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Old Mar 17, 2007, 02:34 PM
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<center><font color=191970>Let me fall
Let me climb
There’s a moment when fear
And dreams must collide

Someone I am
Is waiting for courage
The one I want
The one I will become
Will catch me

So let me fall
If I must fall
I won’t heed your warnings
I won’t hear them

Let me fall
If I fall
Though the phoenix may
Or may not rise

I will dance so freely
Holding on to no one
You can hold me only
If you too will fall
Away from all these
Useless fears and chains

Someone I am
Is waiting for my courage
The one I want
The one I will become
Will catch me

So let me fall
If I must fall
I won’t heed your warnings
I won’t hear

Let me fall
If I fall
There’s no reason
To miss this one chance
This perfect moment
Just let me fall

Josh Groban

Source:
</center>


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  #2  
Old Mar 17, 2007, 02:57 PM
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<center>
"I am black but comely, O ye daughters of Jerusalem."

- The Song of Songs


<img src=http://thefifthbody.homestead.com/clancy_KaliAtPlay.jpg>

Is Kali, my Divine Mother, of a black complexion?
She appears black because She is viewed from a distance;
but when intimately known She is no longer so.
The sky appears blue at a distance, but look at it close by
and you will find that it has no colour.
The water of the ocean looks blue at a distance,
but when you go near and take it in your hand,
you find that it is colourless."

... Ramakrishna Paramhansa (1836-86)</center>
<blockquote><blockquote>Kali's four arms represent the complete circle of creation and destruction, which is contained within her. She represents the inherent creative and destructive rhythms of the cosmos. Her right hands, making the mudras of "fear not" and conferring boons, represent the creative aspect of Kali, while the left hands, holding a bloodied sword and a severed head represent her destructive aspect. The bloodied sword and severed head symbolize the destruction of ignorance and the dawning of knowledge. The sword is the sword of knowledge, that cuts the knots of ignorance and destroys false consciousness (the severed head). Kali opens the gates of freedom with this sword, having cut the eight bonds that bind human beings. Finally her three eyes represent the sun, moon, and fire, with which she is able to observe the three modes of time: past, present and future. This attribute is also the origin of the name Kali, which is the feminine form of 'Kala', the Sanskrit term for Time.

Source: Kali - The Divine Mother</blockquote>

Kali is a metaphor for the place where time melts. Other cultures likely have other symbols and metaphors, but that's the one that resonates for me. Beyond Kali's slashing sword is perfect stillness. Time does not exist there. That's the place of Emptiness. From this place of Nothingness, Everything is born. That's the Luminosity.

In the Kaballah, they call her Binah. Sufis call her Layla. To the Egyptians she is Isis. Within a framework of Christianty she is The Black Madonna. In Tibetan scripture she is Black Tara. To the Gnostics and philosophers, she is Sophia.

See also:[*] Dancing in the Flames: The Dark Goddess in the Transformation of Consciousness[*] The Unmanifest Absolute[*] The Tao[*] The Black Light[*] The Black Latifa[*] Night Enfolds Her Cloak of Holes[*] The Abyss[*] Space, Time and Medicine[*] The Therapeutic Psychology of the Tibetan Book of the Dead


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  #3  
Old Mar 18, 2007, 12:16 AM
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<center>
The Beauty in the Darkness

<font size=4><font color=191970>November Questions</font size></font>

<font color=191970>Where did you go
when your eyes closed
and you were cloaked
in the ancient cold?

How did we seem,
huddled around
the hospital bed?
Did we loom as
figures do in dream?

As your skin drained,
became vellum,
a splinter of whitethorn
from your battle with the bush
in the Seangharraí
stood out in your thumb.

Did your new feet
take you beyond,
to fields of Elysia,
or did you come back
along Caherbeanna mountain
where every rock
knows your step?

Did you have to go
to a place unknown?
Were there friendly faces
to welcome you, help you settle in?

Did you recognize anyone?
Did it take long
to lose
the web of scent,
the honey smell of old hay,
the whiff of wild mint
and the wet odour of the earth
you turned every spring?

Did sounds become
unlinked,
the bellow of cows
let into fresh winterage,
the purr of a stray breeze
over the Coillín,
the ring of the galvanized bucket
that fed the hens,
the clink of limestone
loose over a scailp
in the Ciorcán?

Did you miss
the delight of your gaze
at the end of a day's work
over a black garden,
a new wall
or a field cleared of rock?

Have you someone there
that you can talk to,
someone who is drawn
to the life you carry?

With your new eyes
can you see from within?

Is it we who seem
outside?

© John O'Donohue </font></center>

<hr width=100% size=2>

See also:
[*] The Sacred Source: Life, Death, and the Survival of Consciousness[*] DSM IV: Religious and Spiritual Problems: Case Study - Dr. David Lukoff[*] Guidelines for Family &amp; Friends[*] Schizophrenia &amp; The Hero's Journey[*] The Thunder, Perfect Mind



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  #4  
Old Mar 18, 2007, 07:20 PM
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<blockquote>
My last few posts have felt a little over the top and I even asked LMo if she would be so kind as to remove two of them for me. (Which she did -- Thank you LMo.) In case any readers are concerned, I am not referring to any present state in those posts -- I am drawing on my past experience.

There came a point in that experience, when "God" showed up. I find it reassuring that occurred at the point when I was in the most pain and anguish.

Within the framework of "schizophrenia" this stage would be recognized as a manic phase. Within a mystical framework it would be recognized as the point that the last shred of individual personality has been removed -- there is no longer anything left to separate the I-From-The-Thou.<blockquote><font color=191970>Every frozen piece of grief and trauma within me came forward. Every loss. Every fear. Every failure. Every bit of heartbreak. As I opened myself more and more to the process, as I dropped every possible defense or barrier, it became quite painful, not only emotionally but also physically. My chest felt as if it were being crushed. My throat felt like it was in a vice. My limbs and joints ached and felt disconnected. I hyperventilated. I shook and trembled. I vomited terror and grief. I could feel strange sensations within my body, as if places within me were opening. I smelled perfume. I slipped the bonds of time and into the black womb of the Universe.

<center>. . . I am dancing with God . . . </center>

Source: Psychosis, PTSD and Story as Vehicle of Healing</font></blockquote>

In the thread on Dr. Bertram Karon he notes that schizophrenia is a form of chronic terror. I agree so wholeheartedly with that perspective, and there is nothing so terrifying as death.

That point in my experience has been one I've struggled with the most. In a way, it was the most painful, the most terrifying yet once I actually got there, my pain stopped. Peace, Peace, Peace. For that reason, it's also one of my favorite parts.

How does a human being begin to understand such an experience? You do so by studying what is known of death and dying. Here's a brief excerpt from the link above that can provide some insights...

<hr width=100% size=2>

Ancient books of the dead
The description of the resources available to dying people in pre-industrial cultures would not be complete without mentioning the books of the dead, such as the Tibetan Bardo Thödol, the Egyptian Pert em hru, the Aztec Codex Borgia, or the European Ars moriendi.

When the ancient books of the dead first came to the attention of Western scholars, they were considered to be fictitious descriptions of the posthumous journey of the soul, and, as such, wishful fabrications of people who were unable to accept the grim reality of death. They were put in the same category as fairy tales—imaginary creations of human fantasy that had definite artistic beauty, but no relevance for everyday reality.

However, a deeper study of these texts revealed that they had been used as guides in the context of sacred mysteries and of spiritual practice and very likely described the experiences of the initiates and practitioners. From this new perspective, presenting the books of the dead as manuals for the dying appeared to be simply a clever disguise invented by the priests to obscure their real function and protect their deeper esoteric meaning and message from the uninitiated. However the exact nature of the procedures used by the ancient spiritual systems to induce these states remains an unexplored area.

Modern research focusing on NOSC brought unexpected new insights into this problem area. Systematic study of the experiences in psychedelic sessions, powerful non-drug forms of psychotherapy, and spontaneously occurring psychospiritual crises showed that in all these situations, people can encounter an entire spectrum of unusual experiences, including sequences of agony and dying, passing through hell, facing divine judgment, being reborn, reaching the celestial realms, and confronting memories from previous incarnations. These states were strikingly similar to those described in the eschatological texts of ancient and pre-industrial cultures.

Another missing piece of the puzzle was provided by thanatology, the new scientific discipline specifically studying death and dying. Thanatological studies of near-death states by people such as Raymond Moody, Kenneth Ring, Michael Sabom, Bruce Greyson and Charles Flynn showed that the experiences associated with life-threatening situations bear a deep resemblance to the descriptions from the ancient books of the dead, as well as those reported by subjects in psychedelic sessions and modern experiential psychotherapy.

It has thus become clear that the ancient eschatological texts are actually maps of the inner territories of the psyche encountered in profound NOSC, including those associated with biological dying. The experiences involved seem to transcend race and culture and originate in the collective unconscious as described by C. G. Jung.

It is possible to spend one’s entire lifetime without ever experiencing these realms or even without being aware of their existence, until one is catapulted into them at the time of biological death. However, for some people this experiential area becomes available during their lifetime in a variety of situations including psychedelic sessions or some other powerful forms of self-exploration, serious spiritual practice, participation in shamanic rituals, or during spontaneous psycho-spiritual crises. This opens up for them the possibility of experiential exploration of these territories of the psyche on their own terms so that the encounter with death does not come as a complete surprise when it is imposed on them at the time of biological demise.

Source: The Sacred Source: Life, Death, and the Survival of Consciousness


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  #5  
Old Mar 18, 2007, 11:04 PM
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i am learning a great deal from you and the links.......thanks, pat
  #6  
Old Mar 19, 2007, 12:13 AM
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Thank you for letting me know that pat. I know that I speak from a perspective that is "different" from that of many others and I'm certain that's offputting to many people. It's nice to know that others find something beneficial in my voice and the voices of others I have dragged into this space to help explain this experience that is called "schizophrenia" or "psychosis" in this culture.


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  #7  
Old Mar 19, 2007, 08:01 AM
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<blockquote>
Kali opens the gates of freedom with this sword, having cut the eight bonds that bind human beings. Finally her three eyes represent the sun, moon, and fire, with which she is able to observe the three modes of time: past, present and future. This attribute is also the origin of the name Kali, which is the feminine form of 'Kala', the Sanskrit term for Time.

Excerpts: Time, Space and Medicine

I began to realize that I was witnessing patients becoming healthier through acquiring a new experiential meaning of what time was all about.

My patients were learning a strategy that held serious consequences for the improvement of their health. My own curiosity about this phenomenon evolved into a serious concern. If, I thought, patients can eradicate certain illnesses through adopting a nonlinear view of time wherein past, present, and future merge into a timeless stillness, the obvious question was: do we make ourselves sick by conforming to an idea of a strict linear time composed of a rigid succession of future, past, and present?

We visualize heaven as an eternal timeless state, and our religious traditions assert that it is the child who is its natural citizen. It is the child who is at home in a nonlinear time, and who fits the beatific visions of antiquity. In a way that goes unnoticed we conjoin the spiritual sense and the experience of time. Perhaps it is not surprising that most great religions have always prescribed methods such as prayer and meditation through which one can become as a child; for in practicing these disciplines one quickly discovers that the experience of time changes. It ceases to flow; and experientially one feels enveloped by the stillness of which all the great mystics have spoken.

Space, Time and Medicine
-- Larry Dossey


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  #8  
Old Mar 19, 2007, 08:10 AM
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<blockquote>Death and Rebirth in Psychospiritual Transformation

<center>Are you willing to be sponged out, erased, cancelled, made nothing?

Are you willing to be made nothing? Dipped into oblivion?

If not, you will never really change.


Phoenix -- D.H. Lawrence </center>

During a psychospiritual emergence process, one commonly encounters "death" in many forms. These can consist of the dying of old life strategies, mental and psychic structures, outdated views, notions and concepts, which also frequently involve the subsequent "dying" of such as previously held interests, pastimes and roles held in everyday life. In this context, death can also be described as change, or transformation. Yet, it is not uncommon for people undergoing psychospiritual emergence or emergency to experience these changes and transformations as dying in a most literal sense, especially if these processes occur in a rapid way.

Philosopher Ken Wilber describes the death/rebirth process in psychospiritual growth as primarily the transcendence of previously held identifications with a specific concept of self, to increasingly larger concepts of the same. According to Wilber and others, this process seems to have its goal in reuniting or realizing the self as Brahman-Atman, the Ultimate Source, or God, or realization of "I Am That". This goal has also been described as no-self, the final liberation, the final transcendence of all self-concepts.

The death-rebirth process, however it may manifest during a psychospiritual emergence or emergency, includes some specific phases, which must be successfully completed for the individual to be able to attain the next "level", a larger concept of self, which is commonly followed by a sense of increased freedom, increased ability to express ones creativity, a larger sense of unity with others and the world, in many cases profound psychospiritual and psychosomatic healing and other positive results. When the process or experience is successfully completed, one discovers that nothing actually "died". As Ken Wilber puts it, the previous, smaller concept of self is integrated into the larger one, and is afterwards still fully accessible to the individual. This applies to all the things one might experience as "dying" mentioned above, with the difference that one no longer sees oneself as identified with these structures, notions, roles etc. However, this is often no consolation to a person facing an experience of psychospiritual death and rebirth, although knowlede of how it might manifest can reduce fear and facilitate the process.

The first phase in the death/rebirth/transcendence process is the phase of letting go. This can be difficult and painful if the person is centered on control to a large extent, strongly identified with what is to be transcended at the time, or very afraid. When the individual overcomes the methaphysical fear which is commonly felt at this juncture, and ready to let go, the actual death/rebirth struggle begins. This phase can also be frightening and overwhelming. When it occurs in connection to the physical birth trauma, it can be followed by very intense physical sensations of pressures, pains, choking and powerful emotions of fear, anxiety, aggression and such, which seems to be the reliving of the individuals actual birth, and is a difficult and actually life-threatening experience for the child. When the experience occurs without such connection, the problems can consist of feelings of profound loneliness, aloofness, isolation and disconnection from all that used to be important and meaningful in the individuals life. There have been tragic cases where individuals facing such experiences have mistaken the inner urge for something inside of them to die as an impulse to actually physically kill themselves.

The death/rebirth experience can also encompass different mythological and symbolic visions of deities and demons, engulfment or dismemberment, imagery that seems to be connected to the individuals concepts of death. Furthermore, this phase can be experienced as total annihilation on all levels or hitting the cosmic bottom - as Stanislav Grof puts it "physical destruction, emotional disaster, intellectual and philosophical defeat, ultimate moral failure and even spiritual damnation." It is also important to note that physical breathing can actually cease for a short period of time during the death/rebirth experience.

After this phase, the person can experience an "inbetween" state of "nothingness", or "emptiness", which can also be difficult and frightening, and sometimes is experienced as being dead - being nothing and being nowhere - although still physically alive. This "inbetween" state can last for a few seconds, ranging up to a prolonged period of time. In some cases, the "dying" experience is immediately followed by visions of heavenly realms, feelings of redemption and release, and profound positive emotions. In other cases, this process takes more time and is a more gradual merging into the new "level" of functioning or larger self, which may include a "waiting" period which can also be experienced as difficult.

The crucial point in this process, whether it is deliberately evoked or occurs during the course of a spontaneous psychospiritual emergence process or crisis, is the ability to surrender, something our egos always fight, and sometimes fight fiercely. In most cases, it is not possible to stop such a process when evoked - which can lead to one "getting stuck" in some of the very unpleasant phases involved. In many ways, death and rebirth experiences in psychospiritual transformation actually resemble real death - the difference being that the physical body stays alive. The positive emotions and "levels" or "states" attained after successful completion of such experiences also resemble the states described by near-death experiencers, and going through such phases on the spiritual journey can strongly reduce fear of death. In a sufi saying it is said that "The man who dies before he dies does not die when he dies".

Source: <a href=http://home.swipnet.se/reality_center/spiremergenceinfo2.html>Death and Rebirth in Psychospiritual Transformation</a>

See also: Awakening by the Gate of Sorrow</blockquote>



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  #9  
Old Mar 19, 2007, 08:22 AM
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<blockquote><blockquote><font color=191970>What we lost...

The interior love poem
the deeper levels of the self
landscapes of daily life

dates when the abandonment
of certain principles occured.

The rule of courtesy - how to enter
a temple or forest, how to touch
a master’s feet before lesson or performance.

The art of the drum. The art of eye-painting.
How to cut an arrow. Gestures between lovers.
The pattern of her teeth marks on his skin
drawn by a monk from memory.

The limits of betrayal. The five ways
a lover could mock an ex-lover.

Nine finger and eye gestures
to signal key emotions.

The small boats of solitude.

Lyrics that rose
from love
back into air

naked with guile
and praise.

Our works and days.

We knew how monsoons
(south-west, north-east)
would govern behaviour

and when to discover
the knowledge of the dead

hidden in clouds,
in rivers, in unbroken rock.

All this we burned or traded for power and wealth
from the eight compass points of vengeance

from the two levels of envy

© Michael Ondaatje</font></blockquote></blockquote>

[b]See also: Skeleton Woman: The Life/Death/Life Nature



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  #10  
Old Mar 19, 2007, 10:49 PM
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<blockquote>
In the aftermath of my experience I was very surprised to discover that some people try to actively cultivate such experiences. "Whoa! That's crazy!" I thought to myself.

All spiritual traditions emphasize the need to have a guide during such a process. Within a therapeutic context, the therapist serves as guide. Within a spiritual tradition, a guru, elder, or spiritual teacher typically serves as guide. For me, my guide (and therapist) was my animus.

See also: [*] The Major Archetypes: Mentor[*] Archetypes and the Individuation Process



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  #11  
Old Mar 19, 2007, 11:20 PM
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</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
To love another is not enough, to be "not an impediment" in the life of the other is not enough. It is not enough to be "supportive" and "there for them" and all the rest. The goal is to be knowledgeable about the ways of life and death, in one's own life and in panorama. And the only way to be a knowing man is to go to school in the bones of Skeleton Woman. She is waiting for the signal of deep feeling, the one tear that says, "I admit the wound."

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">

this i try to always remember........xoxxo pat
  #12  
Old Mar 19, 2007, 11:42 PM
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<blockquote><blockquote>
Singing Over the Bones...

The archetype of Wild Woman resides in the guts, not in the head. She can track and run and summon and repel. She can sense, camouflage, and love deeply. She is intuitive, typical, and normative. She is utterly essential to women's mental and soul health.

She is the female soul. Yet she is more; she is the source of the feminine. She is all that is of instinct, of the worlds both seen and hidden -she is the basis.

She is intuition, she is far-seer, she is deep listener, she is loyal heart. She encourages humans to remain multilingual; fluent in the languages of dreams, passion, and poetry.

She is the voice that says, "This way, this way."

She is the one who thunders after injustice. She is the one we leave home to look for. She is the one we come home to. She is the things that keep us going when we think that we're done for.</blockquote>

<hr width=100% size=2>

Clarissa Pinkola Estes was Jungian trained -- I have repeatedly found it was the Jungians and transpersonal psychologists who had the most insights for me. I'm glad to know that you've enjoyed her work as well.

The quote I included above can be found on this page, along with a whole lot more from the wisdom of Clarissa Pinkola Estes: Women Who Run With The Wolves</blockquote>


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Old Mar 20, 2007, 12:28 AM
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when i moved to NM, after my divorce, a friend gave me the book. it's ragged now......she told me that she always thought that i ran, secretly, with wolves at night......i liked that a lot......
  #14  
Old Feb 03, 2008, 03:02 AM
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</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>

<center><img src=http://www.geocities.com/~divisiontheory/flag.gif></center>

In much the same way, the Templar's mysterious battle flag, known as the Beauseant, also seems related to the binary soul doctrine. Consisting of two equal but opposite vertical blocks, a black one atop a white one, this flag also suggests that the Templars' secret teachings revolved around the integration or unification of two.

[b]Source: The Binary Soul Doctrine


</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">

See also: Mysterium Coniunctionis

Music of the Hour:




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