Colloidal gold anyone?

I've heard people benefit from colloidal silver and a recent bug bite scare has made me consider purchasing a bottle for it's advocated broad spectrum of use.
Searching articles on it I've also come across those on colloidal gold and it's supposed to be beneficial for a number of conditions, is a general tonic and aids mental focus and mood. Many people report a noticeable improvement on it, depression, rheumatism, overall exhaustion and weakened cognitive abilities etc seem to improve significantly. I've done some research on making your own and it seems pretty easy and affordable to make a decent hydrosol at home, partner says the few needed supplies are easy to obtain (basically 3 9volt batteries, an ordinary electrical wire, 2 aligator clamps, a glass jar, some saline, distilled water and two wires- either 99.99% silver or gold, depending on whether you need silver or gold hydrosol), the process takes minutes.
I wonder whether it's worth it? Sounds like it's worth a try, especially with that little fuss involved in making it. There seems to be some controversy on safety but it's generally considered perfectly harmless if the metal is pure and if you don't overdo it with ingestion. It also has external uses, I've heard of some also using it in IVs under supervision.
Not sure whether I'm allowed to post a link but this is a description of colloidal gold uses (or you could google it, there seems to be loads on it):

"used to treat unstable mental and emotional states, such as depression, S.A.D. (Seasonal Affective Disorder), melancholy, sorrow, fear, despair, anguish, frustration, and suicidal tendencies.

A natural stimulant and rejuvenator for cells throughout the body, colloidal gold improves the transmission of electrical signals between nerve cells in the brain. In part, this may be because gold is a catalyst for endorphin-like hormones. Gold also enhances the antioxidant enzyme superoxide desmutase (SOD).
In recent times, colloidal gold has been used both separately and in combination with colloidal silver to help fight many forms of cancer, including prostate and ovarian cancer. It has been theorized that gold helps prevent the spread of cancer by essentially encapsulating cancer cells yet still allowing colloidal silver to penetrate the cells.

In July 1935, the medical periodical Clinical, Medicine & Surgery had an article titled "Colloidal Gold in Inoperable Cancer," which recognized the benefits of using colloidal gold against cancer. The author of the article, Edward H. Ochsner, M.D., Chicago-Consulting Surgeon, Augustana Hospital, stated:

"When the condition is hopeless, colloidal gold helps prolong life and makes life much more bearable, both to the patient and to those about them, because it shortens the period of terminal cachexia (general physical wasting and malnutrition usually associated with chronic disease) and greatly reduces pain and discomfort and the need of opiates (narcotics) in a majority of instances."

Colloidal gold is a powerful anti-inflammatory agent and is often used to ease the pains and swellings of arthritis, rheumatism, bursitis, and tendonitis. When combined with colloidal silver, it is particularly effective against some forms of arthritis, such as rheumatoid arthritis.

Other traditional uses for colloidal gold have included using it for skin health, using it to rejuvenate sluggish organs and using it as a remedy for digestive disorders, circulatory problems, obesity and burns. In former times, gold was even used as an aphrodisiac.
Colloidal gold has been shown to help dogs in many of the same way it helps humans, particularly for joint and back problems such as canine hip dysplasia - where once again, it's best used in combination with colloidal silver. Dogs that are down in their backs will often show marked improvement within a few days when given a few teaspoons of colloidal silver and gold daily - sometimes displaying friskiness not seen in years."

-Anyone with experience?
-Anyone made it themselves? Made ormus, perhaps?

The subject has my curiosity as from my understanding of metaphysics electroconductivity is key to "anything"- just wondering whether it works in practice

All I know about colloidal gold is that my grandmother used to get "gold shots" for her arthritis. She lived to be 100 years & 6 months of age, so the gold must not have hurt her.

Thank you! I've heard gold is used in shots for rheumatism, just wasn't sure it was the hydrosol.
After some more research it seems the gold hydrosol is a bit more difficult to make at home although the silver version sounds doable. Some warn against using saline. It's recommended to use it on one hand because it's a conductor but then others say that wouldn't make silver hydrosol but silver chloride. Making it without the saline would take a bit longer but might be safer. I'm not sure I understood properly though, I'm quite a dummy as far as chemistry and physics are concerned. I know it can't be a miracle but perhaps it's of some use.
My mom used to persuade me to try an old wives tale. She said using a silver spoon used to be considered beneficial for children because it was believed silver would kill any pathogenic organisms. I just read a chemistry student's comment that sucking on a silver spoon could have similar effects as the hydrosol. That sounds whacko . Really curious what it's about though so I'll probably give colloidals a try and report back in a while.

You aren't going to like this answer but I'm going to give it to you anyway. There is no science behind the curative claims of colloidal gold or silver. It's snake oil... a scam.

Hmm...I don't know that using gold is "snake oil". As I mentioned, my grandmother used gold shots for rheumatic arthritis and found it very helpful. Perhaps it helps some people.

Okay... then substitute placebo effect for snake oil The fact remains the same... there is no scientific evidence of any benefits from either gold or silver.
http://www.thescienceforum.com/pseud...what-hell.html
A couple of shots of Goldschlager can also seem helpful

It doesn't make any logical sense to me that your body is capable of doing anything with the gold other than passing it through. I think spending it on whole foods would be more therapeutic

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I actually came across some academic articles on medicinal use of colloidal gold- albeit the uses mentioned are not as many as the non-professional articles mention.
The silver however is not mentioned as beneficial in any of the academic articles.
It's a bit confusing and a lot of the data seems to be along the familiar "miracle- cure" lines but some have been using it for a while with good results ( I doubt persistent infections are that often cured via a placebo effect). The people who've never used it seem to trash it, those who have are mostly strong advocates.
Scientist seem to be interested in extracting nano particles of titanium for example, claiming that they could identify the HIV virus (unlike other colloidals who can't seem to target it because it "fakes" to be one's own dna)- but they haven't so far found a proper way to get titanium nano particles suitable for therapeutic use. I believe there is something to colloidals- how far that "something" extends is a different story. I take all of it with a grain of salt.
Nano particles interest me, so does the matter of conductivity-as a layperson, of course. I'm not looking to find a magic pill, I'm curious. Huge difference.
As far as whole foods are concerned I think I've been more than a good example for decades.

Anybody can do a study. It needs to be repeatable. Iow, what the scientist says it can do must be repeatable in another independent lab. Those claims involving conductivity should be provable. I've been surprised by many things that don't make sense and do the job people say they can. But I still fall on pragmatism. To claim something does that much and isn't available in our food source naturally doesn't make sense to me.

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It used to be part of our food in traces. The theory is the ground is too depleted for that now as contents in food are significantly lower then they used to be. Fluoxetine isn't naturally present in my food but I take it.
The study on colloidal gold has been repeated and proven decades ago. Colloidal gold is used in medicine and proven effective for some conditions. Period.
As far as other colloidals go, research is ongoing. Meaning there appear to be POSSIBILITIES. No one claimed anything definite about that.
Conductivity- studies on it are endless, as well as implications of use. It would be impossible to do an EEG without it. Conductive polymers are are changing medical technology. If it weren't for conductivity your cells wouldn't be able to communicate. What is inter-cellular fluid again? And so on and so forth. To claim that experiments involving conductivity lack value and proof is so ill-in formed it's just funny. The issue didn't just fall off my turnip truck.
Anyway, i didn't mean to cause upheaval about it, posted out of curiosity and asking if anyone had any experience. Apart from having an interest in this, I'm diagnosed with Lyme and simply trying to find information whether anything has proven useful to take along with the prescribed meds. I understand doubt and have it myself but I will look for more info and consult a physician before I take anything so I really don't see any reason for trashing. It's okay, Case closed as far as I'm concerned, I'll just keep my musings to myself next time .

I'm not trying to be argumentative but you did ask for opinions. You didn't post any sources so I looked them up. (Posting links is fine, btw.)

I never said there isn't conductivity in your body but those amazing cures you list help your mood. This I doubt. What I did find are contemporary studies that are using nano particles of gold as some form of "tool" for lack of a better term. For instance, medicine transport or viewing tumors for diagnostic purposes. This makes more sense although I do not think it is in common practice. I also found what looks like good research with rheumatoid arthritis although I admit to not being all that interested in deciphering how it works (you said case closed.)

I'm sorry I'm not giving you the answer you want but that's my opinion.

Interestingly there has been some work on thoughts, human electrical currents and water. This I do buy into but for another topic.

http://www.ishaya.ca/Articles/Water/...20Article1.htm

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those would be nano tubes, a bit different, but I get your point.

ROTFL! So many experts here, lol. So your body uses Iron, Magnesium and other metal elements correct? Anyway without being to big a jerk let me say GO FOR IT! It is not deadly and in fact it has been shown many old timers have had good experiences with it. Of course it much less expensive than drugs so no one can get rich selling it to you and yes you can make it yourself. Use in good health!!

I can understand your frustration with some of the responses you recieved, but ultimately, I had the impression from your initial post that you were looking for opinions, not just positive stuff you want to hear. I know as someone who has some chronic health issues myself [not just mental issues], it can be exciting to come upon something that has promise, and very frustrating when we start getting negative feedback about a treatment or therapy we were feeling positive about.

The thing is, you asked for opinions, so you will generally get responses that include every kind of opinion.

I think the responses regarding validity and reliability- two very specific terms when speaking of research- may be referring to the fact that the only thing you cited was from 1935. So, people who rely on recent studies that are peer reviewed- which are often considered to be the most valid and reliable- are not generally impressed by outdated material. That is not to say what you cited is completely nonsense- but if it is still accurate information, it has likely been redemonstrated more recently.

Google Scholar is a great place to look- one can be very specific about subjects and year and there are many free access peer reviewed articles available. Pubmed is good as well. Harvard, Johns Hopkins, and other large universities [I'm not as familiar with which ones might be most helpful where you are] often have access to research resources somewhere within their offshoot med sites, even if you aren't a student. These are some of the places I look for information to consider when thinking about a treatment or therapy and if it may benefit me.

I can't speak for those who were critical, but conductivity is not in question in my book. I have seizures, which are kind of a freakin' electrical storm in the brain. But intercellular fluid is mostly potassium and sodium along with other trace elements [as in sodium/potassium channels]... and while gold is a great conductor, a lot of things need to be done for the gold to actually be helpful, in my opinion.

The blood-brain barrier is very selective, for example. It doesnt just let anything. So not only do the gold particles have to be small enough, they have to be disguised in a way that will induce the blood brain barrier to let them pass- and then the way they are disguised can't interfere with any good the gold particles could possibly do.

This process doesn't sound like a cheap one?

Nanomedicine is really in its infancy. There may be in theory all kinds of uses for colloidal gold, but the logistics of it may be just out of reach for real results. But that could just be now.

I know that some of the strongest ideas running right now for it are to be able to use it in cancer treatment.

I don't have lyme, but some of my symptoms are similar.
I don't know what you have tried thus far.

I've personally found fish oil [high grade, no vit a, etc] in high doses to be helpful, but that can take a while to kick in.
My vitamin D is low and that can be pretty brutal. An imbalance of certain B vitamins- in particular B6 and B12- can affect nerve pain and other types of pain.

I'm not one to subscribe to solely non-pharm approaches *if* I feel the pharm approach is helpful as well- I do think there is room for pretty much anything that helps. We have to be careful about possible build up in our bodies of certain elements, particularly if we have a pretty chronic condition. Long term it's hard to always predict what the results could be.

I can't say either way whether colloidal gold is the way to go. I personally feel right now there may be other things you could try that have progressed further and might not be as expensive, may have a little more evidence to back them.

I wouldn't try it, not now. In the future, as understanding of possible advantages or disadvantages to the therapy increases, I would consider it.

Another thing to think about is there are different things that could be referred to as colloidal gold, and "colloidal gold" of 70+ years ago is not the same as that of now.

But I mean, if you are considering putting something in your body? I would certainly start at academic research [from a variety of sources- not just one] to get a feel for if it may be right for you. If you feel good about it and get a go ahead from a provider who is up on all your meds... there really wouldn't be any harm. If it doesn't end up helping, than at least you have eliminated one more possibility- you've narrowed the field of things that might work! So it's still a success.

The study on colloids is extensive. It's wonderful how people choose to disregard the same science they have to thank for getting diagnosed and treated for basically
whatever they have- without bothering to get at least decently educated about it.
No one is forcing anyone to take anything or convincing people on subjects that lack proof. As stated, i have an interest. Obviously, some don't even have the interest
to do do a simple search before trashing medicine.
As for wanting to make sure there is academic research done on something before you put it in your body.- you people seem to disregard the fact that doctors use
colloidal gold (and more) to treat cancer and rheumatism in patients when all else has failed and these people have that exactly to thank for improved health and
quality of life. Or do they inject patients with mumbo jumbo they haven't done reasearch on??

Again (odd how this has to be repeated), I'm not claiming there's definite benefits for taking unprescribed colloids for any kind of diagnosis. The subject is interesting and promising.
I distinctly remember previously stating that.
Also, no, I did not ASK for ill-informed people to utter nonsense that clearly opposes science as well as simple biology.
Conductivity is not an issue with neurological disorders, seriously?? This is new both to me as to neuroscience. You cannot state something as blatantly erroneous as
that and expect that "opinion" to be respected.

Again, I don't know about the silver. It even seems to be responsible for some neuropathy, i.e. neurotoxicity resulting in epileptic seizures. Like I said, I'm interested
in the subject but never stated there is any actual, proven benefit in taking it- from the information I've gathered at least. It's interesting and I like to keep my
finger on the pulse with these thing as this is the same approach that I have to thank for not having ended up completely dysfunctional or paralyzed in the past 25 years.
I guess I took some more time and effort to explore
different strategies and approaches than most people take to investigate before they trash just to get a piece of their mind out there. I specifically asked for
EXPERIENCE with taking or making it, not ridiculous pseudo-intellectual remarks from people who make more of an effort to be cynical in a roundabout way then they do
to extend their general knowledge.

This thread, I'm hoping can get deleted as I see it serving no good purpose. And I'm bored to death with it and do not wish to provide more fodder for anyone who needs
an excuse to gain a sense of mental satisfaction via their limited interpretation of basic biology.
Anyone who shares my curiosity on colloids may do a search on nanoparticle permeability across the blood–brain barrier, methods used to determine
whether a treatment results in a change in hydraulic conductivity, colloid osmotic pressure in relation to brain compliance and brain hydraulic conductivity in vasogenic
brain edema (Yoji Hakamata, Umeo Ito, Shuji Hanyu, and Mitsuo Yoshida),
Bechhold's colloids in biology and medicine, COLLOIDAL GOLD REACTION IN MULTIPLE SCLEROSIS
THEODORE J. C. VON STORCH, M.D.; TIFFANY LAWYER Jr., M.D.; ALBERT H. HARRIS, M.D.
AMA Arch NeurPsych. 1950;64(5):668-675. doi:10.1001/archneurpsyc.1950.02310290064006.,
the danger of colloid cysts in neurosurgery ( pay attention to the explanations on how
and why they form),Possibilities of the therapeutic use of radioactive colloids in rheumatology (this one is a bit old but fun nevertheless),
yttrium-90 colloid as a local and minimally invasive therapy for inflammatory arthritis (both cirtate and resin forms), the same used in persistent synovitis of the knee,
colloidal forms of radiotherapy. An ancient albeit fun text exists by ALFRED B. SEARLE for those interested in the history of use ( i repeat, outdated theories but a nice read).
To name but a few. there are plenty of further references in any of the mentioned studies (conclusive and unconclusive) but for those who either lack the interest or ability to get some basic information about how their bodies work even I guess no amount of suggested material would do.

Oh, my lyme- medicated, thank you for the concern. I don't believe I need "snake oil". I'm following research, not drugging myself. Not every patient out there is dumb enough to
resort to taking just about anything- although
some are obviously going to greater lengths to be responsible and educated about their (or the future generations') illness and treatment options than others.
That being said, I didn't post to get into a debate about nanoscience or similar, I was more of hoping someone who makes colloids shares an interest in the field and has experience-based insight to provide and perhaps explain why they have that much trust in it regardless of academic data sometimes suggesting otherwise. In terms of medicinal use of colloids some use makes sense and some doesn't but we clearly lack the knowledge to determine what makes some use of it beneficial and some not- goes the same for any treatment. Seeing as there are clearly no people here with experience in the field I see no point in going on. Might be a question to pose at experimental labs ;-)

The best thing to do when you feel there is extensive research is to post links to references. A lot of us, as I'm sure you can relate, have been listening to treatment after treatment over the years. Naturally there is a tendency to be skeptical. I feel this is healthy, not argumentative.

(Sigh) delete away

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Actually it would be frustrating to me to delete this post because there are people providing useful information and food for thought. I think it is disappointing that you even propose it. I don't understand why I am being accused of being argumentative. I used the phrases "my opinion" and "I think" as I do most of the time. I don't know how else to make this clear.

I have seen no reliable research for the body absorbing and using gold on its own for anything other than arthritis. I don't feel I should go hunting down extensive research as it takes time which I don't have. I primarily used nih and Wikipedia plus look a couple indie nutrition pages. contrary to my first response I acknowledged there are potential uses.

Magnesium and iron have conductive properties and are used this way. There is no dispute that nano gold works this way. As I said I see no evidence that it helps mood.

There. You got me emotional. I assume it will be deleted by the end of the day. I have a job to go to. And I don't think saying case closed is very nice in a social forum either. There's that phrase again.

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Funny thing is all you had to do was type the listed references into a search engine
but you don't have time for that. You do have time to express your ill informed opinion though.
I do spend my time on this but I guess I have an interest that exceeds the interest of some posters and that's okay, I don't expect you take an interest in the post to the point of making a valuable contribution but I do't see why you would even reply then. Being opinionated isn't enough sadly if it isn't based on more than your own limited cognition.
Nano gold use translates to psychiatric treatment, the reference is in the post above but you didn't bother with it. Besides, It's obvious that because nanometals in colloidal for permeate membranes of single-cell organisms and biofilms that otherwise make them untreatable, infection related neurological disorders can be treated with them.
I do know a swiss professional who treats the grossest of cases of angioedema with a simple colloid combined with drugs ( not even steroids) and gets it to subside significantly faster. He's frequently hired by several hospitals to treat cases where rapid retraction of edema is crucial. I've seen E.Coli treated very well with a simple solution used in warzones (no, i don't know the recipe. my mother was treated with it on one of her travels and her doc back home commented it was safe and quite efficient although not usually used under normal circumstances but could be of use when other treatments the patient is undergoing don't allow for the conventional approach) My point being that sometimes all we have to do is ask some questions following some education to get quite practical and safe advice on how to get a better effect regarding our treatment.
As for the thread, obviously it isn't of use to people who don't actually go through the bother of educating themselves. The "it lacks proof" argument especially is ridiculous, as an extension of my last claim and previous explanations. But if you wish to be entertained without bothering to use a search engine perhaps an example ( can you manage to copy-paste words to get to a page regarding other aspects and research?)- it appears I was wrong about the silver: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3739460/. It has a huge collection of related material on the right. You know, as in, click permalink. Or will that also be too hard? All before mentioned references literally require no more than copy-pasting the words to access texts.
To be honest, I've obviously done much better on my own devices in the past decades than I have on today's unsolicited idiotism here presented so I grant you one thing : Not everything is as useful as advertised- this forum included . I feel no need to rely on the "support and advice" of anyone who can't be bothered to utter anything other than their own myopic and blatantly ignorant nonsense so consider the discussion closed and the account as well- might help with your tendency to get emotional to not be exposed to people who go to greater lengths before making claims than yo do. The frustration must be difficult. On this lovely note I bid thee farewell and hope you don't rely on your judgement in too many areas of your life as I can imagine the consequences of that far exceeding even the damage the nastiest of supplements could ever cause anyone

I'm not sure if what you wrote here was a direct response to what I wrote, but it's confusing in the least if it was, and really kind of hurtful as well.
I put a lot of effort into expressing what was my experience and my knowledge on the subject.

What you wrote in response was extremely insulting and patronizing to me. I don't understand the offense you are taking [if that is the case], at what I posted, as I don't believe I actually said anything offensive. I reallly did my best to express a well balanced reply.

So...
I mean I actually have feelings.
I know it's really hard for people to believe, but when I put like an hour into a post, it's because I have really attempted to acknowledge the feelings of the other person, who is clearly very frustrated.

When I write I represent me, and only me.

It really sucks to be trashed, as you have just done.
I kind of thought you'd get that considering how upset you had become in previous posts.

By the way, I took time and effort to look at several articles from various academic and research sources from the past four years before responding to your post.

I felt that was only fair.

I've done research in more than one atmosphere on peer reviewed studies, I have an extensive background in biology, I see the body as a whole and, as I said, I use a multifacted approach to things I am struggling with.
We actually are saying a lot of the same things, only now I feel like I have been particularly targeted.
Also, I feel stupid. For trying.

Everything that was said in response to my post really really REALLY hurt, I mean just to be crystal clear on that.

This sucks.

Wait... I thought it was me the poster was talking to Lets go back to that original post. I'm going to bold what I see as what appeared to be the most relevant passages that I responded to and that seem to have evolved into pure science since they were written. I think I will even change the font color to red Okay, I believe it was Michanne who posted some links to actual scientific research. Other than possibly being useful in the treatment of cancer there doesn't appear to me to be anything else except folklore and anecdotes to back up any other claims. An article written by an MD in 1935 isn't something I would use to guide me in making an informed decision to place a foreign substance in my body. There were some pretty bizarre (and dangerous and ineffective) beliefs and treatments back in those days.
Okay... I've lost interest. It is snake oil in the original context/content of your post but you're free to believe otherwise.

I don't know if you are referring to me but I wasn't responding to you. I thought you made some good observations. My response was to the op who was asking the post be deleted. I don't think this thread deserves that. I would be very disappointed. Yes, I am rather hurt too.

Prem, with all do resp I do a flipping lot of research. I did google one of the names and did not find references that I felt significant enough to trust. So I did my own search. I spent an hour to two hours reading. I work. I think that is a very reasonable amount of time to spend on it. I tried to suggest, politely, that you post the links. I think it is fair to ask people to provide links in a thread like this.



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To be honest I find it very difficult to understand why you would quit a forum just because of a debate over colloidal gold. That is rather sad. What is wrong with healthy debate. If you believe in it then use it regardless of what others think. Just because others don't agree with you is no reason to get all upset and quit. Go ahead and use it if you think it will help.

I myself don't see any evidence of a therapeutic use. There is a big difference in using it as a delivery agent to cancer cells then having a therapeutic use itself.
Phase I and pharmacokinetic studies of CYT-6... [Clin Cancer Res. 2010] - PubMed - NCBI
Gold nanoparticles: A new delivery for cancer drugs

Use in electron microscopy and tagging tumors to light up the tumors for certain types scans has nothing to do with gold itself being of therapeutic use.
Colloidal gold, a useful marker for tra... [J Histochem Cytochem. 1977] - PubMed - NCBI

The use in gene therapy is also a delivery method and not therapeutic in and of itself.
Gene Therapy - Development of a novel gene delivery scaffold utilizing colloidal gold-polyethylenimine conjugates for DNA condensation

I can't seem to find any studies on therapeutic use other than by companies who sell products. Those I do not trust. The above links are from very reputable sources. If you can post a link to a therapeutic use study from a reputable source such as NIH or John Hopkins or Mayo or something similar I would gladly read it.

This whole idea seems to also be about a delivery system for drugs across the BBB.
Receptor-mediated delivery of magnetic nanoparticle... [ACS Nano. 2012] - PubMed - NCBI

Here is just one example of a study I would not trust because they are selling a product.
Colloidal Gold Studies | Purest Colloids

But like I have said it doesn't matter if I don't agree with you. If you believe it go for it. But don't be afraid of debate.