[SprinkL3]

I don't know why, but I get excited whenever I hear that boosters and vaccines are available. In my mind, the more protection, the better!

That said, I'm also very confused with all the news about mixing vaccines when it comes time for the 'Rona boosters.

I had the Moderna (mRNA) vaccines back in February and March 2020.

Initially, I thought they recommended 8 months for the 'Rona booster, then it went down to 5 months as a recommended timeframe for boosters, then the boosters were limited to only certain groups of people with certain immunocompromising disorders for the full 3rd jab. .

Now, it's opened to a 1/2 booster dose (not the same as the full 3rd jab) for the Moderna, for adults ages 18+ with high-risk (such as me) and those above a certain age (65+) without any conditions.

And then, almost immediately thereafter, they said that it's okay to mix Moderna with other vaccines, such as those who got the J&J singular jab or the two-shot Pfizer series jabs (like the Moderna, but different timing between jabs). I read some statements from Katelyn Jetelina (Your Local Epidemiologist) about how the mixing of jabs helps to boost the efficacy of the vaccine, but it was unclear whether the data included the full Moderna jab mixed with the others or just the 1/2 dose (I think it was the full dosage).

If I had a choice, I would want the full Moderna 3rd jab, but that doesn't seem to be on the table - at least not yet. For humanitarian, political, and economic reasons, Moderna decided to only offer the 1/2 booster jab for certain individuals. I fear that it won't be strong enough to withstand the surges in cases 6 months after the booster shot, but we'll see. I also wonder if it would be better to just get the full Pfizer jab as my booster, if the data support that it's efficacy so far is about the same.

There is a decision tree circulating on the World Wide Web.

But even with the tree and the explanations from many, all of these choices are driving me bonkers.

I miss the days when the last vaccine that was created for the H1N1 was just a simple vaccine, which eventually got blended with our annual flu shots. With that then novel virus, the singular vaccine was available to everyone - there wasn't AS MUCH OF this divide and confusion that we're seeing now with the 'Rona pandemic, and there wasn't this very massive amount of disinformation spreading either (even though the linked report reveals that there was some misinformation, but not enough to cause massing amounts of deaths, job losses, career changes, and long-term disabilities).

I really don't know what I should do. If I wait for them to open it up to a full dose, it might be too late or may never come to pass. But if I get it too soon, I might miss out on YET another changing decision about boosters and their efficacy. These yo-yo decisions from the CDC and FDA are making it harder for everyone.

Overall, if I get the booster, I will feel safer and more free to walk outside, which in turn will help me to lose some weight and get some sunshine - all while wearing a mask outdoors for added protection for myself and others. I will start by asking someone to walk with me, like my recreational rehabilitation therapist. Once boosted, I will also feel better making my in-person appointments and getting lab work done about 2 months after I get my booster and flu jabs. At least I will feel a little safer and less isolated - the sooner I get my booster, especially as flu season is already here, and especially as the traveling behaviors will bring about more surges in 'Rona, flu, and pneumococcal cases. (Thankfully, I'm vaccinated against certain strains of the pneumococcal bacteria, and I should be current on all of my other vaccinations.)

Anyone else deal with these strange decisions regarding the 'Rona boosters?

[ArtleyWilkins]

I received a full Moderna 3rd dose. Very pleased for that. I had no problems with it. Pretty much the same as 2nd dose for me. How did I get it? Pure luck. Our district had a vaccination day. Went in for flu shot and just happened they had Moderna and offered it because I was almost 8 months out from 2nd dose. Glad to have it aboard.

[sarahsweets]

Originally Posted by SprinkL3

I don't know why, but I get excited whenever I hear that boosters and vaccines are available. In my mind, the more protection, the better!

That said, I'm also very confused with all the news about mixing vaccines when it comes time for the 'Rona boosters.

I had the Moderna (mRNA) vaccines back in February and March 2020.

Initially, I thought they recommended 8 months for the 'Rona booster, then it went down to 5 months as a recommended timeframe for boosters, then the boosters were limited to only certain groups of people with certain immunocompromising disorders for the full 3rd jab. .

Now, it's opened to a 1/2 booster dose (not the same as the full 3rd jab) for the Moderna, for adults ages 18+ with high-risk (such as me) and those above a certain age (65+) without any conditions.

And then, almost immediately thereafter, they said that it's okay to mix Moderna with other vaccines, such as those who got the J&J singular jab or the two-shot Pfizer series jabs (like the Moderna, but different timing between jabs). I read some statements from Katelyn Jetelina (Your Local Epidemiologist) about how the mixing of jabs helps to boost the efficacy of the vaccine, but it was unclear whether the data included the full Moderna jab mixed with the others or just the 1/2 dose (I think it was the full dosage).

If I had a choice, I would want the full Moderna 3rd jab, but that doesn't seem to be on the table - at least not yet. For humanitarian, political, and economic reasons, Moderna decided to only offer the 1/2 booster jab for certain individuals. I fear that it won't be strong enough to withstand the surges in cases 6 months after the booster shot, but we'll see. I also wonder if it would be better to just get the full Pfizer jab as my booster, if the data support that it's efficacy so far is about the same.

There is a decision tree circulating on the World Wide Web.

But even with the tree and the explanations from many, all of these choices are driving me bonkers.

I miss the days when the last vaccine that was created for the H1N1 was just a simple vaccine, which eventually got blended with our annual flu shots. With that then novel virus, the singular vaccine was available to everyone - there wasn't AS MUCH OF this divide and confusion that we're seeing now with the 'Rona pandemic, and there wasn't this very massive amount of disinformation spreading either (even though the linked report reveals that there was some misinformation, but not enough to cause massing amounts of deaths, job losses, career changes, and long-term disabilities).

I really don't know what I should do. If I wait for them to open it up to a full dose, it might be too late or may never come to pass. But if I get it too soon, I might miss out on YET another changing decision about boosters and their efficacy. These yo-yo decisions from the CDC and FDA are making it harder for everyone.

Overall, if I get the booster, I will feel safer and more free to walk outside, which in turn will help me to lose some weight and get some sunshine - all while wearing a mask outdoors for added protection for myself and others. I will start by asking someone to walk with me, like my recreational rehabilitation therapist. Once boosted, I will also feel better making my in-person appointments and getting lab work done about 2 months after I get my booster and flu jabs. At least I will feel a little safer and less isolated - the sooner I get my booster, especially as flu season is already here, and especially as the traveling behaviors will bring about more surges in 'Rona, flu, and pneumococcal cases. (Thankfully, I'm vaccinated against certain strains of the pneumococcal bacteria, and I should be current on all of my other vaccinations.)

Anyone else deal with these strange decisions regarding the 'Rona boosters?

I am a vaccine outreach person for my state. The science is good about mixing vaccines and honestly when it comes to Moderno and Pfizer they are both in the same class of vaccines. Different than Johnson and Johnson. In my state Moderno has not been approved yet however they were still giving it out because they knew it was going to be approved. I have my Pfizer booster shot. The thing is breakthrough infections can and will happen when people congregate in groups with no masks. Vaccines don’t mean you won’t get the virus they are targeted so that you won’t die if you do get Covid or you will be asymptomatic.

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[Broken Old Man]

I get my booster (Moderna) tomorrow afternoon.



BOM

[Mountaindewed]

They say you can mix and match now and I got moderna but I kind of want to get pfrizer for my booster. Although I’m not sure in the long term how mixing and matching will help with my anxiety. I am not due for a booster until they say when the general public can get theirs.

[sarahsweets]

Originally Posted by Mountaindewed

They say you can mix and match now and I got moderna but I kind of want to get pfrizer for my booster. Although I’m not sure in the long term how mixing and matching will help with my anxiety. I am not due for a booster until they say when the general public can get theirs.

The science supports mixing the mRNA boosters like Pfizer and Moderno. I know they tossed in Johnson and Johnson as well. I don’t know if you still have to stick with to Johnson and Johnson’s.

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[SprinkL3]

I scheduled my Moderna booster for Friday! I am fully vaccinated with Moderna (from Feb. and Mar. 2021), so I'm within the timeframe. It looks like I will be getting the full dose, but we'll see. I have a trusted friend giving me a ride to and from that day.

For the flu shot, I think I'll wait at least two weeks after my Moderna jab. I'm not sure though. If my friend can give me a ride to the VA or somewhere where I can easily get my flu shot, I might try to get that done on the same day (different arm), but we'll see.

[ArtleyWilkins]

You can get the flu shot at the same time. I had the flu and Moderna on the same day. No problem. They say there is no reason to space them apart.

[SprinkL3]

The facility where I'm getting the booster doesn't have the flu shot, so I just figured that it's safest for me to space it out. I want to be fully covered by the booster before I get the flu jab, just so that I reduce my risk even further for Covid-19 because I'd be exposing myself to two different facilities with very different rules and people.

My friend only has time to drive me to one place and then drop me off when I'm done, so I have to wait.

[Mountaindewed]

My mom is trying to convince me to keep with moderna. She says the side effects are less and that moderna is actually more effective then the other 2. She is for the most part right about these things although I’m still on the fence.

[SprinkL3]

Originally Posted by Mountaindewed

My mom is trying to convince me to keep with moderna. She says the side effects are less and that moderna is actually more effective then the other 2. She is for the most part right about these things although I’m still on the fence.

I looked around and asked around, and I've come to the same conclusions. I think Moderna has been the strongest vaccine out there, and I think it is the best choice for anyone to get as a booster - whether you've had Moderna initially, Pfizer, or J&J. Moderna is the best choice. For those who can get the full Moderna instead of the half-dose, that's even better. But even the half-dose of Moderna is still thought to be stronger than the full dose of Pfizer.

[sarahsweets]

Originally Posted by SprinkL3

I scheduled my Moderna booster for Friday! I am fully vaccinated with Moderna (from Feb. and Mar. 2021), so I'm within the timeframe. It looks like I will be getting the full dose, but we'll see. I have a trusted friend giving me a ride to and from that day.

For the flu shot, I think I'll wait at least two weeks after my Moderna jab. I'm not sure though. If my friend can give me a ride to the VA or somewhere where I can easily get my flu shot, I might try to get that done on the same day (different arm), but we'll see.

I think waiting for the flu shot is OK I mean I got both my booster and my flu shot at the same time. But caution is not a bad thing.

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[sarahsweets]

Originally Posted by Mountaindewed

My mom is trying to convince me to keep with moderna. She says the side effects are less and that moderna is actually more effective then the other 2. She is for the most part right about these things although I’m still on the fence.

Moderna and Pfizer are nearly equal in effectiveness.

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[SprinkL3]

Originally Posted by sarahsweets

Moderna and Pfizer are nearly equal in effectiveness.

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You're actually correct, Sarah! I keep track of Katelyn Jetelina emails regarding updates from Your Local Epidemiologist, and it looks like mixing Pfizer booster with original Moderna series is nearly the same effectiveness as getting the Moderna booster with the original Moderna series (though I forgot if the research only showed the full Moderna jab and not the 1/2 shot).

"After the primary Moderna series, there was benefit from either a Moderna or Pfizer booster. There was really no difference between the two."

That's only if you've had the original Moderna series for jabs #1 and #2.

If you've had the J&J, the research suggests the following:

"The most benefit, by far, was for those with a primary J&J shot. A Moderna booster gave the greatest benefit to J&J folks (56.1 fold increase in IgG; 76.1 fold increase in neutralizing antibodies). Pfizer also worked very well (32.8 fold increase in IgG; 35 fold increase in neutralizing antibodies). There was minimal increase with a J&J booster (4-fold increase)."

And if you've had the Pfizer, the research suggests the following:

"After the primary Pfizer series, the greatest benefit was from a Moderna booster. But a Pfizer booster helped a lot too."

It looks like the Moderna booster works best for those who had the J&J initial jab or the Pfizer jabs #1 and #2.

It looks like the Pfizer or Moderna booster would work best for those who had the Moderna jabs #1 and #2.

Again, I don't know if they used the full Moderna dosage in their study or the 1/2 dosage that is now being doled out.

[sarahsweets]

I do wish the CDC had approved different boosters for people because the science really supports using A different one for your booster it’s sort of like creating mega immunity in your body I think right?

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[SprinkL3]

Originally Posted by sarahsweets

I do wish the CDC had approved different boosters for people because the science really supports using A different one for your booster it’s sort of like creating mega immunity in your body I think right?

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I thought the FDA approved of it. Did the CDC not approve of it? That's strange.

I wonder if it's a political-economic thing with the CDC, or if it's a precaution against people getting "vaccine happy" (meaning, people overdoing it with vaccines). I have a friend who initially got the J&J jab. When he realized that it wasn't effective enough, he decided to withhold information and get the full Pfizer series (first and second jabs) - long before boosters were approved. He said he did fine with the Pfizer after having the J&J jab months ago. I think there are many people who are doing this, just to feel safer.

The CDC might disagree with allowing boosters because of this or for whatever other political or economic reason. Sadly, however, the CDC has also been horrible about changing their mind and being too lenient on recommendations for masking and vaccinations, etc. Perhaps they are trying to prevent a different disease or situation by limiting things like vaccine boosters, but their leniency with the mask recommendations sounded more political than evidence-based. It's almost as if their real-world experiment on vaccine efficacy took precedence over safety precautions.

The FDA's agenda, however, is to approve whatever would work in terms of treatments and preventions. I think the FDA has different experts working on the pandemic crisis, and their decisions may conflict with the CDC's agendas.

[ArtleyWilkins]

"Eligible individuals may choose which vaccine they receive as a booster dose. Some people may have a preference for the vaccine type that they originally received, and others may prefer to get a different booster. CDC’s recommendations now allow for this type of mix and match dosing for booster shots."

CDC Expands Eligibility for COVID-19 Booster Shots | CDC Online Newsroom | CDC

[SprinkL3]

Originally Posted by ArtleyWilkins

"Eligible individuals may choose which vaccine they receive as a booster dose. Some people may have a preference for the vaccine type that they originally received, and others may prefer to get a different booster. CDC’s recommendations now allow for this type of mix and match dosing for booster shots."

CDC Expands Eligibility for COVID-19 Booster Shots | CDC Online Newsroom | CDC

Thank you! I thought they had approved of it, but I wasn't sure.

[SprinkL3]

Perhaps I misread what Sarah meant.

I do wish the CDC and FDA would approve boosters for all Americans.

I do wish that our POTUS would have held off on promising boosters for all Americans in 8 months; I think that was premature, which left many Americans feeling left out. I support our POTUS, but I just wished that certain statements would have not been said until things got finalized.

I do wish that Moderna would approve full-dose boosters for all Americans. To cut it down to half of a dose for economic reasons (to have enough to donate to other countries, whilst also withholding the ingrediants for replication) demonstrates a form of capitalism that hinders public safety. Also, the research lacked comparisons between full-dose boosters and half-dose boosters, especially among minorities who could benefit from boosters. Hopefully the clause of being in certain essential working fields or situations that are high-risk would allow more Americans to get boosters, even if their health risks aren't noted yet.

Many people are not yet diagnosed with diabetes, for instance. They might not realize that they are at risk for severe or fatal Covid-19. Just because a diagnosis is not yet established doesn't mean that it doesn't exist. Many Americans - especially minorities - lack adequate and effecient healthcare, so they are likely to be under-diagnosed or misdiagnosed. Furthermore, one of the risk factors that the CDC mentioned for severe or fatal Covid-19 is having a mood disorder. Not everyone seeks mental health treatment - especially minorities and males - which could explain why they lack the diagnosis and therefore the risk acknowledgment to seek booster shots. Because of such inequalities that lead to non-diagnoses, and because non-diagnoses and lack of healthcare could lead to severe Covid-19, such oversight should have been factored in when determining that full-dose boosters should be available for all Americans and all those migrating to our country, since a pandemic is a global responsibility (not just a local one, and not just an individual choice). Historically, however, minorities - however defined by mainstream society, have always lost the invisible wars that structural violence can see but the privileged eyes cannot.

And so here we are.

[sarahsweets]

You guys were right. I misunderstood. Yes a mix and match approach is ok. What I had been reading was that the science was good for vulnerable people and 65+ but it was still being studied for the regular population as far as whether its better than sticking with your original booster brand.

FDA advisory panel OKs Pfizer vaccine for kids 5 to 11

This makes me want to do cartwheels.

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[SprinkL3]

Originally Posted by sarahsweets

You guys were right. I misunderstood. Yes a mix and match approach is ok. What I had been reading was that the science was good for vulnerable people and 65+ but it was still being studied for the regular population as far as whether its better than sticking with your original booster brand.

FDA advisory panel OKs Pfizer vaccine for kids 5 to 11

This makes me want to do cartwheels.

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No worries. The news changes daily regarding these things, so what we post now might differ tomorrow. LOL. I struggle with that all the time. I'm sorry if I misinterpreted what you were saying, but I do think that all people should be able to get the vaccine, including the boosters, no matter their medical status.

I'm excited about the children getting vaccinated, too! I'm not sure how that will translate to school mandates or children's rights (regarding medical neglect when parents refuse to vaccinate their children), but I'm hoping that many parents will allow their children to get vaccinated and therefore protected from severe disease.

I'm kind of cringing at the anticipation of more protests from parents who refuse vaccinating their children, as well as the poor children who want to be vaccinated but can't because their parents won't allow them to. I wonder what protections children have when their parents aren't listening to their healthcare wishes, even if they are underage.

[ArtleyWilkins]

I fully expect the parents who are vaccinated will by and large have their kids vaccinated; the ones who aren't, won't.

I don't expect a vaccine mandate in our state. They don't mandate for flu; I doubt they will or can mandate for Covid. We barely mandate for any vaccines - lots of loopholes parents can find to exempt their kids from vaccines in our state.

I have family and friends who have been longing for this because until their own kids are vaccinated, they are still very much still in rather restricted mode AND their unvaccinated children are exposing them unfortunately. My niece's family all ended up with Covid around Labor Day - adults were vaccinated, but the kids obviously weren't. They are pretty certain the 8-year-old brought it home from school and exposed them all. Everyone's case was mild except her husband. He ended up having to get monoclonal antibodies and was pretty sick - not hospitalized though.

Our school actually has NO cases right now - I honestly don't remember when the last time was that I saw that. In fact, our entire district only had like 70 cases last week - we have 52,000 students and 6,000 in employees spread over around 75 campuses in 8 or so towns, so that is rather fantastic. Looking MUCH better.

Numbers are definitely on the way down around here in general. From what I am reading from the experts, while we'll probably never be down to zero and we'll probably see occasional local spikes - they won't be as extreme as previous and definitely not statistically as deadly. Even this delta wave, while having just as many cases (more in many places), had lower death rates than last winter's spike. We're getting there.

[SprinkL3]

ArtleyWilkins, so sorry to hear about your family members getting Covid-19, but glad to hear that they will get their children vaccinated soon. I think many families will see this as great news! Some have been playing it really safe, especially grandparents and disabled extended family. So with increases in children getting vaccinated, they can make the holidays even more special this year!

I am still isolating in place because our numbers have peaked supposedly. We're on crisis standards of care in all of our hospitals here, since I live in a red state that is highly antivaxx and antimask. Here, there will probably be protests about the children's vaccines, even if they aren't mandated, there will still be protests. It's horrible. They like to keep spreading disinformation out here, no matter how many times the news tries to dispel their lies. Thankfully, there are quite a few blue dots in our red state, so that helps.

[ArtleyWilkins]

Try to watch less news coverage. It helps. I actually don't watch live television at all anymore, and I limit my news to just the facts from reputable sources, and I don't allow myself to spend lots of time reading the news. Self care is important; it is easy to get lost in the media hype and not see things in perspective - news media is NOT about perspective.

I have to be able to work, to teach, to function, AND to not get bogged down in the constant bickering. Too much media exposure is a beat down. I choose to spend my time interacting with my family, my friends, my students, my organizations. Can't isolate in my life, so it is important to keep things in rational perspective.