[ken1538]

There is a girl I like at work (I will call her Jessica) and whenever I attempt to talk to her, the conversations are somewhat difficult. This is sort of a follow up to a previous post I made. I think Jessica likes me as a person and she is generally friendly when we pass each other in the hallway but when we are in the same room together and I try to have a conversation with her, it doesn't often go smoothly. I work in a retail technology store and my first conversation with Jessica went pretty well. I asked her about her position at the store and told her I was interested in working in her department (she works in a department that services computers and provides various tech services) and asked her about her job and her experience with the store. It was a good first conversation and there seemed to be some chemistry there (not necessarily romantic but just interpersonal chemistry). Over the next few weeks after our first conversation, I was working as a cashier at the store and had a few smaller conversations with Jessica when I cashed her out for some things she was buying. These conversations were a little more difficult and I started to notice that Jessica definitely has some social anxiety and she didn't seem to feel as comfortable as during our first conversation. Although, Jessica did eventually inform me that some positions were opening up in here department because she knew I was interested in working in her department.

One night when I worked until the store was closing, I walked into Jessica's department to get the vacuum to vacuum my department and Jessica was there so I simply said "hi, jessica, how are you?" and she sort of reluctantly turned around and said "i'm okay". I noticed when she said "I'm okay", her mouth was literally shaking. She was obviously pretty nervous to talk and probably was caught off guard by me entering her department. I initially thought she just didn't want me there but then she started a conversation and told me that she had just gotten over a cold that she got from going to a video game convention. Her body language seemed like she wanted to talk as she was maintaining eye contact and her body was facing me directly. This then led to me asking her about video game conventions, gaming youtubers she watches, various other things, etc. The conversation went okay, but I noticed when I would ask here things like which youtubers she watches, she would give me very vague answers like "all kinds" and she had a hard time giving me specific answers.

After that conversation, I didn't work with Jessica for about 2 months because we worked different shifts but recently our shifts have started to overlap again and I had a chance to talk to her for a few minutes the other week when she was in the break room. She was playing a Nintendo Switch game that I own and when I walked into the break room I said "hey, I own that game" and started talking about things I like about the game. Again, Jessica seemed nervous that I was in the room and caught off guard but she was still friendly. Jessica had just gotten back from another video game convention so I asked her how it was and she said it was good. Then I asked her if there were any highlights and she simply said "no". I was getting those vague, short answers again so I tried asking more questions and asked here what kinds of things there are to do at the video game convention she attended and and how many people were there. This was when Jessica seemed to get a little irritable. Jessica sort of responded to me like I was stupid and the answers were obvious and they were obvious and I basically knew the answers but I was just trying to make conversation. For example, when I asked Jessica how many people attended the convention, with an attitude, she said "there were a lot of people, it's the biggest video game convention on the east coast". It almost seemed like Jessica was getting defensive. Maybe she thought that I was testing her with my questions and didn't want to look stupid; I'm not sure. This is where our conversation ended and I had to get back to work.

When I observe Jessica interact with some of the other guys at work, she doesn't appear to be nervous at all and is quite talkative. I actually happened to be in the store's main office the other day working on one of the computers and Jessica walked in to talk to one of managers who was also in the room who is around our age and the conversation between them flowed completely naturally and she was acting like her natural self. They started talking about how she moved from her home state to our area because of someone she was dating and revealing a lot more personal info than she ever revealed to me. It was interesting because even though I was in the room, she was not nervous and she wasn't afraid to say these things and act like her natural self while I was in the room.

All of this brings me to what I don't understand; are my conversations with Jessica difficult because we don't have chemistry or is there some other reason? I don't feel that nervous when I talk to her but she definitely gets nervous around me and I'm not sure what is causing that. I'm not sure if it is here own anxiety or something I am doing to make her feel uncomfortable. There are some girls I talk to where conversations are easy and they flow naturally and I seem to connect easily with them. I don't think Jessica dislikes me as a person because she is still generally friendly to me.

I'm not trying to date Jessica; I'm just trying build up my social skills with women in general and trying to understand what is going on. Could I be asking Jessica too many questions at once and maybe that is irritating her and coming across as me being intrusive? How do I make Jessica feel more comfortable around me? Does this sound like a lack of chemistry between us?

[Artchic528]

Let me see if I understand, you have a crush on her, but don't want to date her, right?

[ken1538]

Originally Posted by Artchic528

Let me see if I understand, you have a crush on her, but don't want to date her, right?

That is correct. I don't want to date her because I don't want to cause problems at work. I'm trying to figure out why she feels uncomfortable around me and why are conversations are sometimes difficult. If I can figure this out, I can learn from it and apply it to my interactions with other people.

[SeekerSeeking]

Ken1538,

Sounds like you have given this a lot of thought and effort. That’s a good thing. However, Jessica may not be the best person to build your social skills with—she may just have issues of her own. Maybe you remind her of someone…who knows?

So other than not trying to engage much with her—you could take the direct approach, and sometime when it’s just you two say, “I feel our conversations are strained sometimes. Am I doing something to make you uncomfortable?” If she has an answer, great==you can work on it. If she doesn’t perhaps she doesn’t know or cannot say—either way—again, she’s not the girl to learn social skills on. Not everyone is—there will be folks that you click with and folks you don’t—you’ve given it lots of effort and thought. It may be time to just hand it up.

[Artchic528]

So your using her as a social experiment to gain knowledge about social interactions with? Ethically I would suggest asking her permission to use her as a subject for learning.

[Bill3]

Then I asked her if there were any highlights and she simply said “no”. I was getting those vague, short answers again so I tried asking more questions and asked here what kinds of things there are to do at the video game convention she attended and and how many people were there. This was when Jessica seemed to get a little irritable. Jessica sort of responded to me like I was stupid....

Those vague, short answers are social cue. They are a signal. They mean “Hey, I don't want to talk about this now.” She got irritated with you because you missed that signal and pressed ahead with more questions. Something similar apparently happened when you asked her about youtubers.

Perhaps this is why Jessica feels nervous around you. But whether it is or not, in my opinion you would be wise to back off when people signal to you that they don’t want to speak about something.

Given that she can speak freely and naturally with a manager, I am skeptical that she has social anxiety.

You can’t “make” Jessica feel comfortable around you. However, you could change your style of questioning and see whether or not, over time, that makes a difference in how she reacts to you. You could tell her that you’ve been thinking and you realize that sometimes you ask too many questions. You could apologize for that and promise to do better.

[ken1538]

Originally Posted by Bill3

Those vague, short answers are social cue. They are a signal. They mean “Hey, I don't want to talk about this now.” She got irritated with you because you missed that signal and pressed ahead with more questions. Something similar apparently happened when you asked her about youtubers.

Perhaps this is why Jessica feels nervous around you. But whether it is or not, in my opinion you would be wise to back off when people signal to you that they don’t want to speak about something.

Given that she can speak freely and naturally with a manager, I am skeptical that she has social anxiety.

You can’t “make” Jessica feel comfortable around you. However, you could change your style of questioning and see whether or not, over time, that makes a difference in how she reacts to you. You could tell her that you’ve been thinking and you realize that sometimes you ask too many questions. You could apologize for that and promise to do better.

When talking to Jessica about the convention, I suppose her telling me that there were no highlights may have been a signal that she didn't want to talk about the convention. When I asked her about the convention, she was playing a video game on the break room TV, so she may have been wanting to focus on that. I will try not to ask too many questions if she gives me short/vague answers like she did before. It is a difficult situation, though, because all I'm trying to do is get to know her and I at least need to ask some questions to get to know her better. When I asked her about Youtubers that night, she didn't get irritated, she just had a hard time thinking of which Youtubers she watches, but I agree that this was probably a signal that she didn't want to talk about Youtubers. Part of the issue here is that because I don't work in her department and because I only see her at this point, about 1-2 times per week, I don't get much of an opportunity to have conversations with her. That is why when I did get opportunities to talk with her, I would ask more questions than I normally do. I was trying to establish a connection with her so that it would be easier to talk to her in the future.

I know you are skeptical that Jessica has social anxiety but having observed her over the course of 5 months and as someone with a background in Psychology and who has social anxiety, I see signs of it in her. Remember, when I walked into her department to get that vacuum, her mouth was shaking when she turned around to talk to me. That is social anxiety. I can't think of anything I could have done to make her so nervous that her mouth would be shaking as our interactions were pretty basic prior to that and had only known her for a few weeks at that point. There are a few other reasons why I think she has social anxiety. With the way that she walks, she sort of carries herself like she is self conscious. Another example, one night I was at the register talking to my co-worker, Jessica walks up and says "I'm bored", my co-worker and I stop talking for a second to acknowledge Jessica's presence and then before we can start talking to her, Jessica says "okay", smiles, and walks back to her department. I would say this social anxiety because I think she felt awkward in that moment, couldn't handle the awkwardness and decided to leave. In addition, our first conversation went very well but just about every conversation I had with Jessica after that, she seemed nervous. That is all I can really say; she gives off a nervous energy that I sense. She doesn't have social anxiety around the people in her department because she has been working with them for the past 2 years. Most people are not going to have social anxiety around co-workers that they have worked in close proximity with for 2 years. I think Jessica is able to talk with the managers easily for the same reason; she has known them for 2 years. I don't know if she doesn't have social anxiety with the people from other departments that aren't managers because she doesn't interact with them very much.

[ken1538]

Originally Posted by Artchic528

So your using her as a social experiment to gain knowledge about social interactions with? Ethically I would suggest asking her permission to use her as a subject for learning.

I'm not using Jessica as a social experiment. I like her and would like to be friends with her. However, in addition that, I am trying to figure out what I'm doing wrong that is making our interactions strained. On side note, I would think it would make someone you don't know that well feel very awkward if you walked up to them and asked them if you could use them as a subject for learning. That is not something people do. Why would there be an ethical problem? Even if I was simply using Jessica to improve my social skills, I wouldn't be harming her in any way by changing my approach to conversations with her when my current approach isn't working. I'm not asking her intrusive questions or making advances on her.

Compare this to a patient in therapy that is working on their social anxiety. Part of overcoming social anxiety is to throw yourself in social situations to get used to being in them and lessen your anxiety. The therapist might have the patient start a conversation with 10 random people walking down the street. In this scenario, the patient is trying to build their social skills but they don't need to ask permission to do this. They are simply trying to build basic social skills and they aren't harming anyone. Ethics only come into play if some sort of harm is being done.

[Artchic528]

Then ask her to help you. It's as simple as that.

[ken1538]

Originally Posted by SeekerSeeking

Ken1538,

Sounds like you have given this a lot of thought and effort. That’s a good thing. However, Jessica may not be the best person to build your social skills with—she may just have issues of her own. Maybe you remind her of someone…who knows?

So other than not trying to engage much with her—you could take the direct approach, and sometime when it’s just you two say, “I feel our conversations are strained sometimes. Am I doing something to make you uncomfortable?” If she has an answer, great==you can work on it. If she doesn’t perhaps she doesn’t know or cannot say—either way—again, she’s not the girl to learn social skills on. Not everyone is—there will be folks that you click with and folks you don’t—you’ve given it lots of effort and thought. It may be time to just hand it up.

I certainly have issues of my own but I agree that Jessica does have some issues of her own based on my experience of working with her over the past 5 months. I might remind of someone that annoys her. I don't usually irritate people when I ask them questions because I'm a good listener and I'm generally interested in what people have to say. However, as I explained above, maybe I'm missing cues that Jessica doesn't want to talk about certain things and need to back off the questions at that point. Maybe Jessica is someone I won't click with. I guess I will find out as I continue working with her.

[ken1538]

Originally Posted by Artchic528

Then ask her to help you. It's as simple as that.

How do I do that? What, specifically, would I say to Jessica to ask for her help?

[Artchic528]

Something along the lines of, "I need help learning and understanding social cues and intwractions. Would you be willing to help me?"

Originally Posted by ken1538

How do I do that? What, specifically, would I say to Jessica to ask for her help?

[mote.of.soul]

I think just leave her alone now. She seems uncomfortable for whatever reason, so let her have her space to do her job. Maybe you've been trying to catch her eye one too many times and she spotted that, and now she feels a little uncomfortable? Whatever the case, I would just not worry about her from now on. It's okay, these things happen.

[eskielover]

You can't FORCE someone into a conversation to get to know them just because YOU want to. If the other person doesn't want to by giving short answers then their desires NEED TO BE RESPECTED too. Life isn't always about only what we want to accomplish. We need to be sensitive to those we are interfacing with.

[Unavailableartist]

I think it is good that you're trying to build social skills, but I find trying to force yourself into awkward social situation is never good. It doesn't help build confidence, and it can push people away (because they are uncomfortable too).

Give it time, sometimes just saying hi, as you pass on another each day is enough, until then I'm sure you'll find more women to talk to.

[Sussmaus7]

I may be wrong.. but I am the sort that hates question after question.. small talk fine, but if it isn't flowing, and seems pressed I feel frustrated. I also have ADHD, but I do tend to hyper focus on things I like... and if someone breaks that, I get irritated... not with the person, more the circumstance... and if she was in her zone with her game, when she's trying to focus on it.. during her break.. she may have given short answers so she could get back to her game. I HATE it when people bother me at the gym.. especially during cardio, when I have my headphones in I'm looking straight and someone decides they want to poke me for attention.. I try to give short answers too because I just want to get through my cardio and get even more aggravated when they are not picking up on my short answers. Even my husband knows not to come down to the basement when he heard me on the elliptical.. So my guess is, if she's a gaming freak .. when the game is out .. It's not a great time till after she is done.
Two things to try..
1. If you see her just wave hello and pass.. let her come to you. Girls hate it when the friendly guy suddenly doesn't seem interested. Even if they don't want to date them.. It's an ego thing.
2. If she's playing her game next time.. just say hey and leave it at that. When she's done say 'Hey, didn't want to bother you during your game.. . ___start convo here '
See if she says 'you don't bother me' or 'thank you'. If she thanks you.. her shortness was just her being in the zone.
Good luck. Oh and.. crushes at work are fun.. ex boyfriends/girlfriends are not..

[scorpiosis37]

I think you are misreading Jessica’s discomfort around you as social anxiety. She may have gotten the hint that you like her or that you seem over-eager in getting to know her, and she is acting nervous because it makes her uncomfortable. A reason her mouth could have been shaking is because she was unexpectedly alone with you (a male) late at night at work. Or she was simply startled because she didn’t realize you were there. For whatever reason, she feels uncomfortable around you and is sending you a lot of signals that she doesn’t wasn’t to answer your questions. Maybe you could practice socializing with people who seem more receptive than she does?

[eskielover]

REMEMBER social skills are being sensitive as to when to engage with someone & when to back off. BOTH of equal importance

[ken1538]

Originally Posted by scorpiosis37

I think you are misreading Jessica’s discomfort around you as social anxiety. She may have gotten the hint that you like her or that you seem over-eager in getting to know her, and she is acting nervous because it makes her uncomfortable. A reason her mouth could have been shaking is because she was unexpectedly alone with you (a male) late at night at work. Or she was simply startled because she didn’t realize you were there. For whatever reason, she feels uncomfortable around you and is sending you a lot of signals that she doesn’t wasn’t to answer your questions. Maybe you could practice socializing with people who seem more receptive than she does?

That is definitely possible that Jessica was nervous that night because she was alone in that room with me. I will note that the room that she works on computers in is not actually sealed off. The room doesn't have any doors and is simply positioned behind the customer service department. There was another guy working in customer service that night who was close enough to easily hear our conversation. Jessica was initially nervous but she still decided to have a conversation with me that night. When I asked her how she was she told me she was alright and then proceeded to tell me that she had just gotten over a cold from visiting a video game convention. We talked for a few minutes and then I had to leave to finish my vacuuming. Prior to this, Jessica did display what I perceived as signs of anxiety. Literally every time Jessica came through my checkout line after our first interaction, she seemed a little nervous and her voice was always a little bit shakey. I will also once again bring up how Jessica walked up to me and my coworker while we were talking, said "I'm bored", paused, then said "okay" and walked away. During these times, there really was no reason for Jessica to feel uncomfortable around me because our interactions were limited at this time and I had not yet developed feelings for her or gone out of my way to get her attention.

I know Jessica didn't seem to want to answer my questions the day she was in the break room playing video games but she doesn't appear to be completely trying to avoid me. A few weeks before this break room incident, I my shift had ended and I walked to the exit door to have my coat checked by security (standard procedure). As I was talking to the security person, there was initialy no one else standing with us, then I turned my head and saw Jessica standing right next to me when she had not been there the second before. It was snowing pretty heavy and she was looking through door to see the snow. When I left that day, it had already been snowing heavily for a good hour and I just found it interesting that Jessica decided to come to the front of the store to see the snow when I was leaving. Part of me wants to see she did this because she wanted to see me before I left but I could be completely wrong and I can't know for sure. Also, I didn't mention some things about the break room incident. Initially, I didn't ask Jessica about the convention. She was playing Mario Kart 8 on the Switch and I mentioned that I had Mario Kart 8. Then I started talking about Switch games I own and upcoming games I'm excited about for the Switch and Jessica did engage in the conversation a bit. She told me about some upcoming games she was looking forward to and how she also has Mario Kart 8 for Wii U. When I asked her about the video game convention she jokingly said "it was lit". It was after this that I asked her if there were any highlights and then she said there weren't. Then I asked her what kinds of things there are to do at the video game convention she was at and she talked about a few different panels that were held there. I asked one or two more questions about things to do at the convention and then she seemed to get irritated. I mention all of this because it wasn't like I entered the break room, said "any highlights at the video game convention?" and then she said "no" and that was it. There was some conversation and some of it was friendly.

Before she left for the video game convention, she came through my cash out line to purchase some food and told me she was excited to go to the convention and she her family. The convention was in her home town. More recently I was talking with someone in her department whose name is Matt, about the new Avengers movie and Jessica was nearby and asked what we were talking about. A few days ago, I entered the break room and saw Matt at the vending machine. Jessica entered a second later and they started talking about his smart watch. I asked if it was a Fitbit watch and Jessica told me it was an Apple watch that Matt was given as part of his position at the store. I know this is a lot of writing, but I'm just using these as examples that Jessica doesn't want to completely avoid me. Jessica seems to be willing to join the conversation if I'm talking to someone else she knows at the store.

All that said, I agree that for whatever reason, Jessica feels uncomfortable around me. I think I might irritate her sometimes but I don't think she dislikes me as a person and I don't think she is trying to avoid me at all costs or anything like that. I will be friendly but keep more of a distance with her. If she wants to get to know me better then great, if she doesn't, oh well.