[sittingatwatersedge]

I need to hear from some of you who have been in therapy for a while, your story told & you're in a phase where you identify & evaluate protective measures formed at an earlier age, and try to gauge whether they are still effective - and if not, working on changing them

I think this is where T and I are headed now, and when I think of going to see her I am just blank -

I know it's resistance, it absolutely is. Those pieces of psychological armor tht I put in place so long ago HAVE worked, in their way, even though sometimes the price is high; the alternative - adjusting or eliminating some of them - is scary beyond words.

I don't want to go back to see T any more, and if I do go, I certainly don't want to tell her all this. Could some of you please share your experiences and help me ?

[sugahorse1]

SAWE - you seem to have touched on a lot of scary and deep issues; I can even hear this in your post.
I would maybe journal about these feelings - start with whatever you find easiest... Then maybe write it out for T to read. Start slow
I'm not sure if your T formally annouced that you were going to start focusing on these issues, but maybe you need to have a discussion on where your therapy is going from here.
It sounds like you have gotten through crisis management, and are now looking for more long-term solutions; this is an exciting time :-)

[Omers]

My experience at that stage with several Ts is that they get really gentle and patient with us. Even more than before. They know this is an all new kind of trust and an all new scary. They know us better now, what feels good and safe and each time we take a step towards them they support us with a safety.

[WikidPissah]

Haven't gotten to that stage yet. I know you asked for only people who are there...but can I at least give you a and whisper "your so strong and brave, I know you can do it"

[Perna]

It's never all or nothing. Picture your whole defense system as a literal defense (in my case, a castle :-) and you are not going to knock down the castle, you are just going to realize that it's your castle and you control the various defensive parts. You can decide when to open and close the drawbridge and whether to have alligators or swans in the moat!

Everyone has defenses, at all times. But think of the Great Wall of China versus a garden wall. Some of our defenses we've over-developed because we have felt attacked from that direction. So, they have become habitually "better" developed, kind of like the difference between a highway, a country road, and a path through the woods? Some of the defenses need balancing, the trash picked up beside the highway and a bicycle lane put in instead where the fast-track commuter lane was.

How did my T and I do this? Over time and with conversation back and forth. When I got scared, I took a chance instead of running and kept moving forward. I caught myself when I caught a feeling and blurted out what was happening, when it was happening. I named what I was feeling when I was feeling it. I recognized that T was at my side instead of "opposite" me; she wasn't a teacher/leader, but a friend of my growth who was with me but had to depend on me for direction.

I quit thinking about what T was thinking, doing, how she felt about me, etc. and how I felt about her and started to look at the work only and look at her in relation to the work. When I felt hurt by her, I did not take it personally, did not look at the "hurt" feeling but at what she had said. You know how when you point, the cat looks at your finger instead of where you're pointing? :-) I started to look at where she was pointing.

For example, she once said, "Not if you do what you usually do!" and I felt I was criticized as my stepmother had criticized me, telling me I couldn't do anything right and was going to fail again. But, I worked on that for 2-3 days nonstop, looked at the larger picture. My T got nothing from criticizing me and that was not her style. She was not harsh like my stepmother, did not "snap" in anger so, I reasoned, the words had probably not been meant as criticism. What else is there? I finally was able to picture it like the two of us on a white water raft trip through the gorge in a little rubber boat and T was helping spot the rocks that might capsize us. Can you see it? She had actually said, "Hey, watch that rock there, it got us last time!" See how that changes everything?

[sittingatwatersedge]

(yes sugahorse, T did say this is where we go next and that it's going to take a long time).

When I started I hardly knew who I was; now I'm supposed to be different. I feel so lost.

thank you WP but I don't feel strong and brave; this is scary on a basic level..

[with or without you]

SAWE, I feel like I could have written your post! This is exactly where I'm at right now, and I have been seeing this T for almost 10 years! A lot of stuff has happened in this decade. But I got to a point around 4-5 months ago where I felt that I needed to take this to another level. I'm not being hard on myself here. But it's a fact—there is so much stuff that I've been thinking and feeling since I was very young and I've never told anyone, not even her. I have arrived at the conclusion that my hiding ends now. So, I've been doing it all in writing, I mail it to her, and then we talk about it the next time.

The only advice I can give you is to do this slowly and take care of yourself. You may end up not even feeling any better after getting this stuff out, and that's OK. Sharing the deepest places of your soul is not going to be some quick fix for your mood. A lot of emotions are going to spew out like a volcano, they have with me anyway. Good luck!

((((((((((((sawe)))))))))))))))))

I think that's where T and I have been for a little while, and it IS very scary.

I remember the first time I really understood that I was going to have to (or at least I thought I was going to have to) integrate all of the scattered parts of myself. I literally remember where I was sitting at the time (in the car in the driveway talking to T). It TERRIFIED me and made me angry, and yeah, it made me want to quit T forever.

But T has always been really gentle. And learning to let go of my defenses, slowly, slowly, has been a process. We dip in and out of it, and T says it's okay to put my walls back up for a little while if i need to.

I think we really start the process when we start therapy. I know that for me, just walking through that door and basically admitting "I need help" took a huge amount of bravery and willingness to do things differently. I don't think I had ever really asked for help in that way. (not that I used those words, but just walking through the door sort of said it for me). It was never safe before. Learning to show up every week and to be willing to start to let down my guard enough to tell my story was part of the process. Every step of therapy really has been all about taking down my defenses (and putting them back up, and taking them down again) in some ways.

So. For me, each new "phase" of therapy brings it's own set of fears...AND I know that I DO want to be able to live with an open heart, without unnecessary fear, with the ability to love and be loved. I'm learning that each new awful scary phase of therapy somehow gets less scary eventually.

It can be slow, and gentle.

You ARE brave, sawe. You couldn't have reached this point otherwise.

[elliemay]

Originally Posted by Perna

It's never all or nothing. Picture your whole defense system as a literal defense (in my case, a castle :-) and you are not going to knock down the castle, you are just going to realize that it's your castle and you control the various defensive parts. You can decide when to open and close the drawbridge and whether to have alligators or swans in the moat!

Everyone has defenses, at all times. But think of the Great Wall of China versus a garden wall. Some of our defenses we've over-developed because we have felt attacked from that direction. So, they have become habitually "better" developed, kind of like the difference between a highway, a country road, and a path through the woods? Some of the defenses need balancing, the trash picked up beside the highway and a bicycle lane put in instead where the fast-track commuter lane was.

How did my T and I do this? Over time and with conversation back and forth. When I got scared, I took a chance instead of running and kept moving forward. I caught myself when I caught a feeling and blurted out what was happening, when it was happening. I named what I was feeling when I was feeling it. I recognized that T was at my side instead of "opposite" me; she wasn't a teacher/leader, but a friend of my growth who was with me but had to depend on me for direction.

I quit thinking about what T was thinking, doing, how she felt about me, etc. and how I felt about her and started to look at the work only and look at her in relation to the work. When I felt hurt by her, I did not take it personally, did not look at the "hurt" feeling but at what she had said. You know how when you point, the cat looks at your finger instead of where you're pointing? :-) I started to look at where she was pointing.

For example, she once said, "Not if you do what you usually do!" and I felt I was criticized as my stepmother had criticized me, telling me I couldn't do anything right and was going to fail again. But, I worked on that for 2-3 days nonstop, looked at the larger picture. My T got nothing from criticizing me and that was not her style. She was not harsh like my stepmother, did not "snap" in anger so, I reasoned, the words had probably not been meant as criticism. What else is there? I finally was able to picture it like the two of us on a white water raft trip through the gorge in a little rubber boat and T was helping spot the rocks that might capsize us. Can you see it? She had actually said, "Hey, watch that rock there, it got us last time!" See how that changes everything?

This is exactly how my therapy has played out.

Especially the part about looking at the finger versus what the finger is actually pointing towards.

Very very wise words there.

[sittingatwatersedge]

Originally Posted by elliemay

This is exactly how my therapy has played out.

Especially the part about looking at the finger versus what the finger is actually pointing towards.

Very very wise words there.

I understand the analogy but when I point to my cat's bowl, she looks down my arm and then at the bowl.

[elliemay]

Originally Posted by sittingatwatersedge

I understand the analogy but when I point to my cat's bowl, she looks down my arm and then at the bowl.

All bets are off when pet food is on the line.

Given the opportunity, mine might actually eat my arm on the way to bowl.

[sittingatwatersedge]

Originally Posted by elliemay

All bets are off when pet food is on the line.

lol - actually the reason I was pointing at the bowl that day was because there was fried chicken on the table, and the cat wanted some of it, and I pointed to the canned cat food I had just put down for her.
The cat followed the angle of my pointing finger, and looked at the bowl. Then she walked over to the bowl, and scraped imaginary dirt over it.

Yowch. Let's hope we don't do that with our therapists' attempts to guide us....

[sunrise]

Originally Posted by sittingatwatersedge

The cat followed the angle of my pointing finger, and looked at the bowl. Then she walked over to the bowl, and scraped imaginary dirt over it.

LOL when cats do this it means they are saving the food for later and don't want anyone else to find it. Your cat sounds very smart. Maybe he was trying to hide it from you so he could get some chicken.

About the main part of your post, I have had some trouble discarding defense mechanisms from the past, and some success. There is an automatic reaction to use them. I have to be vigilant and try hard not to, when the occasion arises. I want to not have to automatically put them down the old patterns as they arise. I want "the new way" of reacting to become automatic. Don't know if it is possible. I would suggest just starting very small, trying it just one time in therapy and seeing how it goes. You don't have to discard a defense all at once, just slowing try new ways of being. Therapy can be a safe place for that.