DBT is very invalidating.

So, its like a classroom and I'm in 'Stage 1': I must learn skills to downregulate the intensity of my emotions.

Except most of my emotions now are caused by a discrete life problem that needs solving. And I already made myself 90% calmer and self-control self-controlled prior to the DBT sessions.

I've done psychodynamic previously and loved it, I got to choose what to speak about, gained new insight. I was seen, heard, understood and accepted. I was ok as I was, yet I improved so much.

Here in DBT I can't speak about problems freely, nor emotions. The sessions itself are invalidating: what I feel, anger and sadness, are not ok - they must be changed and modified.

Well, let's stop a minute and see if I have a reason for feeling so maybe, please?

So: is this a fault of my therapist, the method or me?

(No self harm or aggressive or suicidal behavior. Only anger and sadness caused by a deep betrayal and hurtful behavior objectively caused by someone else)

How did you end up in DBT? Can you go back to psychodynamic therapy?

I don't think this is necessarily anybody's fault - certainly not yours. DBT is a method that does not work for all people - after all, no method suits everybody. And yeah, everything I've ever heard about DBT, mostly from people who have been helped by the method, tells me that for me it would only be invalidating and probably aggravate any feelings of sadness or suicidality. So I completely understand where you're coming from.

I agree with licketysplit that it sounds as if you would probably benefit much more from returning to PDT.

Oh I was abroad studying and had the most fantastic T, now I had to move back home and psychodynamic private is too expensive, public is 25 + 25 sessions for free "only". DBT I can get for over a year.

Also there was a situation with my T abroad where she interrupted therapy, which made me go from successful independent uni student to living in a specialized treatment facility, where I now get DBT. Odd what abandonment can do :/

I'm a huge fan of DBT myself. Mine is run with group + individual sessions. So group teaches the skills and we practice them through the week. Then in group we go over how that went, get some very helpful, nonjudgmental, feedback. For issues we go to our individual therapist and work with them - so I speak very freely with my T about issues and problems. Group isn't really group therapy, it's skills and individual therapy is when I do actual therapy.

Is yours set up this way?

My several experiences with DBT were very much like yours...
I wonder what about it makes it horrific for some and wonderful for others.

I was wondering if it was set up. I was horrified when I heard how some people's groups were set up - and I suspect Linehan would be horrified too.

And that's not to say people would suddenly find it useful if were set up properly - but they might not feel so negatively against it either if that makes sense.

My impression is that it was created as one thing (by Linehan), and insurance companies latched onto it for its short-term, goal-oriented approach. New therapists could be drawn to where the reimbursements are, plus the fact that there's less skill involved in leading DBT than traditional psychotherapy. I know at least one person (newly licensed) who could not, for the life of her, do anything close to psychotherapy, but she's all aboard the DBT gravy train. I don't think they should charge as much as a counselor, but that's how the system is set up.

That said, those that practice DBT the way it was intended probably have a lot more success than these others that are making people feel so invalidated.

Yeah, I've heard that insurance companies love it - and it seriously concerns me that there are corners being cut My DBT is run through a clinic that's well known, so they have a reputation on the line. I know the Ts have regular training hours for example. I've been in two different groups (six years apart) and both have been run pretty much the same way even though it's different facilitators, so they're consistent.

Yikes and yikes and triple yikes.

this was one of my biggest problems with my DBT groups. Validity of any emotions were never acknowledged. Everything was seen as over-the-top and needing change. I think some of the programs fall into the trap of generalizing all clients to be the same. I know I find that to be true in congregate care settings where clinicians and treaters have become burnt-out. They forget that clients are individuals... They also get so mired in dispensing skills they forget that they are dealing with people, not robots...

even when I was able to ask if we could explore why I felt the way I did, I was told that I needed to moderate my reactions, and that my emotions were over-blown for the situation (even when I knew they were not as out-of-proportion as the T's made them out to be).

Insurance standards ruin a lot of standards of care...

Out here, if you want a true DBT group, you have to pay out-of-pocket. None accept any type of insurance. Then there's the individual therapists trying to run a DBT group, but aren't actually trained. Lastly, there's the clinics. Because of budget restraints, most have been modified.

Mine cut out mindfulness and mixed it throughout the other modules, and they don't have any individual Ts at all (not just for the group).

I doubt my facilitators have any real training. My guess is that they are simply following handouts? I don't know. The facilitators seem kinda stupid to me. And the handouts suck. Our homework this week was to be aware of any "blocks" in communication and write it down on the back of the handout. To me that seems extremely unstructured and very vague.

I think the problem is also that DBT was originally intended for BPD, but since the skills are useful for other diagnoses, it's been modified to encompass more types of people. Maybe it's because of this or maybe because of the population of the clinic, but I feel like the group is "dumbed down".

I'm sticking it out though. Maybe it will get better? Maybe I'll learn something new? If not, at least I will have done what my T, Pdoc, and insurance wanted me to do.

When I read posts about DBT being invalidating I get frustrated, because that's not what DBT is about. I've been in and run groups and from my perspective DBT is all about acknowledging and accepting your feelings. The point of the exercises is to teach skills some people lack so issues can be handled in a more productive, effective way. If you need individual therapy you should still see someone, since DBT is not meant to be a replacement for individual therapy. Some DBT groups are not run very well and some people might have a hard time with the class like format. If the T is leaving you feeling invalidated though, I wouldn't write off all DBT groups. I'd try to find another or get some books and try it on your own.

Yes it's the same, thanks for sharing.

You described it very well. Yes it's the same formula for everybody, so generic. I took it up with my DBT therapist and he might understand it given a bit of time.

I appreciate the advice. After discussing it with T his answer was more or less that feelings and thoughts are valid yet perhaps ineffective.
I just felt like they've thrown at me a mountain of "downregulate emotions!" orders without even asking me what happened in the first place.

Hoping for a great collaboration through dialogue.

Is individual therapy not usually a part of the DBT programme as well as the group?

IndestructibleGirl, I think that depends on the program. It was not part of the ones I tried. There were weekly individual times to meet with the goup leader, but it was mainly to check in around how we thought th egroup was going for us. I had to fight my insurance to be allowed to see my individual T while in the DBT groups. They did not want to pay for both at the same time for me...

Interesting, thank you. Gosh it really does seem to vary dramatically depending on who is running it!

I hope you managed to get your insurance to pay.

I did. And my T at the time was going to let me keep seeing hr for just the cost fo the copay if they wouldn't... but I had been such a liability, insurance agreed to pay for up to 3 individual sessions a week plus the DBT...