[SweetCrusader]

I have a question for non-Christian folks here. I don't mean to discriminate against Christians, and I don't want to hurt any feelings, so pls don't take offense. It's just that I am not Christian and I want to talk about conceptions of God outside the realm of Christianity. I grew up Christian and am pretty familiar with that way of viewing God and religion. Now I am sorting out my own feelings about it and want to dialogue a bit with other non-Christians.

Again, pls I don't want to start a fight, I just want support that's catered a bit more to my situation & beliefs.

My question is, how do you see God or your higher power? Male/female/both/neither? Human/animal/plant/none of the above/all of the above? Characteristics of God/higher power? Anything else...?

Peace, respect, and love to all, Christian and non-Christian alike

SC/Angela

[Danialla]

No offense taken Sweet, at least not here .

Just wanted to say that you do ask great questions! I truely wish you love and peace during all your searching.!!

Take care everyone

[sunrise]

Have you read "I and Thou" by Martin Buber, the Jewish philsopher? I find a lot in that book that resonates with me. He talks about there being two ways you can address a person (or the world, for that matter). You can say "you" to the person or you can say "it." The latter mode of interacting--saying "it"--objectifies the person and treats him/her as something to be used or experienced. Whereas saying "you" to a person is not addressing him as an object but as an authentic being, in a mutualistic and holistic way. When you say "you" to someone, or when two people say "you" to each other, there is a connection to God in that interaction.

So for me, maybe God is in how I relate to and encounter the world. God is in whether I say "you" to the world, or to the people I interact with.

[KathyM]

Hi Angela

I would say none of the above because I don't see why God would need reproductive organs - or food and water in order to survive. I use the name God because that's the first name I learned, and it's the most accepted name to use among most people. It feels weird for me to refer to God by any other name (i.e., Creator, Allah, etc.) because I don't believe it really matters what name we choose to call him. It's more important to honor him and live accordingly than to address him by a proper given name.

I refer to God as "him" again only because it's easier, just as I refer to all humans as "mankind." Although love doesn't have a gender, I also refer to "him" because of the relationship I had with my own father. I feel it is similar, only with greater power. My father provided for me, loved me, and guided me when needed. He also allowed me to make my own mistakes and learn from them. He punished me when I disobeyed him, but it was only to teach me - no malice involved, and it was for my own protection. I wasn't always obedient, but I tried my best to honor and obey him because I knew how much he loved me.

I don't understand why people fear God. My father's punishment was harsh, but I never feared him because I loved him, and he knew what was best for me. I obeyed because I didn't want to disappoint him - I wanted him to be proud of me. If I had obeyed only out of fear, I would have grown to resent him - and I wouldn't have learned the lessons he was trying to teach me.

[dragonphoto]

Hey Angela,

I was raised Southern Baptist, fell away from the church and it was not until my wife and I got together that I started attending church again. As far as how I view the Higher Power (God) I don't think it matters as much as as long as we live the right way. God is so many different things to different people, and most don't view Him (or Her) as a being but more as a higher power. But when it comes down to brass tacks, the Bible really does not make too much of a reference to how He (or She) looks but gives us the rules to live by. That being said if you don't believe in God, that does not make you wrong, however as long as you follow the words of the Bible (the rules of life) then you are doing the right thing! If you want to view your Higher being as a cat then go for it, it is what makes you more comfortable (just follow the rules of life).

Dragon

[nowheretorun]

hi SweetCrusader!

there's so many different ways to answer this question... i dont belong to any organziation of Spirituality, but i've borrowed from many...

i dont "see" God Spirit as much as i feel God Spirit... i feel Spirit strongest in prayer and meditation... that may sound very serious and ritualistic, but it isnt for me... i just relax and ask and then feel.... happy, sad, love, anger, woe, sympathy....

i "feel" God present during the process.. Spirit has never had a face for me... but Spirit is in all faces... ive seen Spirit as Wind, Lightening, Rain, Earth, the Unknown and All that is Greater...

i can See the work of God all around me, in Everything ... and there is far more than i can see...

i wanted really take my time and put some juicy stuff here, but, talking of or meditating about God Spirit harnesses my attention in such a way that at times, i feel limited in the amount of expression i can move.... it is overpowering and my fingers shake and miss the keys...

then i just rest, and breathe...

Great thread, i'm enjoying... (((smiles)))

[coralproper]

I think at this point in time the best way I can describe what I feel is God, in short

Your conscience, you don't need a book to know right from wrong or good from evil

I don't think any God is crazy enough to put his word in the hands of men as a written text to dictate to other men how to feel, act, talk and live

Though I do feel that allot of ancient people wrote what they saw in good conscience, what they felt or saw as Gods work or words in different books, some that have been rewrote to the benefit of men who had a desire to control men in my opinion...but after sifting through the lines though, some books concur along the same lines, in some respects, to modern men and ancient men, having the same conscience or consciousness of good and evil

So I see God as a carbon copy, in our conscience,at this point in time,this may not be my final decision in life
but for me, it works for now

[SweetCrusader]

ty everyone!

my brain is a little too overloaded atm to thoughtfully respond to these ideas. i am going to come back to this thread soon and give it the attention and depth of thought and feeling it deserves.

I see God. I feel God in everything I do and say .... sometimes my God replies, sometimes doesn't... but I know God is there....

God has to be there.........

or I wouldnt be.....

Treasure

[KathyM]

Jinny

Several years ago I was standing with my husband in the front yard, and our teenage son was raking leaves nearby. It was a beautiful autumn afternoon. My neighbor came out to visit, a spunky elderly lady who had been my mother's best friend. She looked all around, took a deep breath and said with a smile "How can ANYONE deny the existence of God?" We agreed.

She also liked to "flirt" with my son. She said "I don't have much time left here, but I'll wait for you up there - and we'll go dancing together." She then said to him "Don't worry, I'll be young and beautiful by the time you show up for our date."

I dont know why but this made me cry

thanks for sharing.....

Jin xx

[youOme]

If I was to attempt to visualize God (which is impossible because God cannot be perceived through human sensory), I'd imagine God as the commonly used picture of the universe or the images in biology books of molecules and cells. Or the energy seen from satellites in a sky when looking down upon a 5 categorized hurricane. Some people visualize God as a man or a human like figure but personally this ruins the concept of complete and utter perfection...because humans are flawed. Really, God is everything..the air, the sky, energy and heat from the sun...the earth and universal galaxis...everything, including the small unnoticed natures like flowers and mammals, the placenta of a newborn...all nutrition. It's all so grand and complicated.

[SweetCrusader]

I believe that we all have our own kind of relationship to the Universe and all the Powers That Be, and I think that's good. God doesn't have to be the same thing for you that "he" is for me. I think we all see aspects, only partial glimpses, of a reality that is far too great to grasp. And I think our interpretations and understandings of that Truth are colored by our views of the world, and ourselves.

For me (as an example), growing up with the idea that God was a white male just felt too much like an exclusion of females, non-whites, non-Christians, and non-humans.

The Creator, to me, by definition encompasses all forms of life, and all possibility. It just doesn't make any sense the that the Creator of all has to be confined by the concept of gender. I also think it makes no sense that the Creator would be exclusively human. My T always says she thinks it would be quite an awakening if some of the "god-fearing" people she has known who are cruel to animals and consider themselves somehow superior to them, sit at the final judgement and learn that God is a deer.

I find that thought funny... although I don't believe in a final judgment, or any judgment for that matter.

I mean, I do believe there are some things that just aren't good to do. But I don't necessarily believe there is really "justice"- that someday we will all have to pay for our mistakes. I think we all pay for our choices in one way or another, on an on-going basis. What we do affects our spirits. And I don't think that's meant to be a punishment, it's just what happens when we make choices, but if "punishment" is needed, then I think that is punishment enough. Wherever you go, there you are... and you have to live with yourself. Am I making any sense?

I have more thoughts I would like to send out there later...

[nowheretorun]

hi SC .. im enjoying reading your expressions about God/Spirit...

i was sitting here on break for a minute and remembered a favorite quote from Homer Simpson (ok, my education about God comes from cartoons) not really..

Marge is getting on his case cause its time to go to church ... Homer doesnt really want to go, and for an excuse says "What if we die and find out we've been worshipping the wrong God all these years... Man, is he gonna be pissed!"

and thats what its been for me at times, how do i know i'm worshipping the right one?

well, it was a funny quote and i got a chuckle...

[EJ711]

Sweet Crusader,

You said you were raised as a Christian. May I ask what denomination?

I was raised Catholic, which is so fear and guilt based, I rejected it in my early 20's. After many desert years I found the protestant religion. Our minister was an amazing man, and I learned about God's love.

From Catholic to Protestant was like night and day.

Now I've been living in rural Kansas for five years, and can't find a church I like.

Anyway from my Catholic roots, it has been hard for me to see God as a loving Father. Also my human father was distant and cold.

I hope my interjection hasn't distracted me from your discussion.

EJ

[SweetCrusader]

Hi EJ,

I was raised as a Mormon. I know some Christians don't see Mormons as Christians, but Mormons usually do see themselves as Christian, and I see Mormons as Christian.

My T was raised Catholic, and she said once that she thinks the Mormons and the Catholics seem to hold the corner of the market on fear- and guilt-based faith. That was true of my experience, too, although I respect that some people find a feeling of love and light from Mormonism and Catholicism.

TY for sharing your experience. I'm glad you found a way of worshipping and connecting that works for you. I don't need a denomination to belong to myself. But I understand the feeling of missing having a church you belong to that seems to "fit." It is nice to connect with people who understand spirit the same way you do, isn't it? I had a lot of spiritual experiences as a Mormon as well that I still hold dear. I just think of them in the context of a more open framework than I used to.


Angela

[SweetCrusader]

nowheretorun,

I've seen that Simpsons! Actually, I think the Simpsons can be quite profound sometimes. And I don't believe in separating out where we are allowed to get our spiritual learning and inspiration from, and where we aren't. All life, even cartoons, can be spiritual!

[EJ711]

Angela,

I really miss being a member of a church, since I don't have any family in Kansas. Since I really have only a little family left, my church family has really played an important part in my life.

I worked with a lady, who was a Mormon, for approximately 10 years, and learned a lot about the Mormon faith. She never mentioned the fear and guilt factor. Thank you for sharing that -- it was eye opener.

EJ

[ocdchick]

I see God as a spirit with both male and female characteristics-the Hindu view. I call it "Abba"-Aramaic for Daddy.

It gives me strength to face each day!

[recluse1]

i cannot in my mind even attempt to fathom a physical appearance for God. in my opinion, God as well as people, the outward appearance isn't of much importance to me. it is the energy.

God is so many things to me. i will try to put my thoughts into words and keep it short and simple.

God is the power, the energy source, the creator, the all knowing, all loving, and is in all that is good and beautiful in life.

[SeptemberMorn]

AMEN!!!!

God took the form of a man in His son. Otherwise, He permiates every living thing and even inatimate objects.

I see God mostly in a beautiful sunset. All the beautiful sunsets I've seen are the sun shining through clouds. The opening that will send a ray down to almost touch the horizon, therein is God!

[nowheretorun]

yeah.. those rays of light always get to me too... everyone has their own visions though.. i try not to tread...

[KathyM]

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
SeptemberMorn said:
I see God mostly in a beautiful sunset.

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I also enjoy watching the sun rise. It's a chance to share a "Good Morning" with God and breathe in all the beauty of the new day. It provides enough hope for me to gather the strength to make it through the day in a good way. Then I usually take a nap.

Sunsets are beautiful too. It's a chance to thank God for the day, hassles and all, and share a "Good Night" together.

[splitimage]

I was raised in a religious Christian home - my father and many of my uncles and cousins were ministers. This left me, like many other preacher's kids highly skeptical towards organized religion. When you see the pettiness of the church politics or spend a sunday morning helping cut up the wonder bread for communion a lot of the mystery goes away. I do not now consider myself a Christian, but i miss the community & support that belonging to a community based faith can give. I guess my closest concept of God is a force of nature. When I see the beauty and symetry that exists throughout nature, I have to believe that some higher power had a hand in its creation. So while I am firmly an evolutionist - I still think there is a spiritual force beyond the realm of what science can explain. When I was little, my mother who was deeply spiritual would tell me that the sound of the wind in the trees was God talking. I still think of that when I hear wind today. I don't believe nature is god exactly, but I guess it's more that I find the expression of god more in nature than in any where else. I also find god in the kindness of people who help others, for no reward it impliess an interconnectedness of spirit that is greater than man alone.

--splitimage

I used to see him as a man. Now I see him as essence.. like energy balls inside everyone... maybe even animals.