[xp1155]

Doing this PhD thing with Bipolar (mixed episodes and rapid cycling) sucks. I have been on and off so many meds that it's affecting my performance in school. I made it through my Masters; but I am not sure if I can make it through my PhD. I am going to try to adjust meds over the break. Currently, we took care of the mania (hypomania typically and mania is NOT the problem), but I am abusing caffeine to deal with the depression.

At what point do you step away and try to take care of yourself? I love teaching the undergrads but I am not being challenged and I find the coursework to simply be busywork. I am thinking about working for a few years and returning later, yet I am not sure if I can get back into a PhD program after leaving under these circumstances.

[faerie_moon_x]

I think you're really strong to be going after your PhD! That is a huge accomplishment. I wish I'd had the conviction to even try. I really did want to be a psychiatrist. I wanted to because my cousin has schizophrenia and I wanted to help people. But, I didn't even make it through my assosiates degree. So, I think it is amazing what you have accomplished!

I know for a fact that when I dropped out of college I was fully intending to go back. I never did. You know those comercials where it says "life comes at you fast" and like one second a kid on a swing is 5 and then suddenly he's full grown.... well, that is life.... Why am I not still 19? I was only 19 yesterday. And that is a huge regret for me that I "gave up on myself." I often feel like a total failure. I'm a secretary. I'm too smart for my job yet I struggle at my job. It is hard to come to terms with. Of course, I didn't drop out because of my health, (although it was just it wasn't to make myself better it was the direct result of being ill, I thought I was far too stupid to finish school.)

So, I think if you need to stop for your health, you need to first acknowledge that stopping for your health isn't being a failure. You have to do what is right for you, and that it is the right choice. And if you are unable to go back, that it isn't a reflection on you in a negative way. If you can go back, then that's great! Don't work so hard you make yourself sick.

I hope whatever you choose you realize that you have done a great job so far already.

[AniManiac]

Much sympathy. I'm in the same boat, more or less, except I'm almost done and I just got diagnosed. And no mixed episodes yet, as far as I know. My meds are being changed every other week, which makes dissertation writing extra hard. Like it needed any help...

Don't all grad students abuse caffeine? Just kidding - it's such a stereotype, one just assumes it's normal!

Coursework is busywork in many ways. The only thing to be done about it is to get it done, and get on with it. Life gets much better once the coursework is done. Fewer constraints on your time and more flexibility to work the way you need to. If you're not being challenged in your courses, though, talk to your advisor and/or profs - I'm sure they can help you find ways to make it live up more closely to your expectations! I always figured that going the academic route means that if I'm bored, it's my fault. That means it's also my opportunity to fix it - what a privilege! Most people's jobs don't allow that freedom.

Most of the time, people who leave a PhD program never come back. It's not that they couldn't, but life moves on. Making a real paycheck for awhile makes it harder to go back to student wages. It's hard to transition back into the academic world if you've been away from it. After a long enough period of time, credits expire, etc. You can probably take a leave of absence if you need to (check with your program director) but if you can hack it and still have the passion for it, IMHO you should keep going.

I have found my advisor (and most of our faculty) to generally be quite sensitive to the "real life" needs of PhD students. This is not a sprint, it's a marathon, and you need to keep up your health. I've had to dial back my work hours and travel considerably because I was getting pretty burned out, plus all the bipolar stuff popping up. I can't work 80 hours a week (for long) without starting to have serious consequences, so I'm just not going to do that to myself. No one has complained yet.

Good luck - it's a tough spot to be in. I hope it improves soon!

[Anneinside]

I earned a PhD before I was diagnosed but already had bipolar... have been for most of my life. Yes, some of the coursework feels like busy work but profs need a way to assess your learning so dig in and get it done as soon as you can. Your research and writing can be a challenge but also very interesting. I found that I did best in writing in blocks of time, such as writing my lit review during Christmas break. I went into a room, got rid of all distractions and went through every article I had found, mined for relevant information and then on to the next.

It is possible to earn a Ph.D. but I would agree with the others that if you drop out now you can lose credits and may not be accepted into another program as you may no longer viewed as a good candidate. If you want to teach at a university then stick with it. Be aware that tenure positions can be scarce, depending on your area and having dropped out and returned may not be viewed positively. So the question is, what do you want to do with your life?

[Artesian Wells]

I almost cried when I saw your post because I am feeling so down about how unable I am to function at school and work. I am currently working on my masters in a helping profession related degree and this makes it even more challenging. I got into this profession because in some way I wanted to help people, just like people have helped me. I feel sometimes I do a wonderful job because "I get it" because I live it and have fought tooth and nail to be able to manage my illness, but at times no matter how hard I fight, things become unmanageable at times and the depression always creeps in and immobilizes me. I always feel like, after all these years I should know how to manage these depression periods, but I am so lost and self defeating that I am starting to really be critical of myself. Earlier tonight when going through one of my depressive episodes. my husband told me I need to "just go run on the treadmill." as if running will automatically stop my depression (although it does help.) When I responded that it wasn't that simple, he became angry. I told him that I didn't need him to fix it, I just wanted him not to be critical, and he said "well it needs to be fixed and you haven't fixed it yet." I cried all night and feel more alone than ever, and this just played into my self defeating guilt. Ahhhh!!! Any similar experiences with loved ones?

[Sophia57]

I am just working on my Master's but I have a few friends in PhD programs. One had to get a disability extension, and that might be the answer for you. I think there are laws that prevent discrimination, so you might have to admit to your illness. But they should be required to work around your illness. I don't think you should give up, but don't be afraid to ask for concessions.

Boredom can be a symptom of depression. It might appear like busywork now, but sometimes just slogging it out, you may find some of it coming in handy in the future. And even if not, picking it up later is just much harder.

Remember end of semester is always time for the blues. My daughter was in her Bachelor's and when I would whine about quitting, she was always going into finals and papers, and would remind me that she, and every other student was in the same boat this time of the semester.

My advice is don't give up. How much longer do you have to complete the degree? Would it be an advantage to your career to have this degree now? Would it disadvantage you NOT to have it in the future? Hope you figure this out. Don't question yourself and your goals. Question the depression instead, and you may find the answers you are looking for.

[xp1155]

Thanks, all.

I just don't understand why I made it through my Masters with minimal problems and now my PhD (with the same type of coursework) is proving difficult for me with Bipolar. Maybe because I am in a new city I hate (I don't feel safe)? New state? Without my boyfriend (who is moving in with me in a few months? Maybe because I was on quarters and I love quarters, but am now on semesters and I think semesters are too drawn out? I don't know. Also, I am on pills that control mania and not depression- so, maybe I need a new med combo? It's just tiring when I am trying to many meds and both being Bipolar and the new meds affect the quality of my work.

I am in a more professional degree; so I can work or teach with a PhD. I can work with a Masters, but always wanted a PhD and my students tell me I am a good teacher. I love teaching and I want to teach and contract myself out for work. I don't care about tenure.

My Mom thinks a PhD will someone validate my work more and my Dad is waiting on me to get a "real job," lol. My boyfriend says he will support me no matter what I choose to do. My field is "helping people" but it's less intense than, say, social work.

I think I chose the wrong program and the wrong city. I have dropped hints about being Bipolar and my professors don't seem to care. They all think I do good work (so far I've gotten an A and an A-... waiting on one more grade) and I know when I have the energy, I am "on it." However, when meds take away my mania or if I get in a depressed state, all bets are off.

[KeepingItReal]

I'm really delighted that you guys took the courage to post as, I too, am in the some position. I'm currently pursuing a PhD at a R1 institution in the Midwest. My work and productivity as suffered tremendously since the diagnosis. Prior to the Bipolar I diagnosis, I was a workaholic. I was single-mindedly focused on my research and I absolutely loved it. I'd work very long hours at the university often sleeping on the office floor and got an often lot done during that time. I was was very confident and outgoing, praising the life of the academy to others and myself and absolutely convinced that I would successfully earn a tenure-track job, as that was what a wanted at that time.

The Bipolar I diagnosis completely blew me out of the water. I was hospitalize five times this year alone and was forced to take a leave of absence for a semester. I was so delusional and scared that I even called my department stating that I no longer wanted to be in the program.

I have since recovered but only partially. I'm on a cocktail that is managing my symptoms fairly well and I haven't had a manic or psychotic episode since. The problem is that the fear of a relapse has completely paralyzed me. I no longer exert myself like I used to and question my confidence, afraid that I may once again becomes manic or psychotic. They say that stress should be removed from one's live who suffers from bipolar and I've definitely taking it to the extreme. All I do is sloth around the apartment, watching YouTube and Netflix while my dissertation is collecting dust.

As for your questions, I am of the belief that self-care is most important. I well know that I'm not as engaged as I once was, but I also know not to beat myself up, as my therapist says, because I'm still in the healing process. Dealing with Bipolar can be a traumatic event itself and oftentimes the body and psyche needs time to recover, especially if you are adapting to new medications.

As for leaving, I know a number of students in my department who have left. Some have returned, others have not. If your unsure as to what to do, I would take a leave of absence and find some kind of temporary work until you've reached a place where you can make a final decision as to whether you want to return. Getting a PhD is a difficult, stressful, and competitive process. This is particularly the case for Bipolar suffers. What is helped for me is having a strict regime of support in place. I attend a biweekly support group, see a therapist every week, see my doctor once month, try to get adequate sleep, and, of course, take my meds every night. If you don't have some kind of support structure in your life, I strongly encourage that you to get one in place.

In any event, I'm sorry about the long-winded response, but this is a really important topic and I want to thank xp1155 for bringing it up. Moreover, if anyone wants to discuss this issue further, feel free to PM me.

Take care and I wish all of you well
KeepingItREal

[faerie_moon_x]

Originally Posted by xp1155

Thanks, all.

I just don't understand why I made it through my Masters with minimal problems and now my PhD (with the same type of coursework) is proving difficult for me with Bipolar. Maybe because I am in a new city I hate (I don't feel safe)? New state? Without my boyfriend (who is moving in with me in a few months? Maybe because I was on quarters and I love quarters, but am now on semesters and I think semesters are too drawn out? I don't know. Also, I am on pills that control mania and not depression- so, maybe I need a new med combo? It's just tiring when I am trying to many meds and both being Bipolar and the new meds affect the quality of my work.

I am in a more professional degree; so I can work or teach with a PhD. I can work with a Masters, but always wanted a PhD and my students tell me I am a good teacher. I love teaching and I want to teach and contract myself out for work. I don't care about tenure.

My Mom thinks a PhD will someone validate my work more and my Dad is waiting on me to get a "real job," lol. My boyfriend says he will support me no matter what I choose to do. My field is "helping people" but it's less intense than, say, social work.

I think I chose the wrong program and the wrong city. I have dropped hints about being Bipolar and my professors don't seem to care. They all think I do good work (so far I've gotten an A and an A-... waiting on one more grade) and I know when I have the energy, I am "on it." However, when meds take away my mania or if I get in a depressed state, all bets are off.

Well, I know exactly what you mean. When I'm doing well, I do really, really well and I'm very impressive. When I'm not doing well... then things go down the toilet so to speak.

I know that for me personally, any type of change can seriously disrupt my functioning. Routine is so important to me. Even small things that shouldn't effect me at all like "we had a book shelf here and now it is over there." That can completely change my ability to work. I don't know if it is a bipolar thing or just me. But moving to a new school, new town, new house, boyfriend not there, etc... that's a lot of changes and I know it would throw me off probably for several months.

Also, the number 1 thing I know about bipolar is even is people know, they don't care. They don't realize exactly how "disabling" it can be (you know, being a disability and all.) Most people think it is a fake thing, an easily ignored or gotten over thing, or the "illness of the hour" thing.

[AniManiac]

Hm, sounds like a few things to consider here.

One is the meds combo. If you're experiencing depression and aren't on anything that helps address that, then maybe it's time for something new, difficult as that can be.

Second, the transition to a PhD program is difficult, especially with moving, for everyone. So you're not alone in that - just about everyone starting a program has a tough time getting adjusted.

Third, it sounds like you're in your first semester? Everyone questions their ability to finish and succeed at some point; there would be something wrong if you didn't. But if you're having serious doubts about this path at an early stage in your program, then it's a good time to do some honest re-evaluation.

The happy news is that assuming you do decide to finish the degree, you can target your job search at "mid-level" teaching schools, small liberal arts colleges, or even community colleges, where they will really value your teaching ability. That also means less pressure overall. But tenure is still much better than untenured, even if you're "just" teaching. Adjuncts make very poor pay, don't get health or other benefits, get the worst scheduling, are basically invisible to the organization, etc. But if your main plan is to do consulting, that might not matter so much.

If you think you're in the wrong program in the wrong place, you can do something about it - but you should act quickly. If you're only partway through coursework, you can transfer to another program in another university, but you'll have to write new applications (and you would only have a couple weeks to do that for a new admission for next year.) If you get through coursework, it's too late to transfer. It might take slightly longer for you to finish if you transfer, but you may be happier with the whole experience.

If you can teach and consult without a PhD, then that may be worth considering if it gets too hard to keep up or you stop seeing the value in what you're doing. Doing a PhD is hard. You have to really want it in order to even make it through - always having wanted to have a PhD is not the same as wanting to do a PhD!

Can you talk to your advisor about any of these concerns (aside from MI issues)? If not your advisor, then a program director or senior students, perhaps?

[ladyjrnlist]

Oh, I know what you are going through. I am getting my master's and working part-time. The depression is so difficult to handle. I fell behind this past semester, which just ended last week. But, I kept on doing as much as I could. To my surprise, I got a 4.0! So keep working, you can only do what you can do. If you need to, tell your profs about your illness. They will probably understand.

[xp1155]

Thanks all for your support. I think it feels worse because I am in a huge depressive stage due to my meds. I am going to try adding an anti-depressant to the mood stabilizer. My general doctor thinks I should go practice in my field for a while. My mother tells me a PhD will better validate me (although, in my field, it doesn't matter if you have a Masters or PhD). My boyfriend is hoping that when he moves in with me (he is in another state) in April (at the latest) that I will do better. Everyone else just says to give it another semester. I feel like I am locked into next semester because I am teaching a class and it's so close. Hopefully, I can get myself together before classes start again. I don't want to go back. I hate the city. I don't feel safe where I live (and my apartment complex won't let me out of my lease).

This is one of the worst times I have felt psychologically and I really don't know how to handle it. I feel angry and, up until a few months ago, I hardly ever felt angry or annoyed at anyone. I normally don't cry and now I'm crying over everything! Lately, I look like the stereotypical person with depression. This may sound weird, but I want my mania back. Yes, I rapid cycle and my episodes are mixed- but at least that goes away after a few hours. These meds are just horrible. I keep telling the doctors that the mania isn't the problems because they're not full-blown episodes, it's the depression.

Regardless, I am locked into another semester. I really, really don't want to go back in January; but that's life right now, I suppose.

[BlackPup]

I've just finished my PhD in microbiology. It was a tough slog, particularly while we were trying to find meds that worked without side effects...
The manias fuel the depression so you have to stop the manias to stop the depression.
Good luck with your studies.

[xp1155]

4.00 my first semester!

Congrats on your PhD, BlackPup!