[DazedandConfused254]

Today’s reason for my grumpiness? The world’s ideal for chatty, dominant extroverts. We live in double-standards where the phrase "be yourself" is at every street corner, yet seemingly the entire human race always wigs out every time I screw up socially or have a quiet/introverted personality. On Myers Briggs I have scored slightly extroverted, but truly identify more ambivert (middle of Int-Ext spectrum). But still feel punished for not being completely extroverted.

For almost 2 years now I’ve gone through counseling sessions and taken meds for the spectrum of anxiety disorders in large part due to a heavy weight of guilt I’ve had to carry with losing friends quite literally over one wrong thing said or an inappropriate social move. This was the story of my social life during undergrad at my uni. When I have reached out to well-intentioned friends about these issues provoking a poor self-esteem, I receive unsympathetic answers like “you know you’re not supposed to do x,y,z”. When people have recommended working on so-called “social skills” they are never clear as to what this term means or what I should improve. C’mon man gimmie a break. I am not a behaviorist. Speaking of behaviorists people think its ok to pathologize the crap out of someone who's any less than extroverted or perfect with social niceties. Plus my loved ones who spend the most time with me and know me the most know me for taking courtesy and tact to the next level. Isn't the advice of people who know me best the only thing that matters?

Although I understand this is not reality, society gives me a sobering impression that if I'm not absolutely perfect socially nor 100% extroverted, it's a heinous crime and I'll live life at the bottom of society's totem pole and stay there. It's like I'm never going to be good enough with others or not social enough.

Cut to the chase: Is it ok to be introverted, quiet, or make the occasional faux pas? Is “Be Yourself” a real phrase or just a conspiracy to further my misery?

[zapatoes]

Can relate to what you are saying and I’m an INTJ. I’m a typical introvert and prefer having a few close friends over having several friends. Would love to be able to “fake” being an extrovert, but have social anxiety to some degree.

[TishaBuv]

How frustrating it must feel to lose friends over a simple misstep. I guess the best you can do is learn from each mistake. Are you sure it’s an introvert/extrovert thing, though?

I am in the same boat. Have rusty social skills and at the bottom of everything. Even when I receive a phone interview for a job, I am expected to be extrovert and funny ... etc, which I am not. When people say be yourself, I think they mean not to think too much. I have found that I overthink things, and that's why I probably mess things up. But I cannot help it. It's anxiety-induced and anxiety-inducing at the same time, if that makes sense.

But I agree, there is a preference in the world towards extroverts, and people who are not very sociable don't get the same share as sociable people. I would say, being sociable and extrovert is more import than being competent when interviewing for a job (I am using the job example, because I am seeing its effect in my life in that domain these days). I think it's true for many things as well, like romantic relationships.

People are usually judged by their social skills the first thing. For some reason, it's a bad sign, and it tends to affect the total judgment of a person. It's called the halo effect in psychology.

[DazedandConfused254]

Thank you for your responses everyone.

zapatoes: I'm glad that I have found someone who relates to me. It's all about the quality of friends and not the quantity.

TishaBuv: Got a special shout out to you and thank you for your helpful and insightful response. Already feel better that you've understood my situation and have reminded me maybe so-called friends are really friends when they explode over a social mistake. Good point... The more I have stewed upon the OP the more I've thought about that point. I've heard of the "awkward extrovert" and the "gregarious introvert" anyway....

Background Noise: I can relate to you on all those levels. I come from a very analytically-minded family so unfortunately I am guilty of over-thinking and often hyper-focus on some awkward/off-moment that I completely forget what I was originally overthinking about. I think I'm pretty decent socially but most people I have met tend to put the microscope on me to watch for every mistake I seem to make. Those who criticize people for social blunders seem to speak the loudest (often with a megaphone!). This is also the reason I'm embracing my singleness.

P.S. to Background Noise: I see you are pretty new here so welcome to PC! I hope that you've found this forum useful and have been finding an online family here like I have!

[Lefty Seven]

Here's a theory: Extroversion is glorified and made socially mandatory because it sells. Extroversion, especially in the context of social media, promotes lifestyles and associated products and services, while introversion, by contrast, has no market value. If you're not extolling the virtues of your favorite snack food illustrated by a selfie of you snarfing it down, you are of no value to the retailer or the economy.

Extroversion, especially amplified and hyper-distributed by social media networks, is a valued market asset and money makes the world go round. Remember that the primary underlying function of each step of mass media development, from newspapers to radio to television to movies to the internet, is the advertising and promotion of products.

Introverts are of no value in this system, so the system stigmatizes introversion and glorifies and insists on extroversion to serve its purposes. In Oliver Stone's film JFK, Donald Sutherland's X told Kevin Costner's Jim Garrity that the primary organizing principle of any society is to wage war. I don't disagree, but the secondary organizing principle of any society is to facilitate commerce. Introversion is bad for commerce.

My reasoning is that in this modern world where we live alongside thousands and millions of people who we don't know, the only way to know someone's intentions is through socialization. In the age of hunters-gatherers this wasn't a problem, because we have evolved in small groups with kin relatives, and everyone knew everyone very well. Socialization withing these groups was important, but it was easier.

[DazedandConfused254]

Of course it often seems as if some degree of extroversion is required in daily life. How else can our president, for example, build a repertoire with his country and cabinet to get elected? Keeping this former part of this post in mind, I would like to clarify that my question posed is seeking if it is ok to be introverted or have non-mainstream traits in situations where it is not required to be completely extroverted, chatty, perfectly social, etc. If this makes sense. The whole idea behind this OP is that I have gone through some mini-traumas with previous friend groups and overly-sensitive people so I am beginning to question if there is even any benefit to socialization or persistent efforts at genuine relating at all outside of situations necessitating extroversion, such as work and so forth.

[winter loneliness]

I am extroverted and I get on people's nerves. I talk a lot, am loud and can be obnoxious! I enjoy people who are introverted. My brothers were shy, my mother was shy and my sons are shy.

I think there is some notice of introverts. Millenials are staying home more than going out, Netflix and other streaming service are growing and food delivery meal kits are popular. I think marketing has changed a bit.

Embrace who you are.

Originally Posted by DazedandConfused254

Of course it often seems as if some degree of extroversion is required in daily life. How else can our president, for example, build a repertoire with his country and cabinet to get elected? Keeping this former part of this post in mind, I would like to clarify that my question posed is seeking if it is ok to be introverted or have non-mainstream traits in situations where it is not required to be completely extroverted, chatty, perfectly social, etc. If this makes sense. The whole idea behind this OP is that I have gone through some mini-traumas with previous friend groups and overly-sensitive people so I am beginning to question if there is even any benefit to socialization or persistent efforts at genuine relating at all outside of situations necessitating extroversion, such as work and so forth.

It's OK to be introvert, however, extroversion takes you far and beyond in life. Most people like extroverts. If an introvert went somewhere with an extrovert friend, probably the extrovert would be remembered, but not the introvert, at least not positively, most of the time.

Socialization is the only way to read someone's mind and know his/her intentions. It promotes trust. We humans have evolved to be ultra sociable because we are weak as individuals, and socialization was critical to surviving. Without collaboration we wouldn't have survived, and collaboration needs the element of trust.

I consider myself as introvert and anxious. These are two different things. I get anxious around people, specially those whom I don't know. But even when I am with people I know and feel more relaxed, I prefer not to talk too much and prefer to be alone.

So, it's OK to be introvert, but you need to accept what comes with it

[DazedandConfused254]

Background Noise: I guess my main goal is to find people who accept me, as is the case with many people on PC. It's not so much to gain the approval of every obnoxious extrovert in society, nor is it to always be remembered like inventing the wheel. I learned this lesson looking back over my years of college, and have realized that I spent pretty much the whole time looking in the wrong places to be accepted. When I have read your posts over and over again, I have thought to myself: "Why would anybody be my friend if they were extroverted and forced me to be the same in order to be remembered and liked?"

But I have noticed those same positive effects in the small amount of socializing I get in with a small group of friends. Thanks for your help.

[DazedandConfused254]

Originally Posted by winter loneliness

I am extroverted and I get on people's nerves. I talk a lot, am loud and can be obnoxious! I enjoy people who are introverted. My brothers were shy, my mother was shy and my sons are shy.

I think there is some notice of introverts. Millenials are staying home more than going out, Netflix and other streaming service are growing and food delivery meal kits are popular. I think marketing has changed a bit.

Embrace who you are.

@winter loneliness: This rocks!! I really dig this. We need more people who are extroverted, yet acknowledge there is an introvert population that deserves respect in the same way as the extroverted population. I guess some of my bad experiences with people in my generation who are rather unaccepting of my introvert traits came with just searching in the wrong crowd. Now that I think about this topic more carefully I remembered that most of my friends are quite introverted, and I still value them. Thanks for reminding me to be myself and for giving me hope!

[zapatoes]

Regarding introversion there is a good book about Introverts and its called something like Being Introverted in A World That Can’t Stop Talking by Susan Cain and it discusses the strengths and advantages of being an introvert who is also a business leader for example and explains how introverts see the world.

[DazedandConfused254]

Thanks for the recommendation! As I've gotten into psych things and have discovered the stigma introverts face that is a book that keeps coming up! Even as an ambivert I have to check it out

[sarahsweets]

Its perfectly ok to be an introvert imo. My husband is and you would never have thought we'd have gotten together but I met him when i was 18 and it was love at first sight. I make up for his deficits. And he helps calm me down and keep me in check. I am extremely friendly, I talk to everyone its my nature but it helps to know that everyone is not me and I try and be sensitive to that.

Originally Posted by DazedandConfused254

Today’s reason for my grumpiness? The world’s ideal for chatty, dominant extroverts. We live in double-standards where the phrase "be yourself" is at every street corner, yet seemingly the entire human race always wigs out every time I screw up socially or have a quiet/introverted personality. On Myers Briggs I have scored slightly extroverted, but truly identify more ambivert (middle of Int-Ext spectrum). But still feel punished for not being completely extroverted.

For almost 2 years now I’ve gone through counseling sessions and taken meds for the spectrum of anxiety disorders in large part due to a heavy weight of guilt I’ve had to carry with losing friends quite literally over one wrong thing said or an inappropriate social move. This was the story of my social life during undergrad at my uni. When I have reached out to well-intentioned friends about these issues provoking a poor self-esteem, I receive unsympathetic answers like “you know you’re not supposed to do x,y,z”. When people have recommended working on so-called “social skills” they are never clear as to what this term means or what I should improve. C’mon man gimmie a break. I am not a behaviorist. Speaking of behaviorists people think its ok to pathologize the crap out of someone who's any less than extroverted or perfect with social niceties. Plus my loved ones who spend the most time with me and know me the most know me for taking courtesy and tact to the next level. Isn't the advice of people who know me best the only thing that matters?

Although I understand this is not reality, society gives me a sobering impression that if I'm not absolutely perfect socially nor 100% extroverted, it's a heinous crime and I'll live life at the bottom of society's totem pole and stay there. It's like I'm never going to be good enough with others or not social enough.

Cut to the chase: Is it ok to be introverted, quiet, or make the occasional faux pas? Is “Be Yourself” a real phrase or just a conspiracy to further my misery?

[nicoleflynn]

It is okay to be who you are. WHY be like someone else? There is only one you!

[downandlonely]

I struggle with social skills too. It's like other people automatically know how to behave and what to say in social situations and I don't.

[DazedandConfused254]

Originally Posted by downandlonely

I struggle with social skills too. It's like other people automatically know how to behave and what to say in social situations and I don't.

Thanks for replying. I guess in my situation it's not that I completely lack social skills, because when I am at full capacity to interact with others, people have described me as tactful or courteous, and even classy on a few occasions. It's more about this narcissistic generation we live in now, where perfection is the norm, sadly expanding into social situations.

[DazedandConfused254]

Originally Posted by sarahsweets

Its perfectly ok to be an introvert imo. My husband is and you would never have thought we'd have gotten together but I met him when i was 18 and it was love at first sight. I make up for his deficits. And he helps calm me down and keep me in check. I am extremely friendly, I talk to everyone its my nature but it helps to know that everyone is not me and I try and be sensitive to that.

Thank you so much for your response, @sarahsweets. You sound like a fun person to get to know and also the perfect spouse to your hubbie! Even in my quieter or my "off" moments I strive to be the same way.

[DazedandConfused254]

Originally Posted by nicoleflynn

It is okay to be who you are. WHY be like someone else? There is only one you!

Big thanks and shout out to you. Couldnt have put it any better!

I’m an introvert. Being shy or anxious are not the same things as introversion... I happen to be a shy, anxious introvert though. I worked hard overcome my social anxiety and shyness but I’ll always be an introvert.

I don’t like the bias against introverts. I get so aggravated when I watch a crime show and inevitably the murderer is described as a “socially awkward”.... “shy”..... introverted person.

I believe roughly half the world’s population is introverted. That means an awful lot of us are hiding our introversion to get ahead or fit in with society.

[Goforward]

I agree there is a social bias toward extroverted people persons. It is challenging to make and keep friends when you are introverted. My husband left me because I couldn't bring people into our lives. It is a double whammy being neurotic and an introvert. All of this falls under accepting what I cannot change.

[DazedandConfused254]

Sisabel: Thank you so much for your reply. Always great hearing from you. Yeah I agree that although shyness/social anxiety are not always inter-related, people in general are otherwise brainless and fickle when it comes to being absolutely perfect with what you say or do socially. If half of the population is introverted maybe it's just simply another way of being

Goforward: Now that is the most superficial thing for your husband to leave you over. I am so sorry that you had to go through that. Since I am an ambivert who has quite a bit of introverted friends I think you will eventually come across people who will accept you for who you are

[Fuzzybear]

Originally Posted by Sisabel

I’m an introvert. Being shy or anxious are not the same things as introversion... I happen to be a shy, anxious introvert though. I worked hard overcome my social anxiety and shyness but I’ll always be an introvert.

I don’t like the bias against introverts. I get so aggravated when I watch a crime show and inevitably the murderer is described as a “socially awkward”.... “shy”..... introverted person.

I believe roughly half the world’s population is introverted. That means an awful lot of us are hiding our introversion to get ahead or fit in with society.

I agree. This bias really is too bad and so wrong.

At the “least” people labelled as “shy” or “introverted” etc are labelled as “dull” by extroverts with inflated egos who don’t bother to attempt to get to know them. Shrugs, I find those judgmental A holes “dull and boring”

[DazedandConfused254]

Originally Posted by Fuzzybear

I agree. This bias really is too bad and so wrong.

At the “least” people labelled as “shy” or “introverted” etc are labelled as “dull” by extroverts with inflated egos who don’t bother to attempt to get to know them. Shrugs, I find those judgmental A holes “dull and boring”

I love some straight forward honesty. You said it perfectly - its often the loudmouths who are often the most superficial and empty, not the other way around!