Do You Think It's Fair?

So, my son, whom I strongly believe as well as the therapist he had seen every week for a couple of months at the beginning of this year believes, needs a psychiatric evaluation because of observations during the sessions.

He is 18 years old and has always had social issues (being picked on at school because he was always a little smaller than other boys his age) and has and still is very obnoxious to be around. He's very disruptive to the family and he's never really had any friends and I certainly can't remember him bringing any home since he was about 7 or 8 years old. His behavior has gotten more obnoxious and has even become sort of a "hater" meaning that he basically "hates" anything the average person would like. His temperament has become more concerning because he talks about punching people when they do something he doesn't like. In addition, he has a problem telling the truth and taking any responsibility for his life (he constantly makes up lies and everything is someone else's fault.

Because I am concerned, I told him back in February that he needed to get an evaluation by a psychiatrist and depending on what the results are, continue at least 4 counseling sessions before I pay for his college tuition/fees etc. Him being 18, I feel this is the only control that I have. Needless to say, until two weeks ago, he has refused and said that there is nothing wrong with him, but that it's me that has the problem (the therapist earlier this year interviewed us both over many sessions, yet saw something concerning in him). He, at such a late date, has very reluctantly decided to get the evaluation, all the while complaining that nothing is wrong and that this is a waste of money etc...

Here I am, standing firm on what I told him his requirements were to get his college paid for about 4 months ago, now I am being unreasonable about what can get done in the next few weeks before school. Unfortunately I've heard so many excuses from him.

Is there something wrong with following through with what I promised?

Barx, there's absolutely nothing wrong with following through on what you told him. He needs to know there are consequences for his choices.

I'm going to sound like a hard-hearted meanie. He is 18, which means he is a legal adult. You are under no obligation to pay for his college education. For that matter you are under no obligation to allow him to continue to let him live in your home if his behavior is unacceptable to you.

It is not only FAIR, but you are doing him a big FAVOR. Hopefully, he will one day appreciate you for it. Hopefully.

Look, I abridged your post just to highlight core issues. If he does not see that (1) is WRONG (he does not see it, per (2)), but you see that (1) is wrong, you then find yourself being the only person able to see that something is wrong. He needs to figure out that it is wrong and to get help in order to live a happier life and to gain social acceptance in college (as you are certainly well aware of, college years are not just about education, but also about figuring out who you are by yourself and within your social group).

Then, you used whatever leverage you have as a parent paying for his college to induce him to make the right step in seeking evaluation - (3). So you are being more than FAIR - you are being very KIND and SUPPORTIVE.

I think you're doing the best thing a mother can do - what happens if his behaviour leads him to dropping out of college and not being able to get a job? You are right to be concerned as clearly something isn't quite right - i won't go into possible diagnoses as i'm not a psychiatrist nor are other people here so it wouldn't be fair but you're going with your gut instincts and i think eventually that will pay off. The fact that your son has finally decided to go would say to me that he too is concerned to some degree and wants to change for the better. I would capitalize on that as much as you can - it's hard to come across as anything but patronizing to an 18 year old but carry on encouraging him as best you can. Maybe go out for dinner after you've had the session or take him to a mall or something that will help him associate getting treatment with also doing something fun. Sounds basic and probably a bit childish but aren't we all children at heart? This would probably also give him the chance to open up to you a bit more and discuss what his therapist thinks might help him the most. I just wish my mum would take me out for ice cream after i have groups I'm working on it! All the best.

What you are doing is more than fair - you do not have to pay for his college education.

And you know what? If he hasn't met your criteria by the time school starts... welll... tough for him. Don't give him the money until he's done all of what you asked. If that means that he's broke and can't pay for his courses and has to back out for a year? Well, that's his own problem as he wasted all the time and not you.

He might rage and be hateful towards you and continue to think nothing is wrong ... and is likely only agreeing now because he's desperate for the money. So do NOT give him the money until he's got an actual diagnosis for whatever it is. If the psychiatrist decides he's just a jerk and nothing is wrong.. then so be it. But don't let up until it's at a point where either your son is going to WILLINGLY continue going, or where you know what you need/want to know. If you give him the cash any sooner and he will STOP going because he won't need to to get the money -he'll already have it.

Thanks so much for all of the support. I can't tell you how much it means to hear this. I have felt so bad about all of this. It breaks my heart. This is, by far, one of the toughest things I've had to do.

@CheshireCatGrin, I think you are correct in that he is just desperate for the money because even now, when I talk to him, he is hostile to me about this and still refuses to see that he needs help. His results come back in another week and he is already talking about what the plan is once the psychiatrist finds nothing wrong with him. That's how adamant he is that there is no problem, yet the licensed therapist, who counseled him every week for two months, said she knew within 30 minutes of talking to him that he needed help. And as far as not letting up until my son is willingly going to go to counseling... well, he has made so many promises that he never followed through on, hence is why we are here, a few weeks away from college tuition time, that we are having this "crisis" about it. He knew since the end of February, the beginning of March about my requirements. I think he plays mental games with me. Everything is a competition and he isn't about to lose.

Barx, a couple of other people mentioned not giving him the money for school until he complies with your condition. I would recommend not giving him the money directly. Send the university a check for his tuition instead of giving him the money.

Yeah... so.... he's going to rage at you when you don't give him the money on time because he hasn't met your requirements. Be prepared for that, it's going to be nasty! Like... probably nastier than anything you've ever experienced with him before, because that is a legitimate high-stress situation for him. And, from the sounds of it, he will not accept that that's his OWN fault that he's in that mess.

Also - don't be surprised if the psychiatrist comes back and says there's nothing wrong with him. Your son has likely lied and acted to the best of his ability. I would suggest - IF he has been successful in convincing the psychiatrist of this, that you only give him as much for the base tuition for the first semester/term. Give the BARE minimum and tell him he'll get more when he continues going. Do NOT give him any extra - don't cover his books, don't cover his expenses. Just the base tuition costs so that he can attend class.

Make him go back to the psychiatrist anyway, even if he's managed to con him over. AND. If the pyschiatrist has seen through it, still only give him that bare minimum to make sure that he goes to more appointments. Pay that base tuition. If you were going to cover other costs? Do not give him the money for them until after he's gone to more appointments - because seriously, he can go without the textbooks for a while. Most students don't even look at them And as the poster above said - don't give him the cash. Go in with him to pay for things.

It does not sound like the problem just started. I like the idea of follow through but wonder if you have a "Plan B" in case he decides not to follow through and not do anything about college either. It sounds like he wants to go to college but if you make it more difficult to maintain who he wants to present himself as, he might not want that anymore and/or if he has a problem with college, as it sounds like he probably will, and drops out, then what do you have?

I would sit him down and tell him how you see his life and give him two or three scenarios for how the next couple years can go and let him choose: (1) evaluation, therapy, college, therapy must be for X years (2) evaluation, he gets a job and you contribute whatever you're willing to pay for college in that time to his support, therapy for Y period of time; (3/4) no evaluation/therapy, X support for Z period at home/not at home; etc.

I would seriously consider what you want. If he doesn't want to grow up/get help, I'd insist he move out and I would support him, at least as much as college would cost, for a period of up to a year or two. I'd set up a joint checking account so you could review the money, make strict rules when you'll put some in, etc., and, if he gets evaluation/therapy sweeten the pot and freedom but otherwise insist he get and maintain a job first or the support really goes down (like with divorce).

Do you really think its possible to fool the psychiatrist? Oh I hope not. There were two visits to he Dr. The first visit was a sit down interview with him and then the second visit, a week later, was the actual testing.

He's been under the care of another psychiatrist since he was 12 for ADHD. I thought that was the only issue (impulse control and processing issues) until this year. Because he was so disruptive and unable to get along with anybody and could never tell the truth about anything as well as his demeanor getting worse, I made him go to a psychotherapist to help him with his attitude etc. It wasn't until we saw her, that we realized that we had a real problem on our hands. Then we requested his files from the psychiatrist that had been treating him since he was 12 for ADHD and come to find out, he had written several observations about him, however, none were supplied to me. He characterized him as being "highly manipulative", "peter pan syndrome" and other things to suggest possibly a personality disorder.

And yes, the rage has begun. I only hope that I am doing the right thing. I see it as standing firm on my requirements now to help his future, otherwise, I fear he will be living a very lonely life.

Yes, the rage and blame has begun.

To the extent that CheshireCatGrin raises the issue of your son's being dishonest with a psychiatrist - have him go to a PhD psychologist trained in neuropsychological assessments. He will be tested on a battery of well-validated tests that are designed specifically (among other things) to help make a diagnosis in people who are lying.

Millon Clinical Multiaxial Inventory - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

MMPI

Stay strong barx!

And yes, if he's already a liar and already manipulative and clearly resistant to the idea of going to see the psychiatrist... I'd bet my butt that he will be doing his VERY best to lie on both any tests and to the psychiatrist.

These tests are specifically designed to catch lies. They have many questions that are very similar, but not identical. How consistently a person responds is all tested. One of the outputs of testing is a measure of how honestly the person must have been when answering these questions.

The tests have been validated on millions of people.

I am not saying that he is not trying his very best to lie on the tests - I am saying that the test makers were smart enough and his lies would be caught.

ADHD can get better with meds or it's probably not ADHD (and/or he probably should not be on those meds if they don't help). If he has been seeing a psychiatrist all these years, I would have looked into Oppositional Defiant Disorder (ODD) Oppositional defiant disorder (ODD) - MayoClinic.com or something else.

Yeah, but has barx actually said that they're doing those tests specifically? (I can't remember and am too tired/wired -- odd combo -- to reread the thread! My posts is on the assumption that they aren't, at least not yet. I could very well be totally wrong!)

He has been tested and does have ADHD. He is also on ADHD medication, but there still seems to be more going on. He has been tested and we get the results 7/17. I will update when I get them.