Is this what it's like to be 13 in todays society??

It is a very good point D&D. A lot of guys (and no I'm not pointing the finger at all of them) come up with every excuse under the sun to get sex. I've been told that if a guy has to wait any longer than 3 months to get sex he has every right to break up with a girl. And there's the old 'guys need to have sex or they can die from prostate cancer' excuse. Well start planning your funeral honey...

yeah evening i know exactly what you mean and it is total bs. guys like that really bug me cause they ruin relationships for the rest of us.

Ha you know I think you may be right on that one.

What if you brought up the bus monitor idea at a PTA meeting or maybe have a flyer in the schools office. Maybe have a talk with the school counselor about this idea. Maybe enough will sign up to have a rotating schedule so no one person has to do it all the time (kind of like meals on wheels). If that doesn't work, a kid cam recording for a few days should catch something. Keep a copy for yourself, copy for the school and a copy to the media? I know city buses have cams to protect the passengers.

I remember having parents as school volunteers in the lunchroom in Public School when I was growing up.

I guess, given the high cost of living, there aren't many at home parents anymore.

This is a worrisome topic; as it is known that many young girls who have been violated at an early age(in the home)DO become very promiscuous, and also develop very early...I am sad for this girl.

Even in homes that Appear to be "loving&normal"; you don't know what is really going on.......I didn't know what was happening in my own home till my daughter came and told me when she was 13. I was a blind idiot!!! Some of the most "good" homes are
being infiltrated by incest ---people in them just don't want to believe it.

It is frightening-----------------------and sad------theo

It seems that there is quite a bit of support for the 'parent volunteer' on the bus idea but I see a potential problem, in fact, potential is not quite right, I see an almost inevitable problem. Whose moral standards are the parents going to uphold? It may be that the parents who are interested in volunteering may have the most similar standards, but I suspect that they will be hearing loudly from the more argumentative parents in no time.

We know that their are some huge ideological moral gaps between say a San Francisco liberal and a midwestern conservative; who gets to determine what standards are used to police the children? I really think that question could get tied up in the courts till the kids all graduated from college.

Take the girl in question. Her parents aren't going to come forward and say, "Wow, thank you very much for bringing this to our attention. We had no idea how much our neglect of our daughter in order to provide for our alcohol addiction was impacting her." What they are much more likely going to say, if confronted, is "How dare you tell me how to parent! We believe in girls embracing their sexuality - why is it only boys that it's okay for? This is normal kid messing around and you're a prude!"

Or how about when one of the parents tries to prevent two gay boys from holding hands? Or two lesbian girls? Especially after that parent ignored heterosexual hand-holding while staying alert to breast handling. One parent allows a peck on the cheek; another freaks out over it.

We know that their are some huge ideological moral gaps between say a San Francisco liberal and a midwestern conservative; who gets to determine what standards are used to police the children? I really think that question could get tied up in the courts till the kids all graduated from college.

The parents should not have to take on the responsibility of monitoring the students. That is the responsibility of the school. The school can assign an aide to ride the bus to keep kids in line for as long as it is needed.

When my son was in elementary school he was a wild child with ADHD in the afternoon. His ritalin in the morning kept him fairly calm but despite taking an extra dose of ritalin at school at noon he was very hyperactive in the afternoon and he could not control his hyperactivity enough to stay seated on the bus ride home. They assigned an aide for the afternoon bus for a couple of years and by the time he got to middle school his hyperactivity was not as severe and he no longer needed that supervision.

If they are actually doing acts on the bus, then you would be in possesion of Child Pornography...

Just this week the school started sex education for grades 7 & 8 - I imagine the more detailed version for the grade 8. The kids in the school know already, there's no hugging, kissing or hand holding on school property. I think I'll call the principle and see if he can make a point of emphasizing this rule on the bus as well.

They have parent volunteers for lunch and recess and when my daughter went to her previous school - 3 older kids would patrol the bus. For some reason older kids think it's dorky to be a patrol in grade 8.

Going back yo the incident this wasn't a young boy and girl who are a couple an snuck a feel. Boys know they can just reach out and grab her - she's fine with it.

Desperate&Disturbed and Evening - I wish more young peoeple were like both of you. Even though I didn't have sex until I was 18 - I truly wish I waited even longer. I wish I had a mentor who would have said, you have to graduate from University before getting serious with a partner. Once I became involved in the relationship I lost focus on school. School is so hard and kids don't need all the complications of relationships dragging them down. Plus those relationships rarely last and then they end up feeling used.

(from another of your replies):
I just looked up the girls profile on Facebook and saw a 'report' button but I doubt this will make a difference. I'll check more in depth tomorrow if I can somehow send a direct email to Facebook. There has to be some law which prevents a 13 yr old from posting bikini shots of herself.

Unfortunately, I don't think there is a damn thing that can be done regarding her facebook matter as, most likely, she has parents who just don't give a rats ***.
THAT is the primary problem. The parents and how THEY attend to it.

I'm not familiar to facebook whatsoever, (never cared to even check it out), so I can't be sure of what their rules are, but of course, it's illegal for ANY minor to include any kind of sexual innuendo's & profanity, or access anything which has profanity & sex on the Internet. Because of this, I'm guessing that she has lied about her age to have the access that adults do, hard to say.

Unfortunately, the Internet creates so many opportunities for the youth not only be introduced to sex too early, (therefore greatly influenced), but how incredibly easy it is to respond in the same.
It's as simple as typing in the appropriate age on the site membership application and..Bingo! You're in.

I can't help but to wonder if going to the principal of the school and notifying him of her facebook behavior is going to even make a difference.

The reality of the matter is it ALL begins with the parents and how they attend to their children.
Kids really ARE a product of their environment.

Shangrala

That's the primary root to it all, I think.
It all starts at home, and if there is no one there to guide them enough of the time, then they are left to wander sooner, further and far more freely.

And what sucks, too is, there are MANY hard working and single parents out there who are struggling to maintain a structure of morals and values, but are losing the battle as the influence of the Internet is winning the war, so to speak.

You know I did a little poking around the internet last night. There are padded bikinis for 7 year olds out there. 14 year olds are presenting with STDs at an epidemic rate. And a powerful media that knows some kids parents don't give a rats *** about their kids morals. This is where the media goes after the kids money.

I would like to comment on AkAngel’s post. While you bring up very good points, the fact remains that the contact that this girl is engaging in is most probably already against school policy. Volunteer parents would not be willy nilly deciding what behavior is acceptable, differing day by day depending upon the parent, their job would be to ensure that school policy is being followed.

The standard has already been set by the school board and is clearly written in the student handbook. In our school district it has gotten to the point that ANY physical contact is strictly prohibited. BECAUSE some parents do use the logic “how can you punish Johnny and Susie for heavy petting in study hall when Billy and Sally were holding hands.” ALL contact is prohibited, you cannot shake another person’s hand, you cannot tap someone on the shoulder to get their attention, you cannot pat someone on the back and say good job, no high fives. This begins as soon as you enter school property. Graduation was last night, the students did not get a congratulatory handshake with their diploma, just a nod of the head. How sad is that?

Yoda – I disagree, it IS our job as parents to do as much as we possibly can to support our schools. Their budgets are being cut left and right, no one wants an increase in their property tax. If they can eliminate some paid hallway, playground, lunch and study hall monitors so they can… I don’t know, turn the heat above 60 in the winter so the kids don’t have to wear their winter coats to classes or order more textbooks so that students don’t have to share or deal with literally 15 year old books with pages missing held together with Duct Tape, I call that a good system. The days where you give birth to a child, pay your taxes and send them to school and figure the rest is on them are long gone.

The salaries of the aids you speak of are paid for by the federal government for special needs children. These aids are a great asset to the school, especially when parents such as me authorize them to fulfill other school duties when my child did not need her assistance. But the money does not come from the local school’s budget.

I do understand what you are saying, but the reality is, the parents would be deciding. Case in point, my wife is in prison - probably one of the most regulated places on earth. Every six months the visiting sergeant rotates out and a new one in charge of visiting rotates in. The rules are very clear and yet every time we get a new sergeant, the interpretation of the rules change wildly.

We can't share drinks becomes, we can't share drinks or food. A brief kiss upon greeting has been described as, "no more than three seconds", "less than one second", "open mouth kisses prohibited", "open mouth kisses are allowed" etc. Blue tops are not allowed, but on some rotations green is not allowed because it looks too much like blue, During one six month period yellow was not allowed because it looked too much like blue too...don't ask.

My point is, no matter how well written and clear the school policies and rules are, people are going to interpret them differently.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AAAAA The standard has already been set by the school board and is clearly written in the student handbook. In our school district it has gotten to the point that ANY physical contact is strictly prohibited. BECAUSE some parents do use the logic “how can you punish Johnny and Susie for heavy petting in study hall when Billy and Sally were holding hands.” ALL contact is prohibited, you cannot shake another person’s hand, you cannot tap someone on the shoulder to get their attention, you cannot pat someone on the back and say good job, no high fives. This begins as soon as you enter school property. Graduation was last night, the students did not get a congratulatory handshake with their diploma, just a nod of the head. How sad is that?

Incredibly sad. I recently heard of a young girl, validictorian of her class - giving her best friend a hug when she learned that her friends grandmother had just died. They weren't even in school but they were on school property in sight of both of their parents (it was after school and they were being picked up, the girl had noticed her mother had been crying, inquired, and that's how and when she found out). The validictorian was suspended.

And see, that was my point. People make bad choices when they try to enforce rules so the system tries to make those rules stupid-proof by requiring blind obedience to the rules. The school district doesn't need to worry about some discrimination lawsuit brought about when some teacher breaks up two boys hugging in front of the school but let's these two girls console each other because their going to throw the book at everyone equally. It's stupid, but people can't be counted on to use discretion intelligently, so they've tried to take discretion out of the equation.

Good discussion.

Perhaps it’s my OCD, but rules make me feel secure. In theory it makes things predictable. But the downfall is that I’m forever irritated when people do not follow the rules and even more irritated when the rules are not enforced. Life would be so much easier if I could just not care.

So what ever happened to car pooling?

Well I'm 12 years old almost 13 right now, and from my experience people in my grade are french-kissing, girls and guys are bisexual, people are having sex, posting proactive pictures of themselves on facebook, cursing, wearing a cake load of makeup, dressing slutty, having more than 3 pericings, getting henna tattoos and the list could go on and on. But I shouldn't be talking anyways.

Yes I agree Shangrala - I wrote that post the first day it happened and was upset seeing the 13yr olds pictures. I also heard from my daughter the school has had repeated problems with this girl - skipping school, getting caught behind the school with a boy and even on the roof with a boy. So I thought if I mentioned the facebook, then the school would have grounds for informing 'child's services' - because I sense there must be something very wrong in her home or with her. Now that I've calmed down I don't think I'll notify the school about her Facebook - not my business.

Are you kidding? At right about 13 years old if anyone should be talking it should be you. Thanks for your input.

i just found out a girl at my school who is 17 has a 2-3 year old daughter.
and that a friend of mine started having sex when he was 10. smh
im kinda getting pressured into it

Thanks for sharing what you see from your view -sounds very scary from a parents view.

I just wanted to mention in general about pictures on the internet/texting. Anyone can take those pictures copy it, send it to as many people as they wish or post it on Google. Photobucket or bad porn sites. The picture will last forever.

There was one case in Michigan where a high school girl sent a nude photo to a boy she liked. He sent it to a few people and they did the same -before she new it, every student with a phone had her naked on it.

This child I'm talking about, could have her picture copied and pasted as advertising for a child porn site. I just can't see how it's legitimate to have your 13 yr old posing on Facebook in underwear and bikini bathing suit.

Talk with (not at them) your kids about the subject, make them feel comfortable to be able to talk to you about anything. Explain your point of view in terms they can understand. Because of my illness, my son grew up helping my husband take care of me, he saw me nude and to him it is just a body not a provocative object, he is now a grown man, and respects people that way including anyone he dates. He thanked us for being such open minded parents that he could come to with any question and we would not critisize. Your kids are smarter and know more about things in life than we did at that age due to the media, I know I learned alot from our son too. Good Luck, there is no manual, just do the best you can and dont push them away but guide them in the right direction as best you can.

Great point you made about talking with and not at young people. I've been having a progressive talks with my own daughter since grade 5 and she knows about sex, STD's, pregnancy and the emotional risks of getting involved too young. She knows I'll answer any question and I'm not uncomfortable speaking about it. I don't want to be how my mother was, not teaching me anything. You're all going to laugh, but when I was 18 I thought oral sex was 'talking sexy' lol. I also didn't know about STD's

So far my daughter is excellent and I'm proud she told me what happened. When she 1st told me she looked a bit sad and she said "you know Ive know this boy since Junior Kindergarten and I'm so disappointed in his behavior" and that's when she told me. She's an independent thinker and a leader type - so proud of her.

Very interesting is reading & skimming over all the posts, I only noticed one mention by AAAAA about the lack of moral values that exists in society anymore.

I am guessing that moral values are a thing of the past in many cases. Seems like many of the parents who's children have no moral values don't live their lives based on any moral values so have no concept of what to teach their children in the first place. The world seems to have turned into a place where people have to do what ever they want without regard to themselves or their future or thinking about the others they interface with either...if it's something they want to do, & feels good, they they have the right to do it whether sex or drugs or anything else when it comes right down to it.

I remember the philosophy that came with out of my generation. Many didn't want to corrupt our children minds with values or beliefs because they wanted to allow them to make up their own minds by not giving them any values at all to base their thinking on or change from. Now I see where that thinking has brought our society. Sadly, this link is very descriptive of how society has degraded so rapidly over the 40 years since I was in high school.

The comment that we can't do anything about it is very accurate. It is impossible to make people care or have values they don't have & don't want to have. We can't make parents be good parents who didn't have good parents to learn from. I can't imagine what the next generation of children are going to be like based on where society is in the 13 year old lives today since it's degraded so bad at this point.

Personally, I truly believe that the lack of moral values that exists is the basis for the problem, then you add to that, the music, the TV, the movies none of which contain any moral value teaching either & all society is pushing is sex & drugs & pleasure & other values that have nothing to do with what a person's true value is all about. When we have nothing to give us reason to have values, where does that reasoning come from? How do children know good values when they haven't seen any good examples from their parents?

I think I have done enough ranting on this subject. Lynn, I think that you are right in trying to fight the things that are being allowed to happen on the bus. Those of us who do believe that there needs to be good values in place can't sit back & do nothing. Not sure just how much the principal can do as much of their hands are tied in enforcing any moral values either. I don't want to get into the subject about the lack of being able to enforce anything in the schools. The teachers have their hands tied by the parents who don't want their children's freedoms interfered with. Teachers don't have a way to enforce any rules that are set anyway. It has been touched on in other threads anyway.

Enough of my ranting on this subject, but hold to your values Lynn & let it be known that those who have moral values do not believe that action to be allowed on the bus. Children should not have that kind of action pushed on them to see, just because a young 13 year old girl has lack of moral values she wants to live with. She needs to learn that there is a right & wrong in society even though in her world she hasn't learned that.

Thank you for taking the time to write such a meaningful post ((Eskielover)). I think you're absolutely right - the moral values are degrading along with the influence of TV and particularly the internet. I wish I knew how to stop or improve it

Let me tell you a story. My daughter has MSN and was talking to a nice boy from school. I had to use the computer but she was still signed in. So his convo pops up and it reads "hey you're a biotch". She called him by telephone and he vehemently denied saying this and said he was having a snack, while his mother was on his computer. I said let me have the phone and she admitted she did that and was supposedly kidding around cause all his friends talk like this - I was stunned! This is a perfect example of what some parents are like.

I know there are many good kids at my daughters school and I think kids like these are the minority I hope. I do agree it's scary how the morals and even common politeness is fading away. I've been worried abut this for a while now. Everyday when my girls get home from school we talk about their day and when they tell me who misbehaved, we discuss what would be the right thing to do.

In this case, I think the principle should ban her from the bus, She's been banned before for telling the principle to F*** O**. You should hear the way they swear - unbelievable. When the year 1st starts every child comes home with bus rules like no standing, no candy/gum etc so all I'm asking for is no sexual contact. Even on a city bus people wouldn't do this. I know this boy wouldn't have done this if he thought there was a chance of rejection.