Unpardonable sin not possible woohoo !

I have been researching this mystery for me, quite some time off and on and have had help from many who differ greatly in their opinion of what it is, all blasphemy is frogiven, except of the holy ghost, but it was always unclear to me what it actually was.

Most who have studied it either think it is not possible in our time or think it is highly unlikely one has done it inadvertantly.(IMO)

Obviously everyone with faith can comprehend scriptures
drasticly different so my intention here is not to debate the validity of others comprehension of what it is, but I have read mainy beliefs on both sides and most who have studied it in detail give me the confirmation that it is "impossible" for us to do or highly unlikely that we can.

Anyway,this has been a heavy load for me in my struggle to explore other beliefs and options in faith since I did not want to do the unpardonable sin in the process of exsploration..or times I have lacked faith in God.

Here is someones very detailed "POSITIVE"comprehension that I feel is "PROBABLY" correct for others who may have had similar thoughts about crossing the line into the unforgiven,while searching for where "you" want to be in your beliefs.

As I said above, others can comprehend this mystery drasticly different, so this is just what I feel is true and very " ENCOURAGING "

Kind Regards
Eddie

The Unpardonable Sin is not possible today. Now this may come as a revelation
to many but here is why I hold to this interpretation. As you read Matthew 12
you again come head to head with the confrontation of the religious leaders with Jesus.
The Pharisees will not open their hearts to the deity of Jesus, and the overwhelming proof
of miracles cannot convince a closed mind-not even the casting out of demons, and the miracle clearly visible to all, as the man spoke in his right mind after Jesus healed him. In this chapter Matthew quotes Isaiah to show that Jesus performed His miracles by the Holy Spirit and not himself. It was the Holy Spirit empowering Him to heal and raise the dead, and it was the Holy Spirit that was being blasphemed.

Yes, enter the son of man, the champion of the blind, lame, sick, possessed, poor, and gentile (Luke 4:18-19). Jesus would give these lost souls respect, honor and most of all, salvation. Yes, jealousy will now enter the hearts of the religious leaders and they will not stop in their scathing and ungodly remarks against Jesus and his democratic beliefs, not even to the point of calling Jesus the devil himself. Jesus makes it known that all sin can be forgiven, but the sin of the Holy Spirit cannot, when Jesus says cannot, that means it is impossible. But why will not Jesus forgive such a sin? Considering his sacrifice was perfect and complete, no sin can with stand the deep grace of God, cf. Romans 5:8-9. And the parable of the Good Samaritan is another wonderful story of love and forgiveness, which seems to point to God's ability to forgive even traitors. We also know that as one walks in the light they will be forgiven of all sin, cf. I John 1:7. The word all means either omission-ignorance-, or co-mission, headstrong. Therefore, God will forgive all sins expect the sin of the Holy Spirit? Why is this? Let us look further.

In Hebrews 6:6 the writer- I believe to be Paul, so he did talk on this subject- is clearly discussing the sin of the Holy Spirit, and claims that those who have been enlightened, tasted and been partakers of the power of spirit, but now have fallen back, cannot-there is that word again- be forgiven. Notice the parallel with Matthew 12? The reason is they cannot be forgiven is they witnessed and partook in the power of the spirit, they were eyewitnesses to the spirits power and deity-face to face-, and they still did not believe, or shrunk back from the deity. This is why both Jesus and Paul confer that one who commits such sin-Ist century phenomenon-cannot and will not be forgiven.

Never again will we witness the profound and great miracles that the first century did. Paul himself in Hebrews 2: 2-4 confirms at the time of this writing, that the power of the spirit had ceased. He states that the miracles were confirmed in the past-historical record of what took place in the past. And if you understand that only the apostles could pass this power on thru the laying on of hands (Acts 8:12ff), and when the apostles died, then so did the ability to pass the miracles on, cf ( Daniel 9:24-miracles and prophesy to cease in the fourth empire-Rome), then you can better understand the one time event of the unpardonable sin. It was not something that would take place throughout history, not any more than the sacrifice of Jesus would happen over and over again, cf. Hebrews 9: 28.

Therefore, the sin of the Holy Spirit is not possible today because the direct operation of the Holy Spirit has ceased-not indwelling however, cf. Acts 2:38, Romans 8:9. And the miracles of Christ have ceased and not to be repeated again. Yes, the forgiveness of God is open to all those who put him on-Romans 6:3-4,and one must not worry about the sin of the unpardonable sin because it is not possible to commit today.

by: Gary Howard

coral, does the bible support transendence or just salvation? ive wondered about that a little... i dont read the Bible like some do, so the answer isnt that important to me, but i wonder.. how do you see the difference between transendence and salvation?

why do you think salvation is the most commomnly considered option? do you think transendence is better to aspire to yourself?

i think i like transendence better...

I actually am not even sure I believe in the MANY comprehensions of the bible really yet.......

I just want to make sure I understand them "just in case" it is the only source of truth.

I will have to give your questions some thought since I am truly unsure of what I actually believe is truth, or if/how it supports transendence.

I am interested in the answers to your questions myself

I will research this and see what I can come up with, then reply when I have my thoughts collected on it.

If anyone else has a responce to NW questions feel free to elaborate since I am stumped

However I can say I like the concept of transendence better

Eddie

thanks coral... i thought of the question while i read your post and trust your answer because i genuinely feel you'll try to answer honestly and not from personal agenda...

if we are truely repentive of our sins we shall be forgiven by God, it's ppl who don't forgive as easily

(((((((notthemama))))))

wise words indeed.....Jin xxxxxxx

!!!

Blaspheme, Blasphemy, Blasphemer, Blasphemous:

either from blax, "sluggish, stupid," or, probably, from blapto, "to injure," and pheme, "speech," (Eng. "blasphemy") is so translated thirteen times in the RV, but "railing" in Mat 15:19; Mar 7:22; Eph 4:31; Col 3:8; 1Ti 6:4; Jud 1:9. The word "blasphemy" is practically confined to speech defamatory of the Divine Majesty.

Nave's Topical Bible (Reviling, Using Harsh, Insolent, or Vituperative Language; Scoffing)

1Cr 5:11; 1Ti 6:4; 1Pe 3:9; 2Pe 2:11; Jud 1:9

Evil Speaking:

is translated "evil speaking" in Eph 4:31, AV (RV, "railing").
See BLASPHEMY.
2 Strong's Number: 2636 Greek: katalalia
Evil Speaking:

"evil speaking," 1Pe 2:1; See BACKBITING.

I strongly disagree that miracles ceased back then. I have seen many miracles in my lifetime. I think/feel is your relationship with God that makes miracles possible. Also the only way to Heaven is thru God himself. salvation rules!

((((((((bebop)))))))

I agree..... He will be the only one to judge EVER......

love and hugs ......Jinnyann xxxxxxx

sorry had a mad moment there .......

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bebop said:
I strongly disagree that miracles ceased back then. I have seen many miracles in my lifetime.

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My comprehension is that the mircales of Jesus as a "man" thru the holy spirit with men as witness have ceased and Jesus has set total forgiveness up for us after giving his own life to bare the burden of sin

My opinion is that with God anything is possible, and this is not the same as the above discripton since mircales have happened even before Jesus through God, not to seperate one from the trinity, is to say everone that has said G-D in their life has blasphemed the ghost,it says all forms of blasphemy but that of the ghost will be forgiven.

My comprehension is that miracles are still possible through God/spirits but not directly through "Jesus " as a "mortal man" by the holy ghost.

Eddie

Where are you drawing the line of distinction between God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit? I'm curious.

Jesus was fully human and fully God. The Holy Spirit is also a facet of the Triune (three-in-one) God. So... if you blaspheme against the Holy Spirit you're also blaspheming God as well as Jesus... in "my comprehension."

To take God's name in vain, or Jesus', as in swearing is also wrong, a sin, but it's not the same as blasphemy.

These are MY beliefs as explained in the Bible... or like you say "MY comprehensions."



** Disclaimer: Coral and I had PMed re the subject of grieving and blaspheming the Holy Spirit. Since he posted his "comprehensions", I felt inclined to respond.

This is another subject that has potential to become a debate. People will have different conprehensions of what the unpardonable sin is, as well as the potential for miracles in our time. We just really need to watch that what we offer here is support, and doesn't question or challenge the beliefs of others.

Eddie, I would like to offer my perspective on your concern, if it helps you. I don't believe that it is possible to commit an unpardonable sin unknowingly. While I do believe in miracles, and I believe that we can be witnesses of the Holy Ghost, I believe that if you know, then you know. To have received a sure witness and to deny it and lead others astray would be a terrible thing. However, if you are searching and have not found what you believe in yet, then when you say that you don't know what is true or what to believe in, you are telling the truth. That isn't a sin by any definition that I know. So, if you are interested in my advice, continue your search, and ask for more information when something calls to you or feels right. You will not be condemned for your honest efforts, and when you do find what you are looking for, your faith will be much stronger than had you never questioned.

I would like to make a request. Because questions like this do have the potential to spark debate and hard feelings, especially when the discussion goes on and on, maybe you could tell us when you feel that your question has been answered to your satisfaction. Then the subject can drop and nobody will feel the need so much to continue trying to make their point. And you can always PM anyone if you want to know more of their point of view.

Thanks,
Rapunzel

september, you did give me scriptures to read in reply to the last question I asked in another thread, but no elaboration, so I was still unclear what you actually thought.

I figured I'd share with others who might also be concerned about this what I felt was a good comprehension,though I have seen many different one's.

I am not really comfortable drawing lines and such at this point in my life so am not really sure how to respond to your question since my mind changes regular as I learn more and more.

I do see what you are saying by using his name in vain is not the same as blasphemy,but alot seem to think it is,I am saying I dont think it is or it would be unforgiven,if they are not seperate and it is blasphemy...my dictonary defines blasphemy as "profane" abuse of God or sacred things

I did get a pm "not from september" that I felt the person condemn'd me for this topic, crypticly implying it was already to late for me, atleast thats how I took it, it is unimportant who it was since it just "encouraged" me to try to understand what it ment that much more,heck I miscomprehend all the time and may even have miscomprehended the pm I got LOL,but I don't think so.

I actually think this is a very good topic though, that is confusing for many.

Rapunzel,I have seen other descriptions like yours and think that is the next best thing to "impossible".

Could you point out what and how "impossible" may have been miscomprehended in your comprehension? How would one witness the holy ghost in our time and know for fact that is what it was like in Math 22:32 ?

It is pretty clear about not forgiven in this age or the age to come. Is this the age to come?

Also why might some think miracles are not possible today ? I thought it just ment miracles through Jesus before he was crucified.

Eddie

To clear any confusions that could possibly be made about me,I will only give my opinion and ask questions,I understand that I am not the best speller or the best organized,but I am just trying to sift through many confusions I have since just scripture don't help me very much since they can be comprehended many different ways that seem to make since to me. I will not post my replys as diffenitive answers to questions, and they are only my opinion if given.

I have experianced in "real life" that alot seem to feel they hold the gate key in my opinion,and state everything as a fact, and if I don't agree with them I am hell bound,this has actually hender'd my search for God,since my faith has always been fragile.
I guess strick rules and guidelines on top of constant condemnation by men if I don't follow them have actually turn'd me astray at points in time,I feel humans turn people away more than the bible,I have come in contact with many who feel the same as I,long before finding this BB,I quess when your faith and mental health is fragile it makes it just that much harder to take,this is why I felt comfort amongst others who know what is like to suffer from fragile mental health as well since I feel they may can relate to me better than most I am in contact with.

I have found some here that are very supportive and feel comfortable with most,I understand I can be difficult at times and this is probably a mental issue of mine so please bare with me if I come across that way once and awhile.

Kind Regards
Eddie

Some churches teach that God doesn't communicate with man anymore, or that there are some kinds of limitations on interactions between God and man. My belief is that God is not limited in that way, and still communicates with us, and calls prophets, and is as concerned with us as He ever was. I believe that there is still revelation, and that the same church and the same gospel that existed from the time of Adam was restored to the earth. Please read this account of how the gospel was restored:

http://scriptures.lds.org/en/js_h/1/16-17#16

The highlighted part tells of what we refer to as "The First Vision," in which God the Father and Jesus Christ appeared to Joseph Smith. If you actually saw God appear to you, then you would be a sure witness, as sure as those who lived in Jesus's time and saw his miracles. There are other miracles that happen in our time too, some large and some small. People are healed of incurable illnesses, or are given what they need when there was no hope of finding it. It might be something so simple as losing something, searching everywhere for it, praying, and finding what you had lost (I have had that happen more than once). If you ask, you can receive your own witness from the Holy Ghost. God doesn't need to come down and appear to each of us, but we can all have that feeling in our hearts if we ask for it that will tell us what is true. I have felt it when I asked, more than once.

If you read more of that passage (scroll up as well as down), you may find some answers to more of your questions. I'm not sure that I am on the same page with you about "the age to come," but regarding the unpardonable sin, I believe that the age to come refers to after death - the next life.

you are on the same page then,I ment did it mean not forgiven now or in the future either...like today.

I will read all of the link.

I thought I was reborn at one time at the alter,but then later started to think this was just me caught up in emotion and not really the spirit of God and am still unsure of this,so not sure was I a witness or not

1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins He is faithful to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteouness.

1 Corinthians 1:22 Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.

Romans 8:35,38-39 What shall separte us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or pesecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? For I am persuaded that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Romans 10 :13 For whoever calls upon the name of The Lord will be saved.

Hi Sky, what is your opinion of what Romans 10:13 means?

I understand it is fairly clear...is this scripture in your opinion,in relation to me being uncertain of whether or not I was truely a witness after being saved ?

I honestly think the emotion subsided possibly starting the same day or in the few that followed since I did not really feel as if my mind was really much different ,after the fact , I was still just plain old crazy me.....I quess I may have just been trying to fit in with the majority around me and could not put up the front for long ,since I felt like I was being dishonest, I also did not like the thought that everyone that did not feel/act the same as I was supposed to be, was hell bound...atleast thats what the majority I was around thought (I think)

Eddie

I was actually saved after a clique of christians at work conspired to get me fired (IMO) several years ago, though it did not work they definantly tried,I quess they had me convinced I needed to be like them,atleast for a few days........

Coral, many people expect to feel differently when they decide to give their live to Christ. It's a lot like when you fall in love with someone. You expect the feeling to last a lifetime. They don't.

Just like marriage, you have to work at what you feel you need to change in your thoughts and your actions. Some changes don't come easy. You feel they don't fit You. This is when the Holy Spirit will nudge you, as He has me, and either you think about it constantly or some other way will feel uncomfortable.

Giving your life to Christ, or "being saved" isn't the same for everyone. It's a very personal thing. God/Holy Spirit meets you exactly where you are at the time. He knows your needs better than you do. He will work with/on you where you need it the most and in a very personal way.

IMO, I think Sky was telling you that "once in Grace, always in Grace"... or something like that. "What can separate us from the love of God?" Nothing! IMO, you are searching for knowledge and understanding... for comprehension of the Truth. Like Sky has also posted (not sure where ATM) "Lean not on your own understanding." If you open yourself to the leading of the Holy Spirit, He will show you the way, give you that comprehension. It's your chose, however. Remember that.

thank you september for the kind reply.

I wonder why so many that I have been exposed to in real life and "it is ALLOT" that are confident in their reservation standing in heaven, talk so much about so many that have been saved, but then fall back into their old ways, I have heard them talking about them many times and it almost always ends in something to the effect that they must never have really been saved...or something to the effect of, " they say their saved but they cant be or they would not still be doing what they were before they were saved, they have to make a noticeable change "...I live in the rual south where probably 98 % have some form of christian belief, so have been exposed to the religion allot.

Obviously I have been around a small handful I'd not describe as above at a few points in time....but usually they are the ones being talked about by the above mentioned groups for something or another

Kind Regards
Eddie

Hi Eddie..... not to belittle your dilema because as you know I've been following your searching but perhaps the words coming to you are suggesting you rest in what you know for a while. Set aside the questions and the hypocrocies that have you doubtful and fearful. Set them aside and be in the knowledge you have.

Try going through the next few days asking yourself 'What would Jesus do?' Determine your actions, your thoughts, your pre-occupations after what you think Jesus would do in each moment of your time.

I've done this on ocassion. Specially when feeling separated from the gift of salvation and forgiveness. How would Jesus respond. What would he do, say, think about my situation if he were walking in my shoes. We talk alot about walking in Jesus' footsteps. Put Jesus in your shoes and walk his footsteps in your own shoes.

After a day or two of that its very clear where you stand in the kingdom of heaven and not only that but, you've lived a wonderful blessing of communion.

Walk in Beauty.....

The first thing that comes to mind at this point is he'd call them all a bunch of self rightious hyporcites,or tell them judge not lest ye be judged or something to the effect.....

Or tell a parable similar to that of seed sowing or something....as to why ones seed did not suceed..but I will take your advice and try to reflect out of my own box for awhile on your advice

..... and try to reflect on everything going on around you and in your life. Not just this one issue or this community of people. Let Jesus' thoughts become your own as you consider your thoughts next to his. Read his words from the Bible but leave the rest of it alone for a time. Just let it be all about being with Jesus for your own self. Not to prove right or wrong, good or evil but to know good and to know righteousness and to come away humbled by the light.

All the best to you....