[salukigirl]

http://parenting.blogs.nytimes.com/2...ral-parenting/

I was wondering if anyone has tried this? It upset me a little bit that today my bf said letting a little boy wear a dress is "f'ed up". It actually kind of hurt me a little bit. I want my child to know that however they feel is okay. I don't want them to grow up confused with expectations that girls act one way and boys another. I want them to be who they are and not feel like they have to be ashamed of themselves. And I feel like pushing a certain gender on your child (i.e. if your little boy wants to play with barbies and you tell him that boys can't do that) then you're just teaching them "it's not okay to feel how you do or be what you are".

To clarify, no we don't have kids. But I feel like these things need to come out in the open if we even want to think about marriage or kids. Just looking for some other opinions if maybe I'm being too sensitive or reading into this too much.

[AAAAA]

I have absolutely raised my children this way. My son wore pink and my daughter blue. I remember when I found out I was pregnant with my second child. I bought my son a baby doll to teach him how we would care for the baby. My father FREAKED out. Thinking about it now, that baby doll was the first “gender specific” toy I purchased. Everything before that was learning toys.

I bought my children the toys they wanted. By the time my twins came along we had toys/clothes by the truck load. My older twin wanted to play with the “girl” toys and my younger the “boy” toys. They learned to compromise on their own. They would negotiate on their own. Pumpkin would play trucks for a period of time as long as Peanut played Barbies with him. When Pumpkin got old enough to verbalize what he wanted to wear he’d go and get one of his sister’s outgrown night gowns to play in.

At that time I reminded my father of his reaction to the baby doll and let him know that if he wished to continue to be a part of the kid’s lives he’d LOVEINGLY accept them and he did.

What really pisses me off is how random people feel they have the right to express their opinions on what I let my children wear or play with! When the twins started pre-school, the teacher ACTUALLY had Pumpkin evaluated because he preferred to play with the girls and “girl toys”.

When the original Toy Story came out, all Pumpkin wanted for Christmas that year was a Boo Peep doll. A co-worker over heard a friend and I talking. This is a woman I had not shared more than ten words with in the year I had worked there. She felt the need to pull me aside and tell me: “you have to nip this in the bud!....” I called her a fool. GI Joe and Barbie are both dolls. What difference does it make if my son wants to play with Boo Peep? The oldest one wanted Buzz, my daughter wanted those Martians, Pumpkin Boo Peep, and the youngest Woody. She was SO angry that I dared let my son play with “dolls”.

[salukigirl]

I just confronted him about it and told him it really hurt me. I told him he is basically telling our (hypothetical) children that they have to be ashamed of who they are. He says he agrees with me but who knows. I told him no matter what, if we had kids together and my little boy wanted to wear a dress he damn well will and I will take him (my bf) on if he wanted to challenge me on it.

He said the article he read was about parents literally refusing to call their children a boy or a girl even based on genitalia. That they would tell their kids "you don't have a gender" and THAT'S what he meant was "f'ed up". Now that I don't agree with. Just because I want my kids to feel comfortable in their own skin doesn't mean I have to ignore the fact that they either have a penis or a vagina.

[hanners]

I'll say this, as a trans person, I can't tell you how much I would have loved to have been raised like that. Woulda saved me a lot of pain, and given me the freedom to be myself a lot earlier.

[AAAAA]

Love changes thinks I think. Had this not been my father's beloved grandson he would not have changed his attitude. (And he did change his attitude). I have an Uncle and an Aunt that are homosexual. While he loved them, he never "approved" of their lifestyle.

NOT that the color a child prefers is an indication of sexual orientation, but that is the assumption. Your bf may very well change his attitude if it is his own child.

I don't know how I feel about refusing to call a child boy or girl. I can see both sides. All I know is LONG before my son even knew there was a difference between boys and girls he said he was a girl. When a potty training accident with my niece (about 10 months younger than the twins) made him realize that girls and boys were phyically different he changed his statement to I am a girl in my head. He was 3!

So anyone out there that tries to tell me that he was not born this way can get stuffed! He is they way he was meant to be and God does not make mistakes.

[mgran]

My son dressed up in my clothes when he was a little boy, and teetered around in high heels with flowers in his hair. He had a very realistic (if tiny) baby doll, and he used to pretend to change her nappy, and breast feed her. Of course he also played with toy cars and trucks.

I had a lot of people mock me for the way I was raising him, but if he wanted to play "mummy", who was I stop him? A lot of people told me I was setting him up to be "gay". In fact some people even told me he was gay. I asked them what was wrong with them, speculating about the sexual orientation of a three year old.

Anyway, despite all the comments, he's grown up to be pretty secure in his sexuality, certainly seems straight so far (he's fifteen, and has a girlfriend). He's far kinder to girls than a lot of boys his age, is very good with little children, and the thing I'm most pleased about is the fact that he's not sexist or prejudiced at all. I think if I'd forced views of masculinity down his throat it would have been bad for him.

I think it's "f'd up" that some people make such a fuss about forcing stereotypical gender straight jackets on little kids. As parents the most important job we can possibly do is to love our children, and let them grow comfortably into their own skin.

[salukigirl]

After I told him to imagine it as his own child he did change his tune. I said "your dad tried to force school and education and being the best on you and how did that work out?". He hates school and never thinks what he does is good enough. I think he started to see how his own dad did those same things but with a different subject.

My parents never enforced any of the typical girlie stuff on me. I played baseball and did a lot of sports. Never wore make-up or fingernail polish or anything. For a little bit I know my dad was concerned I was a lesbian. But even then he didn't try to force anything on me. I asked him what he would do if I were a lesbian and his words were "I wouldn't disown you or anything but you wouldn't be bringin' your girlfriend over for dinner." I know a lot of people would say "if you would have come out I'm sure he would be more understanding" but no.....he wouldn't. I'm pretty confident of that.

I'm not a lesbian or even bi and I don't feel that I'm in the wrong body or anything. But it is a little disheartening to know that, yeah, if I (or my brother or sister) were to be in that situation, he might actually stop talking to us.

But you know that saying that a woman becomes a mom when she gets pregnant (or even before) but a man becomes a father when he sees his child. Just like the guys who may very well be womanizers change their tune once they have a daughter.

I totally agree that no matter how you raise your child, they will be what they are. And you can either raise them to be resentful of that or accepting. And I would much rather have my child not be afraid to come and talk to me about anything and to feel good in their own skin. mgran - I'm so glad your son is such a respectful person. He sounds like an awesome kid!

[littlebitlost]

I agree with not giving kids stigmas about gender. I have a little girl, and she is very girlie. But she will play with the dog, and in the yard, is very interested in bugs and had a tonka truck when she was smaller. LOL, she used it to move her dolls in it, but hey....

She has still got toy cars, although at 7 shes very into barbies and clothes and writing and books.

I definitely agree parenting should be discussed well before pregnancy.

I have a single parent guy friend who is very anti gay and often remarks ****** and thats so gay and crap like that. I daresay my daughter will have a little chat with me about that at some point.

2 of our barbies got married because the boy doll was already dating anohter barbie....

I will raise my children to be tolerant, open and accepting of other peoples choices. No A.H will screw with that.

[CantExplain]

Originally Posted by salukigirl

I just confronted him about it and told him it really hurt me. I told him he is basically telling our (hypothetical) children that they have to be ashamed of who they are. He says he agrees with me but who knows. I told him no matter what, if we had kids together and my little boy wanted to wear a dress he damn well will and I will take him (my bf) on if he wanted to challenge me on it.

He said the article he read was about parents literally refusing to call their children a boy or a girl even based on genitalia. That they would tell their kids "you don't have a gender" and THAT'S what he meant was "f'ed up". Now that I don't agree with. Just because I want my kids to feel comfortable in their own skin doesn't mean I have to ignore the fact that they either have a penis or a vagina.

Bravo. I agree entirely.

[zbmom]

I think everyone parents differently. Playing dress up at home wouldn't bother me but I dress my son in gender specific clothing in public. He has dolls he can play with if he chooses but he doesn't do much with them. I think children will pick up on gender roles and societal expectations no matter how much they are sheltered at home. I dress him as a boy but I love him as a person and that's the most important thing with kids. Just accepting them as they are and working within your family's boundaries.

[weird artist]

yay! I love these posts!

I explained to my son when I started explaining the 'bird and bees' that sometimes boys like girls, sometimes girls like girls, sometimes boys like boys, and it doesn't matter as long as everyone is happy.. That has eventually evolved to 'yes our best friend X is a lesbian, that means she has girlfriends not boyfriends' which was accepted with barely a shrug. He has always had dolls, construction toys, cars, teddies, and a random mix of whatever toys he is in to, just as I would offer them to him is he was a she, and he was always allowed to pick pink or purple toys/books/bags etc etc, if he wanted, same as a girl could have blue or red or green. I was brought up free from gender boundaries until I hit school, he is 7 now and happy that it is ok to dress up like a girl or boy or whatever, no matter what his friends think. He also knows he can like football, or ballet, or rugby, or dancing, or kung fu. It makes no difference to how we see him, and he is perfectly entitled to his own preferences. he is after all, his own person and I am glad he is allowed to be that way.

[Gus1234U]

i agree with you 100%, saluki, and think you are a most enlightened person. you deserve a partner as empowered as you, so you may have the best loved children ever~! thank you for saying what you did. best wishes,,,, gus

[BlueInanna]

I like this post too, nice to get my mind on to other things.

I think it's great that you are good and quick to communicate with your partner about such things. This will be really important core beliefs and parenting style!

I have such fond memories of my 2 sons dressing up in big sissy's dresses and fluffy tutu skirts! She would love to dress them and paint their nails. What fun we had. They did not actually ever ask to wear it in public, but i would support it absolutely. We have close friends who are gay/lesbian. So it's not so taboo to talk about in our family. I volunteer at the elementary school and it's not uncommon for boys to have painted nails, lol, it's all good fun.

The adolescent years are a huger struggle and must be handled delicately seriously and compassionately, everyone will have different needs, preferences, genetic makeup. imho