Insinuated child abuse and that intern

Blah

This might be a little long. I need to talk about it and I don't know if I can bring it up to the intern tomorrow. This will probably also be triggering for abuse.

So, I played a gig Friday night. It was for an extremely wealthy man's dinner party celebrating his son's swimming accomplishment. We knew it would be a weird gig because we had played for the patron previously, but throughout the night, we got pretty bad vibes. Before we even left, I joked with my best friend that she should wear a super low cut shirt so we get more tips. She has abnormally large breasts and got hit on by someone at the last gig we did for him so it was kind of a running joke we had in the quartet. Right after we arrived, we talked to the patron about the plan for the night. After he left us to set up, my friend laughed that I was totally right because the patron was apparently staring at her chest a lot despite the fact that she wore a high cut dress.

After all of the guests had found their seats, they went around the room and talked about the process of training the 11 year old boy for this event. Apparently, he swam 120 miles and his coaches and parents were talking about pushing him and "some days, he didn't want to train but we pushed him and he got through it". I felt super uncomfortable and triggered just imagining what pushing an 11 year old to do something so extreme would entail. My friend felt the same way about the situation and knew I probably was struggling so she leaned over and told me to count the number of glasses on the table which distracted me.

At the end of the party, the patron came up to us, clearly quite intoxicated, and started laughing with us that he told his son that he'll "swim it or he'll die". He then said he didn't have enough cash to pay us and pointed at my best friend and asked her to come back to his house on Monday and he'll give her the money. I interjected and asked him to write me a check and I'll handle dividing it up which is what ended up happening.

I just can't stop thinking about how awful all of that seemed. I can't tell if it just seemed super awful because I'm super sensitive to all of that or if it actually was as bad as what was implied. So much was left to the imagination. I can't stop thinking about that kid. I can't stop imagining what he might be going through or what his father might be doing to him. I don't think we have enough info at all to file a CPS report. The swimming feat the boy did wasn't exactly kept quiet and I feel like there isn't much anyone can do to stop a parent from overworking their kid like that without any actual evidence of any physical abuse. I don't know if a threat (swim or die) a drunk man made to some outside people after his son was in bed is enough. It's possible that the kid wanted to swim and was just super driven that but I think about myself at 11 years old and my little brother and the kids I've worked with and 120 miles of ocean and I just... I can't figure out how that is normal or okay. I keep wanting to rescue him because I remember being 11 years old, staring out the window, wishing someone would save me so vividly I sometimes forget that it isn't happening again. I also still can't figure out how much I am allowing my own memories to affect my perception of this. I have never even seen the two interact.

I need to talk about this to put myself at ease. I'm seeing the new intern later today and I know I should talk about this, but I don't know if I can. I don't want her to probe for why I am triggered by this. She knows I have PTSD but she doesn't know what happened or why I have the diagnosis. I don't feel comfortable talking about what happened to her. She tries to weasel her way into getting me to tell her all the time and I know that if I talk about this, she'll use it to ask about how it relates to me. The fact that she always asks makes me feel even less comfortable with the idea of telling her anything. I feel like she needs to wait for me.

I don't know what to do in either situation. I feel like something needs to be done but I don't know where the true story ends and my story begins. I feel like I need to not waste my time with another pointless session with that stupid intern but I hate her so much and don't feel comfortable saying anything. I tried switching but her supervisor is awful and won't let me.

Growli, what a sad story. I really feel for that little boy, 120 miles of ocean
Well done for finding good coping strategies at the gig, and supporting your friend. I can see how it has been very triggering, and I think you're right to identify that you feel the need to rescue the little boy because no-one rescued you.
Could you talk to the intern, and say it really doesn't help if she starts digging, that you need time just to say stuff with no agenda? Maybe you could say that you need to tell her something but you don't want a response, then say what you've posted here. If she's an intern, she is learning too, and needs feedback from you to get it right for you.
hugs xxx

Well, I was not about to let anything happen to her. I'm again over sensitive to that issue as well, but I don't think that's something to ever mess around with. She told me she wouldn't have gone back to that house anyway without me and the guys so that's good.

Yeah LCM wants me to tell her that I hate her. I don't feel comfortable telling her that. Giving feedback to people I don't know or feel safe enough to get upset with is difficult for me especially when it pertains to something I feel should be obvious. If it were LCM or my old school T, I would have no problem telling her to shut up.

Another one of my friends also goes through the interns at the school. I complained to her about the situation involving this annoying intern. Her response to hearing my rant was "awww sounds like someone misses their old T". And I wonder how much of that is true. I see her in the same room I saw old school T in and she has me sit in the wrong chair. The chair old school T used to sit in.

Isnt that like swimming to Cuba? I would think the kid did it in a summer swimming program, not all at once. And you guys did well at protecting yourselves from the creepy patron.

I don't think the situation is as you interpreted it to be, with the 11 year old swimming 120 miles in one day. That is very close to what only the very best adult long distance ocean swimmers have done, and that kind of swim takes the hourly equivalent of 4 days without stopping. If an 11 year old really did that kind of swim, it would be all over the news. More likely, he did that distance over weeks. I also find it difficult to imagine that a parent-- even a "tiger mother" in overdrive-- could force a child to do that unless he really wanted to. That is not to say that abused children cannot be manipulated for the parents' needs-- but honestly, that doesn't sound like the kind of thing a parent would push for unless the kid wanted it.

I would really encourage you to use how you felt about it-- because whether or not you are perfectly accurate about what the situation was isn't important-- but the feelings that it brought up in you as they relate to your own experience of trauma do seem really important. I think that if you don't start digging into this in some way and making some progress, your trips back to your parents' home will get more and more miserable. And starting off with what you felt about the situation with a child who is a stranger to you is a very open ended way to start.

You do realize, I think, that the longer you delay working on your past traumas, the more difficult it will be for you to not massively react to the triggers in your environment. I think you could avoid trauma work if you also avoided your parents and your childhood home, but avoiding the work and not being able to diffuse triggers (which is the benefit of trauma work) is going to come crashing down on you at your next visit back.

I think you misinterpreted what the father was talking about. My neice who is on a HS swim team also did this. It is spread out over time and at least at her school, is being done to raise funds. Children involved in athletics often have to be pushed a bit at this age since practice is time consuming and hard work. This dad didn't choose his words well given that he was talking to a group of college age women and not other parents (I can imagine this probably sounded very strange to you and your friends), but there's nothing abusive there from what you wrote. HE might be overbearing or a Tiger parent, but I see nothing else to be concerned about. It is good however, that you and your friend protected yourselves when you felt uncomfortable.

I agree with Anne2.0 in that it's more important to reflect on the feelings the words of this man brought out and what that means for you. Benign commentary like this will continue to trigger you and make many potential interactions very difficult. Sharing this info with the intern T could open a useful conversation and I see no reason to share details. I am not a professional and can see how this is triggering for you without knowing details.

No he swam some channel in some sort of event. It was 120 miles in one run. Maybe he was followed by a boat and got picked up for breaks to spend the night or something but it definitely was some distance from A to B.

I haven't read any responses all the way through and I'll do that later

[EDIT] yeah it would be all over the news. Maybe he swam enough to be the length of the entire channel or he did a few hours of swimming a day over the course of a few weeks. I'm not really sure. I did jump to conclusions.

See the report of the 8 Bridge Swim this year, 31 Swimmers, 18 Kayakers, 8 Bridges, 120 Miles, 1 River. | Harris Silver , it's 120 miles over 8 consecutive days. It's described as an "elite" event with around 30 swimmers, only 2 of whom actually finished the event.

I wonder if you are in part attuned to this swimmer kid's story because it seems like he is being pushed by his parents, and you have had similar experiences growing up? I don't think it matters if the "pushiness" isn't abuse per se, as it seems to me that kids being pushed into activities or classes or schools or whatever can have significant psychological effects. It's a form of oppression, if nothing else.

This might also speak to the parent's narcisism. What the kid actually did wasnt good enough for the parents ego. I get that carp from my mother. She used to brag on me to other people, but she would lie!

This father sounds like a nut. Who knows how much he brags on his kid? I'm a former teacher and was obligated to call CPS for even suspicions. If you feel better, call them. But tell them some friends have advised you the swim could not possibly be that long all at once. Then it's off your plate and on theirs. They are used to all sorts of reports. I know you might really need the gigs, but you might skip this guy in the future.

You didn't have all the details of what the father did or didnt or what the boy did or didnt do ..

The only thing that was a certainty was how it triggered you.

Its okay that you hate your intern.. You can hate everyone you see. The only person that its going to hurt is you.The longer you put off jumping in with both feet and dealing with your past trauma is only going to make it harder each passing day for you to get on with living your life. You know all this of course. Its nice to see that you used a coping skill to handle uncomfortable things. Pat yourself on the back.

Guys, yeah I know I need to work on trauma. I'm not running away from it. I just think that it's super important that I work on it with the right person who knows what she's doing. I don't think the intern can treat this with the care it needs.

I didn't talk about it with her. I instead started ripping some paper and told her that I don't like her. She took it as me missing old school T and hating her because she's in her place. Maybe that's it but I also don't like her for her as well. She's kinda cold and clueless.

Sorry growly, I agree that an intern is not a trauma t , but at least it's a stepping stone to talk about coping skills and what to do when you are I'm distress. Honestly though , you know I hate sugar coating lol, and I don't mean disrespect , but at this point I think you are going to find something negative in whoever you meet to potentially be your t or trauma t. You will find the most minor thing and shut them out, not even giving it a real chance. This will go on and on. I think a super qualified tt great match would present herself to you, and something would be wrong.

Then , I'm not judging you , it would be a good idea to start at this point. Why are you pushing away therapists.

I hope you find someone soon.

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First, I want to say I don't see anything odd about your reaction to Creepy Dad. His behavior is what sounds odd to me, the sort of thing any normal person of perception (who wasn't also drunk on his booze) would find offensive. What he said about pushing his kid and his comments about your big busted band mate. Creepy. Offensive. Weird. Your response showed you're not numb or unempathetic. You know a creep when you meet one.

Second, your cold and clueless intern sounds fairly well tuned into your discomfort at meeting in the same room where you met old T and that you really dislike the situation. You can go ahead and ask her to change chairs with you and if the chairs aren't too heavy to even move their location in the room if that would make you feel more comfortable. There would be nothing wrong with telling her how uncomfortable it makes you and ask her to change. Expecting her to read your mind would be ineffective.

Next ... I'm a big believer in making the best use we can of whatever resources we have available to us. Your intern T is a resource. She's also a person, so when I say "use" I don't mean that in some narcissistic, mean way. I mean we can't sit around refusing help until the perfect person shows up.

Maybe you'll never want to talk about trauma work with her. Most people don't want to jump right into dealing with terrible, emotional things with someone they barely know. It takes time to build up trust. Maybe you'll never get there with this particular intern T.

But along with trauma comes dysfunctional coping skills. We get triggered way too easily and react way too badly over things that leave other people going, "What the f... is wrong with you?" Those things are going on right now, in our daily lives, and that's the sort of thing an intern can help us with if we allow them to, if we give them permission to help us and even to pry a little bit.

For instance, it's "normal" for traumatized people to not be able to name or ever accurately perceive their emotions. Learning how to do that in daily life is a skill. We have to learn it and it helps if we have someone to teach us. The intern probably can help with that.

There are some relaxation techniques we can learn to help us calm down when we feel triggered or just feeling stressed, like breathing and meditation techniques.

We often have defense mechanisms and cognitive distortions we don't recognize that leave us in an emotional heap of distress and wreak havoc with our current friendships or romances.

We have anger issues, self-care issues, panic attacks, inappropriate crushes, and on and on.

Interns who've studied in the psychology or social work department usually know about these things. Maybe not all of them, but they can teach us skills to recognize and deal with a significant number of these things in the present without ever coming close to our childhood or the traumatic events that led to our deepest wounds.

We also have a lot of surface wounds and dysfunctional coping skills we use in daily life. Learning to cope with those first can prepare us to do trauma work later on. I know from experience that it's absolute $%*! to bring up deep trauma from the past with no skills to cope with the full brain-body slam it can be. If we have no coping skills, we may need to be medicated just to get through the next 24 hours. Not optimal for getting better.

If you don't want your intern to get within a mile of your trauma it's okay. But it doesn't make any sense to refuse to let her teach you how to deal with the surface stuff that badly impacts your current daily life because she has the chairs arranged wrongly in the office you meet in.

Just something to think about. Some day you'll meet a therapist you can trust and like and who has the skills to do trauma work with you. It'll help if you're ready for that deeper work. In the meantime, use what you have. The intern. Who probably can teach you a few things if you let her.

I wish you the best, Growli.

She let me take the battery out of the clock which old school T wouldn't let me do. I was freaking out and the room looked pink like the walls in that room because of the ticking. I think I seemed crazy because I said the walls are blue again and she said what helped and I said the clock but I don't think she knew I was dissociating or having a flashback or whatever was happy. I might be craxy.

Yeah I have tones of bad coping skills like I'm pretty drunk on a Monday night alone but I can't tell her and I'm so fat I hate myself but whatever like duck it I want pizza but too fat. I had a horrible night mare my dad was gonna hurt me again in this a basement with no window but the leaves blew and the squirrels warned me and I woke up screaming and drooling a LOT.

LCM will be happy bring her I hate that damn intern.

We can talk tomorrow when you're sober. Take care and be careful.

It sounds a lot like your new T is trying, but you're not letting her.

You decided to not like her the instant that the supervisor decided you should see her instead of the initial one she had put you with. You didn't exactly give her a chance.

If you're that miserable with it and refuse to open up, ask the supervisor and explain that you felt a potential bond with the other one which you just aren't feeling with this one and ask to switch back.

I did. The supervisor said no. I gave her a chance the first session.

I think it makes perfect sense that you're not feeling comfortable talking about trauma with this new intern. But I do think that SnakeCharmer's post about using her to develop some skills you need for the long haul is a really good idea. If there are coping skills you know you need to learn, make a list of them and go in and tell her these are the things you need her to help you with. I also think it's perfectly reasonable for you to tell her that the trauma issues are off the table at this point, that you won't touch them until/when or if you ever reach a comfortable and trusting point in your relationship with her. Talk the list over with your LCM and go into your next meeting prepared and open to working on what YOU want to work on. If after six or seven sessions things are still awkward and disconnected with this intern, request another meeting with her supervisor. You'll have a lot more to back up your claim that things aren't working out if you present the list of things you requested the two of you work on and nothing is getting done. And you might be surprised, you might actually build a working relationship with this intern--it won't be the same as your other sch. therapist, but it might be helpful in one area of your life--coping skills. I hope things begin to work out for you.

I run the risk here of sounding harsh or wrong or judgmental, I apologize if I am, honestly I do. I say it wit good intentions though.

First, the big picture here is you keep pushing away every potential t or intern or social worker or ect.., whether it be because the color of the room, her voice, the chairs, the temp in the room, her hair, ect... What I'm getting at is things that can be worked out, you make them permanent and shut them out and hate them.

In my oppinion, maybe you should sit down and ask lcm why is it that you seem to push these ppl away.

I think , that as long as lcm is 100 in your therapeutic life, you are going to continue to push these people away. I'm not saying to give up lcm.

Lcm maybe should transition you to another t.

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Yeah it's not all at once, I follow swimming among other things and only one adult has done it.

I'm not pushinf anyone away. I'm allowed to genuinely not like people. That is something I am allowed in this world. In the past year, I've worked with 6 separate new T's if you count the group leader/substitute T when I was in patient. I loved 2, liked 1, was indifferent to another, and disliked 2 but gave one a genuine chance. That's 4/6 T's that I didn't dislike and 5/6 I genuinely tried with. So tell me how exactly am I pushing anyone away?

I don't understand why we have to cherry pick my posts and continuely bring up little things I might have said and cast LCM away as a damaging force. Imm sorry that you people are deathly afraid of attaching to a therapist/mental health person and think I need to get rid of any possibility for having a meaningful emotional relationship with a T. Or whatever she is. I'm never getting rid of her. Ever. Never transitioning out. Not happening. Maybe she'll leave and I'll deal with it or die but stop telling me to leave. And I'm not pushif anyone away.

Growli,

I understand that you get frustrated when it comes to peoples advice on here, but I believe 100% that everyone means well, maybe some see you headed down the road they once traveled or maybe some have just worked really hard to improve there life and want to help you.

Do you want everyone to stop offering advice? If so maybe you should label your Thread as " I just want to vent No advice needed" ? and hey that's an okay thing to do.

I'm sorry growly, like I said in the beginning of my post, I didn't mean to offend. I agree with Christina . We all have difficult pasts and presents more than others, it's up to us to decide to get stuck or try to take baby steps. I'm at baby steps, I have been through so much, pc has helped me so so much, pc is family to me, then I have t and maybe 3 friends and my higher power, my family too, but some are the cause of all of this turmoil.

I didn't mean any harm in my post towards you, but if you maybe think about it , you have accomplished stuff. As far as therapeutic though you do push away .

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You are currently putting words into people's mouths here.

We notice your behaviours over time because we read what you say and pay attention - sometimes outside perspectives notice things that the individual doesn't. And many of us appear to see you pushing away people and not giving them a chance, or find the tiniest fault and then decide you're done.

No one wants you to leave your LC. We want you to have an additional support that is actually trained and qualified to help you properly, who will have a professional boundary with you. This isn't a way to push out your LC - it would actually support that relationship because then you won't end up overwhelming your LC. Through actual therapy you can eventually tackle the hard topics that LC isn't qualified to help (and of course, no one expects you to start talking about the really hard stuff right away! that's unrealistic for anyone) but that a new therapist can also help you have a healthier relationship with LC. The fact that you feel like you could die if she left shows that it's really not all that healthy - we'd all like to see that you would in fact handle it and be able to work through that pain if it ever came to that.