Home Menu

Menu


Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #26  
Old Jun 08, 2014, 09:59 PM
Lauliza's Avatar
Lauliza Lauliza is offline
Grand Magnate
 
Member Since: Nov 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 3,231
Quote:
Originally Posted by My kids are cool View Post
But when the T has been informed it is perceived as a challenge or hostility and then chooses to continue to engage in the behavior, I think it DOES become a challenge or hostility, regardless of whether or not it was initially intended that way. If the challenge is not one the client can or is prepared to overcome, then I think the client is entitled to seek help elsewhere.

And I just don't agree that Granite's T has been particularly flexible. She shuts down Granite's most effective method of communication. Granite has made huge progress, but that was due to Granite's huge efforts to overcome the barriers her T was putting up to Granite's best methods of communicating. That is just my opinion, obviously, but that is the way I have seen it.

The way it sounds from Granite's post is that her T is silent and Granite perceives that as hostile. Unless she is silent when she should be talking (like after being asked a question), then her behavior is to the majority of people, benign. Granite's T doesn't change her behavior because that's not what would happen in the real world. If a t adapts their behavior to accommodate how a client may perceive it, then I don't see how that is helpful, or always even possible. A different client may perceive too many questions as hostile, a T can only adapt her own way of interacting so much. I think of therapy as a safe place to acknowledge our challenges and learn new ways of perceiving and coping with them. We can't expect other people to change behaviors that society in general accepts because we experience them differently. Philosophically this may not seem fair, and maybe it isn't. But it is the reality and one or those instances where you just have to accept it. I think that is
Thanks for this!
rainboots87, unaluna

advertisement
  #27  
Old Jun 08, 2014, 10:14 PM
stopdog stopdog is offline
underdog is here
 
Member Since: Sep 2011
Location: blank
Posts: 35,154
The second therapist I see asked me if I needed more talk from her or less/more distance or less distance/ sitting facing each other or sideways and so forth - so she asked what would help me and was willing to modify for me until my anxiety went down some. So I do believe some are more willing than others to modify their approach to help a client. With the second, because she helped, my anxiety went down a lot in a few months. With the first one I see, it is still fairly high after 4 years and I believe any reduction is due to the second therapist and not the first.
__________________
Please NO @

Selfishness is not living as one wishes to live, it is asking others to live as one wishes to live.
Oscar Wilde
Well Behaved Women Seldom Make History - Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
Pain is inevitable. Suffering is optional.
Thanks for this!
Lauliza
  #28  
Old Jun 08, 2014, 10:39 PM
CantExplain's Avatar
CantExplain CantExplain is offline
Big Poppa
 
Member Since: Oct 2011
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 19,616
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lauliza View Post
The way it sounds from Granite's post is that her T is silent and Granite perceives that as hostile. Unless she is silent when she should be talking (like after being asked a question), then her behavior is to the majority of people, benign. Granite's T doesn't change her behavior because that's not what would happen in the real world. If a t adapts their behavior to accommodate how a client may perceive it, then I don't see how that is helpful, or always even possible. A different client may perceive too many questions as hostile, a T can only adapt her own way of interacting so much. I think of therapy as a safe place to acknowledge our challenges and learn new ways of perceiving and coping with them. We can't expect other people to change behaviors that society in general accepts because we experience them differently. Philosophically this may not seem fair, and maybe it isn't. But it is the reality and one or those instances where you just have to accept it. I think that is
The "real world" argument is very popular but I am not convinced. Therapy is not the real world. It wouldn't work if it were.

To bring the "real world" into the therapy space is a pretty good definition of therapeutic challenge.

(This post toned down in the interest of good manners.)
__________________
Mr Ambassador, alias Ancient Plax, alias Captain Therapy, alias Big Poppa, alias Secret Spy, etc.

Add that to your tattoo, Baby!
  #29  
Old Jun 08, 2014, 10:40 PM
CantExplain's Avatar
CantExplain CantExplain is offline
Big Poppa
 
Member Since: Oct 2011
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 19,616
Quote:
Originally Posted by stopdog View Post
The second therapist I see asked me if I needed more talk from her or less/more distance or less distance/ sitting facing each other or sideways and so forth - so she asked what would help me and was willing to modify for me until my anxiety went down some. So I do believe some are more willing than others to modify their approach to help a client. With the second, because she helped, my anxiety went down a lot in a few months. With the first one I see, it is still fairly high after 4 years and I believe any reduction is due to the second therapist and not the first.
Which one is "The Woman"?
__________________
Mr Ambassador, alias Ancient Plax, alias Captain Therapy, alias Big Poppa, alias Secret Spy, etc.

Add that to your tattoo, Baby!
  #30  
Old Jun 08, 2014, 10:42 PM
stopdog stopdog is offline
underdog is here
 
Member Since: Sep 2011
Location: blank
Posts: 35,154
The one with whom it is still fairly high.
__________________
Please NO @

Selfishness is not living as one wishes to live, it is asking others to live as one wishes to live.
Oscar Wilde
Well Behaved Women Seldom Make History - Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
Pain is inevitable. Suffering is optional.
Thanks for this!
CantExplain
  #31  
Old Jun 08, 2014, 11:59 PM
Perna's Avatar
Perna Perna is offline
Pandita-in-training
 
Member Since: Sep 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 27,289
Quote:
Originally Posted by granite1 View Post
I just wish that she didn't do things to make me feel that way if she knows that something will.
I get the problems with silence. I talked about it with my T 10+ years after we had had several years of silence problems and she replied, "I wish you had let me know, I would have said something". Of course, at the time, that was my problem, I could not speak, was locked inside my own head, debating my imagination and learning the truth of why I could not beat my way out of a wet paper bag.

I don't know if your T can tell every time she is silent how you feel or, ahead of time if "this" time you will feel a particular way. How long exactly does she have to be silent? I would think all of that could change or be different depending on what else is going on? Maybe you can make a bit of a game of it and try to tally when you feel T is angry with you and when it is "okay" and what the differences are/feel like? Maybe saying out loud, "You're angry at me again, aren't you?" will get a bit of a discussion going and get rid of that feeling? It could be that she only understands after you all have hashed out that particular session and how you responded, not beforehand like she can plan and control you?

My T and I discussed body language once too, and she immediately explained she does not even try to do much with body language, she has enough just understanding speech/the conversation/words.
__________________
"Never give a sword to a man who can't dance." ~Confucius
  #32  
Old Jun 09, 2014, 09:13 AM
unaluna's Avatar
unaluna unaluna is offline
Elder Harridan x-hankster
 
Member Since: Jun 2011
Location: Milan/Michigan
Posts: 42,241
I didnt get that the t was being silent. I thought it was more that granite wasnt focusing or whatever on what the t was saying. Its hard to stay present and listen to what the other person is saying, instead of going off into your own head. I used to get mad at my t for talking AT ALL. Like what right did he have to talk during MY session? Thats a little different, but now it is more of a two-way conversation.
  #33  
Old Jun 09, 2014, 09:32 AM
Anonymous37917
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lauliza View Post
The way it sounds from Granite's post is that her T is silent and Granite perceives that as hostile. Unless she is silent when she should be talking (like after being asked a question), then her behavior is to the majority of people, benign. Granite's T doesn't change her behavior because that's not what would happen in the real world. If a t adapts their behavior to accommodate how a client may perceive it, then I don't see how that is helpful, or always even possible. A different client may perceive too many questions as hostile, a T can only adapt her own way of interacting so much. I think of therapy as a safe place to acknowledge our challenges and learn new ways of perceiving and coping with them. We can't expect other people to change behaviors that society in general accepts because we experience them differently. Philosophically this may not seem fair, and maybe it isn't. But it is the reality and one or those instances where you just have to accept it. I think that is

I disagree. I cannot think of anyone in normal society who will sit there in silence and just stare at a person who is obviously in distress and struggling to speak. If a distressed person clearly was having trouble speaking and tried to communicate with me in writing, I would accept that writing and read it and not refuse to deal with the communication until the other person read it out loud to me. I consider myself something of a hardass and even I would not refuse written communication.
Thanks for this!
CantExplain
  #34  
Old Jun 09, 2014, 10:57 AM
stopdog stopdog is offline
underdog is here
 
Member Since: Sep 2011
Location: blank
Posts: 35,154
Thinking more on this, I interviewed one therapist, who in response to my asking how she could help with my anxiety at appointments, said she would try all sorts of things and gave an example of one person with whom she sat next to and they emailed each other for months until the person could talk to her. They were in the same room and could see each other, but the client couldn't talk so they wrote until she could. She was not for me for other reasons, but this showed she was willing to work with a client who had trouble with talking to her.
__________________
Please NO @

Selfishness is not living as one wishes to live, it is asking others to live as one wishes to live.
Oscar Wilde
Well Behaved Women Seldom Make History - Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
Pain is inevitable. Suffering is optional.
Thanks for this!
CantExplain, growlycat
  #35  
Old Jun 09, 2014, 03:15 PM
unaluna's Avatar
unaluna unaluna is offline
Elder Harridan x-hankster
 
Member Since: Jun 2011
Location: Milan/Michigan
Posts: 42,241
Interesting. Is it about form or content? And does it switch back and forth?
  #36  
Old Jun 09, 2014, 03:21 PM
Perna's Avatar
Perna Perna is offline
Pandita-in-training
 
Member Since: Sep 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 27,289
Hankster, please define "it" :-) Talk/silence? And, at whom are you speaking/wondering out loud (speaking of wandering off into one's own head)?
__________________
"Never give a sword to a man who can't dance." ~Confucius
  #37  
Old Jun 09, 2014, 03:32 PM
unaluna's Avatar
unaluna unaluna is offline
Elder Harridan x-hankster
 
Member Since: Jun 2011
Location: Milan/Michigan
Posts: 42,241
Quote:
Originally Posted by Perna View Post
Hankster, please define "it" :-) Talk/silence? And, at whom are you speaking/wondering out loud (speaking of wandering off into one's own head)?
"It" is the "this" of the thread title. And i'm posing the question to the ether. Actually to the poster just before stopdog, kinda. Not so much what stopdog posted.
  #38  
Old Jun 09, 2014, 05:55 PM
Lauliza's Avatar
Lauliza Lauliza is offline
Grand Magnate
 
Member Since: Nov 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 3,231
Quote:
Originally Posted by My kids are cool View Post
I disagree. I cannot think of anyone in normal society who will sit there in silence and just stare at a person who is obviously in distress and struggling to speak. If a distressed person clearly was having trouble speaking and tried to communicate with me in writing, I would accept that writing and read it and not refuse to deal with the communication until the other person read it out loud to me. I consider myself something of a hardass and even I would not refuse written communication.
Maybe I misunderstood then. I thought the T had times when she was quiet in the moment and the silence was being perceived as something very different.
I didn't understand that the T sat there continuing to be quiet while she could see she was clearly in distress. If that's the case then that is different. But Ts do often sit quietly if a client isn't talking. If that is upsetting and the client expresses this then the reasons behind that should be discussed.
Thanks for this!
CantExplain
Reply
Views: 3470

attentionThis is an old thread. You probably should not post your reply to it, as the original poster is unlikely to see it.




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:59 PM.
Powered by vBulletin® — Copyright © 2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.




 

My Support Forums

My Support Forums is the online community that was originally begun as the Psych Central Forums in 2001. It now runs as an independent self-help support group community for mental health, personality, and psychological issues and is overseen by a group of dedicated, caring volunteers from around the world.

 

Helplines and Lifelines

The material on this site is for informational purposes only, and is not a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis or treatment provided by a qualified health care provider.

Always consult your doctor or mental health professional before trying anything you read here.