Are they all so persistent in trying to get you to come back?

I believe he is acting with your best interests here. Once you've told your t you've decided to leave with no ambiguity, then they'll respect your wishes and not contact you. Ts in a hospital or group practice setting are more likely to take a formal approach to termination and so long as you seem safe, will leave the ball in your court. But your situation is very different. He is in a solo practice, you've expressed intense transference with him, and your behavior with him (from what your emails say) have been somewhat erratic. So looking at your situation now, I think his reaction was very good. He's not trying to convince you to do anything, he wants to make sure you are ok with what transpired in your sessions. You weren't direct in your emails, so he wants to be sure your making the decision for the right reasons and don't have any unresolved business. You read so much into everything he does (the smile, the colon after your name in emails) that I'm still inclined to lean towards a closure session and then a clean break. It's great you found this new T and think its wise to stay with a female. I hope it works out for you :-)

Ooooooooook. I GET it. I'm a wreck, I'm erratic, I'm out of my head, I overanalyze everything.

I can see he's just doing the right thing and also likely covering his *** at the same time.

I'm of two minds about things. If I agree to a closure session, I am fearful I'll go in there and frankly? SOB. Just cry. Cry cry cry cry cry.

And it will change nothing. I have to go. I have to move on, for my THERAPY'S sake.

If I don't go, I have this deep seeded fear, I might...regret it somehow, or worse, still think of him.

So are you going for closure?

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Coltran, each time I read your posts I wonder....who do you need to convince?

I get this feeling that you are trying to convince someone, maybe yourself, you are better off with another T? IDK. Your feelings are just that, feelings. It's okay, and quite normal, to cry. This isn't about your T, it's about what HE represents to you. It also might be a little fear....that this could really be IT. If you don't reach out to him, he has made it clear, he won't contact you again. Your tears might be of genuine sadness.

It's okay if it's too painful with this T and you need to change to a new T.

There is no right or wrong answer here. No one's going to laugh at you. Only YOU know what's best for you. Regardless of what you choose, I would (gently) encourage you to make an appointment with your old T for one or two final sessions to wrap it all up.

coltranfanatic - I could have written this post, except my therapist didn't contact me. I wish she would have. Everything else, though, I completely relate to. I ended up seeing the new T exclusively for 10 weeks. About five weeks in, I was really missing my original T and our relationship. In the end, I went back to my original T and am glad I did. I hope you determine what's best for you soon - good luck.

Umm...I'm sorry but the only person who knows what's good for you is YOU. Doesn't matter what other people think sounds beneficial to you. Only you know the whole, 360 degree situation involving your experience, feelings, emotions, etc. And you are completely right, even if a therapist is a complete saint, you don't have any sort of obligation to be "fair" to them. You are paying them, end of story. If the service was free of charge, sure, be fair.

Sounds like you had a great experience with this new therapist. Glad that it feels good and I hope that continues! I personally would respond to my old T just to say I have already worked it out. Nothing is set in stone at this point.

I don't know yet. I'm ambivalent.

Helplessly Hopeful, I DID let him know I was all set on the therapist front, which sounds strangely like a twisted version of "All Quiet on the Western Front!" LOL!

And yes, there is en totem expression all around here as to what's best for me. I keep thinking, like...what the hell would I say during a closure session? "Hi there, well seeing as how this is our last session and I'll likely never see you beyond this point, here's the deal.....I want you, this want has been a culminating heat that is now clouding my judgement and my ability to think straight. All reason is going to ****. I want to **** you wildly and then never see you again. I've been feeling this way forever. I don't love you, I could never love you, I have no interest in loving you, or worshipping you, or the likes, it's very simple. I just want your ****. And I want to suck on your bottom lip, I wanna play with that for a few hours.

And then I never want to see you again. Oh sure, I like you. I used to eat boys like you for breakfast. You'd be cool to hang out with, but that's not...really necessary?????"

I CAN'T SAY THAT!!!!!

Or worse, mumbly, trip over my words version..

"So ummmm (fidgets) like as this is to be the last time I see you, I just really want to say ummm that I am very sorry to be...leaving you, I'm sorry if I"m costing you anything, and I really think you're very nice, very smart, and I'm really sorry, I am also sorry I seem to have this transference crush that distracts me so as to be rendered useless around you, cause you're just...so.....sexy?"

EWWWWW....I CAN'T SAY THAT!!!!

What THE HELL WOULD I SAY???? That's the big problem. 50 minutes of goodbye???? Really? How would I do this?

If anyone has been in my shoes, what did you say on the last day?

I feel it is best for you, to go with the first scenario. I think everyone will really benefit. Because obviously you would have to post EXACTLY how it went. lol I could definitely see how it is pointless. Especially when it is romantic/erotic transference making you leave. If you have a deeply emotional connection with your therapist, I could see how a closure session is necessary and may be helpful. But you are right, what would you say? For 50 minutes?

Why don't you ask your ex-T what would normally be discussed in a termination session? It's a fair question.

I have not been in individual therapy for a long time, like nearly a decade, but my husband and I recently "graduated" couples therapy. The last session was all about recapping the skills we'd learned, recounting our progress, and talking about the importance of continuing to practice our new tools. T normalized the future setbacks that will inevitably occur and helped us develop a plan for addressing them. He invited us to give feedback, and he let us know that his door was always open (via email, phone, or in-person sessions) if we needed him. This T was truly remarkable, so of course we thanked him very deeply.

From what I recall, past individual termination sessions were more or less the same: an opportunity to reflect on where you were and where you are now, a chance to get anything you need to say off your chest, a plan for seeking support when you need it, and a goodbye.

(For what it's worth, I experienced transference toward our marriage therapist early on. I felt asinine. I mean, here I am trying to work on my marriage, and I develop a crush on our therapist? Is that counterproductive or what?

Ultimately I decided not to disclose the transference with T. It wasn't due to lack of trust or a sense of shame. Rather, the nature of our work was short-term, concrete, and couples-based, not psycho-dynamic and individual. My transference didn't seem to keep us from making progress. Also, I'd banished my demons a very long time ago, or at least stripped them of their power, and I'd been stable and highly functional for a very long time. There didn't seem to be much point to digging up the past.

But I did tell my husband, who was really understanding, supportive, and not threatened in the slightest. The act of sharing with my husband removed some of my imagined 'stigma' of transference and actually brought us closer together. So, something positive came out of it.)

One more thing. This probably speaks more to your post about your experience right before terminating and right after. Therapy isn't a walk in the park. When it's working right, you're going to be a mess, at least for a while. It's like cleaning your house -- you've got to drag stuff out and dump it in the middle of the floor before everything can be put back together again.

So yeah, when you're doing therapy right, you're going to cry. And cry. And cry some more. It's going to be raw and you're going to feel like you're bleeding and walking around with open wounds. You're going to feel weak and pathetic, and you're going to wonder if you're crazy for intentionally putting yourself through all this pain. Sometimes it's going to hurt so much that you'll wonder if you're losing your mind.

And then one day, you'll start to heal and you'll start coming together again, stronger and better than before.

There are no short cuts. If you want change, one way or another, you've got to work through the pain.

I left mine on a really bad note, in tears and arguing. I gave him several chances (as people here on PC had suggested to others) to work things out with me but he refused (how sad is that?). It was one of the worst experiences of my life because I suffered long after and still suffer because of what went down.

It doesn't have to 50 minutes... My last session took 25 minutes, we both said what we wanted and that was it... In my case, I think it was helpful - probably my T was not extremely happy with my choice but he accepted it... After such a session it was easier for me to move on, like I finished one chapter so I don't have to think about it anymore and I can start another chapter without any distraction...

I can't remember my last visit with my p'doc in 2004. I do remember wanting to pitch a brick through his window. His letter to my new p'doc referred to me as she. Seeing my new p'doc was wonderful. I could really connect.

Do whatever you need to move along.

Best Wishes.

I still suffer too. It's front and center stage in my current therapy. I can't believe how impactful and demonstrative this has been in my life over the past 10 years. Closure is very important. But everyone's situation is different and had I gone on to a different therapist right away, maybe it wouldn't have been such a problem.

You know that the erotic transference you're having is an expected part of the process right? Normal, and something it's typically important to work through?

That is not to say you have to do that, obviously, but I just want to make sure you know that this is a natural part of therapy, not some atypical experience.

The things you described saying to him are basically the real work of therapy, to acknowledge your feelings honestly, which will lessen them, and to understand the deeper root of the feelings and take that knowledge into your other relationships and be more fulfilled. To stop projecting and share your reality with him so you can take the charge out of it.

One would like tho think! My ET borders on obsession sometimes. I had it under control for awhile and things were great but now I'm relapsing, you might say. BUT, I'm so glad I told him even though now I find myself in a bit of a rupture with him. I don't have to carry the burden anymore and I can hold on to hope that we might be able to work though it. Besides, my T has never turned his back on me - I'm projecting these thoughts onto him and I know it.

All this to say that I still think (and this is just my humble opinion) that Coltrane should go back for a final session. Not to stay so much as close the wound by sharing her honest experience (he's probably heard it before) and maybe put things into perspective before starting up with her new T. I fear you might not regret it now but that you might regret not having closure later, and by then it might be too late to go back.

Hello again-

I will say again that yes, transference is a common occurrence in therapy-as it is in all relationships. The difference is that in therapy it is, because of the dynamics of the therapy relationship, typically much more intense and often crazy-making. But that is also one of the confusing and frustrating parts-as common as transference is in therapy it is not nearly as common to find a therapist who knows how to help to make it a useful and beneficial situation for the client. In fact, the therapist can make things much worse and, at times, damaging. This isn't always the case and if people have been fortunate to have a therapist who helped them to work through an intense transference that is wonderful. I'm just saying-it does not always happen that way.
As for the closing session-Coltrane, I think you need to ask yourself what it is that you want to get from it. It is about you, and what you need-not your therapist. So, what would be the benefit to you for returning for the session? If it would be helpful for you to say things and get things off your chest it might be good for you to go but do you think that retuning for another session would make it even more difficult to make a permanent break-if that is what you want to do? And, you don't have to meet with the prior therapist right away, do you? Maybe you could wait for awhile, as you acclimate with the new therapist. Just a thought.

You bring up, as does everyone here a lot of good points, and I'm considering them, believe me.

Crimson brings up a very acute point, what do I want to GET from that closure. That's the part that's cloudy to me. I don't actually....know.

When I met this new T, the one thing that struck me instantly was that she had the very type of personality/dynamic that I knew would be GOOD for me in therapy. She's very warm and bubbly in a way that makes me instantly smile, the way I smile at...cute adorable people. She immediately radiates this warmth and it puts you at EASE. My T that I'm suffering my transference with, it occurred to me, that his personality is not wonderful for me for the therapeutic process. He's cool. Charming admittedly, and sexy, he's a touch aloof, very dry, very sardonic, and very controlled. That's hard to open up to. It turns me on, but it doesn't open me up.

So if I turn up there, on the last day of our acquaintance as Sinead O' Connor once famously sang, while I know it's for MY benefit to close it out, I know it's unavoidable that the majority of the subject matter is going to be about HIM. I have to wonder, is that...really going to achieve closure, or is that just going to create debate, which is what I'd been avoiding all the time, sadly.

I understand everyone's points about how facing one's fears is crucial to progression in life. Facing my transference issues with the subject of said transference, or minimally, the catalyst for them, and working through it with said person, is a challenge, and for some one worth doing. I do not feel that the dynamic (sorry if I'm overusing that word) I have with the current T is the right dynamic for this, especially if I come full force and describe in depth what it feels like to sit across from him, with my lower half on fire, my heart pounding, my mouth dry, and the likes. I also feel this has now dominated so much of my therapy, that it's actually taking up too much space in the overall part of the sky, there is a LOT for me to air out, and I can't even get past how much I want him, so it's actually counterproductive for me.

I've rehearsed what I'd say during this closure meeting, that "while I think our personalities are complimentary if we were social, I think they are perpendicular to the therapeutic process for what I need." Stuff like that. And I'd say that, and I'd hope it wouldn't spark debate. I am definitely going to leave. I am definitely going to have therapy with the new T.

So the only two things I can think of to get from closure, is fear-facing and condolences. I would say I was sorry for it not working out, and that I hope he doesn't take it personally, that in the end, I'm saving us both from a dynamic that could get potentially very harmful in the long run, mostly to me. It's a very expensive goodbye, and I'm wondering, is it really going to CHANGE me in any way? It might! I might walk out of there, and feel like a weight lifted and I'm free, or I might walk out of there feeling like I wasted my time, or worse, I might walk out of there feeling like I'm walking away from an experience I wanted badly, but couldn't have, which I mean I knew I couldn't have it anyway, but...I don't want to walk out of there feeling like.......defeated, you know?

Well someone's it feels good to hear someone say " no ,don't go"
It can feel validating and it can make you feel like someone cares enough to try and get you to stay .
Sometimes I'll say I'm ready to go when there is an awkward silence or if the topic is anxiety provoking however deep down I don't want to go. I want to stay for a long time but I know my T will say
" one option is to leave but another option is to stay and we can work through something's to make you feel more comfortable"
And that helps me.

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I so understand what you're saying here and I feel for you and can identify with your feelings. The difference in the eroctic transference I feel for my pdoc is exactly what you stated: even though he is cool, he is sexy, he has the looks of an actor...he has all that. But it never becomes a part of how I relate to him in session. I may fantasize, maybe even obsess sometimes. But it still never enters the real life relationship I have with him. I do tell him things, embarrassing things I wouldn't tell other people. I don't hold back from him. Sure when he's extra friendly I may feel a little warm inside, and if he's having an off day, I'm disappointed. But that's where it ends.

I'm repeating myself, I know, but what I see between you and your T is the dynamics of attraction and how much it can mess with you. When I first saw my pdoc I hung on to every word he said, analyzed every look, just like you! That's the stuff of infatuation. I did work through it on my own and still have my moments but I've pretty much backed off, mainly because of the talk I had with him which was not nearly as intense as what you shared. So we can call what you're having transference that needs to be worked through, and it very well may need to be worked through since it triggers so much in you. But NOT with him. You really really like him. Regardless of the transference part of this, it really could be as simple as that. So because of this the only person who can really decide how to proceed regarding a "closure" session with him. I actually don't think there is a right or wrong answer here, it's really whatever makes you feel peaceful in the end. Since you have a new T, you can hold off a littel and see how you feel. It may be that "out of sight, out of mind" may be what's best for you here. But maybe not. But you don't need to be pressured or rushed. Just take it day by day and see how you feel. Hugs to you

Or it could really really be transference, or like defenses working overtime, to make sure she doesnt change. Why are these sexual feelings being treated as if they are so dangerous? What does it mean when she says she might feel defeated? Her defenses will be defeated? Is that such a bad thing? Again, im not speaking sexually but psychologically.

Oops 6 pm time for the real mccoys - time to relive MY childhood - and not in a good way!

I don't think coltrane's sexual feelings are dangerous per she, although they could be if they are interfering with daily functioning, not to mention the relationship with her husband. Psychologically this kind of situation may beetter to work out with a different person. When you want someone but can't have them, thats hard and it may be too much for some people. But only coltrane knows that. A closure with him might certainly be nice but if she doesn't want it I don't think it will be harmful either.

I have to ask that people here stop talking bout me like I'm in not in the room. LOL!

Nothing is interfering with me and the hubby btw.

Sorry about that!

Sorry me too.