[crackednfragile]

My therapist starts the session by being invalidating. It hurts me. Then at the end of the session, he will try to repair the relationship by saying complimentary things. I know this is dialectical or DBT (the private part). I hate it. Has anyone else had experience with this. I don't know if I should keep with it????My SIB's have been getting worse and I feel torn up inside. I know DBT focuses on self reliance, so he would never do supportive therapy. It is so hard because I have a lot of issues going.

[wisewoman]

I guess I need to look up DBT as I know little about it. You can come here for support as much as you need. My understanding of DBT is it's often used with people who have Borderline Personality disorder. People here are cool and very supportive. Good luck.

[JustBen]

I've never been through it, but I've heard similar stories. One of those "feel worse and then feel better" deals. Can't be very much fun, especially in the beginning.

Gosh. No part of good therapy involves invalidating the client - just the opposite. YOU should be validated. Your history should be validated. Your feelings should be validated.

Your BEHAVIORS are what may need to be explored for changes which can improve your overall life. Sounds like something is not quite right. Perhaps you can ask your T what's up with this process? If you are feeling invalidated as a person, something is wrong...imo.

Hugs, emmy

[wisewoman]

Thanks Em, was just reading about DBT and thinking the same thing.

[(JD)]

Sorry, I never bothered with what I call "diabolical therapy" lol

[brianm101]

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
_Sky said:
Sorry, I never bothered with what I call "diabolical therapy" lol

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">

Hi Sky.
I am not sure if I would ever find any of this funny. Or would I 'ever' make a joke about it.
Changing the spelling of the word is plain disrespectful and nothing less.

[crackednfragile]

Thanks for your replies, support and humor. I look at it this way--it will either make or break me. It could make me stronger, but I feel so broken now that I don't know if I can follow through on my therapy. Then, I'll be right back where I started. Confusing.

I like the spelling change and think it fits that therapy process. Course I am one that looks for the humour side of things for it sure makes life with DID so much easier to live with. And no I don't see changing therapy process labels spelling as disrespctful in fact some therapists also do that to lighten things up.

[(JD)]

Extreme emotional vulnerability is rarely the sole cause of psychological problems, an invalidating environment is also a major contributing factor.

IMO if your T is truly invalidating you, she isn't using DBT. In fact, the one main issue that the "originator" determined was that the patients were not receiving ENOUGH validation with basic CBT, so she changed it with DBT.

DBT: Stage 1 Moving from being out of control behavior to in control. Target one: reduce and then eliminate life threatening behaviors Target two:reduce and eliminate behaviors that interfere with treatment Stage three: decrease behaviors that destroy quality of life Stage four: learn skills that help

Stage 2 Moving from being emotionally shut down to experiencing emotions fully.
Stage 3 Building an ordinary life, solving ordinary problems.
Stage 4 Moving from incompleteness to completeness/connection

[JustBen]

Help me out, crackednfragile. What do you mean by "invalidating"? I've heard that word used in so many different ways, I'm just not sure I understand what it means anymore.

[heartspace]

Surely you should feel comfortable enough in your therapy sessions to explore things that are potentially uncomfortable. If your sessions start uncomfortably, I don't see how that can ever be productive. I'd be looking for another therapist.

[crackednfragile]

Invalidate is to dismiss. "No, it isn't that bad." "No, you don't feel that." "Oh, you feel good enough to go back to work." Dialectical means to pit opposites against each other and try to find a middle ground. I've read, when DBT stalls, the therapist will try to jumpstart it by saying something invalidating. They are suppose to be careful, because the client became sick by invalidation in the first place. I don't know what to do???I'm feeling sick. Read my blog under crackednfragile.

[(JD)]

I'm not an expert in DBT (nor do I play one on TV.) I do know that the usual course of DBT is 3 hours of therapy a week, for a year (2 hours of that being in a skills group.)

How long have you been trying DBT; what lesson are you on?

I also do know that it's part of the therapy to get their patients "riled" or upset and then lead them to working through it.. breathing, meditation etc.

I'm sorry that you feel you are being treated negatively. I do hope you realize that borderlines often feel this way about therapists when they are confronted. However, I also believe that you might have a T that doesn't understand the true VALIDATING nature of DBT.

Validation is the key reason that DBT was created, as an extension to regular CBT. Borderlines were found to need MORE validation, yet therapy needed to progress in a different manner.

If you can have a DIALECTICAL session with your T regarding these feelings, I think that would be great! If you continue to feel invalidated, I would ask that if you could post EXACTLY what the discussion was, we here at PC can better assist you to decide if DBT is what you need. TC

[crackednfragile]

Thanks for your input. I am almost through my 1st module of mindfulness and interpersonal skills. The group part is not bad, and I learn a lot. I will have to have "a serious conversation" about the therapy. I think in this situation he has truly stepped over his bounds(using my reasonable mind). It is overkill. Yes, he gives me the deep breathing exercises. I need them after the bleep he puts me through.

[Hopefull]

It sounds to me like the purpose is to get the person to experience the troublesome emotions by riling up the client and then help them deal with the emotions. It sounds like a hard type of therapy to do because the T must get you riled up and let you know that you are in a safe environment. I couldn't deal with that form of therapy. I would certainly want to see if it was helping me or not. I can usually see a sign outside of sessions that the sessions have a nice effect. How long have you been at this? I would definately have a talk with my T if I found that I wasn't feeling validated. I do find that my T has made me annoyed because she tells me to stop worrying about stuff like I'm a freaken child. But, strangely, I actually stop worrying about that subject for a few weeks. So, maybe I need to be treated like a child sometimes. So, it may be that you need this or perhaps your T is clear on how to do this therapy or maybe you are not ready for that level of confrontation.

[wisewoman]

The way I understand the treatment would not explain what you have written in your blog!!!! I have never been told I was borderline and if someone said those things to me your T has said to you I would me running for the mountains a long time ago. My guess is he really does not have a clue what he is doing. Those statements he has made to you are unacceptable under any therapeudic circumstances. I also about wanted to up-chuck when I read about the social workers for the kids. Borderline has been a trash can diagnoses for a lot of people and it seems to some quote professionals to mean they can treat people horridly. To me you sound like you are making sense.

The other thing is about self harm. Not everyone who does this is borderline but, it is a great way for you to be labeled and to be treated with less respect.

I have done fairly well with self injury by coming to the conclusion that mentally I know it is bad for me cause T and everyone here says it is so I try to do good things for myself so I will be more healthy. It's kinda like flying blind but it worked for me.

Not to say I don't have issues with other ways that I do not treat myself well, or that the thoughts don't pop into my mind.

Good luck speaking with him. I wonder if you should arrange to have his supervisor with you?

[crackednfragile]

I have a mess. I'm glad someone gets it. It feels like an induced psychosis, in my mind. I actually thought I should call in the supervisor, too. It is so hard for me to deal with these power people. I feel like an ant but ants work hard and each have a place. Thank you for visiting me.

[JustBen]

Yeah, that's invalidating for sure. I'm no expert on DBT, but none of that sounds right. Talking to his supervisor sounds like an excellent idea.

[(JD)]

I don't read blogs in general...so I'll go with what the others who have read yours say....

Can you ask for a new T? DBT isn't denegrating, it is confrontational, imo. I personally haven't had experience with it, but from all I read, it isn't invalidating, "just" intense.

But putting that aside, if you feel totally invalidated, what kind of progress can you make? You need to know that it's ok to have the feelings you have, but maybe need to make behavior changes so you won't suffer with those feelings?

TC of yourself. Let us know what you think, and what you decide.

[crackednfragile]

Today, after group focusing on DEAR MAN-DBT'S know what that is, I talked with the "T". We are working on "repairing" the relationship. I think we made headway but there will be more work ahead. I know I will be sticking with him. One thing we are planning is having a team meeting with the S.W.'s that are difficult for me.

[(JD)]

[kimmydawn]

Great job!!! and thank you for letting us know. Keep us posted.

Good luck!

kd