Depression and Chemical Imbalance a Myth?

I came across this article about the link between depression and chemical imbalances. Not sure I agree, but it makes you think.

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/ar...obotomies.aspx

where is the link?

It's up now

A good rule of thumb with things like this (and most information you are presented in our culture) is to ask, "What's the angle?" and "Am I being sold something?" I am also always very skeptical anytime people start throwing around the word "proof" in a non-scientific/mathematical context.

From what I have read from Harvard and NIMH the chemical imbalance theory that goes along with the SSRI's and SSNRI's is a part of the puzzle but only a small part. It is far more complex than that theory explains but it is part of it.

How else would those meds be so effective for some people if there wasn't something to it.

I will have to read the article tomorrow but I don't think anyone will ever convince me that mine is not very genetically and biologically based.

Physiologically there is probably some truth to it but not in such a simple way Everything about us is a chemical reaction. Doctors can't run blood tests and then analyze the results and say okay... chemical A122 is out of sync with chemical 702c so we'll give the patient a prescription for chemical Z to bring them in line
Given the fact that most psyche meds are at best marginally more effective than a placebo I think there is a long way to go before chemical imbalance means anything.

I personally feel that depression for me comes from circumstances. When the circumstances are not that great, then I get depressed. But I feel that's pretty normal with everyone. As far as depression being chemically imbalanced, I don't know. I'd be having a great time with friends and then feel very down for no reason. Or I would feel anxious.

For myself I believe it is genetically linked.. I had a whole side of my family I did not know as I got to know them I found out our history dates back to 1650AD quite a ways back and many many of them today suffer bipolar , MDD, various anxiety disorders.. It's incredible how many.

The thing is we all grew up different in different parts of the country. I found out all this info after I had already been diagnosed . So for me there is no way that it is not in the genetics too much proof. Hundreds of years of it .

That being said I watched a interesting show where they did brain scans of depressed people and people without.. They also dissected brains. They is actually structurally differences in brain matter between the two ..
Food for thought

I've always been told mine is from a "chemical imbalance" but I always think if this were the case surely medications should just balance them out and make everything good again? I believe it may be a factor, but there are other things too such as genetic and environmental things - otherwise that magic pill I've been told by many doctors that "doesn't exist" surely would?

I don't think its a myth per say, it probably is a real factor in a lot of cases, but certainly not the only one. Also in general brain chemicals can be effected by outside factors...

Hello, Jolisse. Some accuse Big Pharma for the biological model. Big Pharma has a pill that will fix anything. Unfortunately, the US is one of only a few countries that allow direct advertising by Big Pharma. End Big Pharma Direct to Consumer Advertising | Dr Terry Simpson

Dr. Ronald Pies has written numerous articles on the subject. Here is one:

Psychiatry?s New Brain-Mind and the Legend of the ?Chemical Imbalance? | Psychiatric Times

Pies also addresses doing away with the dualistic approach to treatment. I see much benefit in doing so. The mind and body affect each other. A holistic treatment team approach seems to be much more efficacious.

I wish you well.

When I have my coffee, I feel better. Think better. There are mornings when I am totally the "don't talk to me before I had my coffee" type. Caffeine imbalance in the brain? Nah. Mind altering subtances make you feel different, that's why they are called... mind altering substances.

Another example... we know booze makes people less shy. Does it proof there is some alcohol imbalance? Does feeling different after smoking a joint proof something?

Meds work in too strange ways to be a proof of some mystical imbalances. Why wouldn't they "correct the imbalances" straight away? Why sometimes changes in lifestyle or thinking "balance" you better than all the pills? Why they stop working hence stop "correcting the imbalances" for no good reason?


meditation affect brain.
Liberal brains look differently from conservative brains. Apparently, even brains of coke lovers look differently from Pepsi lovers brains.

Maybe it's outlook difference, rather than "illness" versus "normal" difference? Could some people be simply depressive as characteristic thus more prone to fall into the "clinical" depression?

Just saying. We sorta see what we want to see. We interpret date with preconcieved notions, hence why many weird beliefs carried on for so long.

These are the sources that I trust as they do the most research on the subject. Some articles may be dated.

What causes depression? - Harvard Health Publications

If you read the whole article you will see that, at least according to harvard, monoamines, genes, environment, stress hormones, and many other factors.

NIMH · Mental Illness Defined as Disruption in Neural Circuits

What is Depression? - Depression Research Clinic - Department of Psychiatry - Stanford University School of Medicine
Overview of Mood Disorders | Johns Hopkins Medicine Health Library

Depression | University Health Service

You know I can find a same amount of links declaring the chemical imbalance theory a Bs, right?


this is pretty good one:

The "chemical imbalance" myth

BBC NEWS | Health | 'The myth of the chemical cure'

a new one:

Social worker claims bipolar disorder link to chemical imbalance 'is a myth'

What bothers me is when I read people here say "my pdoc said I have chemical imbalance". Really? Why is it acceptable to present a theory as a fact, to a vulnerable being nevertheless?

And yes, chemicals play a role. As in everything. Chemicals play a part of being in love or enjoying a moment. But is that really a chemical thing? Or are simply chemical reaction to the different factors.

Of course it is a myth, it was created like that and not meant to be "serious". The brain is much more than transmitter substances even if they of course are important.

Take for example stroke patients. Oftentimes they need SSRI:s to function better. Why? Because the stroke that killed part of their brain selectively killed stuff that produces serotonin? Of course not! It is really not like Parkinson's where part of the brain that produces dopamine actually is physically destroyed, which is a physical thing that never has been seen in mental illness/depression.

SSRI:s might help, but not to "correct" anything, they help because they are a general boost. Nothing else.

Big Pharma makes billions of $$$ off of psych meds and every few years they come out with a new "miracle pill".
Years ago, I was in a double blind study. One med was a tricyclic and the other a SSRI. I didn't know which med I was taking and they did switch them during the study.
Years later, My pdoc told me the results of the study. There was no difference in symptoms, between the two meds. Yet Big Pharma sung the praises of their new SSRI and everyone jumped on the band wagon.'
I'm disappointed with pdocs, all mine wants to do is put me on more meds! I pay $100 for a 15 minute "medication review", WTF is that all about?
I do feel there is something to the "chemical imbalance" theory, but I don't feel there's been enough research done to know what helps.
We are flooded with commercials about all the "happy pills" we can take, but do they really work?

The National Institute of Mental Health has a more balanced view of the causes of depression: NIMH · Depression

Another perspective:

I believe it is important to have your psychiatrist explain the role of glia in the treatment of depression.

I think few psychiatrists understand the possible importance of glial cells in mental illness. Psychology textbooks focus on neurons, with glial cells referred to mostly as structural support and for disposing of waste. The focus on glia is relatively recent.

The chemical imbalance theory is a myth in the sense that it is not that simple. Psychiatrists will agree that brain chemistry is involved in mental illness, but very few would say mental illness is caused by an imbalance of neurotransmitters.
http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/printpdf/198129

Here is an article regarding depression in particular:
Antidepressants - The Chemical Imbalance Myth

I think the research community at large would agree that monoamines play a role.

One of the recent approaches is focusing on the pathways/ neural circuits/ communication between, the pre frontal cortex and the limbic system. It is strongly believed that these pathways regulate mood and behavior. This is what TMS is based on.

We are in the dark ages as far as glial cells are concerned. Only very recently are they looking at them. They have always been ignored and just thought to be the inert structure that neurons exist in.

The director of NIMH does have a balanced view and says that the chemical imbalance theory (neuro transmitters in the pre synaptic cleft) are a part of the picture. It is how neurons and dendrites communicate so would have to play a role in a great many things.

I will use myself as an example. Most of the time when I speak of depression I am talking about very severe, chronic, long term depression. The majority of posts I read in the depression section are by people who describe this type of depression.

I started getting it when I was thirteen years old. I started getting treated for it at 32. In my 30's and most of my 40's it developed a very definite pattern. Three or four times a year at just about the exact same time each year I would go down for three to four weeks. I mean flat out down in bed all the time suicidal for those four weeks. Then I would snap out of it and go back to work until the next one. I could set the calender by it. I was on meds, in therapy, group therapy, very active in AA and working the steps, Alanon, years of consistent meditation, none of it ever broke this very cyclical seasonal type of depression. There were no big changes in my life or any current situational issues. I worked very hard for many years on all the past situational issues. I grew up in a dysfunctional family but not really that bad. No physical or sexual abuse. No big traumas. The biggest issues were by dad being emotionally unavailable due to his alcoholism. Emotional abandonment. Surrogate husband to my mom as i was the oldest. All that stuff with dealt with a long time ago and my family has had many discussions about it all. I am very close to my parents and family today. I don't see environmental/ situational issues playing a huge role for me.

Starting about six years ago things started getting much worse. Periods of six to eight months of very severe depression. Anxiety and paranoia added to it for some unknown baffling reason. My situation in life hadn't really changed to much. The second to last one I had for eight months and when it started I was gainfully employed at a very good job with very good benefits. It hit me when I was working and doing everything right to treat it.

Given my lifetime of experience and my level of self awareness I am convinced without a doubt mine is very biologically based. It is like a switch gets turned off and I can feel it and down I go. I can feel the switch turn back on and I snap out of it and function pretty normally.

The only positive difference has been very recently by starting Fetzima. Within three weeks i felt it drag me out of a very severe suicidal depression I had been in for six months. I could very much tell it was the med and not just me snapping out of it. That chemical has changed something in my brain that has allowed me to be pretty functional mostly since april. Better than every med I have ever tried. I was deemed very treatment resistant along time ago.

Something in my brain whether it be neurotransmitters, circuit pathways, glial cells or whatever gets seriously whacked for no apparent reason. After a period of time I return to normal some how some way.

I don't think that in my case you will ever convince me that mine isn't deeply ingrained genetically and biologically based. I have the family history on both sides.

The biggest question to me is not the cause but the treatment. I am very interested in causes because I love science and bio chemistry. I wanted to be a bio chemist but depression got in the way. What counts to me is effective treatment. Of course effective treatment has to be based on a good understanding of causes.

It is like for some reason the way my genes in my cells are told to express themselves gets whacked for awhile. I think the thing between the pre frontal cortex and limbic system shows a lot of promise. Some times I swear i can literally feel the disconnect.

I mostly pay attention to the respected research community such as NIMH, Stanford, Harvard, University of Michigan, UCLA, John Hopkins, University College of London, etc, and not the occasional blog post or one social workers view. The collective research communities view just like it works in physics or other sciences and medicine. The brain is a much harder subject to study.

Very, very hard. Which is why there is no sure agreement on the cause of depression (or many mental illnesses) even within the psychological community.

Even though I'm a psych major, I will be the first to admit that neuroscience never interested me much. I'm more interested in the effect (of mental illness) than the cause (of mental illness). Though, the cause can be interesting, too, all the technical talk about dopamine and seretonin starts to bore me.

I will say that I tend to lean toward the view that it is part environment, part genetics/biological. I do believe some of my circumstances contribute to my depression, but then one has to wonder why there are people in my same circumstances who aren't suffering from depression. Something - be it seretonin or glial cells... whatever... something - in me is triggered, causing depression, that isn't triggered in someone who does not have a depressive disorder.

These sites also identify multiple potential causes of depression:

What is Depression? - Depression Research Clinic - Department of Psychiatry - Stanford University School of Medicine
Depression | University Health Service

WebMD too lists multiple potential causes: Causes of Depression: Genetics, Illness, Abuse, and More

No one knows with medical certainty what causes depression.

I have to agree with you Zinco my family history is too long and detailed to overlook that it is not genetically / biologically linked as I said in a prior post. We are only in our infancy of discovering our the brain works.. In the documentary I said I saw it was a study in the U.K. Where the structural brain difference between depressed and non depressed individuals were studied. If I remember correctly the glia was shown as well in that there was a size difference between the two.

As someone said here it could all be in the perception as per people who love coke or Pepsi see the caps differently.. I hardly think that is the case with this study to me that is like saying someone who heart disease with blocked arteries is the perception.

It is exciting for me to see that they are starting to see actually proof of this illness as they have with so many other physical illnesses.. It may be a small step but it's one more step towards discovery that will build upon. With a family history as long as mine maybe one day it will not be a high probable factor for future generations .

At least we have options to try better than having none at all even if we are still searching mostly in the dark.