Who should do the traveling?

You've just, in my mind, answered your own question. Every situation is unique, and between two people, there is no "standard" of who should travel based on whatever criteria people might send you as in "the man should be the one travelling ..bla blah blah" If you trust the person fully you know his details and are fine with it, nothing wrong with it.

First of all, there is some legitimate concern there whenever you meet anyone from online. the "dangerous" part, well, hopefully you've taken care of because you say you trust him, implying that you know and have seen enough evidence to show that he's not a danger. In any case how would him traveling to your location be any safer really? You'd be giving him your location and city and if he were dangerous it carries it's own weight by letting him come to your city/town and know your location. There's that. That is of course again, assuming he were dangerous but then if he is being in the relationship is a bad deal with him all around right?

What is this deal with letting him off the hook anyway? Do you have a relationship that carries some obligation from his end that he has to hold up that you're letting him off the hook for? Ask yourself, what does your friend mean by that and then consider whether you agree. If you do agree that he has some sort of obligation as your romantic partner? I honestly would have probably asked your friend then and there, what she meant he should be "on the hook" for in the first place.

TBH I'm going to assume that she is saying because you're the female that you shouldn't be responsible for doing the travel. And although it's not a wrong way to think, for many it's an old fashioned way of thinking (for me, as a male it doesn't bother me so much). but you have to weigh whether or not that is a standard that you live by or want to live by. Go from there.

Are you letting him off the hook? see above. Again, the thing about whether or not you should be making him come to you is, what do YOU think? It's something that's so dependent on the individuals, the couple, your values, thoughts and what your relationship is that I don't think anyone here can definitively answer this.

Sounds like you were already pretty fine with it but you either are one that is swayed to easily by others' opinions or this one particular friend happens to affect you this way. Trust your own gut, first. Others opinions next.

Thanks for the thoughtful reply, S4. I agree with the "off the hook" thing, and believe my friend was being a bit old-fashioned. At the same time, looking back, there was a bit of legitimacy to it. I believe he was stalling, and I think it would have been nice (though, now understanding his work and family commitments, not possible) for him to offer to come here. The relationship is now, however, over. He has decided that he just doesn't want to invest time into it.

PS In regards to the message I posted earlier, he responded to me from this morning saying he acts in his own time, I was pushing, and he's sorry I am hurt. Idk wtf this extreme adversion to pushing is. I admit I can be pushy. But I don't start off in any conversation that way. I think if you take two weeks to give me dates you said you'd give me a month and a half ago, I will push. If we are having a serious conversation that is inappropriate for text and I say, "I would rather discuss this over the phone," and you say okay, but then back out and say, "Well, I'm actually too tired, I'm going to bed," I will push you. Everyone has their needs. He needs to think things through and needs space to do that. I need validation and for someone to communicate with me instead of just plain retreating. Those two needs can coexist, but in order for that to happen, you cannot just ignore the needs of the other person or else it becomes a clash of wills. Which is what is happening here, I believe. We're both strong willed people who aren't getting our needs met. I think, carefully, that could actually be resolved. And it sucks, but I don't think that can be solved long distance.

You're welcome and I'm sorry it's now over.

from what you describe in the second paragraph here, what comes to mind here is that I don't see his behavior so much as his strong will affecting things (not saying whether he is strong willed or not, you know better than I) but that it is the sort of thing that I would do when being "pushed". Being what you call pushy, or assertive as I would more aptly put it and a little demanding is just your personality type. Nothing wrong with that and I know you know this. But the thing that stands out for me is that he may be an introverted person or at least more of an introvert than you are. The backing off when being pushed is something that I typically do unless pushed way too far. Initially I would do such things as "oh actually I'm tired" rather than engage. Introverted personalities tend to expend more energy during social interactions and even more so when interacting with those that are far more extroverted, assertive or dominant.

This is only my assertion here. I do know I may be completely wrong but my point here is that looking at what you've said and how I interpret your personality, I you just need to find someone that has the type of personality to match your assertiveness. Funny thing, introverts and extroverts are attracted many times, and although the situations can work, many times they do not, they end up like the one you just described.

He's actually an extrovert and I'm an introvert, believe it or not He's an ENFP (the most introverted extrovert) and I'm an INTJ. Well, the jury is out on mine. I behave like an INTJ, but I wonder if some of that is walls and protective mechanisms. There are times when I am more INFP. I know it's not cut and dry anyway.

He actually has talked to me a bit this afternoon. The extreme aversion to pushing stems from his "former domestic badness" as he puts it. I asked him point blank if it was a trigger, he affirmed that it was. And this opened up a lot of dialogue about how he feels unheard but that he is sorry for not hearing and acknowledging me. I think neither of us is hearing the other because we are both strong willed and are hyper focused on getting our own needs met in this situation bc the other person isn't doing it. I told him I thought I was hearing him but I know I wasn't....and that it's also hard to hear him when he doesn't talk. He acknowledged both of these things. I believe this is a situation which boils down to communication, which could be remedied if we were local, but which is probably too hard long distance. I don't believe he is like the other guys. I just think he has stuff like we all do.

i think he likes you alot!!!

I know he does. But if he can't communicate with me, if he can't get past the past, it doesn't matter a whole lot. I can put up with a lot if a man is willing to try because I have walls and I get scared and I push people away like its a contest and the prize is a billion dollars. And people still put up with me, because these days I tend to be more self-aware and I am willing to communicate and work on my stuff. But if he's just going to retreat and push me away there is nothing I can do.

((((Ruari))))

Sending hugs. I'm so sorry to read this latest update.

Eh. There's more news. And it's not so depressing. But I'm not going to share because I don't want to vascillate so much, and I'd rather just wait a little bit to see what's up.

Basically, I have cautious optimism as we had a very long and frank discussion. But I'm not going to invest my emotions wholeheartedly right now. I'm just going to focus on work and what's important to me here at home and see where things take me.

Hope it all works out, for you.

Thanks.

I think, as divine1966 alluded to earlier, I'm dealing with an emotionally unavailable man. This one just happened to be more covert than the other ones I'd dealt with in the past.

We talked last night and had a really great, frank conversation about communication and what we both needed from the other. We both talked about triggers, his being that he didn't like being pushed, mine being that I didn't like feeling invalidated. There were apologies made, blah blah, some boundaries set. Both of us said we wanted to continue talking, I said I was still interested in coming in August but that I was planning on staying elsewhere (he appreciated that gesture). The last thing I'd said was that I was happy to continue things, but that I wasn't going to be in a situation where I made excuses for a man. He didn't understand, so I clarified (and I don't think I need to clarify, here. Basically, I'm not going to continue making excuses for a man treating me as less than.) I don't think the things I ask for are that demanding. And one of the biggest things has been the calling and Skyping thing. It's been a thing for a while.

I told him last night that I needed less text and more talk. He seemed okay with that. Tbh, I hate text. He hates the phone. It shouldn't be hard to compromise, but it ends up that we're always on text and that's it. We didn't text much today, texted once I got home, and we were both drinking after a point. And the convo was light until something triggered me, and I got super annoyed about the phone thing. I said something a tad snarky about it, but not horrible. His reply, however, was pretty nasty. I was like, "Wow. That's really unfair of you." He said, "I reckon it's not." And it devolved from there. I tried to remain civil, but I said I didn't think it should be this hard to compromise when, in reality I'm doing something I don't like continually because he doesn't like the phone.

I thought about it for 15 minutes and realized that, not 24 hours after saying I wasn't going to make excuses, I was making excuses. And so I said (and it wasn't snarky or mean or anything) that I didn't think trying this thing again was a good idea, and I said why...basically what I just said about the 24 hours. The next thing he said to me was, "We're done. Leave me be." And I'm, once again, blocked. But now it's from everything: FB, phone, everything. No warning. Just, bye.

This person, once I peeled away the layers, isn't who I'd understood him to be the last decade. And I'm conflicted because I really liked him...but I liked the man I knew all these years. And I ache (in empathy) for the guy who I am understanding him to be, who has the same shell I've worn for so long that you think is protecting you, but really doesn't. It just keeps people from getting close enough to love you. I am confident that this person really liked me. I think he really liked me, and still does. I think he's probably at home in his proverbial shell right now, withdrawing, because he thinks I left him. I didn't, but it looks that way. And so he was like, "Oh yeah? Well I'll leave you more!" *block* *block from everything* *never talk to her again* I could have put up with a lot from him, because I get it. But I can't put up with someone who withholds affection, isn't going to meet me halfway, and who, basically doesn't want to be loved. I care too much about myself to lose myself again.

That part where you showed how his blocking you was essentially saying, I'll leave you more. Very insightful and right on point..and so relatable.

I like reading your posts.

#Life is a beautiful lie#

Thanks.

And it was just so abrupt and unnecessary and out of proportion for the situation. Especially after the previous night, it was obiously reactive. I feel like I had opened him up a bit the previous night and I think he was freaking out a bit. I almost wonder if that is why he was drinking last night. I mean, he was at home scrubbing floors and having a few beers along the way, which I might do too, but the way he reacted in our conversation, I don't think he'd had only a few. And I was starting a three day weekend and was on my second glass of wine when the clash happened. I think our Id tends to show itself when we've been drinking. I was never not going to need him to show more affection, he was never going to give more than he wanted to without a fight and he was feeling too vulnerable. I feel badly for some of the things I said in anger last night and am hoping he did have my texts blocked because, while I was still just rational enough to hold back a few really mean comments, I said some really harsh things. And I feel badly. Yes, he hurt me, but my harsh comments aren't going to do anything to make his situation better.

I feel sad for myself but part of me is like meh, what's new. I just don't think love is in the cards for me at this point. And I'm not crying over that, I'm just calm and resigned. I hurt for him because while he has similar issues to me and hurts in the same way, maybe even more, he doesn't have the support I have. And what an overwhelmingly lonely feeling that must be. I wish I could've at least been his friend.

Sorry Ruari, but do you feel that you are putting too much effort for this relationship to work out?

No I don't, as I'm not putting any into it since I broke it off. I'm having a discussion about it, because that's what people do on discussion boards. I'm not a person who likes to stuff things; I did that for too many years.

But while I was in it, yes. I was putting in too much effort. That's why I told him I didn't think it was a good idea to continue. I could no longer rationalize my continued need to push him in spite of his resistance.

I found this article. It explains a lot to me. I think I have a little more work to do.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/margar...b_3311816.html

Oh, I didn't realize you ended it. Sorry, but I don't read all the posts, especially the long ones. I'm lost in the details easily because of concentration problems. Of course discussion is good, but I felt you were putting too much effort and I wanted to know if you realized that. Sorry it didn't work out. But I wanted to say that relationships when meant to be will progress easily and without too many challenges and much effort before it even kicks off. Wish you all the best. You deserve better. Good luck

That's okay. I didn't mean to be snarky, I'm just sad and weepy right now.

I know I deserve better. I just have no idea what that looks like, so I spend too much time in relationships that hurt without realizing they hurt, blaming the anxiety on things like work, when I should be walking away. It doesn't matter how much he liked me (and he does) or how much I liked him (and I do), he wasn't treating me well and vice versa. And I wasn't demonstrating much self-worth by putting up with his BS...though I don't think I actually put up with it too long once I figured it out--I only had real clarity this past Monday.

When it happens you will know how it looks like. Hang in there ruari

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I don't know. I really thought it looked like it this time. Until this past Monday, when the red flag finally went up and it didn't anymore. I'm glad I didn't keep hanging on, though. I am proud of myself for that. I did give him one more chance with that condition of, "I won't make excuses for a man (or rationalize) ever again," and when I found myself doing just that, I got out. I communicated with him since then, but I held my ground and still said, "Sorry, but I can't go back." That has never, ever happened before. Ever.

You are growing. Good job. This is the first step in a right direction

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Thanks.

From this vantage point, I'm not sure what was so incredibly appealing. He was hot 10 years ago. He isn't that hot now. And, while it isn't all about physical attractiveness, and I was more interested in his character than anything else, he isn't who I thought he was. He is different. But I interacted as though he was the same. Meh. I guess we fall for ideals.

I also think maybe his MI is devolving a bit. When he came back after we stopped talking about a month ago, he seemed almost hypomanic--he'd joined a gym, had all kinds of ideas, projects, irons in the fire that he didn't have before. He wasn't sleeping well, but he generally doesn't. However, he indicated it was worse. And the last week, he has essentially crashed. He is exhausted, he has said he's overwhelmed, and the ideas and projects he had been excited about, he's said, are beginning to overtake him a bit. He sounded and acted depressed. Sure, that happens to all of us, but when you're bipolar, sometimes it's a sign of instability. Especially if there are other emotional things in the mix. Especially when you're also over-reactive.

I still miss the interaction. But I'm glad it's over. Maybe somewhere wayyyyyyyy down the road I will be able to say hello. But not tomorrow, or even next month. And maybe, hopefully, I'll meet someone who will make me forget all about even trying to check in on his life ever again.

I know you write the flags went up Monday. For your own growth, It seemed like your flags went up on a Thursday, no?

Yep, they went up Thursday as well, after our long talk on Wednesday night during which I said we could try things again, but I wouldn't make excuses for a man. They went up on Thursday because, even after that talk, I was making excuses...which is why I finally broke things off.

(I'm not sure the exact day matters, the point is that I didn't spend weeks or months making excuses for this man after I realized there was a very obvious issue like I have been known to do in the past.)