[dogtanian]

i had never heard of this but someone mentioned it to me. i'm DX bipolar and possible personality disorder, but aside from that, one thing that's always just been "me" as far as i've been concerned is that i'm a night owl. always have been, always will be.

when i was a baby i had surgery and was in an out of hospital a lot. although i think i slept ok once i was asleep, my parents tell me that i would never go to sleep when they put me to bed.

i definitely remember from a very young age, i'd be sent to bed at whatever time was normal for my age (say, 9pm or something) but i'd never sleep. i'd be actually unable to sleep until around 2 - 3 am. i would read or something until then.

i remember i found it incredibly hard to concentrate at school. there were times where i was really hyper and got constantly asked "aren't you tired?" and other times where i'd be dozy in class. my head teacher got involved: my parents were concerned i wasn't getting enough sleep. she said that just going to bed and relaxing was fine, whether i slept or not. but as far as i could tell, i was doing that anyway.

this carried on for years, the only time i really got tired was around my A levels, but around that time i was severely depressed and getting out of bed at all was quite a feat.

as i left school and started at secretarial college, and then living alone in london, i found that i went clubbing til the wee small hours every night, and held down a job. i found this worked quite well: i had to get up stupidly early for work anyway, but the clubbing didn't really alter things because i wouldn't have gone to bed/sleep until those times anyway.

i've been in hospital under section for bipolar a few times and every time, i was always the last patient up, i'd be pottering around the ward or sitting reading (unless i was manic in which case i'd be running around yelling ) - the nurses noticed this but found that one sleeping tablet rarely helped. i would normally have between 1 and 6 mg of lorazepam before bedtime and then a sleeping tablet later, once that had kicked in and i was relaxed. also, i didn't get the sleeping tab at normal sleeping time, but they'd let me just tell them when i was ready. so i'd get the lorazepam about 10pm when it was standard meds round, and then at about 2am i'd let the nurse know i was ready and get my sleeping pill. it actually worked quite well.

my parents have always been very aware that my sleeping patterns were distorted, and so have i. when i was a kid i was known as the insomniac, but actually, once i slept, i was ok.

over the years my sleep has been disrupted quite a bit: i've always had vivid dreams, and sometimes wake from them, or toss and turn a lot, and this gets worse when i'm depressed or manic, or psychotic, and i tend to put any disturbances down to that.

nowadays i have a lifestyle that fits this really well: i do a part time degree, but it's in the evenings, 6-9pm, so it's pretty much the time my head's just waking up. i have a Tdoc who i see once a week, at 3pm, which means i can get my 8 or so hours from 3am, and wake up in time to be focussed when i go to see her.

i very rarely arrange to do things in the mornings. normally i get to bed between 2 and 3, and i'll read or something til about half 3, which is my usual sleep time. give or take half an hour. i still take a while to get to sleep, even on antipsychotics. i normally get up about 12pm and people think i'm lazy, maybe i am, but ever since i can remember, i just can't "do" normal hours

i normally can function ok if i get 8 or so hours of sleep, but recently i've been having issues with fibromyalgia so i feel exhausted most of the time, and i've been having hypersomnia - i sleep at roughly the same time every night but i am having major problems getting up at all. also the antipsychotic medication does tend to knock me out quite efficiently.

but although there are things like medications and other illnesses interfering, my sleep pattern has always been "late", i've always been a night owl, and i'm always trying to explain to people that i've TRIED to alter my sleeping patterns but just can't. i may be able to do something different for a few days but inevitably it just reverts to the old pattern.

could this be delayed sleep phase syndrome?

[January]

As I read your post, I was wondering if you had fibro and there it was! A lot of this pertains to the fibro. Talk to your rhuemalotogist about it and finding better ways to rest.

Jan

[(JD)]

Yes I agree... pain will alter sleep patterns and quality of sleep. It's something you have to purposely work on each night. It's best to sleep at night, as they have found those who stay up during the night have more incidence of heart disease. go figure.

I use valerian, delta brain wave CD sounds, a long (hour) bedtime routine...etc it's just something I have to do as self care. My T helps me immensely on this.

I hope you can find a suitable sleeping routine for yourself.

[Perna]

Dogtanian, here's a good site about delayed sleep phase syndrome?

http://www.geocities.com/delayed_sleep/index.html

[dogtanian]

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January said:
As I read your post, I was wondering if you had fibro and there it was! A lot of this pertains to the fibro. Talk to your rhuemalotogist about it and finding better ways to rest.

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i will, but the problem with this is that the sleep thing goes beyond that. recently i've been hypersomniac, and have had weird issues with regards sleeping, but i haven't always had fibromyalgia, and i have always had this late sleep pattern.

i only got DX fibro about 2 years ago, and i realise that's causing other issues with sleep, but my entire life i've had this thing where i can't sleep at normal times and where i'm wide awake in the middle of the night.

i think you're right to mention that fibro is having an impact: i agree, but i think there's another issue which goes beyond the fibro.