Interesting video...some narcissists CAN be self-aware

hahahaha!

Why do you come around these parts of the forums anyway?

Your curiosity about narcissists/psychopaths is fascinating.

Such a silly question....... It's obviously another that is intrigued by me.

Hey Aty & Underground: For the most part because I am a very curious person when it comes to psychological matters. I took a few psychology classes at university years ago too. And then, I believe that psychopathy paired with narcissism present humanity with a very complex dilemma to solve, sort of speaking. It stands out, it is not an ordinary mental matter (at least in my opinion), and there are no definitive answers or cures. Plus, on a spiritual and philosophical level, it kind of uneases me to think a person can be born without feelings/a soul. Why is that? a nature mishap or as some view it, a highly refined survival mechanism for those who are born like that?

what do you guys think?

Also, I had a close encounter with a highly charistmatic leader in my teen years. So far, he's the most charistmatic person I've met. I couldn't figure him out (no one really could), until he started showing a few behaviors that made my inner red flag alarm sound, and fortunately for me, I ran away from him before he could force his hidden agenda on me. He left me baffled for some time, trying to understand what went on. Years later, other people spilled the beans about his actions and he managed to dupe people again and remained in a position of power, at a different location.

They are a- holes. Very interesting.

HAHAHAHAHAHA, hey Underground!

Psychology is an interest of mine as well. A grandiose sense of self-worth is defined as a clinical feature of psychopathy. Like the video you posted stated, all psychopaths are narcissists but not all narcissists are psychopaths. It has been suggested by some that narcissism and psychopathy are on a spectrum, NPD on one end and full-blown psychopathy on the other end.

I don't "have feelings", as far as having a "soul"... I've never given that much thought. I was raised Catholic but I never gave a **** about their teachings.

As far as if it's nature or nurture, people will be debating that for a long time.

Speaking for myself personally though, I cannot recall a time I've ever had "feelings", besides extremely fleeting cold rage and amusement/pleasure. I learned early in my life though how to emulate emotionality, it was a necessity to pass in society as "normal". I've always known that I'm "different", I just didn't know it had a name. I don't care about labels much, people can call me a psychopath or a narcissist it really doesn't matter much to me. I know myself, so I know I was definitely born without the "normal" emotional range of humans. I most certainly have a complete lack of empathy and zero conscience among a list of other features of psychopathy.

As far as textbook Narcissistic Personality Disorder goes, a lot of **** has been written about it. Some writers I think have hit the mark, and most others simply fall flat. I see NPD as a very complex condition, I see psychopathy as complex as well just in a very different way.

I smiled when I read this post. I have always been described as extremely charismatic. I naturally "take charge" of any group of people I am around for long. I don't even have to try really. People are, to use a typical conception of a symptom of psychopathy, "charmed" by me. It's not like I go into every group of people I cross paths with and think, "oh I'm going to take over"... It's not that simple.

Do I like being in positions of power over people? Oh definitely. But for me personally, my intentions seem to matter very little. Sometimes I do intend to take over a group of people and rise to the top, other times I don't but it happens anyway. This is weird to discuss actually, I've never given this much thought either. I just see it as a part of who I am.

Narcissists can be extremely charismatic as well(I've known a fair few narcissists), they share a fair few traits with psychopaths which I don't doubt is the reason some have said the two conditions are on a spectrum.

Also, hardly anyone can figure me out. A few very smart people have, but those are definitely in the minority. I am a complete enigma to 99% of people, and a myriad of people I've known over the years have described me as such.

Running away from this person was smart on your part, most people just don't until it's "too late" as it were.

Yes, I am definitely a butthole. I have no issue admitting that at all. A "traditional" narcissist would never admit that, that's what I've observed with the people I've known that have NPD or at least strong narcissistic tendencies.

Something like this happened to me as well. Sorry no more details (I don't want to "make" anyone mad... When I first came to pc somebody "followed" me here . (and they did come here because of me . But I did apologise, I had projected stuff onto them, and they accepted my apology )And no it isn't about this person or anyone on pc. I can say it was a Christian person )

Thanks for making me

Well you won't make me mad. I am incapable of being insulted.

Christians, heh... I was raised Catholic and now I live in the bible belt. Good times, lol. I have never been a Christian; nor would I ever make a "good" one.

Aty, your last post got me thinking and now I remember more details about this guy, rofl! I'll talk more later, but for now I agree that my best move was to remove myself from his presence. I remember thinking 'I am the only person who sees what he's doing, and I even doubt myself because he sends me mixed signals. If I speak up, NO ONE will believe me, because it's my word against his, and people adore him. Also, he will do everything in his power to silence and discredit me. I will be better off by leaving this organization and say it was due to other conflicts'

I couldn't be more right. Years later the truth came out and what I had thought intuitively was correct. And he managed to make people believe HIM even though all the evidence pointed towards his guilt. My conclusion is that a person who is not a psychopath can nevet outsmart one who is highly intelligent and charismatic. Those people rarely get caught.

Situations like you're describing definitely happen, and they happen far more often than people think. Good on you for trusting your instincts (lol) most people just don't.

Nobody has ever truly outsmarted me.

Though I do find it funny as hell that at least three if not more threads I've gotten involved with in this subforum have all devolved into discussions about psychopathy at some point... Heh. I wonder why that is, couldn't be me now could it?

hahaha, I know, right?
Maybe I should rename this thread as "from narcissism to psychopathy, by Aty"

Anyway, I'm glad in a way that the conversation shifted from narcissim to psychopathy because you jumped in and gave me new insights
(I never thought about narcissism and psychopathy being on a spectrum, NPD on one end and full-blown psychopathy on the other end.)

Ok I will shed some light on the matter. The light is obviously my own but i'm sure very helpful anyway. The video is a well played act (as a narcissist) for Sammy boys own pleasure. So many people regard him as the "one" when it comes to NPD. Even the producers play to his needs by saying how impossible it would be to find a "N" with all 9 traits, but wait we did and here Sam is. What he says does make sense probably more to one with NPD then one without. His explanations of being broken down into molecules and so on. The need to control but his acting comes out when he talks about the noises and if the camera man can still hear him... Major BS!!! To become a recluse yet he's married and out in public in front of the cameras. I am not one to bash the guy (too much) as he is doing what he needs to to fill his N needs. On to me, I don't think I was born the way I am nor do I think anyone with NPD was born with the major flaws of the disorder. Figuring out a way to cope as a child and possibly being raised by another disordered person gives us the ways to become what we are. Myself could easily be another on that show with one who possesses all the traits they so hard to describe as impossible to find. I too am a "self aware" narcissist. I have my moments of nothing and then my moments of everything. Luckily my days of being me way outnumber the days of looking into myself. At least for my own sanity. Yes I also realize that we are very difficult to understand, read and so on and this is what makes us so... you get the point.
I love control
I love hearing about how great I am
I love manipulation for the games
I have people around for my own enjoyment and gain
I do what needs to be done without the regret or care of others best interests or feelings
This list can go on and on but I don't want to at the moment.
Truth is I can become that charismatic leader you speak of, I can throw the line out, lure you in and then have you as I want or need. I am a master of the game and as good as the best. If you like I can show you more...... The only way to understand me is if you could be me, other than that it's a guessing game!!!
Over and out for now,
Please enjoy responsibly!!
The Underground

I think it would be very interesting to see two psychopaths battle it out you know, one trying to make the other look worse or both of them challenging each other.

I think it would be fascinating to observe

I mean, you know....because it's only the "smart" people that can "figure" them out assuming psychopaths can perhaps have a feel for noticing other psychopaths then it would be interesting to see how they mingled together. Maybe it would just be cutthroat respect though :/

Maybe some of you guys have been in a situation like that before and would share

Underground:
I think I can see your light, at least partially. Even though I don't have NPD, I have a degree of narcissism. Narcissism is good and necessary for survival. I think I wouldn't be alive without it. My sense of pride, self-love and somewhat specialness helped me through harsh times. So, I have a basic understanding of NPD.
As for Sam's movie, I totally agree with you. The dynamic played by Sam and the movie director was both amusing and intellectually stimulating, lol.
I loved how cluless the director was and how enabling of Sam'a show he was.
As for you: it is really interesting to hear you say that you were not born with NPD.
Would you mind shedding some light regarding environmental factors/issued being raised as a child? Bring it on, underground!
I find it intellectually stimulating to talk with people like you, aty and mattmx.
As for me: I have major recurring depression and anxiety. I think part of my mood disorder is due to my genes (a history of MI in the family), and part of it was caused by environmental/conditioning factors. I also think it is very hard to understand depression unless you have it. Depression sucks. It eats at your soul, your emotions and your mind. Luckily, I've recently come out of a bad episode.

Okay your renamed thread idea made me chuckle, heh. As far as NPD and psychopathy being on a spectrum, in Underground's post below you can see how the two conditions do overlap(I bolded those parts). But narcissists are not born that way no matter who is spouting off that worthless load of crap. Someone's inherent psychological makeup can make them predisposed to having a certain personality disorder, but only psychopaths are "born that way". I say that because psychopaths have actual neurological differences in their brains compared to "normal" people.

---

I have one psychopath actively in my life, and we do challenge each other. No clear winner, there doesn't need to be. It's all in good fun in my mind and his.

I've never experienced depression, but I believe people when they talk about how much it sucks lol. It's good that you have a level of healthy narcissism, that tends to help people a lot I've noticed.

As for Sam... Well, I don't take any of the crap he spouts off seriously. Though I do admit to reading his website when I am insanely bored and could use a bit of amusement. I end up with way too much free time on my hands, I live in chronic pain that prevents me from walking on bad days so I end up having to be creative about appeasing my boredom. Heh.

"I've never experienced depression, but I believe people when they talk about how much it sucks lol. It's good that you have a level of healthy narcissism, that tends to help people a lot I've noticed." yeah, it does. I wish I could trade my brain with yours for a while to experience life without depression and feeling on top of the world! hahaha!

"As for Sam... Well, I don't take any of the crap he spouts off seriously." OMG! I love how you guys can tell how another psychopath is full of it"!

If it were possible I would sell my never ending supply of self-esteem and peace of mind to depressives, I would get money and they wouldn't be depressed anymore! Win win!

Sam has never impressed me, everything he writes is misinformed and/or making it up as he goes along.

[QUOTE=Atypical_Disaster;4528091]If it were possible I would sell my never ending supply of self-esteem and peace of mind to depressives, I would get money and they wouldn't be depressed anymore! Win win!

ahhh Aty!!! you never know! science progresses in such ways that maybe one day we can do business together!

Well I have many prior writings here on my upbringing of causes and effects of how I was introduced to NPD. My mother too has issues and I'm sure I was born with something but due to natural or unnatural ways of being shown as a child I was given NPD as a coping mechanism to deal with life. I don't believe that a person is born with their PD rather their PD becomes them after their experiences with life from the first few years of life. Now I am not a professional but this is my opinion in first stages of any PD. One day very soon I wil write my true self and what a day is like for me. Being open for others to see may help more than just myself. The similarities some of us have are truly amazing. For people who have never met to share so many of these "screwed up" ways keeps me intrigued. And we all know how much that means for a person with NPD to say they are intrigued by others LOL!!!!!

I have had a situation just like that and it was actual in the NPD forum here. It caused me to be almost thrown out and I wasn't allowed to post for quite sometime without being monitored. Some here will remember that time and the person we were interacting with. It was like a sheep within a pack of wolves. The sheep didn't make it in the end hahahahaha

It must feel great when people come in and see my latest posts. Being in the NPD forum and getting insight from an actual narcissist. How lucky you are!!!! 9 traits is beneath me, the greater good is that 100,000,000 people are born each year giving us that many targets for NpD people to choose from (thanks Sam, great point!!). Gotta love it. Sensory overload this morning ha ha ha!!

Such feral aggression, underground! It appears that your target wasn't the only sheep

Do you ever feel as if you are a slave to your personality disorder? I mean, narcissists tend to be viewed negatively in society...do you think the way you are limits your capabilities or do you think it opens you up to more? (Asking your personal opinion, not truth or anything)

Are you able to answer questions or talk about yourself in a way that doesn't put a positive spin on everything you say? It seems like things are constantly being built up or that how people view you is always a machination of your will. (Not meant to be targeting, is a an honest question )

If you consider the sheep to be a sheep and you are observed viewing them that way by others who then look at you in disgust (or apathy) because they understand...wouldn't you become a sheep yourself? Does a narcissist (or psychopath) in an environment filled with people that know what and who they are and how they operate tend to admit fault because it's in their own best interest?

Sorry, I'm thinking out loud quite a bit....that all may not make sense. I hope it does though

And to follow that question...would said narcissist change environments after that in an effort to put him/herself in a better position to find what they want?

But I guess all of us do what we can to make ourselves happy...so maybe the question is pointless? Still, it may be to an extreme?