[rdgrad15]

Do you think it's common for people who strongly deny depression or any other mental illness is a real thing could actually be trying to hide their own personal problems? I know there are some people who truly believe there is no such thing as mental illnesses while others will claim that all you have to do is snap out of it and you'll be fine. I've heard people say stuff like you're not actually depressed or just snap out of it and stop hurting yourself. Sometimes I think this is their own way of hiding their own troubles by acting tough and appearing to have their life under control.

Some people deny the existence of mental illnesses due to their upbringing while others choose to ignore facts backed by years of research claiming that anyone who is depressed is just hurting themselves. Some will go great lengths to do this while appearing to have problems of their own especially if they're generally a negative person which makes me think they're hiding something. It seems more likely someone is trying to hide their own problems by denying the existence of depression despite contradictory behaviors they're displaying. Unfortunately there are those who deny the existence of depression just because they think it's attention seeking behavior and that all you need to do is snap out of it even though it's not that easy.

[Soupe du jour]

rdgrad15, I think you're definitely right about many people. Stigma, self-denial, and other factors definitely shape attitudes, and though it is certainly often a learned behavior, general education and intelligence doesn't always make a difference.

I think a lot of people also know that they may be mentally ill, but flat out want to fight it. What I call "tight fisting it" through life. I did plenty of that in the past, and on occasion find myself still. Several people (and I did in the past) will quit meds, not necessarily denying the mental illness but again thinking they can manage without. Ditto goes when it comes to therapy. Surely bad medication side effects can inspire this, but also other factors. Feeling "weak" is against many people's grains.

Another take on this is being so frustrated with being ill that we convince ourselves we are better than we are. I've been guilty of that, too. I've done mood charts where I kept indicating "baseline, baseline, baseline" when later I redid them to show either mildly/moderately depressed or even hypomanic or manic. An unexpected hospitalization (or near one) or ramification to behavior can be enlightening. I sometimes suspect the exact opposite of some others.

[downandlonely]

Denial is common. Some people think positive thinking is all it takes to cure depression.

However, while I think negative thinking can make my depression worse, no amount of positive thinking can cure me. I have a genetic chemical imbalance that requires medication to treat.

I compare it to diabetes. Diet and exercise can help to treat diabetes, but once it gets to the point where the body no longer produces insulin, medication is also essential.

[Mountaindewed]

I think some people don't want to get better so they dont try and put in the effort. Why? I have no idea. I deleted some, who sounded to me like attention seekers, from my Facebook a couple years ago.

[eskielover]

My depression was situational but no one treating me got that so I didn't either until I left the situation. I look back & wonder how I ever could have gotten that bad but with outstanding therapy we put my 54 years of previous life together & it made sense. Add better skills learned & now life is better than it ever was for me. I couldn't deny it because the depression the situation caused destroyed me & made me totally non-functional after having a good computer design engineering career.

The one in denial was my ex as he didn't believe that anything was wrong with him & neither did my parents when they were alive. After I left, he got angry when I suggested that he ho get a diagnosis to determine what was REALLY causing his total dysfunction though he said it made sense when he atiooed to think about it. The possible suggestion cane from a therapist I had when talking about all I had gone through & suggested that I might even have had more causes for PTSD than I was aware of.

It is nice to be functional again but I am constantly aware if something starts to throw me off again & I take action before it builds up but that is mostly anxiety. Love my life now (single & on my small peaceful farm surrounded by nature) so depression is totally non-existent in my life now. I sure knows what it feels like even to the point of attempting suicide to escape what I was feeling. That wasc13 years of h*ll

[rdgrad15]

Originally Posted by Soupe du jour

rdgrad15, I think you're definitely right about many people. Stigma, self-denial, and other factors definitely shape attitudes, and though it is certainly often a learned behavior, general education and intelligence doesn't always make a difference.

I think a lot of people also know that they may be mentally ill, but flat out want to fight it. What I call "tight fisting it" through life. I did plenty of that in the past, and on occasion find myself still. Several people (and I did in the past) will quit meds, not necessarily denying the mental illness but again thinking they can manage without. Ditto goes when it comes to therapy. Surely bad medication side effects can inspire this, but also other factors. Feeling "weak" is against many people's grains.

Another take on this is being so frustrated with being ill that we convince ourselves we are better than we are. I've been guilty of that, too. I've done mood charts where I kept indicating "baseline, baseline, baseline" when later I redid them to show either mildly/moderately depressed or even hypomanic or manic. An unexpected hospitalization (or near one) or ramification to behavior can be enlightening. I sometimes suspect the exact opposite of some others.

Yeah I think we're all guilty of tight fisting it to a certain extent, we don't want to come off as so weak and negative that we look overly dependent and push others away. I've done that to a certain extent where I pretend I'm fine way more than I really am, also I agree that people with various disorders will stop medication because they believe they can manage without it at least to a certain extent.

[rdgrad15]

Originally Posted by downandlonely

Denial is common. Some people think positive thinking is all it takes to cure depression.

However, while I think negative thinking can make my depression worse, no amount of positive thinking can cure me. I have a genetic chemical imbalance that requires medication to treat.

I compare it to diabetes. Diet and exercise can help to treat diabetes, but once it gets to the point where the body no longer produces insulin, medication is also essential.

I agree, I've heard people say stuff like "think positive things and you'll be happy again" and other similar things. They don't understand that you can't just snap out of it, the way I see it if someone can snap out of it like flipping a light switch then there's a good chance they may not have depression since it's been proven that there's no way to just simply snap out of a genuine depressive episode.

[rdgrad15]

Originally Posted by eskielover

My depression was situational but no one treating me got that so I didn't either until I left the situation. I look back & wonder how I ever could have gotten that bad but with outstanding therapy we put my 54 years of previous life together & it made sense. Add better skills learned & now life is better than it ever was for me. I couldn't deny it because the depression the situation caused destroyed me & made me totally non-functional after having a good computer design engineering career.

The one in denial was my ex as he didn't believe that anything was wrong with him & neither did my parents when they were alive. After I left, he got angry when I suggested that he ho get a diagnosis to determine what was REALLY causing his total dysfunction though he said it made sense when he atiooed to think about it. The possible suggestion cane from a therapist I had when talking about all I had gone through & suggested that I might even have had more causes for PTSD than I was aware of.

It is nice to be functional again but I am constantly aware if something starts to throw me off again & I take action before it builds up but that is mostly anxiety. Love my life now (single & on my small peaceful farm surrounded by nature) so depression is totally non-existent in my life now. I sure knows what it feels like even to the point of attempting suicide to escape what I was feeling. That wasc13 years of h*ll

I think situational depression is common, in fact I believe that's what I have. I always go through bouts of extreme sadness and loneliness as well as staring off into space thinking about things for hours, but I've noticed it gets way way worse if I'm in a negative situation all the time. It's most common when I'm dealing with someone who is toxic and manipulative, they drain the energy out of you which can trigger depressive like symptoms. Now if I'm in a situation like that and I start feeling very sad and it doesn't let up then I know I need to get out of the situation as quickly as possible, I look back at the times I stayed in those situations so long that I was downright miserable and feel ashamed I allowed myself to be in that situation for so long.

[rdgrad15]

Originally Posted by Mountaindewed

I think some people don't want to get better so they dont try and put in the effort. Why? I have no idea. I deleted some, who sounded to me like attention seekers, from my Facebook a couple years ago.

That is true since there are some people who actually seem to enjoy being negative. I've seen enough to know the difference between someone who is truly depressed and someone who just likes attention. Some people may even state they have depression but only when things don't go there way but when they get their way then they're perfectly fine and happy. Someone who is truly depressed will be miserable no matter how well things may be going in their life.

[MuseumGhost]

In my now-nearly 17-year experience with MDD and GAD, I have been exposed to some of the stupidest opinions on MY depression.

I've been told that "depression doesn't exist", and that people who claim to have it are, "attention-seeking losers". (I was told this by my covert narcissist step-monster. Had she spoken to me like that when I was actually not so ill, and so paralyzed in my response times to ridiculous, unforgivably ugly comments, she would have gotten a taste of my admittedly terrifying re-education---via a healthy state, compos mentis rage. (Because not only was I suffering from it, but other people that I dearly loved and admired were now battling with this set of anguishing diseases, too.) She KNEW the pain she was causing me by speaking to me like that. She was one for twisting the knife, and on more than one occasion. How I WISH I could turn back that particular clock, and really give her a piece of my mind. But I came up with no words, and never did get the chance to illuminate her the way she so richly deserved.

Two other people whom I also suspect are very likely some kind of narcissists (both male friends of my husband's), and who have axes to grind (they are macho, alpha-male, snotty entitled jerks, who do not enjoy a history of being very nice to women), have uttered similar things in moments where my husband was momentarily absent. I suppose they believe they are protecting him, somehow. One came right out and said "Depression doesn't exist", and the other said a comparatively idiotic thing, when he opined that "neither depression nor anxiety are real diseases.". Hmm. I wonder what the doctors I've seen would have to say to those very rash and uneducated comments. The first one is single, and understandably so. I feel for the latter's wife, who has, as I've heard through the grapevine, some symptoms of an anxiety disorder. Pray for her---she must be experiencing moments in hell---as they are relative newlyweds, and he has forbidden her from seeing a doctor about it. (Where are we?!? 1950's North Korea?1?)

Nowhere near the despicable attitude of those first 3 towering intellects, the 4th memorable but misplaced comment on Depression came from a well-meaning friend who is actually rather lovely-but-naive, and not the tiniest bit cruel. He insisted (and shared a link to the article containing the miracle cure) that "doing artwork" (which as we all know is almost impossible because of the anhedonia that attends MDD) will, "lift your spirits", and prevent depression from occurring in the first place. AS IF it were that simple. As if ANYTHING were that simple, in life. In response, I sent him a few helpful links of my own. And I am fairly certain they bummed him out.

Lots of people say outrageous, unfounded, and uneducated things, for so many reasons. They might not be informed, which is the simplest and most obvious reason, and ultimately, the reason misinformation and stigmatization STILL have such power over people. It could be that mental illness terrifies the living daylights out of them---they could have sensed it just around the edges of their own life, before, and found the possibility horrifying. It WOULD destroy an awful lot of people's self-image (and world view) if they became the victims of some of these maladies. Then, there are those who just enjoy crushing other human beings' feelings----and giving you a kick in the head on the way through; because of course, if you are suffering from mental illness, you must have done "something to deserve it", the old medieval/ superstitious/ religious explanation for why it happens. And then, there is the completely irrational possibility: There is something about you that threatens them IN SPITE of the fact that you might be ill...and so they express something they know will cause you hurt and wounded feelings. They are the type who need to bruise people, to feel 'on top'.

Whatever the motivation for saying baseless, uninformed, antediluvian commentaries, they definitely :

-Have got the wrong end of the stick
-Should actually go back and take a few more science/ physiology/ general medical/ psychology and perhaps some history classes before they pronounce themselves experts on a topic like this
-Are NOT compassionate, nor are they enlightened people---and they should be avoided at all costs---and need for us to pity THEM.

[rdgrad15]

Originally Posted by MuseumGhost

In my now-nearly 17-year experience with MDD and GAD, I have been exposed to some of the stupidest opinions on MY depression.

I've been told that "depression doesn't exist", and that people who claim to have it are, "attention-seeking losers". (I was told this by my covert narcissist step-monster. Had she spoken to me like that when I was actually not so ill, and so paralyzed in my response times to ridiculous, unforgivably ugly comments, she would have gotten a taste of my admittedly terrifying re-education---via a healthy state, compos mentis rage. (Because not only was I suffering from it, but other people that I dearly loved and admired were now battling with this set of anguishing diseases, too.) She KNEW the pain she was causing me by speaking to me like that. She was one for twisting the knife, and on more than one occasion. How I WISH I could turn back that particular clock, and really give her a piece of my mind. But I came up with no words, and never did get the chance to illuminate her the way she so richly deserved.

Two other people whom I also suspect are very likely some kind of narcissists (both male friends of my husband's), and who have axes to grind (they are macho, alpha-male, snotty entitled jerks, who do not enjoy a history of being very nice to women), have uttered similar things in moments where my husband was momentarily absent. I suppose they believe they are protecting him, somehow. One came right out and said "Depression doesn't exist", and the other said a comparatively idiotic thing, when he opined that "neither depression nor anxiety are real diseases.". Hmm. I wonder what the doctors I've seen would have to say to those very rash and uneducated comments. The first one is single, and understandably so. I feel for the latter's wife, who has, as I've heard through the grapevine, some symptoms of an anxiety disorder. Pray for her---she must be experiencing moments in hell---as they are relative newlyweds, and he has forbidden her from seeing a doctor about it. (Where are we?!? 1950's North Korea?1?)

Nowhere near the despicable attitude of those first 3 towering intellects, the 4th memorable but misplaced comment on Depression came from a well-meaning friend who is actually rather lovely-but-naive, and not the tiniest bit cruel. He insisted (and shared a link to the article containing the miracle cure) that "doing artwork" (which as we all know is almost impossible because of the anhedonia that attends MDD) will, "lift your spirits", and prevent depression from occurring in the first place. AS IF it were that simple. As if ANYTHING were that simple, in life. In response, I sent him a few helpful links of my own. And I am fairly certain they bummed him out.

Lots of people say outrageous, unfounded, and uneducated things, for so many reasons. They might not be informed, which is the simplest and most obvious reason, and ultimately, the reason misinformation and stigmatization STILL have such power over people. It could be that mental illness terrifies the living daylights out of them---they could have sensed it just around the edges of their own life, before, and found the possibility horrifying. It WOULD destroy an awful lot of people's self-image (and world view) if they became the victims of some of these maladies. Then, there are those who just enjoy crushing other human beings' feelings----and giving you a kick in the head on the way through; because of course, if you are suffering from mental illness, you must have done "something to deserve it", the old medieval/ superstitious/ religious explanation for why it happens. And then, there is the completely irrational possibility: There is something about you that threatens them IN SPITE of the fact that you might be ill...and so they express something they know will cause you hurt and wounded feelings. They are the type who need to bruise people, to feel 'on top'.

Whatever the motivation for saying baseless, uninformed, antediluvian commentaries, they definitely :

-Have got the wrong end of the stick
-Should actually go back and take a few more science/ physiology/ general medical/ psychology and perhaps some history classes before they pronounce themselves experts on a topic like this
-Are NOT compassionate, nor are they enlightened people---and they should be avoided at all costs---and need for us to pity THEM.

The first few people you mentioned truly sound narcissistic, I'm sorry you had to deal with them. I'm glad you were able to rid yourself of them, you deserve way better than that and there are people I know that I would love to educate them and give them a taste of their own medicine. For the guy that sent you those links, it actually does sound like he was trying to be helpful but just came off wrong which is actually a very common thing to do since people don't really know how to help others but at least he had good intentions. I agree that most people are just misinformed and uneducated about mental illnesses and could be afraid of them as well, I've been told by people that depression doesn't exist too.

Another thing I've heard people say is depression is easy to snap out of it, just simply think happy thoughts or stop being alone and it will go away. Then thing they don't understand is it's not that easy, I could be in a room full of people and may even be engaged in a conversation and still feel alone. Another thing someone once told me is if you just simply work out then that will cure depression but I've walked before listening to happy music and it doesn't help, I don't think working out does anything to help depression and any relief it does provide is temporary since the negative thoughts and feelings return once you're done. My family believes some mental illnesses don't exist at all while others like depression are easily curable just by thinking happy thoughts, they think anyone who remains depressed is just looking for attention and refuses to be happy.

[downandlonely]

I've never found exercising to be that helpful for my mood, but I can't deny that there are physical benefits.

I've been told that "I don't look depressed" or that I'm too beautiful to be depressed. I find that maddening. Outward appearance has no effect on mental illness.

[MuseumGhost]

Thanks for your response, rdgrad 15. I agree---people are not very educated about the different forms of depression, and they rush to commonly accepted generalizations about it all.

It's laughable, really, when someone who has never personally experienced a certain illness seems to know "everything" about it.

At least the conversations have started. I believe that with education efforts on the increase (at least here in Canada), the topic of mental illness will not be such a taboo, fear-inducing subject in the future. Only understanding can reduce both the stigma and the preposterous misconceptions.

[downandlonely]

I'm working on advocacy at my company. I recently started a group for employees with disabilities.

[rdgrad15]

Originally Posted by downandlonely

I've never found exercising to be that helpful for my mood, but I can't deny that there are physical benefits.

I've been told that "I don't look depressed" or that I'm too beautiful to be depressed. I find that maddening. Outward appearance has no effect on mental illness.

Yeah I agree that exercise is not that helpful, the only real benefit for me is listening to happy music while waking may provide a temporary distraction but even that doesn't always work. Even if it does, as soon as I turn the music off then the negative thoughts come back. I find it annoying when people say "you don't look depressed" too, just because someone looks nice or looks happy on the outside doesn't mean they aren't depressed. In fact, it's very common for those with depression to appear happy on the outside.

[rdgrad15]

Originally Posted by MuseumGhost

Thanks for your response, rdgrad 15. I agree---people are not very educated about the different forms of depression, and they rush to commonly accepted generalizations about it all.

It's laughable, really, when someone who has never personally experienced a certain illness seems to know "everything" about it.

At least the conversations have started. I believe that with education efforts on the increase (at least here in Canada), the topic of mental illness will not be such a taboo, fear-inducing subject in the future. Only understanding can reduce both the stigma and the preposterous misconceptions.

Yeah people like to assume they know everything about a certain mental illness, they also assume that everyone experiences mental illness the same way. I'll be honest, I used to think everyone with depression experienced it the same way but after taking lots of psychology classes in college, I learned that wasn't true. It's rather annoying when those who don't have a mental illness feel the need to put others down and even reject the idea that mental illness exists. I hope the stigmas and misconceptions are debunked at some point but the problem is too many people refuse to acknowledge that depression is real or that everyone has depression, I've heard people say stuff like that to where they believe literally every single person alive on this planet has depression so it's better to just suck it up and not complain and I wish I could give people who say that a taste of their own medicine.

[rdgrad15]

Originally Posted by downandlonely

I'm working on advocacy at my company. I recently started a group for employees with disabilities.

Oh good, that's great to hear!

[MuseumGhost]

I know, rd, I too wish they should be somehow forced to walk in our shoes for a month, just ONE month, with full-on anxiety and depression; and that would open up a lot of eyes to the realities of these illnesses. It would bring the ridiculous assumptions, generalization, and over-simplified, unhelpful advice to a screeching halt.

I'm pretty certain the education levels of the people who've shared their "thoughts" with me are pretty basic. Only one was college-educated, but it was a technical college and not a liberal arts degree by any means. Also, them saying things like that to me---when they really did not know me at all---was deeply insulting. As if THIS is what I dreamed of and worked hard for, all of my life, since before college, and through the start of my career. As if anyone would choose to feel like this, for longer than a day.

Really, anyone who thinks like this is no towering intellect.

[eskielover]

Originally Posted by MuseumGhost

I know, rd, I too wish they should be somehow forced to walk in our shoes for a month, just ONE month, with full-on anxiety and depression; and that would open up a lot of eyes to the realities of these illnesses. It would bring the ridiculous assumptions, generalization, and over-simplified, unhelpful advice to a screeching halt.

I'm pretty certain the education levels of the people who've shared their "thoughts" with me are pretty basic. Only one was college-educated, but it was a technical college and not a liberal arts degree by any means. Also, them saying things like that to me---when they really did not know me at all---was deeply insulting. As if THIS is what I dreamed of and worked hard for, all of my life, since before college, and through the start of my career. As if anyone would choose to feel like this, for longer than a day.

Really, anyone who thinks like this is no towering intellect.

Got news for you....towering intellects aren't any better because many times they are the ones who just worked through what they experienced & succeeded so they think everyone else should be able to do that too. Understanding MH, has nothing to do with intellect but has everything to do with one's actual experiences & how they perceive the life they have experienced themselves

[eskielover]

Just thinking about those of us expecting others to educate themselves about depression /anxiety that we experience.

Just because I am involved with foaling mares & the experiences I go through with that, does it mean that I should expect everyone around me to educate themselves about it?

Seriously, I educate myself mostly about things that effect my life personally, then I educate myself about things I am interested in. Other things I may not make accurate assumptions about if someone draws me into a conversation about something I don't know about. Most times life is so filled with things I have to do that educating myself on the million other things out there in the world isn't even possible. Does that mean I don't have an opinion (everyone is entitled to have their own opinion) even if it doesn't agree with ours.

I think those of us who struggle with mental illness need to be as understanding of others as we expect them to be about us

[rdgrad15]

Originally Posted by MuseumGhost

I know, rd, I too wish they should be somehow forced to walk in our shoes for a month, just ONE month, with full-on anxiety and depression; and that would open up a lot of eyes to the realities of these illnesses. It would bring the ridiculous assumptions, generalization, and over-simplified, unhelpful advice to a screeching halt.

I'm pretty certain the education levels of the people who've shared their "thoughts" with me are pretty basic. Only one was college-educated, but it was a technical college and not a liberal arts degree by any means. Also, them saying things like that to me---when they really did not know me at all---was deeply insulting. As if THIS is what I dreamed of and worked hard for, all of my life, since before college, and through the start of my career. As if anyone would choose to feel like this, for longer than a day.

Really, anyone who thinks like this is no towering intellect.

I agree, people act like those with depression choose to feel that way. Those with this mindset are very uneducated, they truly believe they have the right answers regarding mental illnesses. In fact, I know some people who would probably still deny the existence of depression even if they were forced to walk in the shoes of a depressed person for a month, they would deny they really feel depressed at all or that they were able to cure themselves. Some people will never accept that mental illnesses are a real thing, this is probably a big reason as to why so many people with depression and other disorders refuse to seek help.

[rdgrad15]

Originally Posted by eskielover

Got news for you....towering intellects aren't any better because many times they are the ones who just worked through what they experienced & succeeded so they think everyone else should be able to do that too. Understanding MH, has nothing to do with intellect but has everything to do with one's actual experiences & how they perceive the life they have experienced themselves

That's a valid point, there are people who believe that if they got through their own depression and overcame it without problem then other people should too. Not everyone experiences it the same way but lots of people think depression is the same for everyone, it can be frustrating.

[rdgrad15]

Originally Posted by eskielover

Just thinking about those of us expecting others to educate themselves about depression /anxiety that we experience.

Just because I am involved with foaling mares & the experiences I go through with that, does it mean that I should expect everyone around me to educate themselves about it?

Seriously, I educate myself mostly about things that effect my life personally, then I educate myself about things I am interested in. Other things I may not make accurate assumptions about if someone draws me into a conversation about something I don't know about. Most times life is so filled with things I have to do that educating myself on the million other things out there in the world isn't even possible. Does that mean I don't have an opinion (everyone is entitled to have their own opinion) even if it doesn't agree with ours.

I think those of us who struggle with mental illness need to be as understanding of others as we expect them to be about us

I see where you're coming from, I know we can't expect people to always understand what those with mental illness are going through. I think the thing people with mental illness get annoyed with the most is when people act like there's no such thing as mental illness or that you can easily get over it yourself, there are some who truly believe without a shadow of a doubt that if you're depressed then that is 100 percent on you and no one else but you and that is completely your fault that you feel that way which is why those with depression feel like they have to hide how they feel.

[downandlonely]

I would also add that although most people will never foal a mare, I think everyone knows someone with a mental illness.

But I don't really expect people to educate themselves. I will be happy to educate them as long as they are open to learning.

[eskielover]

Not everyone knows someone at a personal level who has mental illness. I was actually in my 40's before it was more than something out there in the world that REALLY NEEDED my understanding. Life is filled with needs that require understanding in people's lives & spending the time to educate one's self about things in the world that don't touch their life is next to impossible. Even just knowing someone, if they aren't close & require much interfacing with, one does not always have the time to really get a real understanding until it hits really close & personal. Problem is that some people are arrogant with a "know it all" attitude that spew out opinion rather than facts. Those kind of people I don't listen to in the first place