I told T women scare me

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MzJelloFluff said:
how do any of the women here feel about being "scary" to others? just wondering...

Miss... T is not including you in that group that he is scared of? you are a woman.. makes me feel really insecure that T might possibly be "afraid" of me... or hate the idea of working with me.. It's not a happy thought.

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">I too have those thoughts, MzJelloF. I don't really choose those who provide professional services to me based on gender. I have had good experiences with both male and female landscapers, accountants, doctors, lawyers, car mechanics, whatever. When I did have a bad experience, I chalked it up to their competence or personality rather than their gender. Maybe because I'm a woman trying to earn a living myself, I would not discriminate against women when shopping for services. I give both women and men a chance, and usually it works out just fine. I understand I may have some internal gender biases/preferences that may date back to past incidents, but I just push past those and let people in my present have the opportunity to show me their best. I would feel truly weird if my T said to me that women scare him, and I'm not sure I would be able to work with him. (MissCharlotte, I know your T didn't make that statement, so this isn't directed at your situation.) I also understand that a person's therapist is a very special role, in which the T needs to receive our ultimate trust and in which scenarios from our past are played out on the therapeutic tableau, so I can see gender preferences could be worth acknowledging and following here, for ultimate therapeutic value. The car mechanic, lawyer, doctor, or physical therapist--I'm not so sure.

I think it is a really interesting conversation too :-)

I'm reminded of this TV ad (remember the ad, can't remember what it was advertising).

Screenshot of a guy wearing speedos, beach in the background 'ok' is written on the bottom of the picture.

Guy starts walking (towards the camera), away from the beach 'ok' is written on the bottom of the picture.

Camera shot shifts so you can't see beach or sand - you see road and shops 'not ok' is written on the bottom of the picture.

It is quite striking that with the beach in views wearing speedos in public is perfectly fine...
But with the beach out of view wearing underwear in public most certainly is not.

Context certainly comes into play. I guess that is the thing... If the weather is hot and the majority of people wear summer dresses then summer dresses might well be appropriate. It is context relative. Showing an ankle when others aren't isn't appropriate to the context.

Part of what is hard is that females are less represented in professional settings, I guess. It is coming up that time again when students are talking about going to the Eastern Division Philosophy conference in order to hit the job market. Consensus: Males should wear a navy or black suit and a conservative tie. Females should wear... I thought that a nice sweater and some dress pants would be ok for females - but apparently not. Suits. It is weird because typically in social occasions when guys are wearing suits girls are wearing dresses. But no... I guess a skirt suit would be appropriate... Or... A suit. Because you don't want to stand out. Ideally... People should forget what you wore (aim for inconspicuous dress).

But that is a very weird convention... Social norms... Bizarre, huh.

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MissCharlotte said:
Kiya,

Don't you just love the way she says it? I feel like I have come a teeny bit of the way this week, tho still have huge issues surrounding body image. What I feel is like I may be able to begin to discuss some of this with T, and begin to work through some of the pain surrounding it.

My other Bellaruth favorite: "and so you are."

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Heheh... yeah.... and one that has crept into my vocab.... "More and more". I have been to one of her workshops. I actually wish she could spend an hour with my t and I.

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kim_johnson said:
Why don't people listen to what she says more? Why don't those visiting proffs appreciate that she is as smart as her comments and criticisms show that she is? Why didn't she get a job in the field - she is friendly and smart and entertaining in interviews? I think that the way she presents herself (IMHO as a sexual object first and foremost) detracts considerably from the many wonderful qualities that she in fact possesses and those many wonderful qualities that would result in her being a real leader in her field if only people listened a little more and stared a little less...

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">Somehow this woman has failed to learn the norms in her field and is shooting herself in the foot by dressing inappropriately for her profession. I feel bad for her. She has a blind spot for some reason. I think it is her advisor/mentor's role to take her aside and advise her on clothing and presentation. If not her advisor, then other faculty in her department. The discussion may be awkward, but this student needs mentoring so that she can get out there and get employed!

yeah sunrise.. i have not enjoyed working with a *group* of just women... but a group of just guys aint ideal either... i prefer a mix. For some reason everyone behaves. i don't fit in with either group though, so that might be just me.

i can't wait to find out what the bank co-workers are going to think of purple and blue hair. Ha. Do i care? Nope. i don't have any plans to make friends there... my experiences of not exactly blending in tell me that i'm unlikely to meet like minded people.. you never know, but meh, whatever

will i cover my tattoos? yes, for the office i will.

ohh.. a suit? i like suits.. but of course, i'll wear a zebra print scarf with mine

Actually when I started this thread it had nothing to do with clothing but rather the fact that when I am around women in general I have to be more wary and careful of my moves. I have a really, really hard time defending myself against the "mean girl" thing. It's so not my cup of tea. It's the female version of bullying.

Now, as to the whole dressing thing. I don't show cleavage at work and agree it's better to be a bit more conservative if you want to be taken seriously. Just notice how much Katie Couric's oufits have changed since she started doing the evening news. Her outfits are MUCH more conservative now than when she started.

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Miss... T is not including you in that group that he is scared of? you are a woman.. makes me feel really insecure that T might possibly be "afraid" of me... or hate the idea of working with me.. It's not a happy thought.

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Jello, I am sure he meant to include me! After all--look at the ruptures we have had. I screamed at him once so loud that I scared me. LOL -- It was said with a smile and I know he has the utmost respect for me and enjoys our work together. I'm confident with that.

Peaceout

Sorry we got so off topic. I too hate the mean girl thing. I quit a job because of the level of gossip.