just to get thoughts out, feel free to get thoughts out too

i dreamed that i saw you were typing on whatsapp, and that later, you called me. when i woke up, i realized of course i didn't have a missed call from you and that it was a dream.

I am watching a documentary. I thought of how I would like to watch it with you. I was imagining us sitting together, my face close to yours, and being overcome with the desire to kiss you. Then it occurred to me that the feelings I have for you now are likely stronger than the feelings you have for me now, and probably (maybe?) stronger than you ever had them for me. The thought that you may not want the same things as I do had the tears streaming down my face. My feelings are only getting stronger even though I haven't seen you in a month and we terminated (in a mildly bad way).

I vaguely thought about talking to you again, then realised I am not sure if I would feel comfortable being so vulnerable to you (apart from the fact I think I'd only do it to feel closer to you).

Is this addressed to me, in reponse to the preceding post, by me? Or is this a thread that is exclusive to just two people, neither of whom is me?

Who is this "you" whom you are addressing? Not me, I hope! !!!???

Seafarer, this whole thread is intended for people to write thoughts about their therapists, so no, nothing is aimed at you.

Thank you for explaining! I wish whoever started the thread had put something about that in the title. It is very confusing!

Will make it clearer next time @Seafarer !

OWWWWW I ALMOST TEXTED my ex T just to say 'i do miss you though' (translates badly)

I actually really want to do that sometimes

My friends tell me not to and obviously I know it's a bad idea, and would feel weird later probably. owwwww

I was really hoping my t would text me today because it's my birthday. She knows it's my birthday because I told her recently. I suppose she wouldn't do that but part of me still hoped she would so I'm feeling very sad and hurt but I will never be able to tell her because I'm too embarrassed that I could want something that clearly is outside of the boundaries of the relationship

Happy birthday !

I texted him accidentally- really, I promise, though it happened because I habitually check his last seen and still had his chat open (web wsp), one random text, and then an 'oh sorry' etc. He replied something funny and a 'no problem'. I chuckled at his reply for 10 minutes and compulsively smiled for more than an hour. It was so nice to have nice contact with him again.
The temptation to intentionally text him now is huge. I am looking for excuses, tempted to ask you guys, would it really be that bad if I texted him? What are the cons really? He will say no to any moves or not reply anyway.

I really worry about doing the same thing. Glad your T took it well, but can totally understand the need to text him deliberately now. It's so hard isn't it. What are you really looking for? Do you want to go back and see him? Is he the T who was attracted to you as well?

This is how it almost always goes in this forum. It might be confusing at first, but once you’re around for awhile, you’ll get used to it. “T” here almost always refers to therapist and not teddy bear or something else. “Pdoc” refers to one’s psychiatrist. “MC” —> marriage counselor. Sometimes “PU” —> parental units

Yes, it's that T. I'm looking for cuddly sweetness and a bit more, sometimes fantasies are relationship-like, so I would want to see him outside a therapy context. I would go back to a therapy session mostly to see him and to feel happy about that, rather than wanting more therapy with him.

I deleted his phone number to save myself from the madness, and then obviously wanted to re-enter it in my phone, only to find out he has removed his number from his website! Then I realised it's still in an e-mail. What madness, can it please stop, or not because it's nice too
Don't think it really has a very bad side to it atm, it just feels nice to think about him.

How about you now, LIMH? Thanks for replying, it really helps.

It guess it's nice to have found his number but I suppose the flip side of that is it keeps you in that state of longing. I can't imagine a situation where a T was attracted to me - I've had therapy with a T who blurred the boundaries but she was female and straight so it wasn't a sexual or romantic thing, just that she really liked me and consequently it wasn't as ethical as it should have been at times. But overall it worked well. I'm not sure how I would deal with your situation but think it's a wise idea to hold back from texting him for now, hopefully the feelings will lessen. If it's nice just to think about him hopefully that will be enough.

I'm ok thanks for asking. It' kind of weird as I had two weeks of near constant crying, there was a situation where I thought something had happened to T as she didn't respond to a text (turned out she was very unwell) which contributed, but I was also upset about other stuff. This week I feel much more stable so not sure if some of the emotion has resolved inside me or it's a temporary feeling of calm until something else triggers me. My feelings towards T are still strong but perhaps less intense and needy. I'm starting to trust I can see her for as long as I want and that she likes me as a person. I'm still struggling with her getting married though. I think I need to take it day by day.

For those constantly checking your T's texts (not sure how you can even do that -- must be something other than regular text messaging), maybe consider how this would feel if you found out someone was constantly checking your cyber/text history? I'm wondering if you would feel comfortable knowing that someone was so constantly wound up in checking on you like that. I don't mention that as shaming so much as perhaps thinking about this from the receiving end might help you regulate your own behaviors a bit so they aren't so seemingly consuming like you describe them. I honestly wouldn't be comfortable with my own husband constantly doing something like that; (I'd tell him to get a life. LOL!)

Sometimes considering how it would be to be on the receiving end of what we say or do is a way to slow ourselves down and think differently about what we say and do.

You have a fair point Artley and some people would be disturbed by it, but I actually think that if I ever mentioned to my T that I liked to look to see when she was last online she would just say something like, if it helps you to feel connected to me then so be it. She's pretty laid back and unfazed by many things. If she wasn't she would no doubt make her activity private.

I have been on the other side of a stalking situation and it wasn't nice, but that was literally someone tracking ALL my online movements including contacting me on sites, looking at forum posts and contacting me under different names so I wouldn't know who it was etc. It's different to simply looking now and then to see when T has last been on Whatasapp.

I think you've got the wrong end of the stick. No one is hacking into their T's text history... just some people who communicate with their T's via whatsapp can see when their T was last online, that's all. And I think you can turn this function off on whatsapp anyway.

Look, this is the romantic sub forum, so it kind of goes without saying that people posting in the subforum may be a little fixated or obsessive about their therapists. As long as people are bringing it up in session, what's the harm?! This is why most of us are in therapy in the first place., you know... unhealthy attachment styles etc!

This particular thread was set up by someone who wanted to vent and express her feelings... she didn't ask for a moral critique.

I didn't say they were hacking. I was addressing their need to repeatedly check on their T's doings online (which they stated is a problem for them). I also wasn't critiquing (as I very pointedly stated); I was suggesting a perspective that might be of assistance is reframing thinking so that this repeated checking (which they had stated is uncomfortable for themselves also) might be decreased and perhaps ease up that internal tension somewhat.

Although I can't speak for SoAn,for clarity's sake I'm actually not seeing the checking as a problem, I think what you might be referring to is when I said I was also worried about accidently texting my T whilst checking. But the actual checking isn't a big deal for me, I think because I sense my T wouldn't find it a big issue and also the need seems to be lessening over time as I feel connected to her in healthy ways. It doesn't feel a terrible shameful thing because my T wouldn't make it into that. She would understand it.

I didn't read the posts as them worrying about it. It's positive that they're aware of their slightly more compulsive, obsessive behaviours. Also, they aren't checking what their T's are doing online, they are simply looking to see when they were last online. It's a connection thing. I couldn't care less about seeing when or whether my T was last online, but I can be compulsive, obsessive in other ways so I can relate. I suppose the question is, whether or not to offer advice/your opinion when no advice/opinion was asked for?

You can choose who is able to see when you were last online in Whatsapp in the privacy settings. The options are: everyone, my contacts, and none. If you say none, you can't see other people's Last Seen. I think if you have someone in your contacts and they have WhatsApp, you would have to set it to none if you didn't want them to see it. Or maybe block them inside the WhatsApp app, assuming that didn't affect anything outside the app. I'm not sure what the everyone is for. Maybe group chats or something.

Like others brought up, this is the default Whatsapp setting, so it doesn't involve extra snooping.

This is definitely a fair point (although it sounds like you're referring to something more involved than checking someone's last seen status), and I have considered this, even more so after your post here. I agree that a therapist is a person like any other, and their boundaries should be respected, their profession is not a carte blanche for anybody to live out whatever it is they fancy doing.

Nevertheless, I feel that this behaviour (checking my T's last seen), is not so much threatening to my T as it is a sign that something is amiss in my (social) life that would benefit from exploring in therapy sessions. I do think that a therapeutic relationship is not exactly the same as a regular social relationship, and that rather than looking at why this is or isn't inappropriate behaviour, what is most relevant in the therapy setting - for the sake of the client, to be able to improve this in the future - is simply recognizing that this is an urge/need/desire (if it is not a boundary crossing in the experience of the T). To me, most relevant is to explore in therapy what this behaviour gives someone. In my case, I spend a lot of time alone, and it feels as if I am close to him if I see he has been online recently, whether that makes sense or not. And then, how can I fulfill those needs in other ways, why don't I, etc.

When this was posted, it was incredibly painful for me to read. One of the reasons I am in therapy is that, as you phrase it, I do not have a life.
That realisation is very bitter for me, especially as it has been like this for years. I have trouble changing the assumptions I have about the world and others' judgments so that I can start living a little, and not so much in isolation, for instance. It's why I am in therapy, and likely also why I have the urge to check my T's last seen to try and feel close to him/someone - as pathetic and obsessive a way of achieving such a sense of closeness may be. This is, of course, also what's painful about it for me, even though it temporarily makes me feel better.

So I would like to say that, although I assume you did not mean it in a bad way, this is not the forum where these kind of jokes can always be made/taken lightheartedly. It's a great forum, but meaning/intention gets lost easily over text, so let's consider each other's feelings before being too joky.

[directed at T]

I was on the verge of texting you that I miss you. I talked about it with a friend and she convinced me that it was inappropriate, that I would be putting you in a difficult position, so in the end I didn't text you and I removed your number again. It would likely be intrusive to text you and for you to be working and suddenly see such a message pop up. On the other hand, maybe you would like it. I don't know how you feel now, but we both had positive feelings for each other, which makes me think about our relationship in a different way. In some way I feel that I'm being naïve, but I keep coming back to the assumption that it would make you cheer up to be in contact again, even just one text. Perhaps you would be annoyed, that's possible too, but I don't think so. In my mind, it's still possible that something could happen between us at some point, as if I am just waiting for a better moment to arise. Rationally, I know it can't happen, and that it shouldn't, both for me and for you. It doesn't feel that way though.

Maybe I need to talk about it again and have you, or my current T, say very clearly to me that nothing ever will happen. I read the last four words, and I know they are true, but they don't settle in my mind. Fantasies are in the back of my head even as I read them. Perhaps if I did something that would elicit a firmer, clearer response - such as texting you that I miss you - it would actually be helpful for me, but I know that that's still not defensible to do, blabla. I wish I didn't feel like the door was half open somehow though.

The gentle, we-are-on-the-same-level kind of explanation that people give when they feel that you understand something already is not the kind of explanation that will help me change my assumptions on a more emotional level. If I did something irrational, such as texting him I miss him and suggesting we go for a coffee, would likely lead to a clearer and firmer response that I feel I need. Or that would at least be helpful.

It's part of being responsible etc, so even though this kind of response would have helped/would help, it's not as if I am powerless against my fantasies. I think it's the assumption that you would be happy about contact, too, that keeps me coming back to them. Whenever I imagine you being annoyed at an imagined text, it's a moodkiller. The anticipation that you would not shame me for doing this, and that nobody would shame me for it, gives me the feeling it's not something bad to do. Perhaps some shaming would make it easier for me. It is often the fear that my current T (who's in the same practice) would bring it up making me feel ashamed that keeps me from giving in.

If I need shame to stop me from doing this, am I really learning anything?

Late reply on my part, but - yeah I can imagine her not responding would contribute to such a reaction. Nice that you are feeling more trustful about seeing her as long as you want to now though, and less 'needy' as a result. I hope it continued that way over the past weeks and you are still feeling like that. I empathize with the getting married situation as well - that would also have caused me distress, even just knowing of a girlfriend would have. Hang in there!