[dasiy6]

Why, if some/most mental illness is considered to be a biological condition, is therapy + medication the treatment of choice?

[vacantangel]

Don't understand it myself and I've yet to find any combo of meds that work for me. I'm barely new to therapy so too premature to judge on that one.

[dasiy6]

I guess it is just my depression talking...but I feel like such a failure when I fall into depression again...

[vacantangel]

You and me both sweetie. I totally understand. I hope you feel better soon. Believe me, I know how incredibly difficult it is to be where you are. I just rose above mine. I hope you do soon too. (((((((((dasiy)))))))))

[dasiy6]

Thank you AngelGirl... I can't even count how much $$$ I have spent on getting "treatment" for this stupid illness (?) and to end up here again...well sometimes it gets really tough to WANT to continue the FIGHT...

[wisewoman]

Daisy, it is a fight for life and you are worth every penny. Keep up the good fight.

[mortimer]

When patients first began reclining on the couches of psychoanalytic psychiatrists, the depressed folks talked about their past. This led the founders of psychology and psychiatry to believe that issues that began in childhood caused many mental health problems. But questions were still not answered. Why would a bad relationship with your mother create the appetite loss found in depression, especially when eating problems only started several months prior to the session? By what strange mechanism would a childhood issue create an auditory hallucination, often years after the reported traumatic event? Many people had difficult childhoods, but they didn't hallucinate and have a great appetite. It became clear that many mental health problems also had a physical component that involved changes in concentration, sleep, appetite, speech pattern, energy level, perceptions (hallucinations), and motivation. Studies began to determine the connection, if indeed one was present, between the condition of the patient and the physical signs/symptoms that were also present.

Quoted from:
http://www.mental-health-matters.com....php?artID=160

[h0kie]

Technically...treatment for "medical" illnesses is a choice.

Cancer patients can choose to refuse treatment. Just as others can refuse to visit a doctor.

[dasiy6]

Yes...but what if one treatment is contingent on another.... I can't imagine that a oncologist would say to their cancer patient..."I'm sorry but unless you take the chemotherapy, I can't give you pain medication"...is that a real choice?

[dasiy6]

Sounds like "which came first..the chicken or the egg?"

[vacantangel]

As wisewoman already said, it is a fight for life. Neverending. I know that sounds bleak and I know how hard those depressive states can be but they do always end. Sometimes it takes a long time, way longer than we want, not that we ever want them but you know what I mean. I pray that you find the strenth to rise above yours.

[(JD)]

This is a good question!

Remember that psychotherapy also helps us to learn ways to cope with what is happening to us due to the illness, injury. etc.

This is the basis imo for the cognitive behavior therapy. Our brains can change things in our bodies... meaning we can change things...

[dasiy6]

And in therapy I have learned many many coping techniques.. I would say it is like falling into a well....at first I ended up at the bottom and didn't know how... now i am able to feel the ground give way and I can even put my arms out to try and grab something ...but eventually I end up back in the hole...is it me???...am I the failure???? Did I not work hard enough...Am I just not smart enough to get it... I don't know...

[gracetoo71]

i have always believed that it is a 50-50 split when it comes to nature vs nurture. our DNA is the canvas and our environment is the paint. we are stuck with the canvas we are given. our environment choses the colors and designs that go on the canvas

if it is in our dna that we are prone to depression, life will depress us. it is like trying to paint white on a black canvas, you will never get a true white. why is it that some people can roll with the punches, while others of us crumble under such blows? addicts, for the most part, are born to addicts, no matter if it's booze, drugs, misery, etc.. mental illness has a vast array of symptoms. someone with bi-polar is just as ill as a drug addict. both need help to overcome what life/dna has given them. and neither get the help they need in this country because money is being wasted elsewhere!
it is all chemical, in my view. once the chemisty is figured out, everyone can get the help they need. we are all different chemically, so different chemicals are needed to get the balance we all would like to be at.

i could be all wrong (and probably am) but this is my theory on it. i took two semesters of chemistry in college and was addicted to it. chemistry is the key to all that ails us because chemistry is what keeps us all going, it is what created us.
i would love to see more money put into research on the chemistry of the brain, because that is the key to mental illness. but i guess in this day and age, war is more important!
sorry for such a long post, but i have such passion on the topic of nature vs nurture and am a geek that reads alot of science/chemistry books when my mind will allow me to concentrate on something for more than 10 mins.
take care all
grace

[Mahali]

I would make like to add my opinion in here. While it is true that children of substance abusers are more predisposed to addiction they are not predetermined to addiction. It is how their life unfolds that determines what happens.

I also did not "crumble" under the situation of my childhood...I developed sophistcated coping tools that allowed me to survive my childhood.

I was not born to anything but a vicious mother.

[SweetCrusader]

At the request of a good friend of mine, I'm copying and pasting this from another thread over to here.

The Diathesis-Stress Model:

The Diathesis Stress Model basically explains that the development of psychological issues is very complex and it can't be attributed to biology NOR to experience, but instead is influenced by both.

We can inherit a tendency toward developing a particular trait, but that trait may not develop without certain stressors triggering it. Our biology isn't the one answer to understanding, and neither is experience.

Biology influences our experiences, our experiences influence our biology, both influence our mental/emotional/spiritual/physical well-being, and vice versa.

Basically the idea is that there isn't a single "cause" nor is there a simple explanation for psychological issues, but a lot of contributing factors that can be difficult (if even possible) to fully sort out and understand.

[gracetoo71]

sweet, you said it much better than i did. its what i was trying to say, but didn't come across as such, i guess. i will have to chose my words more carefully next time.
thanks for saying what i meant to say
take care
grace

[SweetCrusader]

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
sweet, you said it much better than i did. its what i was trying to say, but didn't come across as such, i guess. i will have to chose my words more carefully next time.
thanks for saying what i meant to say
take care
grace

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">

I didn't mean to step on any toes, hon Actually I haven't read all of the thread

Somebody just asked me to paste this over here, so I did.

[gracetoo71]

you didn't step on any toes. i just didn't do a very good job at trying to explain what i thought and said something that offended another.
wish you would have posted before me, then i would have just been able to say, i agree, great post.

[SweetCrusader]

Oic now! I hadn't read your post.

Um, I can see how it offended. I can also see you didn't mean to.

Well, I hope my post helped.

[Mahali]

SweetCrusader your post did help. Thank-you.

Grace..no problem. I was a bit put off but all is well. It just hit a nerve. It happens..don't worry about it.

But now I am... Sorry all. On with the discussion.

[dasiy6]

Actually, I really loved both of the explanations. Grace yours was so beautifully written..I am someone who is a visual thinker so the canvas and paints made such an impression and prefect sense to me.....and I appreciated the "The Diathesis-Stress Model" it was clear and clinical, something i also need. I guess I feel guilty that not only do I have this illness (?), but my youngest daughter as well.... I tried so hard to be a good parent...so you see... I was guilty twice...if I would have known that whatever I have could be hereditary I would have NEVER had children...

[gracetoo71]

dasiy,
don't feel guilty for having children, just because the canvas isn't perfect, doesn't mean you can't help to paint a wonderful picture. i have twin girls, and see some traits of mental illness in them, but try to give them coping tools that i have learned along the way.
as sweet put much better than i, it is environment that also effects biology. i have seen kids grow up with two addict parents and grow up to go to college and be very successful. then i have see the opposite.

children are the greatest gift in the universe. please don't regret having one. you can help paint the picture. none of us are perfect, all we can do is give it our all. day at a time, do your best, and please don't have regrets. just pass on what you have learned.
don't give up on yourself as a parent. we as parents help paint that picture, keep the colors bright and lively.
take care
grace

[dasiy6]

You know it is funny....with my first three children, as they entered the teenage agnst period I told them what I had dealt with.....deep depression, suicide attempts, long hospitalizations, etc. I told them that people would tell them that these were the best years of their life...but they were probably the most difficult. I tried to give them coping tools..and it worked for them. With my youngest..well she seemed to have the world by the tail.....I never shared my story with her ... At 13 she was diagnosed with major depression with psychotic features....mine at that age was schizophrenia...but essentially we have the same illness. Now, when my depression returns...I am required to have "therapy" to get an adjustments to my meds...if I express a negative thought, a self doubt so to speak, the therapist will say...."well you had to learn that response somewhere...what were your parents, your home life like?".... Well that just reinforces the fact to me that I and only I caused that mental illness in my daughter.... so when she was in therapy...I guess that is what they said to her too... My home life was crappy. ...but I tried so hard with my own children... My daughter? She is doing well, in college, currently trying it without meds (not my choice) but she has a good relationship with her doctor. So I now if I am faced with nature v. nurture. question...well I can see both sides I guess.. it is just that I hate what I did or didn't do........ that caused my own daughter's illness. I hate having to relive my past too....everytime my depression returns Oh well, thanks for all the responses...they were all great!