[sittingatwatersedge]

someone recently posted now that trauma treatment is done, they're done... and I wondered if they were done.

Judith Herman's book Trauma And Recovery is easy to read and excellent for those who are on this path and like me, have an interest in what to expect. She outlines the phases of trauma treatment as these:

** establishing safety & trust with the T
** telling the story
** coming to grips with the fact that one has been a victim, recognizing
that this victimization has had an impact one's life, and discovering what the
extent of the impact is
** reintegration into relationships and society

It's not a straight line of progression, especially the trust part!! but I pretty much know where I am on this continuum. I just thought I'd give her book a recommendation because it was helpful to me. If interested, inexpensive, previously owned copies are always available at http://www.abebooks.com to all

[elliemay]

In my experience, once I told the story, THAT'S when the work really began. Therapy wasn't about telling my story, but it was working in a safe environment to learn HOW that story was affecting me today, and how to develop the courage to change it.

Yes, I had to get my truth out there, but then I had to deal with that truth.

Dealing with that truth is when my life started to significantly improve.

[sittingatwatersedge]

Originally Posted by elliemay

In my experience, once I told the story, THAT'S when the work really began. Therapy wasn't about telling my story, but it was working in a safe environment to learn HOW that story was affecting me today, and how to develop the courage to change it.
Yes, I had to get my truth out there, but then I had to deal with that truth. Dealing with that truth is when my life started to significantly improve.

Elliemay (or anyone) when is the story finally told? When the major facts are told? When it doesn't hurt to tell it any more? When the anger is gone? When the sadness is gone? Is there any going forward if anger and/or sadness still have power?
Or maybe it's "not a straight line of progression" even to the extent that these things can still exist and you can make some forward movement at same time?
I ask because my own "story" seems endless, the hurt and anger and sadness seem endless, and I find myself longing to be able to point to some forward movement.

[SpiritRunner]

Originally Posted by sittingatwatersedge

Elliemay (or anyone) when is the story finally told? When the major facts are told? When it doesn't hurt to tell it any more? When the anger is gone? When the sadness is gone? Is there any going forward if anger and/or sadness still have power?
Or maybe it's "not a straight line of progression" even to the extent that these things can still exist and you can make some forward movement at same time?
I ask because my own "story" seems endless, the hurt and anger and sadness seem endless, and I find myself longing to be able to point to some forward movement.

I relate to what you say about your story seeming endless, the emotions seeming endless.........though I have told the basic facts of my story, the story of the emotions and the pain seems to be so deep, so complex and so long I can't see the end of it and feel like no matter how much I try to tell it, it will still be mostly untold in the end! I think though, that even with this feeling, there can and will still be a going forward....just that the story will continue to affect us in one way or another, with the way it affects us changing as we ourselves change.....we will carry our stories with us.

[ladyjrnlist]

I am currently going through trauma therapy. The first step is the story, but the hardest part for me has been realizing and processing all the emotions that I never let myself feel during the time I was abused, which was my entire childhood.

[sittingatwatersedge]

Originally Posted by elliemay

.....Yes, I had to get my truth out there, but then I had to deal with that truth. Dealing with that truth is when my life started to significantly improve.

this is Herman's third phase, and it's important for T clients working on trauma to be aware that she points to this phase as the place where there is greatest danger of giving up, of self harm ..... Once the realization is no longer run away from, but faced...

ARRRRGH!!!!! It infuriates me so, when i hear insensitive remarks that belittle people in therapy as being weaklings. This is DAMNED hard work, harder than those jerks could ever comprehend. I am so glad to find the PC community, where the truth of it is known.

[pachyderm]

Originally Posted by sittingatwatersedge

i hear insensitive remarks that belittle people in therapy as being weaklings.

It frightens people to see others admitting vulnerability. Scary reminder of one's own fears.

[elliemay]

Originally Posted by sittingatwatersedge

Elliemay (or anyone) when is the story finally told? When the major facts are told? When it doesn't hurt to tell it any more? When the anger is gone? When the sadness is gone? Is there any going forward if anger and/or sadness still have power?
Or maybe it's "not a straight line of progression" even to the extent that these things can still exist and you can make some forward movement at same time?
I ask because my own "story" seems endless, the hurt and anger and sadness seem endless, and I find myself longing to be able to point to some forward movement.

IMO, I'm not sure that the story if ever "fully" told. The truth may be out there, but the story? Well, can anyone ever really get it? Can we ever truly reach back into it? Can we ever completely get it all out? I don't think so - not fully. It's not like a splinter where one says "Ah, that's much better!". It's inculcated in us.

My therapist and I agree that I will always carry the ramifications of what happened to me. It will always be there, I don't get a do over. I still hurt, it's unfortunate, it's way beyond not fair, but, well, there you have it. It is what it is.

I know this may not be very helpful, but I think you will be done telling, hurting, and being angry when you are ready to accept it, and be done with THAT, and not one moment sooner.

For me, it was almost as though my rational side kicked in and was able to take a good hard look at that emotional side. It told me "okay, you're hurt, you're angry and no matter how you fixate on the past, it's never enough. So, what are you going to do about THIS. This is your one life and what, exactly, are you going to do with it?"

It wasn't like I woke up one morning and had that great epiphany. Not at all, it was a gradual realization that, while I likely would never move on from the pain, I could move with it. I could accept it and carry it.

That's when I started really working with my therapist to help me recognize patterns of behaviour. We could then understand where they were coming from. WHY I was doing what I was doing. HOW it was holding me back, and WAYS to get the confidence, bit by bit, to make my own choices - informed by me, in the now and not dictated by what was behind me.

That's why I'm still in therapy. It's helping that rational side to stay on top of things.

That, and I really like Buddhism, make a whole lot of soap, and every single day - no matter what - I write down what gave me joy that day. A moment of just pure joy. It really helps.

Today it was a doughnut. Yesterday it was a freshly laundered sheets on my bed, the day before that these crazy squirrels that play in my back yard. Tomorrow, who knows? But my money is on the doughnut again.

[pachyderm]

Do your squirrels turn somersaults? I wonder if they are having fun, or if they are brain-damaged, or have a virus...

[elliemay]

Originally Posted by pachyderm

Do your squirrels turn somersaults? I wonder if they are having fun, or if they are brain-damaged, or have a virus...

I don't think they have a virus, the play definitely seems directed. Well, I had one squirrel attack a limb on the ground once, but I watched that limb myself. If he hadn't of done it, I would've!

They certainly look like they are having fun, but I worry that they pester each other so much that none of them actually get enough of the food I put out for them.

[WikidPissah]

wow...I appreciate the strength you all have to do T this way. Personally, I just can't stomach it. I told the basics, and spent the last year just letting that go. I have no desire to tell the story, there's no way I could do it justice. Possibly I won't ever be whole, but I won't be totally broken either. That's just my path though, and I wouldn't want anyone to follow any path but their own.

[deliquesce]

Originally Posted by sittingatwatersedge

someone recently posted now that trauma treatment is done, they're done... and I wondered if they were done.

interesting post, sawe . to take this in a different direction - i'm actually rather curious about your second guessing the "truth" of what that poster said about being "done" (i'm not commenting on the veracity of their opinion - i have no idea who you're referring to, and i dont want to judge their situation at any rate).

jmo, but trauma work can take many forms, and a lot of it falls outside the conventional wisdom outlined by judith herman. for example, "telling the story" isn't something i'm ever likely to engage in, and pretty much all of my therapists have agreed it would be harmful for me to go in depth with it also. instead my focus has been on establishing trust (oh boy, that's been a 5 year long process, and is still continuing) and working on present day stuff (relationships/society).

at the same time, austin-t told me about one of his clients who only wanted to tell her story a few times, and who after that was "done" with therapy - she had a great life set up now, but needed to process that period in her past with someone to get closure on it. once she'd told her story (she saw him for 8 weeks) she was happy to move on, because no other work needed to be done. he did say it was a pretty gut wrenching 8 weeks for them both, though.

just been thinking & talking about this recently, because i know the typical formula and also because i know i won't be following it, and there is a concern that other people will question my "doneness" because i've excluded one of the steps. austin-t runs a trauma therapy group, and we'd been discussing whether i would benefit from joining it, but eventually we decided it probably wasn't in my best interest because some people have very set ideas about what trauma work involves, and that i didn't need to feel like i wasn't on par with the rest of the group (or justify myself to them) because i was following the path which was best for me.

i do think hermann is an interesting read though for anyone interested in what trauma work can involve. ive asked about trauma work here before when i've been stuck - it's a good recommendation for me to keep in mind .

[deliquesce]

Originally Posted by elliemay

I don't think they have a virus, the play definitely seems directed. Well, I had one squirrel attack a limb on the ground once, but I watched that limb myself. If he hadn't of done it, I would've!

They certainly look like they are having fun, but I worry that they pester each other so much that none of them actually get enough of the food I put out for them.

a limb? like, a random extra foot or arm you had lying around in your back yard?

lol deli. i think she meant a tree limb.

[deliquesce]

will blame it on being aussie and having never seen a squirrel (possums don't attack trees, they mainly just romp around in your roof and pee on the ceiling. if a possum found an extra arm in the backyard it would go for it ).

[skeksi]

If I remember correctly, in her book Herman does emphasize that the three-stage process is not linear. That is, people might move back and forth between different stages, depending on many different variables.

That's certainly been true for me, and when I revisit each 'phase' I come back to a different spot, one a little closer to some kind of end point. For example, after T and I established some kind of safety, I did some exposure therapy. That helped, so we could do some cognitive work on issues in the present, and then because I still had problems with the trauma memories, some more exposure. Then more present-day stuff. Now we are going back to the trauma story again. This has taken years! But it's a slow and steady progress.

[elliemay]

Originally Posted by skeksi

If I remember correctly, in her book Herman does emphasize that the three-stage process is not linear. That is, people might move back and forth between different stages, depending on many different variables.

That's certainly been true for me, and when I revisit each 'phase' I come back to a different spot, one a little closer to some kind of end point. For example, after T and I established some kind of safety, I did some exposure therapy. That helped, so we could do some cognitive work on issues in the present, and then because I still had problems with the trauma memories, some more exposure. Then more present-day stuff. Now we are going back to the trauma story again. This has taken years! But it's a slow and steady progress.

No, it's definitely not linear at all. In fact, just last week I made a collage because there was some thing nagging at me that I was still trying to express. I HAD to express it.

Therapy is such hard hard work. SOmetimes it makes me feel so "bleh" combined with "ick" combined with "sigh". You know?

[cautious hope]

Originally Posted by sittingatwatersedge

Elliemay (or anyone) when is the story finally told? When the major facts are told? When it doesn't hurt to tell it any more? When the anger is gone? When the sadness is gone? Is there any going forward if anger and/or sadness still have power?
Or maybe it's "not a straight line of progression" even to the extent that these things can still exist and you can make some forward movement at same time?
I ask because my own "story" seems endless, the hurt and anger and sadness seem endless, and I find myself longing to be able to point to some forward movement.

I beleive it's when we begin to have solid evidence how specific past events still impact us and our reactions. I couldn't believe it when I discovered that I was having "Emotional Flashbacks". I wish I could say that I am well, but progress for me is incremental. But I do trust I will be much happier some time in the future.

[cautious hope]

Originally Posted by Eileen2010

wow...I appreciate the strength you all have to do T this way. Personally, I just can't stomach it. I told the basics, and spent the last year just letting that go. I have no desire to tell the story, there's no way I could do it justice. Possibly I won't ever be whole, but I won't be totally broken either. That's just my path though, and I wouldn't want anyone to follow any path but their own.

You know Eileen, My latest time with therapy, I talked with T about not much of anything but complain about family dynamics and tell her about the behaviors I'd like to change. I did this for a few months. I invested a good deal of time getting to trust her. (I also googled her and her politics were the same as mine, haha). I think when you get close enough it will become a burden you will need to dump. Can't say I exactly enjoy the work we do. But I cant survive or move forward without it. I can't stay here either. It would destroy me.