[lucami]

So, 3 days ago I've been to my psychiatrist, and he said I don't have schizophrenia.. but when I told him about my disconnected episodes, like my body would be soulless, like somebody would control me or I would be on auto mode, he gave me 'that' look, like something would be worrisome in this.. but he didn't say nothing, even when I asked him if it may be schizoaffective :s well just mentioned I may be over-analyzing, and that's all..
So it would be nice if somebody could explain me where border between depersonalization/derealization and schizoaffective/etc lies I've heard that ppl with schizophrenia etc. can have dd too, but it's different.. but how different? Do they don't know they felt unreal till it passed or something?
After that visit my depersonalization or whatever it is came back and started to grow, that today I feel like my mind is turned off, my sanity, I'm kind of outside of the body, it's not me, not my body, like I would be a clone of myself with my look and way of thinking, but not 'me'... It's really hard to put this 'feeling' in words :c I felt unreal so many times but this time is different, I feel like I watch but don't see, feel trapped in my body and mind is telling me 'get out of it' while i feel like i's just a body that used to be mine, now it's maybe someone else with different mind.. I typed so many feelings, but 'feelings' are kind of bad word because I 'feel' *yeah again* like only 1% of my mind is scared and working, rest almost don't think and don't feel, and whatever I do is strange, I talk normal and act totally normal as family said, but it feels like I'm on automode, and have very strong compulsions inside, like some kind of beast would force me to him my head to the wall or sth like that.. I know it sounds kinda crazy but I hope someone will understand what I mean :s

[amandalouise]

Originally Posted by lucami

So, 3 days ago I've been to my psychiatrist, and he said I don't have schizophrenia.. but when I told him about my disconnected episodes, like my body would be soulless, like somebody would control me or I would be on auto mode, he gave me 'that' look, like something would be worrisome in this.. but he didn't say nothing, even when I asked him if it may be schizoaffective :s well just mentioned I may be over-analyzing, and that's all..
So it would be nice if somebody could explain me where border between depersonalization/derealization and schizoaffective/etc lies I've heard that ppl with schizophrenia etc. can have dd too, but it's different.. but how different? Do they don't know they felt unreal till it passed or something?
After that visit my depersonalization or whatever it is came back and started to grow, that today I feel like my mind is turned off, my sanity, I'm kind of outside of the body, it's not me, not my body, like I would be a clone of myself with my look and way of thinking, but not 'me'... It's really hard to put this 'feeling' in words :c I felt unreal so many times but this time is different, I feel like I watch but don't see, feel trapped in my body and mind is telling me 'get out of it' while i feel like i's just a body that used to be mine, now it's maybe someone else with different mind.. I typed so many feelings, but 'feelings' are kind of bad word because I 'feel' *yeah again* like only 1% of my mind is scared and working, rest almost don't think and don't feel, and whatever I do is strange, I talk normal and act totally normal as family said, but it feels like I'm on automode, and have very strong compulsions inside, like some kind of beast would force me to him my head to the wall or sth like that.. I know it sounds kinda crazy but I hope someone will understand what I mean :s

short version if you dont meet the diagnostic criteria then you are not called/labeled that disorder.

basic differences...dissociative disorders do not include having delusions, hallucinations, disorganized speech, disorganized/catatonic behaviors for diagnostic criteria schizophrenic type disorders do plus other symptoms called negative symptoms are included those with in the diagnostics.

both schizophrenia type mental disorders and dissociative disorders can have the those same symptoms you describe but if you dont meet the diagnostic criteria thats in the DSM 5 a treatment provider can not legally diagnose you with a mental disorder.

the way the DSM 5 is wrote and that its fairly new you most likely wont find out much of what you want to know unless you contact your treatment provider and ask him why he feels you do not have schizophrenia and ask him what your diagnosis's are. if you don't agree with your treatment providers diagnosis you can also request diagnostic evaluation /testing procedures.

[lucami]

delusions-sometimes I have, like I was sure I saw spider, but there was none, but it lasts for like few seconds so my psychologist said it doesn't count
hallucinations-same, 'few seconds doesn't count'
disorganized speech-I think I may had once, when I was outside with my dog and got so unreal I wasn't sure what I said to neighbor's kid and everything was so strange I was sure I'm going to wrong home, my room looked totally like not mine.. but it was the only so heavy episode like this
disorganized/catatonic behaviors-my life is quite catatonic, I don't go anywhere because of agoraphobia so it's hard to tell
I also never had something like not knowing what I did for whole day, even if I still feel disconnected I talk normally and type normally as you can see. My current diagnosis- anxiety disorder, panic disorder, agoraphobia, depression, depersonalization/derealization, OCD.

But when I feel like now I'm not sure is I'm not shizoaffective, I read that there's thin border between this and dd with anxiety and stuff.. I'll ask my doc about tests but next appointment I have 30th December so it's whole month of waiting. Till I will be able to see doc I would like to know if my current feelings/being are something to worry about, if it may be this or that..

And btw, in next week I'm going to neurologist, I want to check my brain because I have very heavy headaches and sometimes shaking vision an it worries me, so does shizoaffective, etc, could be visible in CT? I've heard schizophrenia can be, but I'm not sure if it's true..

[amandalouise]

Originally Posted by lucami

delusions-sometimes I have, like I was sure I saw spider, but there was none, but it lasts for like few seconds so my psychologist said it doesn't count
hallucinations-same, 'few seconds doesn't count'
disorganized speech-I think I may had once, when I was outside with my dog and got so unreal I wasn't sure what I said to neighbor's kid and everything was so strange I was sure I'm going to wrong home, my room looked totally like not mine.. but it was the only so heavy episode like this
disorganized/catatonic behaviors-my life is quite catatonic, I don't go anywhere because of agoraphobia so it's hard to tell
I also never had something like not knowing what I did for whole day, even if I still feel disconnected I talk normally and type normally as you can see. My current diagnosis- anxiety disorder, panic disorder, agoraphobia, depression, depersonalization/derealization, OCD.

But when I feel like now I'm not sure is I'm not shizoaffective, I read that there's thin border between this and dd with anxiety and stuff.. I'll ask my doc about tests but next appointment I have 30th December so it's whole month of waiting. Till I will be able to see doc I would like to know if my current feelings/being are something to worry about, if it may be this or that..

And btw, in next week I'm going to neurologist, I want to check my brain because I have very heavy headaches and sometimes shaking vision an it worries me, so does shizoaffective, etc, could be visible in CT? I've heard schizophrenia can be, but I'm not sure if it's true..

catatonic doesnt mean you are stuck at home due to a mental disorder. it means you are literally a statue...you cant speak, you cant move, you cant respond. example in mental hospitals you will find people sitting on their beds or standing in the hall ways. they dont move, blink or talk, frozen in place so to speak. the nurses have to literally dress and move them from place to place. some what little movements they can make have no purpose ie take a step side ways but nothing was in their path, nothing for them to do in that new direction just stand there again like a statute. most if not all their catatonic positions are what treatment providers call out of the ordinary/bazaar. maybe their arm is up over their heads for hours/days on end while in this catatonic state, or their foot/leg is held up off the floor for hours/days on end. one person I know during their catatonic state their foot is up off the ground and toes pointed for days at a time and their fingers held at a strange angle for days at a time.

Disorganized speech doesnt mean the person with schizophrenia doesnt remember what they said, or that they cant organize their home. quite the opposite what they say and do makes perfect sense to them and they actually are able to keep their home and activities very organized bordering on obsessive organization....

its others outside themselves like friends family treatment providers that find the schizophrenics speech disorganized because it usually rhymes /echos and a different sentence structure....example one schizophrenic I know says frequently I red, red, gate blue green 123, gzb gzb , ...when she is stable you ask her what it means and she says "you asked me how I am my answer was I was scared, stuck and sad and trying to hear past the 3 voices that wouldnt shut up."

my suggestion dont worry about what else you may have. just keep working with your treatment providers and you will feel better/things will get better

[lucami]

ok thanks I needed clear info. So many things can happen in mind, it's so easy to get lost in this all symptoms..

Ok. I'm trying today think about how I feel as it's only depresonalization/derealization. It's pretty hard though, especially when evening comes, because feeling like something is tearing me apart inside, tries to take control, and like someone would be standing behind me.. Also, this watching but not seeing, such crazy feeling.. I fear that I can loose control any moment :/

[Kiya]

I sometimes end up in a semi-catatonic state. It's SO not fun. Can't move or speak yet in my head i'm YELLING for some one to please please help me. Professionals in the hospital can be so not understanding. They try to shove meds into my hand (which won't grasp anything) or worse, pour them down my throat (YIKE!) when I can't swallow, yet alone open my mouth. It can take quite a long time to come out of and when I finally can move (usually one body part at a time... a finger... then a few more... then a hand... etc) I am in so much pain from the tight muscles that I have been fighting for so long. One alter specifically can usually draw us out if there is someone there to talk to her and get her moving.
We also have one selectively mute alter... try explaining to them why I suddenly can't or won't talk.
Those episodes label me "resistant". Unreal. They think I'm doing it on purpose. I am trying to educate them - type up some things and give them to a nurse I trust. Educate one staff member at a time.

[geis]

Sometimes when I'm triggered, I experience what's called a tonic immobility state, which is similar to catatonia--the difference being that it only happens in direct response to a trauma trigger. And if someone helps me move through the trigger and get grounded, I'm able to move and speak again.

[amandalouise]

Originally Posted by geis

Sometimes when I'm triggered, I experience what's called a tonic immobility state, which is similar to catatonia--the difference being that it only happens in direct response to a trauma trigger. And if someone helps me move through the trigger and get grounded, I'm able to move and speak again.

here in NY tonic immobility state means the same thing as catatonic with one exception... the term tonic immobility state is used to describe an animal who "plays dead" or "appears to be dead" because of fear. thats pretty cool that your location has adapted that definition to include what NY calls Catatonic behavior. it definately fits doesnt it. some people do have a coping mechanism where when they are afraid they freeze, play dead, or appear to be dead like an animal would.

Another term we use for when humans are so afraid they are tonic immobilized is the saying that person is "frozen with fear", and if that frozen with fear has a certain theme to it here in NY its called a phobia.

[Claritytoo]

Originally Posted by Kiya

I sometimes end up in a semi-catatonic state. It's SO not fun. Can't move or speak yet in my head i'm YELLING for some one to please please help me. Professionals in the hospital can be so not understanding. They try to shove meds into my hand (which won't grasp anything) or worse, pour them down my throat (YIKE!) when I can't swallow, yet alone open my mouth. It can take quite a long time to come out of and when I finally can move (usually one body part at a time... a finger... then a few more... then a hand... etc) I am in so much pain from the tight muscles that I have been fighting for so long. One alter specifically can usually draw us out if there is someone there to talk to her and get her moving.
We also have one selectively mute alter... try explaining to them why I suddenly can't or won't talk.
Those episodes label me "resistant". Unreal. They think I'm doing it on purpose. I am trying to educate them - type up some things and give them to a nurse I trust. Educate one staff member at a time.

Is the semi catatonic state an alter? Someone who's job it was to be perfectly still. Can you talk to your system through thought when you are in that state and ask if this semi catatonic state is someone trying to protect you? If it is let them know that they don't have to do that anymore and thank them for their help. I had an issue injuring myself. It was an alter who was trying to help us by distracting us from the emotional pain by causing physical pain. We talked. He still will suggest that we injure our self every now and then but we say no because we don't need to. He accepts that and we move forward. This is just a thought. Might not apply to your system but you never know. I have learned that the things we do began as a way to save us. It was meant to be helpful. Take care.

[Kiya]

Originally Posted by Claritytoo

Is the semi catatonic state an alter? Someone who's job it was to be perfectly still. Can you talk to your system through thought when you are in that state and ask if this semi catatonic state is someone trying to protect you? If it is let them know that they don't have to do that anymore and thank them for their help. I had an issue injuring myself. It was an alter who was trying to help us by distracting us from the emotional pain by causing physical pain. We talked. He still will suggest that we injure our self every now and then but we say no because we don't need to. He accepts that and we move forward. This is just a thought. Might not apply to your system but you never know. I have learned that the things we do began as a way to save us. It was meant to be helpful. Take care.

Good ideas. I know that when we get into that catatonic state, there is so much panic!!! When it happens again, I hope to remember this and try it. In fact, I start seeing a new T in the middle of this month. I ought to write this down and give it to her for when it happens so she can suggest it to us. It does tend to happen with new people, so there is likely a protective quality there. Like NO MORE INFO! brain freeze. SI is the same with us; 3 certain alters - usually one bullying the other into it. Sometimes I can negotiate with them, sometimes they swap in before I get a chance (or even then sometimes I can talk with them when I am in the back and come up with ways to not harm). thanks!

[Kiya]

Originally Posted by geis

Sometimes when I'm triggered, I experience what's called a tonic immobility state, which is similar to catatonia--the difference being that it only happens in direct response to a trauma trigger. And if someone helps me move through the trigger and get grounded, I'm able to move and speak again.

sounds about right to me. it doesn't happen for us otherwise, either.

[cool09]

But when I feel like now I'm not sure is I'm not shizoaffective, I read that there's thin border between this and dd with anxiety and stuff..

Schizoaffective is combination of bipolar disorder and schizophrenia. Do you have mood swings which include severe irritability, agitation, mania, distractability, oversensitivity? My present Dr. said that schizoaffective diagnosis is not used a great deal anymore - one is usually diagnosed schizophrenic or bipolar instead.

[Kiya]

Originally Posted by cool09

Schizoaffective is combination of bipolar disorder and schizophrenia. Do you have mood swings which include severe irritability, agitation, mania, distractability, oversensitivity? My present Dr. said that schizoaffective diagnosis is not used a great deal anymore - one is usually diagnosed schizophrenic or bipolar instead.

Hm. That sounds like ME - and I am in a hospital day treatment program and didn't get that label. But DID (full blown multiple personalities) takes care of that, I guess. I told the doc one (crazy) therapist I'd seen in the summer labelled me as schizo and she shook her head and rolled her eyes, confirming I'm definitely not.

[lucami]

damn it's all so messed up:c now I remember that I had partial immobility state/catatonic(?) about two times in last mmm let's say 10 years, I just lost control over my legs, couldn't move it at, felt down on a street, and my mother didn't believe me at all just yelled what I'm doing...

my doc said I don't have a schizophrenia, it would be visible and somebody would notice it.. he said I'm over analyzing everything eh :s

Do you have mood swings which include severe irritability, agitation, mania, distractability, oversensitivity?

hmm yeah I think I have this stuff but I don't know, my doc says it's anxiety and panic disorder and I'm just a sensitive type of person...
eh today I feel strange, about 10pm I had feelings to kill everyone at home, and i don't know what to think about it too..:c

[Kiya]

ok when your head tells you to hurt yourself, you need to get help.
when your head tells you to kill others, you get yourself to the hospital. period.
I'm serious. This is serious. You need skilled intervention and you need it now. There is no shame in seeking help. It is GOOD to take care of yourself in this way to keep yourself and others safe.
I was on a scary med that made me have that feeling to kill others (it is REALLY unlike me to think those thoughts and want to act that way). I put myself immediately in the hospital. Don't mess around with that. If you are afraid you will lose control - you need to be in a controlled environment.
Please get help. You can do this. It is time (past time) to get help.
take care of you.