[AmandaBroken]

I can not say I did not see this coming. The church I go to is very conservative. Members at one time would only allow or prefer, the men to be in suits and the women in dresses. Now things are different, men wear jeans and women pants. Although some women wear yoga pants and leggings, or tights. Some women cover up their butts by wearing long shirts, some do not. Sometimes I find myself looking at them more than I should.

When my parents were alive I always wore dresses, but after they passed away I started to wear skinny jeans, tights, short shorts, tank tops with no bra, and lots of piercings, makeup, and other stuff.

I then started to date a girl from church. First, it was kissing and holding hands but it quickly moved to heavy petting. We tried to keep it a secret but we were eventually caught.

The staff at the church were always telling me this was wrong but I never listened. The followed the biblical form of discipline, first, they tried to counsel me. Then they tried having me meet with 2 or 3 elders. After a while, they made an announcement in the church that I was no longer a member but I could attend if I would tone down my clothes. But I just could not do this. I liked my clothes, I was constantly buying new clothes, hot stuff and was always visiting the store "Hot Topics."

Well, they have taken the final step. They sent an email stating I was excommunicated. That I was no longer welcomed in the church. They also instructed people from the church to shun me in the hopes this would drive me to repentance. I'm kinda in shock. Not sure what to do, besides cutting. Sadly I must say I have done that. (But I have been S.I. free for 3 weeks and one day now.) It's easy to say go someplace else, but where. I was born into this church it has been a part of my life now for just over 21 years.

Saying I'm heart broken just doesn't say enough.

I'm sorry this happened to you. Religion should be an excuse to love someone, not hate them.

[Patagonia]

I'm really sorry to hear this. But I have to ask if ANY of their teachings were from the New Testament?? How could this place call themselves a church where they don't stand on the basic pillars of faith. Wow! It's shocking to hear this...now a days when everyone preaches acceptance & im sorry you don't have a place to go to.
Yrs ago I used my church as a place to crawl into & catch my breath from all the outside noise. It was a haven of sorts. Not anymore tho.
I hope you find comfort in a place that accepts you, all of you & always makes you feel welcomed.

[amandalouise]

I took time to reread your post more than once... here is what jumped out at me...

you and this girl were sexually active on church property (evidence you stated they caught you kissing, holding hands and heavy petting, they would not have caught you if you were not doing this in/ on church property. right? if you were not doing this on church property then the church (pastor/ reverend ...) would not have caught you.)

the church talked with you about this acting out on church property.

the church after trying to discuss the problem told you that though you would not be considered a member of that church you .... could.... continue to attending their church services if you follow their dress code.

you refused to follow the church dress code and code of behavior.

none of that says you got excommunicated for being a lesbian.

lets put it in another situation...

a high school and their dress code and their no smoking code. ok if you get caught misbehaving and not following a schools dress code and a schools code of conduct a student gets expelled. its not because they are a lesbian, its because they broke the rules.

another example going to the mall or shopping

stores have a dress code people have to wear shirts and shoes. and they have a code of conduct no stealing, no damaging property, no sexually explicit behavior. if a shopper goes to this store with out their shirt, shoes or attempts to use the dressing rooms for sex they are asked to leave and if their behavior doesnt change they are told they can never enter the store...

my point...

the church has a right to set their own rules of conduct and dress code and a church has a right to work with the church member to try and work out the problem but if the member refuses to follow the rules then they are told they are no longer welcome.

its just the way it is in churches, schools, stores and other public businesses.

my suggestion is if you want to be a member of this church then you may have to make some hard decisions like not behaving in sexual manner in church and follow the churches dress code while on their property and attending their church.

maybe this will help going to church is what a couple hours out of 166 hours a week. that means you have 160--162 hours a week where you can meet your friend a place that it is acceptable to kiss, hold hands and heavy petting like her home, your home, a hotel, a motel and other non public places where there are no laws about public sexual acts and crimes.

[AmandaBroken]

Originally Posted by amandalouise

I took time to reread your post more than once... here is what jumped out at me...

you and this girl were sexually active on church property (evidence you stated they caught you kissing, holding hands and heavy petting, they would not have caught you if you were not doing this in/ on church property. right? if you were not doing this on church property then the church (pastor/ reverend ...) would not have caught you.)

the church talked with you about this acting out on church property.

the church after trying to discuss the problem told you that though you would not be considered a member of that church you .... could.... continue to attending their church services if you follow their dress code.

you refused to follow the church dress code and code of behavior.

none of that says you got excommunicated for being a lesbian.

lets put it in another situation...

a high school and their dress code and their no smoking code. ok if you get caught misbehaving and not following a schools dress code and a schools code of conduct a student gets expelled. its not because they are a lesbian, its because they broke the rules.

another example going to the mall or shopping

stores have a dress code people have to wear shirts and shoes. and they have a code of conduct no stealing, no damaging property, no sexually explicit behavior. if a shopper goes to this store with out their shirt, shoes or attempts to use the dressing rooms for sex they are asked to leave and if their behavior doesnt change they are told they can never enter the store...

my point...

the church has a right to set their own rules of conduct and dress code and a church has a right to work with the church member to try and work out the problem but if the member refuses to follow the rules then they are told they are no longer welcome.

its just the way it is in churches, schools, stores and other public businesses.

my suggestion is if you want to be a member of this church then you may have to make some hard decisions like not behaving in sexual manner in church and follow the churches dress code while on their property and attending their church.

maybe this will help going to church is what a couple hours out of 166 hours a week. that means you have 160--162 hours a week where you can meet your friend a place that it is acceptable to kiss, hold hands and heavy petting like her home, your home, a hotel, a motel and other non public places where there are no laws about public sexual acts and crimes.

I think you greatly misunderstood the situation. There are a lot of things I didn't say.

Just a few responses...

First... We never did anything on the church ground. Except maybe holding hands. But tried to be careful. We were caught off the property. I am sorry if I did not make that clear.

Second... Yes, I wore clothes that were considered sexy, but the church allowed women to wear yoga pants and leggings which clearly show the *** of a woman. They had a double standard.

Third... If you had proposed a question instead of an attack I would have explained. I have no doubt the church followed their rules. But this church is so conservative they wanted me to stop all medication and realize that my mental illness was a sin. Under their direction, I stopped my meds and had a major relapse. They do not believe in chemical imbalances in the brain. It is all sin.

Forth... I understand rules. I know they followed biblical procedure. I am not made at what they did but how they did it and how I am being shunned by the whole church while those who commit adultry get away with it.

Thank you for you most unhelpful reply...

[Quarter life]

Belonging to any church is in a lot of ways like belonging to a club. All members follow certain beliefs and adhere to certain rules. I'm not sure how often you attend, but I'm assuming that you are a member because you agree with their teachings. I don't often feel comfortable wearing a suit to business meetings, but smart business attire is part of the culture I work in, and also a form of respect to our colleagues and clients to dress this particular way........I would much rather rock up in a pair of jeans and T-shirt....However my job is important to me.

I guess what Im trying to say is that we all must follow rules and sometimes 'eat crow' to get along in life. I also keep my personal life and medical issues out of the workplace....as it is no ones business except my own.

At the end of the day it is a matter of just how important being a member of this group is to you...if you feel they are biased in their dealings, and too conservative, then you should maybe research other options in regard to where you worship. Some churches aren't for everyone, and often our views change as we get older...no judgement...just the way life is.

The church has no right to make any decisions FOR you. Its your life. Maybe the church excommunicated you because were kissing and so on in public and not the fact that you are lesbain. I know everyone has their own beliefs but that doesn't give the church any right to inflict them on you. I'm sorry this happened. Maybe one day there will be a future without so much discrimination.

[AmandaBroken]

Originally Posted by DaX15

The church has no right to make any decisions FOR you. Its your life. Maybe the church excommunicated you because were kissing and so on in public and not the fact that you are lesbain. I know everyone has their own beliefs but that doesn't give the church any right to inflict them on you. I'm sorry this happened. Maybe one day there will be a future without so much discrimination.

I appreciate the kind words...

[Patagonia]

I'm pretty sure there's a story in the Bible about 2 people giving alms. One is up at the front making a big production about it so everyone notices. The other is a poor older woman in the back giving her last penny.
The question is raised about who is doing this better etc. I'm sorry I don't know the story word for word.
But here's the point. People go to church for different reasons but figure they're all there for the same purpose.
What is worn on the body should not make a difference as to what the body & brain is there for.
Where's the acceptance?

I understand others pointing out work & social situations, but are we mixing laws for church & state?
Usually the people that are pointing the fingers are the ones that have the most problems. Who cares what you're backside looks like or how much skin is showing.....is that what you came to church for?
Personally I'd run far away from this "church."

[amandalouise]

did some checking on this issue of lesbians in church. here in the USA all churches now accept openly LGBTQ, they may not agree with it but because its federal law that no discrimination due to sexual orientation and same sex marriage the churches in america can not excommunicate someone due to their sexual orientation. they can choose not to perform same sex marriage and the couple may need to go to another church that does perform that service but churches can not excommunicate their members based on sexual orientation. The pope has even come on board as recognizing LGBTQ is ok for the catholic churches around the world.

my suggestion is if you still feel like you were excommunicated based on sexual discrimination not as a violation of the churches code of conduct and dress code while on their property and attending their services, contact your locations civil rights department. They will do an investigation and if your civil rights as a LGBTQ person has been violated they will prosecute the church and those involved with the decision to excommunicate based on sexual discrimination.

[Unrigged64072835]

I'm sorry that you used to go to a church that doesn't accept you. Not very Christian of them.

I go to a progressive Christian church. It has a gay pastor and people love him.

[Bill3]

I am so very sorry for the loss of your parents.

(((((AmandaBroken)))))

[AmandaBroken]

Originally Posted by Bill3

I am so very sorry for the loss of your parents.

(((((AmandaBroken)))))

Thanks...

[wiretwister]

welcome to the real world ... many organizations (church or secular) tend to act cult-like in that they demand total obedience to there life style rules or their standards ... many due this to "protect" the other members from outside influence ... or maybe to (in there mind's set) to protect you from yourself ... but most (my opinion) due this to protect there power over the members ...

as I see it you have two choices ... sell your soul and toe there mark , kiss the ground they walk on and beg to be accepted on there terms and live your life on there terms ... or ... accept things as they are and life your life as you desire ... I do not know there mindset but you may ... if they had your best interest maybe you should reconsider ... there is also a chance you may just be rebelling using the church in place of your parents ... if this social connection means that much to you ... then you need to decide why ... and decide if you want to save it ...

I really do wish you find peace in your life as it sounds that you are being pulled in many different directions .... Tigger ..

ps: this is and always has been your decision ... and the results are totally your responsibility ... they were clear up front ... what was coming ...

[AmandaBroken]

Originally Posted by wiretwister

welcome to the real world ... many organizations (church or secular) tend to act cult-like in that they demand total obedience to there life style rules or their standards ... many due this to "protect" the other members from outside influence ... or maybe to (in there mind's set) to protect you from yourself ... but most (my opinion) due this to protect there power over the members ...

as I see it you have two choices ... sell your soul and toe there mark , kiss the ground they walk on and beg to be accepted on there terms and live your life on there terms ... or ... accept things as they are and life your life as you desire ... I do not know there mindset but you may ... if they had your best interest maybe you should reconsider ... there is also a chance you may just be rebelling using the church in place of your parents ... if this social connection means that much to you ... then you need to decide why ... and decide if you want to save it ...

I really do wish you find peace in your life as it sounds that you are being pulled in many different directions .... Tigger ..

ps: this is and always has been your decision ... and the results are totally your responsibility ... they were clear up front ... what was coming ...

Ouch... Tough Message... Good words...

[Trace14]

Originally Posted by AmandaBroken

I can not say I did not see this coming. The church I go to is very conservative. Members at one time would only allow or prefer, the men to be in suits and the women in dresses. Now things are different, men wear jeans and women pants. Although some women wear yoga pants and leggings, or tights. Some women cover up their butts by wearing long shirts, some do not. Sometimes I find myself looking at them more than I should.

When my parents were alive I always wore dresses, but after they passed away I started to wear skinny jeans, tights, short shorts, tank tops with no bra, and lots of piercings, makeup, and other stuff.

I then started to date a girl from church. First, it was kissing and holding hands but it quickly moved to heavy petting. We tried to keep it a secret but we were eventually caught.

The staff at the church were always telling me this was wrong but I never listened. The followed the biblical form of discipline, first, they tried to counsel me. Then they tried having me meet with 2 or 3 elders. After a while, they made an announcement in the church that I was no longer a member but I could attend if I would tone down my clothes. But I just could not do this. I liked my clothes, I was constantly buying new clothes, hot stuff and was always visiting the store "Hot Topics."

Well, they have taken the final step. They sent an email stating I was excommunicated. That I was no longer welcomed in the church. They also instructed people from the church to shun me in the hopes this would drive me to repentance. I'm kinda in shock. Not sure what to do, besides cutting. Sadly I must say I have done that. (But I have been S.I. free for 3 weeks and one day now.) It's easy to say go someplace else, but where. I was born into this church it has been a part of my life now for just over 21 years.

Saying I'm heart broken just doesn't say enough.

Wow, that truly sucks. There are churches with majority gay members. What you do in the bedroom should have nothing to do with your respect and love for the higher power of your choice. With that being said I doubt the church is ever going to change. Might be better to find another church. Even if you were allowed to come back you would be watched and judged by others. Not a healthy religious atmosphere, imho. Leaving that church may be hard but life is about moving forward and accepting the changes that come with that. We are always changing. Just like you changed after the death of your parents, which I'm sorry to hear. But leaving this church is like escaping that toxic relationship, it's will be hard, it's what you need to do, and you will get through it. Grab your support people and get them involved in the plan. Reach out to them when you feel weak or defeated.
I do hope you have found some resolution to this and know that you can love who you want and still worship a higher power. Best wishes.

[sabby]

Unfortunately this thread goes beyond our Community Guideline of limiting our direct discussion of religion and will now be closed.

Limit your direct discussion of politics and religion, as people usually hold pretty strong opinions about these topics.