Here's an interesting article from PC suggesting that PTSD starts with childhood trauma. My T has told me that he thinks my PTSD developed in my childhood even though the actual serious effects from it did not start until well into my adulthood and several serious setbacks. The article focuses on combat PTSD sufferers but the childhood connection may speak to all sufferers. In my case, that appears to be true.

http://psychcentral.com/news/2012/11...ers/47943.html

[amandalouise]

Originally Posted by unhappyguy

Here's an interesting article from PC suggesting that PTSD starts with childhood trauma. My T has told me that he thinks my PTSD developed in my childhood even though the actual serious effects from it did not start until well into my adulthood and several serious setbacks. The article focuses on combat PTSD sufferers but the childhood connection may speak to all sufferers. In my case, that appears to be true.

http://psychcentral.com/news/2012/11...ers/47943.html

my opinion is no PTSD does not always start in childhood with child hood trauma..for example we have many people here in New York that have never been through any childhood trauma but now have PTSD due to the affects that hurricane Sandy has had on them.

I know many people in the military that have PTSD and did not go through any childhood trauma's their PTSD is from things like having to kill people and being shot at while serving in Iraq and other wars...

granted some people in the military most likely have gone through trauma because statistics state one in every 3 gals and one in every 4 guys will have gone through child abuse of some sort. So its no surprise to me that there are people in the military that have undergone some sort of childhood trauma.

here where I live and work in NY, USA the mental health community believes anything can cause a person to go through PTSD because there is no one thing that causes a person to have PTSD symptoms ie panic attacks, nightmares, flashbacks, intrusive thoughts....

it may be the point of view of the author of that article that PTSD begins in childhood, but my opinion is no, PTSD can start even in late adulthood.

[Open Eyes]

Interesting unhappyguy, I wondered about that too. But not everyone that struggles with PTSD have "bad" childhoods where they suffered abuse. I also read that someone is "more likely" to develope PTSD if they have a "smaller" hypocampus.

I can't go by myself because I can now definitely see that I was more susceptable to having PTSD because of my troubled history/childhood. I think that I just suddenly lost too much that was significant and important to me on a very personal level, and it was enough to put me over the edge to where I suffered full blown PTSD.

I do think there is regular PTSD which can be caused by trama and then there is complex PTSD which can perhaps start with a trama and be complicated by a tramatic childhood, or a childhood that consisted of several tramatic events.

However my therapist had talked about those that have experienced trama in childhood that continue on with their lives and don't struggle with PTSD flareups. Then years later have something trigger them into experiencing full blown PTSD. For example, a woman who was sexually abused as a child, gets on with her life with relatively few challenges, then her child gets to the age of when she was abused and that can suddenly trigger her into experiencing PTSD. Or a man that served in the service, came home and managed to reajust back into civilian life with no problems, have a family and a career but goes to a reuninion and sees pictures and film footage and talks with other vets, then a few days later presents with PTSD symptoms.

Why that happens is not known right now, only that it does happen.

Open Eyes

[Open Eyes]

I spend time here and there studying and learning about the human brain. We are really learning a lot more about "the human brain" now and it is facinating.

I believe that given the fact that we are all born with a clean slate in our subconscious mind we actually take a lot of messages from our childhoods that build our subconscious mind that becomes or source for "problem solving" throughout our lives. Many of the responses we have come from deep within the subconscious and we "think" that is "just who we are". However if we lack in "nurturing" and we don't get positive messages in our childhoods either by "seeing good problem solving by our parents" as well as being praised and "encouraged by them" we don't have those strong messages in our subconscious minds. When that happens and we face challenges we can "self blame" and "sense we are incapable" somehow and can be challenged more when we struggle with "bad interactions" from others.

I feel that if someone then experiences a tramatic event, they can end up struggling with PTSD and be "more challenged" in how they learn to "overcome" PTSD.

For me personally, when I had experienced the situation where I suddenly faced many of my loved animals being badly damaged. The first thing that happened to me was I went into "hypervigilance" and I stayed in that state of mind for months because I had to address these damages for months. When my I lost my favorite pony inspite of over a month's effort to have her on IV's and the rest of my efforts to rehabilitate her, pretty much around the clock, plus see to others at the same time, I finally "broke". So my ability to maintain that state of hypervigilance just gave out.

After that I began to experience night terrors and flashbacks, but only of that event and all the damages I saw. Then I went through a depression period where I was just dull and dreary. And then I was constantly dealing and struggling with the Lawsuit and my difficult attorney. Then I began to experience flashbacks from my childhood and that just threw me into confusion. I think that happened because I have been trapped in this lawsuit and that is bringing back my childhood challenges.
I feel that I would have done much better and not be this bad had the initial trama been resolved faster.

I have a feeling that if you had been able to "regain your life" quicker that you would not be as challenged as you are today as well.

Do you have childhood flashbacks? Or do you feel that most of your challenge is that you feel you have just been pushed around too much for too long?

Just curious.

Open Eyes

I don't have flashbacks; I was abused and pushed around too long and too many times by a lot of different people. Not only do I have c-PTSD, I also feel totally defeated, inferior, unwanted and unloveable.

[Beholden]

Guy, I'm reading a book titled" Schattered Minds" about the dx of Adult ADHD and it also talks of PTSD.....I didn't read your link, but it is a very interesting book.

No time, must run and go to bed good night all...

[Open Eyes]

Ok, yes, that does come from being pushed around a lot by others. That does lead to having the feelings you are discribing. Well, I have seen you stand up for yourself, and you are not stupid either. I am wondering if your manerisms might send off defensive messages you don't recognize. Some people think it is their looks that are somehow not acceptable, but some of our best loved "charector actors" were not handsome but they all had that charector about them that everyone liked. Like Jimmy Darante, remember him, Ha cha, cha, cha.

I think that you have yet to see yourself as a "good guy". I already see that here at PC. So it is not your communication skills or lack of empathy and you are "honest" which is the first thing I think of as "important".

You have to find your way past the bullying. I am working on that in a way too. That takes time. I have been pulling it apart and thinking about each way it has affected me and then I work on overcoming my own bad feelings about each issue.

There are always people that are going to try to bully others, push others around and they always look for someone a little "different' to do that with. It all depends on if you "take it" and that is a challenge. And it is taking it "internally" more than anything else. I work on that too unhappyguy and I am the only one that can do that for "me".

My T told me today, often it can be the "nicest" people that get bullied too. Often that is because the people that "bully" are "not truely nice people" so they pick on nice people. I never thought of it that way.

You have to work on loving yourself first, and I don't mean "narcisim", I mean self care and respect. It isn't always easy to let go of "self blaming" too. I am often "hard on myself", especially with the PTSD an not just being able to "just get over it" right away. I have to learn to celebrate each gain along the way too. Something only I often see too.

(((Hugs)))
Open Eyes

[Open Eyes]

I happened to see a special on Steven Speilburg unhappyguy. He talked about how very troubled his childhood was, didn't have any friends and was bullied a lot. He grew up the only Jewish child in his neighborhood, so he was never "accepted" by the other children.

His mother was/is a very positive person and adventurous and funny. That helped him a lot growing up. His father was always working though so he didn't get to really have a relationship with his father. His parents got divorced and he always blamed his father for that. However, the reality was that it was his mother that had an affair which led to that divorce, not the father. But Steven always blamed his father and for many years until just recently, he finally learned the truth and finally made up with his father.

Steven, with no friends, did have a facination with film. He made his own little movies and over time learned more, created more, and we all know and enjoy his work. Most of his movies have a "base theme" that revolves around a "single mother" and an absent father and a charector that is different and often struggles with "being different and acceptance". One film we all know and love, ET, is a perfect example of that theme, the children are being raised by a mother who is divorced and struggling.

The reason why Steven Speilburg's movies are so memorable is that "many" if not "most" people can identify with his charectors on some level. And Walt Disney had a lot of that type of theme in many his movies as well. I can remember finally getting to a point where I was hesitant about going to a Disney movie because many times Disney had the mother "die" or be absent in his movies. I remember saying that I didnt like Disney because all of the mothers die and I wanted to not have to see that.

I have often shared my own story here and I have a "very" challenging childhood myself. And now that I think of it, the Disney movies helped me alot, because there was always a message to "keep trying". And one thing that is always going to affect me is whenever I see a "group" all join together to "pick on someone or something" I do get upset to my core.

When I talk about "self love" unhappyguy, I know how important it is to find your way to think about yourself in a much more loving way and "not" accept the negetive messages that others send "unfairly". The truth is, there are alot of selfish crappy people in the world. My therapist has confirmed that many times for me. And "self love" is one of the most important tools to have when it comes to "thriving".

In my therapy session this week my therapist told me that I am in the stage of PTSD where I am truely "mourning" what was "lost or taken" in my life. I am recognizing all the times that I had to find a way to work around some kind of abuse that kept me from feeling safe and having a "normal childhood". However it wasn't "just my childhood" it was in my teens and even in my marriage. I do "cry alot" because I am looking at it all very differently. However, that is a "normal" part of the "healing process" that needs validation and a guide so that "healing" can finally take place.

I know you have not been able to have therapy unhappyguy, and you have talked about how you seem to be stuck and discouraged. Well, you have to go through the whole healing process , with the right support, to finally get to a point where you actually do begin to understand and feel the "healing".

For me personally, I got to a point where I began to recognize my "gains". However, I also had a lot of things come up that challenged me and I fell backwards and really struggled like I had in the beginning where I was really challenged and crippled and confused. But this time, I was much better and being able to "slowly pull myself out of it".

I happened to have a customer this week that came to my farm that was another big help. The customer was a Neuropsychiatrist that does have patients with PTSD. I decided to tell her that I have been battling PTSD. I was not sure how she was going to react to that but to my surprise her response was "Wow, you are very brave to admit that because most people who have PTSD don't admit they struggle with it".

She brought her three children and that kept me busy, however I did manage to have a chance to talk to her. She told me that with PTSD, the patients can learn to manage the "PTSD episodes that come up" better and better to where they can manage their lives better as well. She did agree that my brain has "changed" and I will always have PTSD. However, I will learn in therapy and time that I can get better and better and "controlling" it.

This "self love and self soothing" I talk about alot unhappyguy is "very important" to develope. It is making sure you set aside a part of yourself that recognizes these "flareups and episodes" and comes in to remind self not to "feed into" the strong emotions and anxieties that come forward. I talk about the "after" alot, and that is always when the "learning about healing" takes place with PTSD. So what I mean by that is that often when a "trigger" takes place what happens is a PTSD episode takes place. The episodes can have different strengths to them and I have also talked about the "wave". The episode comes in a "wave" where it rushes in, crests and then slowly receeds. What I have learned about that is that unfortunately we cannot "stand in front of the wave and stop it", we have to learn how to let it come forward, crest, and receed, "then" we can take time to think about what it means, validate it and say "yes, that did happen, it comes from this bad experience and hurt, and I was reminded of it, but it really is not happening the same now" and each time that is done, when the wave comes again from another trigger and episode, it is "weaker".
Eventually, the overall goal is, and it does happen, is these waves slowly turn into more of a "ripple".

Each person is different depending on their personal history unhappyguy. But if we develope this "self caring awareness" we learn to "not self punish and feed into these episodes which can make them stronger". We instead learn to help our brains calm down and make "gains" and we do begin to slowly feel better and experience longer periods of "emotional balance".

Think about this for a bit.

Any questions?

Open Eyes

Originally Posted by Beholden

Guy, I'm reading a book titled" Schattered Minds" about the dx of Adult ADHD and it also talks of PTSD.....I didn't read your link, but it is a very interesting book.

Hi, Beholden. Thanks for the suggestion! I will look into that book. I have been reading "Waking the Tiger - Healing Trauma" by Peter A. Levine and it has been eye opening. I am not a fast reader and progress in the book has been slow, and delayed by the problems created by the hurricane, but it is an easy read and I relate to it a lot. I seem to have suffered a lot of developmental trauma and a lot of my CPTSD problems are a result of instinctual responses that I have no control over. They have not diminished much over time and I suffer from them numerous times daily. I recently left a good temp job because they resurfaced and I took that as a bad sign; an indication that I could not handle the stress of the job. Interesting, I have a lot - a lot - of ADHD symptoms too. There is also some anxiety, depression and loss of self-confidence. I am just a mess. I am hanging in there as best as I can, that's all I can say. I really don't know what to do and am not accomplishing much lately. I am thinking of going back to school but doubt that I am up to working. I don't know what to do anymore.

Originally Posted by Open Eyes

She told me that with PTSD, the patients can learn to manage the "PTSD episodes that come up" better and better to where they can manage their lives better as well. She did agree that my brain has "changed" and I will always have PTSD. However, I will learn in therapy and time that I can get better and better and "controlling" it.

This "self love and self soothing" I talk about alot unhappyguy is "very important" to develope. It is making sure you set aside a part of yourself that recognizes these "flareups and episodes" and comes in to remind self not to "feed into" the strong emotions and anxieties that come forward. I talk about the "after" alot, and that is always when the "learning about healing" takes place with PTSD. So what I mean by that is that often when a "trigger" takes place what happens is a PTSD episode takes place. The episodes can have different strengths to them and I have also talked about the "wave". The episode comes in a "wave" where it rushes in, crests and then slowly receeds. What I have learned about that is that unfortunately we cannot "stand in front of the wave and stop it", we have to learn how to let it come forward, crest, and receed, "then" we can take time to think about what it means, validate it and say "yes, that did happen, it comes from this bad experience and hurt, and I was reminded of it, but it really is not happening the same now" and each time that is done, when the wave comes again from another trigger and episode, it is "weaker".
Eventually, the overall goal is, and it does happen, is these waves slowly turn into more of a "ripple".

Each person is different depending on their personal history unhappyguy. But if we develope this "self caring awareness" we learn to "not self punish and feed into these episodes which can make them stronger". We instead learn to help our brains calm down and make "gains" and we do begin to slowly feel better and experience longer periods of "emotional balance".

Hi. I watched that Spielberg program too. And, for some reason, I really hate Disney movies because I relate to none of the characters. In fact, I am not a movie fan at all. Maybe I watch one a year. I prefer to have music on or to read / watch the news.

I've heard all of this advice before from various T's. None of it worked. Tried the self-love thing and the Buddhist thing of letting problem thoughts just pass. I do not feel that I am in control of my thoughts or my life. I got no better - just more and more frustrated and depressed from those therapies. I am glad that it helps others but with my combination of deep-seated issues, it's just BS.

[shortandcute]

I'm not really sure--I know it does in some cases, and I can surely see your point. I will check out that site and see what it has to say.

[Open Eyes]

Ok, I understand, depending on each person's background, what might work for one person my not be the same for another. I am not dancing around in complete "victory" myself, there is no "quick" fix for PTSD, it really takes time and patience.
I have some areas that are deep seeded challenges too and I still have to try to be patient and there are some things that are never going to change, so I have had to work around them. I can be sound asleep and my husband closes a door and I always jump and react. I don't think I am ever going to get rid of that startle response, I have tried to slam doors and have my T slam doors and my husband slam doors, and I still have the problem so I understand. There too many doors in my childhood where I was in extreme fear.

Another book you may want to try reading is Judith Herman's "Trama and Recovery" as well.

(((Hugs)))
Open Eyes

[Insignificant other]

Hummmm ... what an interesting question!
Of course it does.
If you were traumatized as a kid and its come back to bite ya in the arse over and over again then yea its post traumatic stress.
We are all different .. some of us can deal with it and some of us cannot. Those of us who cannot are doomed to suffer in silence and try to cope as best as we can. Some of us succeed some of us don't.
I guess it depends on how much 'fight' is left in us.
For me, the battle has been fierce and I think I'm beating it finally.
Only you can do it.
You are deffinatly worth the battle!

When going thru hell .. keep going!