect equality of rights in jobs will be the future and I understand equality as respect for differences.

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Originally Posted by AzulOscuro She’s in the autism spectrum. I think there must be flexibility to understand that not all people are the same but equally efficient or even more at work. Not everyone is a social butterfly or an extrovert. I’m not gonna say which way of work dynamic is the correct but I know for sure that each worker counts and we are not all the same. At least, I expect equality of rights in jobs will be the future and I understand equality as respect for differences.

In a ideal utopian society your thinking is valid. We are talking real world & a small company that has been doing business the way it has long before she was ever hired. I learned in my real world career in larger companies that some things they would make changes to accomodate & other things it was like go find another company where you fit in. You can stomp your feet & complain how unfair but the bottom line especially with small companies is that if you don't fit into their work environment you might as well find another company that does because you only make yourself & the other people miserable trying to force them accomodate your needs.

We can talk our idealistic thinking all over the internet but at the end of the day we have to exist in the real world. There are lots of options out there where we do fit in & it is our own responsibility to find them for our own good

That is exactly the point: if the manager goes as far as to check why the OP did not check in at a group chat on the phone after hours on an issue not related to work, she will cause self-selection into the current jobs of people for whom such culture works. It does not mean that this is an effective culture, it just means that other people do not survive it. OP is already starting to look elsewhere and she has only been on the job for a short time, AND, she is a good worker. So it is a loss for the manager, team, and company that the OP is going to leave. But the manager is blind to such losses and is misguided. I had been a manager and director for a number of years until this partial disability set in and I am very people-oriented, team-oriented, and well-respected by reports and colleagues and pretty much everyone, and I tend to talk about stuff not related to work, but even I realize that when a manager discounts efficiency and thinks that it essentially does not matter, she is not being professional. Even the language she used, about being "liked", is not professional. In the professional context, one talks about being "respected", "valued", etc., by the team members. It it not high school, it is a job. So the fact that people who have survived this and who probably prefer it (possibly because they cannot produce high quality work and be efficient but it is easy for them to chat in group chats) are OK with it is in no way an endorsement of this culture as positive.

I don’t think it’s fair to assume that people who don’t socialize produce great work and those who socialize don’t. There’s really no correlation.

I also think we need to distinguish what’s a requirement (will you be fired if you don’t respond to a chat?) and what’s an expectation and what’s just a suggestion.

I also don’t think it’s realistic that everyone in this company socializes with coworkers 24/7 like they have no families or hobbies or household obligations. Even the most social person on this planet has other stuff besides chatting with work colleagues.

And I think maybe because I am older I don’t understand saying “yes” to social things I don’t want to do (not job description). I participate in chats when I feel like it and don’t when I don’t feel like it. I don’t have any desire to explain it to anyone. You can’t pay me enough to attend weekend or after work activities with coworkers unless they are my actual friends (some are). I have a group of coworkers who like to get together on Friday after work. If I am asked why I am not coming, I say I have other plans. I might feel like going once in a blue moon but normally I don’t. I don’t care what others think about it.

Maybe you’d benefit from learning to say “no thanks” and not agonize over it. And if you work from home, it’s even easier. Turn notifications off. Unplug. Manager asked why you didn’t attend or didn’t reply. Say you had other plans or were busy or just weren’t available and go on with your life. Just because she asks, it doesn’t mean you need to lose sleep over it

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Originally Posted by Tart Cherry Jam That is exactly the point: if the manager goes as far as to check why the OP did not check in at a group chat on the phone after hours on an issue not related to work, she will cause self-selection into the current jobs of people for whom such culture works. It does not mean that this is an effective culture, it just means that other people do not survive it. OP is already starting to look elsewhere and she has only been on the job for a short time, AND, she is a good worker. So it is a loss for the manager, team, and company that the OP is going to leave. But the manager is blind to such losses and is misguided. I had been a manager and director for a number of years until this partial disability set in and I am very people-oriented, team-oriented, and well-respected by reports and colleagues and pretty much everyone, and I tend to talk about stuff not related to work, but even I realize that when a manager discounts efficiency and thinks that it essentially does not matter, she is not being professional. Even the language she used, about being "liked", is not professional. In the professional context, one talks about being "respected", "valued", etc., by the team members. It it not high school, it is a job. So the fact that people who have survived this and who probably prefer it (possibly because they cannot produce high quality work and be efficient but it is easy for them to chat in group chats) are OK with it is in no way an endorsement of this culture as positive.

Not endorsing the culture but it is what it is & it has been functioning for long enough this way that the company is satisfied, the group is producing or upper management would not allow it to continue. Someone new comes in who is just a worker like everyone else & demands to be catered to will cause division & then production will drop. Deciding to leave is the best option at times like this as OP is now looking for opportunities that fit her needs better

Most companies have "inclusiveness'" policies, so you might be able to ask for advice from an "inclusiveness champion" on what company policy says about creating a welcoming environment for introverts.

Utopias are utopias until they become real. The thing is evolve for a fair inclusive world and not the opposite.
The only thing we can’t avoid is death, all the rest can be changed for the better.

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Originally Posted by AzulOscuro Utopias are utopias until they become real. The thing is evolve for a fair inclusive world and not the opposite. The only thing we can’t avoid is death, all the rest can be changed for the better.

That is a wishful thinking world & not reality. There are certain things I nor others will ever willingly toletate. I walked out of a 33 year marriage because I could not change it nor tolerate it any longer. That is reality across the board even in the working world. Idealism is great in books & in universities in theory but it cannot be forced into the every day practical lives of humans who have their own survival modes. We need to find where we fit. We need to stop forcing our thinking & inclusivity on everyone. That thinking is actually divisive rather than the inclusivity it claims to be

It’s not my intention to force others. I only aspired to a better world. A world were an autistic guy doesn’t have to go through struggles because of the ignorance of other people.
I don’t want a group of people to change dynamics that are valid for them. I’m only asking for more flexibility with people who works in a different way, a more comprehension on the others’ part. As long as each one make their job.
Who am I excluding? The O.P.? Maybe, I don’t catch you but I’m all ears.
Am I excluding my nephew? Who has Asperger’s syndrome. I’m not gonna paint him a rose colour world. His parents, teachers are providing him with all the tools to fit in this world, that is what you say, the reality. But, I aspire to contribute the world he has to live in, little by little, understand him also. And it’s only a matter of time for this to be posible.
I know it’s not now a reality.

I had an amazing principal in one of the school and she had the ability to make us show our best potentials. Each teacher was different and she knew how to take the best of all of us so the school and the most important, kids, had a better.

I agree and believe that the manager needs to find strengths in each person and play to those strengths, while also providing stretch opportunities and engage the employees a little bit outside their comfort zones. But primarily play to the reports' strengths.

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Originally Posted by Tart Cherry Jam I agree and believe that the manager needs to find strengths in each person and play to those strengths, while also providing stretch opportunities and engage the employees a little bit outside their comfort zones. But primarily play to the reports' strengths.

Again, this would be in an ideal world that does not exist. Managers have their managements styles they have developed that they believe works for them. Some good managers do it the way you say but not ALL managers are good & not all (or even most) do it this way. I have worked for many managers in the aerospace computer industry & every manager was different & some I found I just couldn't work for. That is just what real life is all about. You find what works for you.

I understand it.
I know that sometimes I’m not very realistic. It happens to me since a little kid. And you also are right in that about me complaining about why certain people and not others are the one who rise up the top or more relevant positions. I admit this to you.
I understand the have a charge of lots of responsibility and I surely didn’t know to do it. But, I see there are other possibilities.
There are companies, factories, corporations whose executives apply strategies to care of the most important element in an organisation, workers. And, it contributes to better profits. So, both things are friends.

Said that, the OP seems to do her job very well and she is asked more than what is required. It’s absurd.
People have their lives apart from work. I know work is a big part and very important but people have other responsibilities too. As long as a person is efficient, there’s no reason to ask her for more.

I know she can look for other job but sometimes it’s not so easy. Maybe, there in the States it is but here in Spain I assure you all that it’s not so easy.

I think we still didn’t establish what is actually “required” and what simply is encouraged.

I asked if it’s actual requirement such as if she do not attend zoom brewery, she’d be fired or is it something they would like her to participate at.

Being invited to participate in something doesn’t equate to being “required” to participate. I don’t participate in anything and I am not an introvert or in any kind of trouble of having a life. When I am asked to participate, I don’t see it as a requirement. Or if people on a chat at 9pm, are they required to be or they want to be? And if someone doesn’t want to, they do other things. If I am asked to join, it doesn’t mean I am required

I think we are confused here what is actually happening.

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Originally Posted by divine1966 I think we still didn’t establish what is actually “required” and what simply is encouraged. I asked if it’s actual requirement such as if she do not attend zoom brewery, she’d be fired or is it something they would like her to participate at. Being invited to participate in something doesn’t equate to being “required” to participate. I don’t participate in anything and I am not an introvert or in any kind of trouble of having a life. When I am asked to participate, I don’t see it as a requirement. Or if people on a chat at 9pm, are they required to be or they want to be? And if someone doesn’t want to, they do other things. If I am asked to join, it doesn’t mean I am required I think we are confused here what is actually happening.

You are right & I wonder if OP is actually confused about the difference between being required & being asked or too unsure to find out & interpreting it all as required