how do you know?

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Maven said:
Women, on the other hand, we tend to look at our bodies in parts. "Oh, my nose is too big," "My hips are too big," "My butt's too small," etc.

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I think that this is an EXTREMELY significant part of women in today's society. Has anyone ever heard of the "Beauty Myth"?? Well it is pretty much this ideal that is created that reduces women to only their looks. No matter where you go, where you look, you're always being involved in this whether you are aware of it or not. The beauty myth tells us what to think of other women, it tells us who they are, and how we should treat them. It implies that when it comes to beauty women must want to embody it, and men must want to posses women who embody it. This is where the media comes in. They create all these ads, or television shows, or WHATEVER with the "ideal" women in them. Then they create this idea that beauty is directly linked to sexuality. And it is through the media that it "teaches" us how to be men and women, teaches us how we should feel about the opposite sex, and what we should be looking for. This is all created for an extremely heterosexual audience, and I think that somewhere along the way, people who are not strictly heterosexual are kind of lost in a sense because everything that they've learned about how they should be feeling isn't necessarily true for them.

And also as it was mentioned before, there are ads of women EVERYWHERE. Womens magazines, men's magazine, you can't get away from this. But what is ironic is women constitute the majority of sales in the media. It is women's money who is contributing to magazines, soaps, television, and yet it is us who is constantly misrepresented. Although i will say that I am glad to see the comercials with "curvier" women in them .. i think its really important for this image to be more publized because it is more realistic. Being super skinny is part of the genetic makeup and so you have people out there who are trying to become a part of this image, yet it is genetically impossible for some.

Anyways, sorry i didn't mean to go on for this long, but i guess what i just wanted to say was that the way the media is portraying women is just ... well its getting to be too much, and it certainly isn't helping people think for themselves. Its instilling images in people's minds of what is "right" and i think that somewhere along there is where all of this confusion comes in.

It's true that men seem to like curvier and women with a little plumpness, rather than women are too skinny, from what I've heard from men directly, plus reading and hearing men on TV, in magazines, on the Internet, and other places.

One thing you might not know is, one of the excuses magazines use for continuing to put skinny models in their magazines is that the designers only give them one or two sizes in the clothing they have for the models. The designers claim (according to the magazine people who have said this) it would be too expensive to send clothes of different sizes. To me, this is bullcrap! We can change things!

I seem to recall somewhere that women are less likely to buy magazines with men on the covers. Don't quote me on that, though. I know I'd enjoy seeing some hot guys on the covers. But I think the reasoning is that women are interested in looking good, and they look to women on the covers for makeup and fashion ideas.

There was a time when fat women were hot. You see the way some artists painted curvy women. Women's beauty standards have changed over the centuries. We've done some crazy things for beauty, and we still do. I tried to quickly find a photo, but I couldn't find one, of a tool once used to shape the foot for high heels. But, if you want an interesting history of footwear, including a photo of some uncomfortable-looking high heels, see http://podiatry.curtin.edu.au/history.html. Of course, you're familiar with the corset. Even today, we do things we think of as normal, but if you think about it, they're rather extreme, for beauty. We get surgery for minor flaws! And, while it's been done for centuries, I'm sure, we do stick needles through our ears--and other parts--so we can stick metal decorations through them. Many (men and women) consider tattoos beautiful, and some people even get into body modification, which can be quite extreme.

In other cultures, they do all kinds of things many of us think is weird, but it's really not so different from us. In Thailand, there are the Padaung "Giraffe Women". I remember a TV show featuring celebrities going to lands that aren't so modern as ours, and some went to an African land, where the natives laughed at how weird it was that one of the American members had a pierced tongue! Some of the Africans had pierced noses, as I recall, or something else that many in American society would consider weird.

Um...what was the topic again? LOL!

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Maven said:
But, if you want an interesting history of footwear, including a photo of some uncomfortable-looking high heels, see http://podiatry.curtin.edu.au/history.html.

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And don't forget the ancient art of Chinese foot-binding though at least that wasn't Western culture. I looked that up a while back after a friend of mine was reading a biography of a Chinese woman. Have you ever seen pictures of that?! It was absolutely horrendous -- women suffered extreme pain for years in order to achieve teeny tiny (3-5 inch long) feet. I think a tenth of them even died as a result of infections from foot-binding. And of course none of them could ever walk properly again.

But this is way off topic! But I definitely think that it's a valid point that the media confuses women about the emphasis on beauty. And the constant portrayal of women could easily result in someone questioning whether they're attracted to women or not . After all, that's all we're being shown.

On a side note, I was really surprised when I was in Las Vegas a year or two ago: I saw the show "Zumanity" and there were men being portrayed sexually as well as women. Granted there were more women, but still. And the men weren't even being made to look effeminate (what often happens when the media tries to show men as sexy). I was impressed.

Anyway, I'll stop rambling.

Sidony

Haha Maven....the original topic is how do you know if you're straight or gay if you haven't been initimate with either sex, and finding the same sex attractive.

I look at other women and what I see is not what I want, but rather what I want to be...
When I say to my bf a girl has nice legs, it means more that I would like to have legs like that, instead of me having actual feelings of attractino towards her...

JustAPixie, that's how I feel, too. I want to be young again, have more elastic skin, more vibrant and youthful skin, thicker hair, redder hair, brighter eyes, etc.

Yes, I know of the Chinese foot binding, too. There are many things we women have done to please our men, and in turn, have learned to see as beauty.

It's really easy to get off-topic, isn't it? It's natural for conversations to evolve. But, to sum up, you have to give yourself time, to evaluate your feelings. It's ok to talk with people about how you're feeling and get help understanding your feelings. If you come to the conclusion that you're gay or bi, talk with others who are gay or bi, because they may have experience dealing with situations that, unfortunately, are common for "different" people, and they can offer support that a straight person may not be able to.

No. It is perfectly acceptable for women to comment on attractivness of other females. I think your friends commemts were a little off color. The human body should be admired.

hi i am new here also ..... but you sound exactally like me 3 yrs ago ...... i am now 28 and a full time lesbian lol
but i think i was a 21 when i stated wondering if my thoughts about women like yours were gay thoughst or just admiration.....turns out all the looking and wondering was not that bad either way i decided to go ..... its just something that kinda happenes .... i have a few questions for you.... have you ever really been into guys? see i dated a guy in high school for a whild but i would not ddo anything with him he was my best friend we did everything together and we still talk to this day. the only thing thay opened my eyes to girls was college some girl hit on me and i had no idea what to do i turned her down i was weirded out but thats all it took it got me thinking after that i did alot of talking on the internet and met my first gf and my life started ...... so my point is i guess if you are thining about it and you have any doubt dont be scared and dont jump into anything give yourself time and it will come to you.... but i think if you are thinking about it and you are not that into guys there is a very good chance you could be and if you have any questions i am here for you please feel free to write back ..... and im really sorry if this is not want you want to hear but for me it was the truth its my life and i love it.

I agree with many of the comments above. I didnt read em all though! I have looked at a female many times. Like said above, some women are blessed with a great body! I dont think i am a lesbian or bi. I think a lot of it is that I am looking at the competion? (for lack of better words) I dont think that makes you a lesbian or bi. Even if you do have slightly sexual thoughts about a female... I have, in thinking how I want to be/look or what I would do with a guy if I looked like her... you know??? Good luck, dont be too hard on yourself, hope this helps!
much love,
mu$ik

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Maven said:
My boyfriend says, as far as the physical aspects go, men look at a woman's body wholly, meaning they look at how everything is proportioned. There are breast men, and leg men and all that, but I think he's right, that most men look at a woman as a whole package. Rhapsody's husband is more right, in that they not only see a whole package in a body, but in the woman's personality and who she is, herself.

Women, on the other hand, we tend to look at our bodies in parts. "Oh, my nose is too big," "My hips are too big," "My butt's too small," etc. If you look at your whole body, you might find some parts you criticize look pretty darn good for your shape! I need to lose weight for me to feel pretty, I admit, and have some "work" done, but I don't feel as uptight about having a big butt, because lots of men like "junk in the trunk"!

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Men are about proportion ... ?

Also about breeding potential ... having some hips as opposed to having no hips = more attractive for many ...

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