[MotownJohnny]

I discussed the issue of paranoid delusional disorder yesterday, stating that I felt my fear of psychiatric persecution was extremely unlikely, pretty irrational, and possibly delusional.

His response was, no, it's not. Although it's a pretty unrealistic fear! it's reality based, in that 1) it already happened to me 2 years ago; 2) I had tremendous exposure to my father's true paranoid delusions, 3). I recognize the irrationality of my fear under IRL conditions.

His opinion, hyper vigilance. Yup. He said that the patients he has dealt with who are truly suffering delusional disorder would never state that their fear issue is untrue/a false belief IRL, because they are completely convinced of the reality of it.

So at least there is that - I won't have that diagnostic code on my rap sheet.

[venusss]

If it comes from past experience than it is not a paranoia as such.

For example, there is a difference if a suburban Westie is paranoid about government and police being after them and if the same fear is experienced by a political refugee.

Psychiatry has it's ways to make you feel crazy. Don't want to take their pills? Must be because you NEED them and are sick. Think you are more or less okay? Must be because you ill. Distrustful of the field and doctors? Must be your illness talking. Kinda mind****y, if you ask me.

I'd advice you to seek help outside of the field as well. It is there.

[Open Eyes]

I am glad you got that straightened out Mowtown. Your therapist is right on track with you being exposed to an individual that posed a constant threat to you growing up. When a person experiences that kind of situation it is a constant "stress" and a child and young adult doesn't have the where with all to really understand how to deal with that.

A "stress breakdown" that is refered to as PTSD, is a "real" challenge and when this happens to a person they are physiologically challenged and as you know that is also "scary and stressful" too. Unfortunately, if a person is also misdiagnosed and further confused, that is only going to make that person even more frightened and stressed, which only aggrivates the already challenging condition.

In that video that I posted where that man explained what is going on physiologically it is easier to understand the challenge and work on healing rather than feeding into it unknowingly. It is unfair to a patient to diagnose them as Bipolar when in reality that person is experiencing the ups and downs of the physiological challenge with "stress build up" where that person builds up cortisol to surpress whatever painful memories/traumas are there.

If you look at how you tried to "self help" Mowtown, you will see that what you did was not bad or criminal in anyway. You actually, without realizing it, did "good things" to help yourself. However, you really did not have an understanding of "why" you kept struggling. You said, "I am going to prove them wrong", well, you always did that Mowtown in one way or the other. However, you were often alone in that effort and your other family members continued the dysfunction because they chose to "enable and be codependent". Unfortunately, that happens all too often in dysfunctional families and when a child finally has more "life experience and knowledge", looking back on that dysfunction and how it manifested into what different individuals are "in the now" because of the dysfunction, it is very hard to "see in the reality" of now.

When "any" child grows up not having parents that really "parent them" and that child ends up somehow having to step into a role of being the parent themselves, that child misses out on something "important". If there is more than one child in that scenario,"all" the children struggle in their own way and end up with some "cognitive distortions" in their coping too. That is what you have been dealing with in your other family members, because if that was not the case, your other family members would be much more open to understanding your challenge and helping you with much more "healthy supportive" interactions.

However Mowtown, you have actually seen this happen elsewhere too. The common red flag is when dealing with "estates", something you have seen for yourself right?

Well, right now you are on a long deserved journey of healing and growing Mowtown. If you really take an inventory by stepping back and looking at the entire situation you grew up in and how you managed that situation, you were never "guilty" of anything.

A big part of the healing is "grieving what was lost" through no fault of one's own. Also understanding how you did your best given the circumstances you grew up in too. But to also come to a realization that you are not, and never have been "guilty" of anything, you did whatever you knew "how" to do, and often most people realize how little help they had while they were busy "surviving" too. It is also important to realize the capacity for anyone at the different ages you were to understand "what to do" in different life challenges too.

There are definitely "stages of healing" when it comes to what is called "complex PTSD". It took "years" of surviving different "stress traumas" that led to this "stress breakdown", so "healing" doesn't take place over night. The truth is that "many" people are challenged and my guess is eventually when science catches up, a lot of the things that challenge different people will be better understood to where a person doesn't have to struggle so much and better help and understanding will take place.

Making peace with your past and then moving forward is what is important. It's your life, choose to learn and grow.

(((Caring Hugs)))
OE

[MotownJohnny]

I'm again in this middle place where I "see" these possible futures for myself, one good one bad, yet I don't know how to choose emotionally. Logically is easy, a no-brainier, but the emotions keep saying "self-destruct mode". For a lot of reasons, the ingrained subliminal message of "never good enough, never smart enough, never strong enough, never worthy" always pops up at random or non-random times to remind me I am inferior and weak. And we all know what the Nazis believed should happen to the so-called-by-them " inferior" people's.

Nazis to me are the epitome of true evil. They would have gassed me by now for being crazy. People who survived them had to be incredibly tough, smart, and almost super-human, yet the message that they got for more ham a decade was "inferior, lesser than, unworthy of being in society, of ownership, of rights" and ultimately "unworthy of life".

How do you reconcile that in your mind. When you know A, the good things about yourself, are true, but you are told that B, the bad things are all true, and that they outweigh all of the good, and that, no matter who you are or how you live your life, your genes themselves, the core of your being, puts you into the class labeled inferior and ultimately marked for death.

One of my young trainer friends is Jewish. We have a very large Jewish community here, and I love living in their shared culture, as much as I love the Arab culture here. He packed up a year ago and moved to ... Germany. It scared me a little. I know, it's the 21st Century, we are only a little more than 6 months away from the 70th anniversary of the fall of the Third Reich, and modern Germany is a stable democracy with very strong civil liberties because of their past. But it scare me and worried me that he would run up against the ghosts of the Nazis and their victims. The thought that 70 some years ago this kid would have been marked for death, along with his entire family and about half the population of my town just floors me. He is the BEST kid, super-smart, super motivated, incredibly hard working, friendly, loving, the kind of kid that makes you feel there is hope for humanity. I would adopt him as my son in a heartbeat if he needed it, but he has two terrific parents and great siblings who love him and support him. His Facebook page is always full of loving comments.

To think that the Nazis would have labeled him as unworthy of life because of his genetic and cultural heritage cuts very close to the bone with me. Persecutory delusion or hypervigilance or whatever, it is how I feel about my own situation, unfairly judged and being cast out as garbage, not because of anything I did, but because of who I am and the label given me.

[Open Eyes]

Mowtown, the scenario you have described took place because of "Hitler's" hatred for Jewish people that was due to his early years of feeling not good enough to fit "their" approval. The individuals that got this whole ideology started were "crazy" loons. So many Germans were "intimidated" into following along with this horrible mindset.

When you really look at history, even now, take your pick because so many "groups" of individuals have been persecuted and murdered by some "crazy ideology". Many Christians have been murdered/executed simply for being Christians too. And Hitler was not interested in Christianity either, he wanted to have his "own" religion and be some kind of god himself.

That being said, these feelings you are discribing are part of the PTSD symptoms. The reason you have these doubtful challenges is because you struggle with "stress" and with PTSD, that has a physiological affect too. I struggle that way myself so I know how much of a challenge that can be.

For myself, as you know, I have been "trapped and disabled" with dept from something that happened to me that was due to another person's negligence. I have not been able to break free from this challenge for over 7 years now. My neighbor kept blaming me, told me I should have "shot the damn dog" too. I have also talked a great deal about how my whole family was angry with me for breaking down too. I wanted to have the PTSD be part of my case and was warned how the opposing side would open up my history and "I" would be put under the microscope.

When I did have a deposition, my ex-lawyer who is Jewish, stopped the questioning and gave a long disertation about how he is "not a bad Jew" and there are definitely bad Jews that are lawyers, then talked about all the Jewish lawyers he was friends with that were good Jews and philanthropists. My deposition was all about "him" not me and so I never got to finish being deposed, he kept forgetting all the scheduled dates the opposing attorney made to finish deposing me. My ex-attorney was trying to deny he was failing mentally and in that deposition it just seemed so important to him to defend
that he was not a "bad Jew". Oh how I wish that deposition was video tapped to show what took place that day. He was not defending me that day, he was defending "himself" and it was so strange. He had been in the top ten in the entire country for a while in his life, which I had not known about. He had such a need that day to talk about "Jewish" people so you are not the only one that has some kind of deep challenge about that. He even had to make sure he made clear that he was not a practicing Jew and that he married a Catholic woman and "let" her raise their children with the religion of her choice. Seriously, that is how my deposition went, oh how I wish I had a video of it to show, it sounds so unbelievable doesn't it? I had taken 1/2 a Klonopin that day and prayed I would not experience a flashback in front of these strangers fearing they would not understand it, and when I experienced them, forget it, I was trapped in them for however long they lasted. At the time I had no help with that either, no money to have help either. I wish I had a video to show the opposing attorney's reaction that day too, I never felt so alone and embarassed and I did not know what to do Mowtown, I really didn't, it was so awful. Then I was asked who got hurt the worst, and I stared down at a diagram I had drawn to show where they all were and how it happened and I went into a flashback and there was nothing I could do, I could not respond or get out of it. The deposition ended with that and I could not wait to get out of that room. I had all I could do to get to the bathroom and I can't even remember "how" I got to the bathroom either. All I remember is sitting on the toilet in the stall in the bathroom shaking, oh I just could not get "warm", so cold, I was so cold. I don't know how I even made it home, I should have never been alone that day.

Oh, I didn't mean to talk about myself, but, just wanted you to know that you are not the only one with this deep challenge. Oh, how I wish I had a video that I could show you what happened in that room and my lawyer's long disertations, where I did see that in him that took over my deposition that day. I never expected to experience that kind of situation and I was in no condition to experience that either. I could not even talk to the opposing attorney about it either, she witnessed this and here I am in a situation where I can not even talk to her about how creepy that deposition was because she is the opposing attorney. I had this crazy double whammy taking place and I had no "help", I wanted so badly to talk to this other attorney but I couldn't.

Well, my main reason for talking about this is to show you how you are really not alone with this deep challenge or "fear".

OE