Wanting my T to acknowledge her Limits/Imperfections

LOVE it. And totally agree.

I had one T that it didn't work out with. It just got worse and worse.
I had another T it works out well-enough. Sometimes he owns what I think is his contribution. Sometimes he owns things I'm not even upset about. Sometimes he doesn't own what I thnk he should own, but he completely listens to me, accepts and doesn't minimize me, and because of the rest of the relationship, I can live with that.

I think if I were feeling better, I would be at the "I can live with that" stage maybe.

You've said it beautifully. I have been thinking about the concept she taught me of a "good enough" mother. They will not be perfect, they will not be completely free of blind spots, but they will try hard, do well, be dependable. She is those things, sigh.

Hard to see them through the charred remains of my week though, ha.

Yes the good enough mother concept also refers to the "holding environment" and it sounds like that was breeched or broken so of course you feel broken yourself or something like that. There is a whole body of work about the positive effects of repair in the relationship so I am more on the optimistic side that this will work out for you though I understand why it doesn't feel that way and have had times when I was not optimistic either about my own therapeutic relationship.

For me, being in the throes of a PTSD reaction that seems clearly rooted in the aftereffects of my abusive childhood, usually means that whatever interaction led to that was a hot button of mine. Feeling like I am 7, or, 8, or 10, or whatever young age is often an indication that some dynamic from my past is playing itself out in a large and substantial way. The problem is that I often wasted a lot of time pointing fingers at the other person and demanding that they apologize or "own" or otherwise change how they are responding to me. It was a waste of time because it kept me from acknowledging how profound certain interpersonal dynamics still grip me in the various storylines of my life. I wasn't able to get free of these until I focused inward and understood myself.

What comes up for me in your storyline is the pain of not being rescued. When you were a child, I'm guessing you were not rescued from the chronic abuse that was perpetrated on you. From my own history, I know that I often felt that I communicated to others that I needed to be rescued from my home, but no one was hearing me, or they heard but they didn't acknowledge it. I was suffering, I thought I was telling others about it, but nothing was happening as a result. When I became a mostly very functional adult, I had many interactions in and out of therapy that nearly perfectly mirrored this dynamic. Sometimes it was something small with my wife, that she didn't do what I asked that showed she "had my back". It happened many times with my first T, that he didn't seem to get how upset I was, I showed up for session and I told him and I wrote in my journal to him. It was super clear to me that I was looking for some kind of specific reaction from him, but he either didn't get it or he got it and was unwilling to react to me in whatever way I was expecting or asking for. In whatever situation there was, I went on and on with the details of the other person's failing. And while I think it was healthy for me to express it (as opposed to be too scared to say anything), it didn't ultimately serve me in moving forward, in being free from my past. I don't believe we are entitled to have people react to us in the precise way we dictate, even T's. It's fine to ask for what you want or to express dismay at getting it, but for me what was most helpful is to stop trying to change everyone around me and work on getting for myself what I needed.

Part of that was learning that my clear communication wasn't always as clear as I thought it was. I know what my words mean, particularly when I see them on paper, but others might not. They might have differing interpretations or they may just not want to do what I asked. This cycle of demanding a specific reaction and the emotional pain from not getting it never ended as long as I expected the other person to rescue me from my pain by doing whatever it is that I wanted.

Funny thing that happened when I realized that I'm not entitled to have other people do what I asked. It stopped hurting so bad when I didn't get it. I stopped getting stuck on focusing on the other person, and turned my gaze inwards to get what I needed myself. I started improving the clarity of my communications with others, stopped expecting them to to magically interpret my words correctly, stopped expecting them to fix things that were broken in our relationship or myself. I started to take more responsibility for meeting my own needs, for ensuring I was communicating clearly. The more I did this, the more I left my past behind, the storyline of me as the little boy who is never rescued when he needs to be. I became a man who asked respectfully for what he needs, and graciously accepted not getting it. I stopped trying to change everyone around me and worked on the ways I could meet my own needs. I found that the more I could meet my own needs, the more others were willing to help me. Kind of backwards from what I expected, but it was a grateful lesson.

I don't know if it is the same for you, but I thought I would share my experience just in case something might be helpful.

What I asked for from my therapist wasn't unreasonable. She may've disagreed, not understood, or not had the skills to provide it until now. Having her help *is* one of the ways I'm working to meet my needs, to feel more stable, graceful, as I deal with the issues I have. When I criticized her harshly last week after difficult period for not providing what I needed, I immediately apologized. That does not change that it would help me for her to own her part in the rupture.

It is exactly because I am in the grip of a difficult emotional reaction, a PTSD reaction, and having some present day problems, that I could have used concrete supports, and she is the woman I work with and hired to help me in these difficult moments to make them better. I tried to redirect us multiple times and be as clear as possible.

Turning my gaze inward to get what I needed is what I did, painfully, when I did *not* want to show up to therapy, but I did. I exposed myself to her to let her help me, and she took me off track, when I really needed help staying on track.

My communication was not perfect, but neither was it completely devoid of helpful meaning. Therapists are supposed to be above average listeners and helpers, she's had enough time with me that I expect her to have some sense of where from our many sessions and the letters I write her, or to ask me questions until she's clear if she is totally unsure.

I agree that the more I can meet my own needs, the easier it is to relate with and receive from others, but the thing is, this is therapy. If I were enlightened perfectly, I'd be in Nirvana right now. As it is, I am where I am and paying someone to help me, and this time, they really didn't and it hurts. That's all.

I don't believe I'll get perfection in this relationship or any other. I manage fine with my husband, relatives, child, co-workers, professionals, friends, etc. Not perfectly, but well enough. The thing is, when I see where I have made a mistake, I own up to it, and it seems to me, my therapist made some and I would feel a lot better if she'd acknowledge it. Am I "entitled" to that? It's not a matter of entitlement- I've asked for what I wanted, that's all there is to do.

I know you like her and she has been helpful in many ways. But this is at least the second time that I hear you making excuses for what sounds like seriously unprofessional behaviour on her part. You rationalize her inability to maintain professional boundaries by saying how really very difficult you are. It sounds like "Mommy drinks because I cry."

Why on earth is she so easily pushed off balance? Why does she lose her cool on the job? Sure, nobody's perfect but there's a difference between cutting your T some slack because she's human and repeatedly excusing her terrible out-of-control behaviour. I can't get over that she said "I'm sick of you! You! You!" She wasn't even apologetic about it.

It is, as another poster once so insightfully pointed out, NOT your job to be easy. It is not your job to spare her feelings or bite back your anger (whether transferential or otherwise) or be reasonable. You don't have to be reasonable. You definitely should not be dancing around her fragile ego and making excuses for her lack of skill, lack of self-awareness, lack of compassion etc.

Your end of the bargain is this: You have to pay her. You can't stalk her. You can't threaten her or her family. You do your best to keep your appointments. Ideally you take the process seriously and put some effort into it. That's basically it. You are allowed to be angry and say angry things. Many T's welcome that and recognize it for the goldmine of therapeutic material that it is. They also readily apologize when they have hurt you or made a mistake. They do not use their mistake as an opportunity to give you a stigmatizing label.

When I read your posts I get the distinct sense that you do not feel entitled to be treated well and perhaps even that you feel that you deserve mistreatment. Which is true of many of us. But that is something that should be healed, not reinforced, in therapy.

Hello Leah123-

I think you are absolutely correct. From where I stand, you are not asking for perfection-you know that people make mistakes. You are asking for the therapist to own what belongs to them. This was one of the issues that caused me considerable anguish in therapy. With one therapist in particular he not only wouldn't take responsibility for his hurtful words and behavior, he would say that my hurt response was a product of being abused not that he had done anything wrong. Everything that went wrong in the therapy was blamed on me-especially hard on me because I was often blamed for the abuse I received as a child) I have often thought about how powerful and healing it would have been had the therapist acknowledged his responses and mistakes and damaging behavior. Even if nothing else had happened I still would have been able to take something from that therapy-something positive, that is-had he owned his contributions. I desperately needed to know what was mine because I constantly blamed myself for the bad things that happened. I didn't want a perfect therapist. I wanted a human who was willing to take responsibility for what they brought to the table. I know that I took more than enough responsibility for my part.

You are absolutely right-what you asked for was not unreasonable.

She did tell me afterward she could take my finger pointing and anger, she's said it before, more than once, that she would never abandon me no matter how angry I got with her or anything else.

The issue with "you you you" was she explained to me at length that the "you" should have been in quotation marks, because she was tired of my accusatory statements, but she insists repeatedly she is not and will not be tired of me, she was simply frustrated with the bombardment and reached her limit at that moment. So, there's a gap between what she meant and what I read and that was very hard to deal with during the period before she told me that. I don't think she is easily pushed off balance: I criticized her for much of an hour and a half before she said that, after a week of long intensive sessions. Also, she did *not* mention it to me at that time, but she had mentioned a while before a stressful event that week, because she had to reschedule our appointment for a funeral and travel, so I do want to cut her a little slack for that.

I think the overall reality of the situation is that there has been so much going on, I can't really hope to perfectly explain it all here, though it has been good to be able to reach out. Of course, I bring my own issues and bias to this situation, and it's just messy.

I think part of the problem may even be my own perfectionism. I find it appallingly embarassing to be rude to her, to be messy, to be unclear, to be off balance. I have a very hard time tolerating my imperfections, so it's not just that she has maybe made a mistake, but that she sees me feeling very flawed and reactive right now, such as when she mentioned my devaluing her was a trait of borderline (she was very clear to say I didn't have it) and that was the final clue that made the lightbulb go on in her head as to what type of structure might help me, DBT.

So, it's my issue perhaps too, that having her having associated anything negative with me makes me want to pretty much curl up in shame and die. I really really have a lot invested in looking well put together, and I've been letting her see the real me more and more, but for her to see the messy me, oh my, it's a very very uncomfortable feeling.

Of course, my lingering feeling is if I had concrete supports, I wouldn't feel quite so messy, sigh, catch 22.

Totally. I get it. But she shouldn't reach her limit in session. My T once detailed for me SOME of what she does to make sure that she can be there for me (and all her clients) and to ensure that her issues don't bleed into my sessions too much. She does her own therapy, she limits her work hours, she makes sure she is rested and fed etc.

It shouldn't be so easy to push her buttons. Ifyou had said "F-you! I'm going to come to your house and burn it down and kidnap your children!" that would be another story...

I mean we make fun of T's all the time for saying stuff like "this is a loaded issue for you, you're feeling ______ that I _____. I'm so glad you feel safe/comfortable telling me this. Now I know____..." and all that T-speak. But there's a reason for that. That's T saying "I hear you and I hear that you're upset and I care but I'm strong enough to take your feelings and have a good enough Teflon armor that you're anger/rudeness/whatever doesn't stick to me. I have enough professional distance from you not to get emotionally drawn in to your issues. I am grounded enough for both of us and can keep this safe for you."

If T's regularly getting her buttons pushed she can't keep the process safe for you.

Leah, it sounds like you are inclined to overlook her unskillful actions if she owns them and apologizes. It sounds like you are inclined to give her the benefit of the doubt under the many difficult circumstances and see if the good things you detailed above can be regained. Is that correct?

And how true is that if she does not apologize, does not own what she said and did/didn't do, or can't see the situation close to the way that you do?

I just finished a useful two-hour session. We spent the first part in silence: I really needed some safe quiet time, my nerves are completely shot. We got to talking and exploring, and we had to work through what "sorry" meant to me, and what it meant to her, and I am glad we learned more about each other in that conversation. I felt it was healing.

And then she apologized.

I took a quiet moment to appreciate that, and trust it. After that, it was much easier to open up to her about how I was feeling now, and how trying a time I've been having. She respected my wishes, and near the end, she led me through a very wonderful DBT exercise where I imagined something in a guided visualization, and I was just really glad she was there for me to do that, and reassure me of her caring and respect for me.

I am really glad I went to therapy today. My stress, scale of 1-10 is usually around a 5. It was at an 8 this morning, I think I'm closer to 6 post-session, and am really glad for that progress, like maybe a little more hopeful that if I can just get some rest, it will help now, as trying to rest the last few days has been an exercise in frustration.

Sounds like a good job by both of you : )

Sounds good. Thanks for letting us know. Perhaps now is the time to rest and replenish yourself.

Therapists are perfect!

Madame T talked about the "good enough mother".
She wasn't.