Violation of privacy / confidentiality by T?

First: they both sound like boneheads.

Second: I would assume that anyone who sees a therapist (including a therapist who goes for consultation or personal reasons) is going to talk about people they have issues with. So, going to your therapist's therapist is not much different than going to a friend, family member or coworker's therapist--you run the risk of having them know things about you. The problem is that this other therapist cannot seem to grasp confidentiality and your therapist was an idiot to tell you the name of his own therapist, unless he wanted this to happen.

I would stay away from both of these guys.

I think one of the issues here is that your therapist's therapist has duties to your therapist as his client. He needs to look out for his other client's (your therapist's) best interests and that may include telling your therapist about his consultation with you. I don't think your privacy or confidentiality was violated under these circumstances because you knowingly went to see this "consultation" therapist, which seems on the edge of stalker-isn to me, like going to see your therapist's wife for a GYN exam or friending your therapist's contacts on social media or otherwise inserting yourself into your therapist's own zone of privacy.

I live in a small town and I know many people my therapist knows and sometimes she lets me know that she knows them. We have seen the same acupuncturist and I've taken a short class with her wife (didn't know it was her wife until after I'd registered, but she was fine with me doing so) and other connections. There's nothing wrong with having connections with people in your therapist's life but IMO a client should not seek these out, or if one does, it should be with disclosure to one therapist or the other. If you'd be straight with consultation T, you could have discussed whether he might feel the need to disclose that you were coming to see him with your current T and you wouldn't be in this situation in the first place.

This is just the way I see it and like the PP, you may feel free to ignore my opinion, it won't bother me at all.

The other T contacted me and asked me if I wanted tne appointment. I had been talking to him because I enjoy his podcasts and his music, and my T encourages me to listen to the other T's podcasts. He also knew that I was going to the other T. I even asked him if I should go or not because I was hesitant. My T told me go to his session. And, I wasn't exclusively seeking the other T. There was another T also that I did a phone consultation with.

I feel like some peope on here are judging me.

I'm not hiding details of the facts. I had innocent motives.

I just feel very judged.

I'm sorry. I'm not judging you--I'm judging these two therapists. Even more so that your therapist encouraged you to see his therapist.

I don't judge because you did not do anything deliberate. I think you didn't think it is a big deal to see a t of your t. I really don't understand the whole arrangement and why was it encouraged?or he just suggested listening podcasts? If he actually recommended you go see his own t then he is out of his mind.

But I think it is pretty normal that your therapist talks about his clients in therapy including talking about clients being in love with them. I am not really sure why it was brought up to you and if it is unethical or not ( probably unethical) but then again how was this new t could keep seeing you?

I would certainly not see this new therapist anymore. In fact I probably wouldn't see neither one of them. I would look for new one

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I didn't feel like you judged me. Your response was spot on and perfect.

It's the comments like I'm holding something back in information and plus several other things that were said that made me feel judged.

I had been also talking to a 3rd therapist and had a session scheduled (for two hours). But I got pneumonia and didn't make it and I was too sick to call. Now, I've tried to reach him 3 times but I've gotten no response. So I probably blew it with the third T.

I would still try, either through email, or Postal. S/he might be understanding of how sick and out of sorts one can be with pneumonia.

Good luck.

I don't really understand this situation now because I feel like the facts are shifting somewhat from your first post, but I think that the main problem from the consultation T perspective is that you didn't inform him that you see one of his clients as your regular T. i think it would have been important information to share and if my saying so makes you feel "judged," that is not my intention.
My intention is to suggest that there were other choices you could have made (or not, I don't really know) that may have contributed to your hurt feelings. It seems to me that increasing one's understanding of what happened from a different point of view can be helpful to many people and if it's not to you, feel free to ignore.

I think that in general a client has an absolute or near absolute right to expect confidentiality with any T, but IMO going to see your therapist's therapist infuses the session with dual relationships that significantly alter this right.

I will cop to being a little judgey in my tone.

I have trouble believing that your motives (however unconscious) were as simple as you say. I suspect you'd have been transparent with everyone concerned from the get-go if there were zero private curiosity or stalkerish intent in seeking out your T's T.

I say this as someone who has had stalkerish impulses toward therapists and understands having intense fascination with one's T's personal life. I get it. It doesn't make you a bad person. But it is worth doing the deeply uncomfortable and often cringeworthy work of figuring out what is going on for you that you did this.

I will reiterate that keeping good boundaries is primarily the job of the therapist. Your therapist did a bad job of this and opened the door to what came next. Therapists should know that it is quite common for clients have this kind curiosity. However, regardless of what is going on for your therapist or what went on between the two therapists, I believe that it remains on you to figure out your part in this.

You do not owe this to your T, your T's T, or anyone else. You owe it to you. The next assignment in your quest for self-knowledge and understanding had been handed to you. It's yours to choose to accept it, put it away for another day or ignore it until it manifests in some other way.

Did the current T mess up or did the new one. It seems to me the NEW T messed up. If you regular T sees the other one for supervision/ect part of that is explaining things that are going on with clients etc. For the new one to say something is completely wrong.

This actually happened to me...I am NOT a T but work on a psych unit. I had a patient who really triggered me so I talked to T about it. After that when doing paperwork for the patient on my unit I realized my patient was also a client of my T. I KNEW that T was able to connect the dots but never let anything on to me.

hi hopealwazys ,
sounds like it to me hope your therapist broke the confidentiality rules between a client and counselor .the only time when a counselor is asked to share information like that is when they testify in court for a competency hearing if the client is ruled to be mentally incompetent to stand trial in court . only a psychiatrist can do that .your therapist can get his license revoked since he violated the HIPPA rules of client / counselor confidentiality with you. he is not allowed to share that information with anyone not even another therapist without written consent from you . my *****y sister wanted to know what my therapist and my psychiatrist are talking about in counseling . I told her no she may know what is going on in counseling cuz of the HIPPA laws of client/ counselor confidentiality rules .




Diagnosis: Anxiety and depression
meds: Cymbalta 60 mgs at night
Vistrail 2 25 mgs daily for anxiety prn
50 mgs at night for insomnia with an additional 25 mgs= 75 mgs when up past 1:00 in the morning

Do I have this correct?

1. You are seeing a T right now, for whom you have feelings. Your feelings for him have influenced your staying with him as your T.

2. Your T's T (TT) has a podcast he thought you might like. You listened to TT's podcast and decided to contact him.

3. You did not tell TT that you were a client of T's.

4. You did tell T that you were going to see TT, and he encouraged you to do so.

5. You went to TT to talk about George Anderson. For whatever reason, he charged you for this session (albeit at a discounted rate), despite the fact that it apparently was not about therapy or your T. This happened two months ago.

6. You are still e-mailing with TT, but you have still not told him that T is your therapist.

7. TT mentioned that you are with your current therapist because you have feelings for him. You did not tell him that you have feelings for your current therapist.

8. TT did not mention T's name (?), just that your current therapist is one you have feelings for.

9. Because you have never mentioned anything about your current therapist (?), you assume that TT knows that you are T's client.

I am with all the folks who suggested that in the event that things are as they appear to you, and that TT knows you are T's client and knows some details about your that only T does, that it is TT who has violated confidentiality (your T's). It is possible that T did as well, but even if he had accidentally done so, it's up to TT to maintain T's confidentiality since according to you, he has no reason to know that you and T are associated. It's like when I bump into my therapist in public. He does not acknowledge we know each other unless I do, even though of course he knows we know each other.

I think it's wholly possible that your T didn't break confidentiality at all, and as has been suggested previously, that between the details you gave TT, and things T may have mentioned in his own therapy, that TT has put it together. But it's also possible that he did break it entirely -- it's hard to know now, but it would be very plausible to me that he actually didn't.

Things that aren't clear to me:

- In what context did TT say that you had feelings for your current therapist? Can you ask him why he said it? Is it possible he drew that conclusion from other things you said?

- Did he use T's name? Again, is it possible he drew a conclusion based on stuff he knows about your therapy, without realizing that your therapist is T? I'm just really confused by this.

- Do you talk to TT about more than just George Anderson, or was this mention of therapy completely out of the blue?

- Why didn't you tell TT that you were T's client? I'm not saying it's your fault or judging you, I am just curious. I can imagine a few reasons, but it does seem a little odd to me.

- Why did TT charge you for a session that wasn't therapy? If it WAS therapy, why didn't he ask you if you area currently seeing a therapist? I've never seen a therapist who didn't ask me if I was already working with someone else, and if so, who. I've also never had to pay someone to talk about a life experience, like seeing a medium.

All of this makes me feel a little creeped out by TT. Less so by T, although it was not terribly bright of him to tell you who his therapist was, much less encourage you to see him. I can't say I'd be in favor of continuing to interact with either one.

I was under impression he encouraged listening to a podcast not actually make appointment and start therapy with the same therapist he is seeing. It is just too bizarre if he said "my t is so and so and its good idea you go see him too "

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Did you sign a consent form for them to talk to each other? If not then yes, it's a violation of privacy.

They talk to each other because one is the therapist of the other. Of course they talk to each other.

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