Moving out?

My son was bullied too. I guess for one whole year in 9th grade he had a bully who would sit near him for the whole bus ride - an hour each way - and say the most horrible and vile things to him. He repeated some of it to me recently, and it was awful. He said he would just sit there as stiff and still as he could the whole time, because any movement he made just brought fresh mocking and cruelty. It saddens me that he went through that and didn't tell me.

We live in a world that just crushes people, dark heart. Just crushes people for no reason. I wish I could change that.

The worst thing for me was that I did tell people and there was no reprocussion for them, but I was the one who had to make the changes to make it stop, according to teachers and everyone. Kids used to push me down the stairs. One group of boys beat me up with a baseball bat. When I went to the principal with th bruises he said I was a "known liar" (I tended to feel sick a lot because my mom was dying so I always wanted to go home,) and that I did it to myself for attention. Kids used to leave notes in my locker telling me to commit suicide.... so I stopped going to my locker. And all of that, they said I was doing for attention.... and so much more....

There was only one time my dad went and talked to a boy's parents to make him stop, but my family was friends with their family.

There are just some of us I feel who have an invisible target, and we're the only ones who don't know it's there until the attacks don't stop.

I do wonder what I would have done if he'd told me. I mean taking him off the bus wouldn't be enough. The problem would still be there at school. And, as you say, the school is often useless in helping with this kind of behavior.

What would and could I have done?

We moved a lot when he was young. Different schools every year until junior high - although some were duplicates, he went to the same school for 1st and 3rd grade and also the same school for 4th and 6th grade. Each year, each school there a kid picking on him in class. In 5th grade I met with the teachers (at their request, over academics). I mentioned that my son was complaining of a bully named Joseph. The teachers all looked mystified but promised they'd watch. A month later they reported that my son and Joseph had what appeared to outsiders to be a joking relationship. In fact, if Joseph looked away or stopped paying attention to my son, he would start poking him to get his attention back.

I don't know if all of my son's grade school bullies were that way, but I do know that in at least one case (kindergarten, Matthew), the teacher seemed to think the two of them were friends, although my son was complaining at home about Matthew. It's puzzling.

I didn't get "bullied" myself. I put "bullied" in quotes, because I can remember isolated incidents of meanness from other kids but never systematic or ongoing mistreatment. I never took any of it to heart. Maybe I just wasn't an interesting enough target?

I did some research at one time about the victims of bullies and whether they had traits that attracted bullies. I found an interesting article that I printed off, and now for the life of me I can't remember what trait they focused on. It did resonate with me, though. It seemed to describe my son. I never talked with him about it for fear he'd think I was 'blaming' him for being tormented. I wouldn't intend that.

Well for me it started by first grade and followed me through high school. In college I think it stopped, but my friends were all fake friends it turned out, so not really sure. But I did't feel "bullied' any more.

My son has friends who also seem to be bullies. But he's six and it's hard to tell. He is also very sensitive. Like if a kid bumps into him he will say he was "pushed." So, hard to say sometimes. But, a lot of the kids at his school I think have disciplin problems at home, so it's hard.

I don't envy you having to sort this out. I guess I didn't have much awareness of bullying when my son was very young, so I really didn't understand. I wish I could turn back the clock and get a do-over, but I fear I'd either make all the same mistakes or make even worse ones by trying to step in and fix things.

I think that's why kids don't tell their folks about these things. Parents seem to have a talent for making things worse when they're trying to help.

Trying to find that article about the kinds of kids who are targeted by bullies. I found this statement on wikipedia:

I have to say that that doesn't describe my son as he was in kindergarten when he acquired his first bully (I don't remember any problems in preschool). He was not aggressive or lacking in social skills. And I know he was popular with his fellow students, because the gym teacher told me that when they took turns doing things in gym class - going one at a time - my son was one of the kids that got the biggest cheers from other kids. She told me that meant he was popular with his peers.

The whole thing just baffles me.

None of those things describe me, actually. I have social problems now because of bullies.

that describes me so much.

except the aggression came on in college. i think the aggression came on because i had been holding it in for so long. suppressing it.

bullying started when i was in kindergarten. still went on into college. i still cant quite figure out why im targeted so much. im still targeted. but by adults in stores and stuff. stuff like that. i just wish i knew why.

my dad used to say ignore them but when i did theyd get in my face more.

it was such hell for me...
i remember mostly getting verbally abused by kids of my own race cause i was seen as a "race traitor" for different reasons. ...but then opposite races called me a nig*er sometimes. i had one guy say he was gonna come hang me. i got made fun of sometimes for my looks i know that much. because i have trichotillomania. but thats the only thing i understood. that wore off as i got into high school. then i would get made fun of for lacking social skills. i begged the admin and they didnt care. they just didnt. god forbid the perpetrators saw me ratting them out id be so dead.

I was super sensitive. I remember everyone always telling me "you're too sensitive." I always felt like I was an alien or something. I just never felt like I belonged, and I still don't. Like at work I just feel like I"m different. I've always felt different.

I don't get bullied exactly but people always have strange reactions to me. Like in stores I can be invisible. If I'm next in line someone will look right over my head and start talking to the person behind me. It's weird.

i think people are a$$holes for one.

Yeah, that's what I kind of think about my son. I wonder if those researchers look at the victims of bullies and describe the effects of being bullied but assume they're the causes.

I think most people aren't.

We really live in a paranoid, shaming culture. People who put themselves out in the public eye risk being ridiculed - not by 'everyone' but by enough anonymous jerks and trolls on the Internet - that most people who are at all sensitive hesitate to make themselves that vulnerable. What a mean world we seem to have created!

There are lots of caring people, though, newtus. Lots. We're the majority, even though it doesn't look that way right now.

its hard to see that from my POV.

most people look like downright a$$holes that target me.

I think there are a lot of jerks out there and a lot of nice people. The more people you know the bigger the population of jerks you run into. I think most people are nice on the outside. But, they are just being polite. I think we live in a very isolationist society and don't really know how to be nice to the person standing next to us othe than "be polite."

Look at Black Friday. I think that comes a lot closer to how a lot of people are....

i would think how people act in politics would come a lot closer to who we really are.

OR even closer would be the people on the internet and the stupid idiotic mean trolling comments.

I'm sorry you've both had such negative experiences.

I found that article on victims of bullying. http://psycserver.psyc.queensu.ca/cr...epler_2000.pdf

It resonated with me a year or so ago with I first read it. I think I'll re-read it and find out if it still seems useful.

Well, Costello. I work in customer service. Maybe it's our society. I would say that we are fortunate in that we have a lot of "nice" patients. But there are a couple of types of nice.

There is the cheerful happy nice person who is genuine.

There is the person who is nice because that's what being polite means.

Then there are the people who are nice but you can tell it's an act.

Then there is the person who isn't nice or a jerk and this type makes me extremely uncomfortable because it's hard to read them.

Then after that comes the first level of jerk, which is low level jerk who is slightly condescending.

Then comes the jerk who feels he is too entiteled to be speaking to you.

Then finally is the full on jerk who doesn't care what people think and will tell you off. (We actually had one of these the other day.)

There is also a study that is interesting that people who have bipolar have more difficulty reading the emotions in faces. It was a study done with bipolar teens and non-bipolar teens. The bipolar teens all would mark "hostile" for faces that were neutral, and the non-bipolar teens would mark "neutral." I don't know if this carries over into other diagnosises, but I would assume it might. That's a big difference. If I find the study I'll link it. This was 4-5 years ago now.

In a way I do customer service too. Reference shifts at a law school library. I'm lucky, though, because we're a small group. No one's going to be a jerk to me. Well, very few.

I guess it's easier to be a jerk when you feel more anonymous.

It is. But it's also easier to be a jerk when you think the person is below you. Being a "secretary" puts me on a low level. Also, doing calls on the phone puts me at "telemarketer" status, which many people think are very low level people. I get a ton of jerks on calls. But, as I said, the more people you're in contact with, the more jerks you find. That is why it seems like the internet is full of jerks sometimes. It's just a huge pool of people all at once.

some sites are more jerky than others. news sites are filled with NOT trolls but actual people are GENUINELY a$$holes.

Yeah, I try to avoid the comment section on news sites. They get me completely up in arms... they can trigger me into mania if I'm not careful. I need a sign on my desk "Don't feed the trolls!" Because I'm one of those people who can get suckered in.