[Rhapsody]

I am babysitting my nieces kids for her (free of charge) for two months while she saves up the deposit needed to place the youngest two of her four kids in day care next school year... and while I've had a hand in raising her first three kids over the last two years I have to say that I am getting a little stressed at the oldest child (7 yr old boy) that is getting out hand - he is becoming defiant of any authority figure in his life... it has gotten so bad that his dentist (a child specialist) informed me today at his check up that if he continues to behave as he did in the office today that he will no longer be allowed back.

The child has his good days and his bad days and while I can understand some of his anger due to the absence of a father in his life - I cannot tolerate such actions for both his mine and his families sake.

I would appreciate any advice of what has helped other parents deal with an out right defiant child.

Thank you.

[MyBestKids2]

Uugghh, I remember those days. My son is 10.5 and has been doing a lot better this past year. He was diagnosed ODD (oppositional defiant disorder) about 4 years ago. I was able to get the school and county involved in addressing this issue. The state paid for a wrap-around service that came to our home 1x a week to work with he and I. The school counselor also worked with him in an individual and group setting. I also had a book titled, (I think), " 1,2,3, Magic", which was extremely helpful in setting boundaries, and establishing a reward system for obedient behavior. I did take him to a p-doc also, and was advised of the diagnosis, and utilized a great support system for treatment (no meds).

Its not easy, but luckily he has you on his side!!

Good luck

[Rhapsody]

Is there any thing in particular that worked best with you and your son?
... how did you deal with him when unknown people where around?

My nephew has seen a p-doc in the past and he was given a possible dx of "attention seeking disorder" and the school counselor has been involved in his treatment as well.

I have talked mom into getting him back into counseling - I will be taking him to apt next Wednesday... keeping fingers crossed.

I have always found that the reward system works best, be it a surprise outing for being so good or a touch on the head with some nice words ! Kids cant get enough praise.

Pocket money with a trip once a week to spend it works well.

Ignoring (this is hard) some bad things and only stepping in when its a danger to the child or others.

It works wonders with five of my six children (one has mental health issues) eldest 20 younges 4.

Our four year old is 'persistant' lol so its harder work with him however we are getting there.

If you have to punish then the chair (if hes seven then seven minutes) or a corner with no talking. Or work in the house for an hour or half an hour whatever suits you. (hoovering polishing cleaning the fridge etc)

I think the main message is to be consistant. Pick your battles so you know you will win (he will learn to accept you winning) and keep at it.

As for other people..... Ignore them !

[Sannah]

I would listen to him and really communicate with him. He is acting that way for a reason. A heavy hand will just make it worse.

[Rhapsody]

Originally Posted by Sannah

I would listen to him and really communicate with him. He is acting that way for a reason. A heavy hand will just make it worse.

That is what I am thinking too... as this poor little fellow has been through so much for being so young and all because that *** of a father was in his life when he was born up until he was about four and now that his son needs him he is no where to be found.... Grrrrrrr - just makes me so angry.

Keeping Fingers Crossed that T (starting next week) will open some doors and windows to healing his inner wounds.

[thelionkinglives]

Originally Posted by Rhapsody

That is what I am thinking too... as this poor little fellow has been through so much for being so young and all because that *** of a father was in his life when he was born up until he was about four and now that his son needs him he is no where to be found.... Grrrrrrr - just makes me so angry.

Keeping Fingers Crossed that T (starting next week) will open some doors and windows to healing his inner wounds.

As some one who was raised by a single mother...kuddo's to every woman who does it.
I can speak on this as a father of 4, as some one who has seen alot of women trying to raise a child, specifically son's on their own, as some one who has coached many boys in many different sports in this age range, preparing to be a teacher. My kids are 13, 11 & 4 year old twins. I've personally was lucky with this age range with my oldest 2 we didn't have any problems like this I don't forsee any issue with the twins...

this is not going to be the pc thing to say. But in SOME cases the more heavy handed approach can work. Each child is different, just like each adult is different. You want to be careful about making sure caring understanding him not having his dad around, doesn't become an enabler to excuse it. It sucks, it's screwed up his dad's not around, I've been there. But even though intentions may be good. I would not rule out a more heavy handed approach. Just like coaching some kids you need to ride & hollar at more that's what they respond best to. They subconsciously want the structure & discilpline...I've seen other kids where if you do that to they will just curl up in a fetal position not be able to speak...those you have to handle with a softer side.

Children do not always have the ability to process their actions & cause & effect in a systemic cognative way adults do, so sometimes simply telling them to sit down think about it doesn't work or ignoring.
My oldest son could care less with "time outs" he could sit in the corner & get entertained by the cracks in the wall for an hour, not thinking remotely about what he did. My youngest son though, you make him stand in the corner tell him your disappointed in his actions & he acts like you just shot his dogs.

Statistically speaking, the reward system does work more often, but all I'm saying is don't rule out the heavy handed approach. Because 7 quickly becomes 18 & the police won't give him a pass simply because his dad wasn't there.

Now that I'm off my soap box....any advice for a stressed out dad with a 13 year old daughter....at 7 I was superman, now I'm her worst enemy & she rolls her eyes at me a hundred times a day...

[pachyderm]

Roll your eyes back.

[Sannah]

My definition of a heavy hand was forcing behavior without understanding. My definition of a heavy hand does not include structure and discipline. Structure and discipline are vital! My definition of discipline is teaching, however, and consequences. It does not include punishment (time outs are used to teach limits not to punish, etc........)

[thelionkinglives]

Originally Posted by Sannah

My definition of a heavy hand was forcing behavior without understanding. My definition of a heavy hand does not include structure and discipline. Structure and discipline are vital! My definition of discipline is teaching, however, and consequences. It does not include punishment (time outs are used to teach limits not to punish, etc........)

Fair enough. I attempted to tread lightly with the topic, I know discilpline, structure, consequences & punishment are touchy topics. I just wanted to lend my experiences if they could be of any help. I know I've needed it over the years.

[Rhapsody]

Originally Posted by thelionkinglives

any advice for a stressed out dad with a 13 year old daughter....at 7 I was superman, now I'm her worst enemy & she rolls her eyes at me a hundred times a day...

Hang in There & Don't Worry - You will become her KING again... once she is out of the trying teen years... I Promise.

Originally Posted by thelionkinglives

in SOME cases the more heavy handed approach can work. Each child is different, just like each adult is different. You want to be careful about making sure caring understanding him not having his dad around, doesn't become an enabler to excuse it.

I agree with you here and while I (the gr-aunt of this child) believes in an equal amount of love & discipline when rearing any child - his mother catered to him when he was young because his dad was around making their life hell and less than enjoyable... and now it angers me that this once sweet trusting boy is the one that has to suffer... I wish I could have ten minutes along with that man in a room with nothing but the dark and the Hulk on my side.

[thelionkinglives]

Originally Posted by Rhapsody

Hang in There & Don't Worry - You will become her KING again... once she is out of the trying teen years... I Promise.



I agree with you here and while I (the gr-aunt of this child) believes in an equal amount of love & discipline when rearing any child - his mother catered to him when he was young because his dad was around making their life hell and less than enjoyable... and now it angers me that this once sweet trusting boy is the one that has to suffer... I wish I could have ten minutes along with that man in a room with nothing but the dark and the Hulk on my side.

Yeah, I must point out something a previous poster said, sorry I don't recall who this second...what ever approach you use, consistency is the key.
You know it's abandoment issues, I know it's abandonment issues but he is not able to emotionally digest & process yet.
His anger for authority figures is directly from feeling let down by them.
I have always had major issues with authority...I have been this very child your talking about. A boy needs a father figure & scum like this disgust me.

Does he have any hobbies? youth sports, or something like that. Something regimented with an expected code of conduct?
Baseball, karate, even football or basketball?
This will give him a healthy outlt for his anger & teach him in a nurturing way cause & effect. Typically these boys respond well to a good coach or instructor...just make sure YOU are comfortable with whoever coaches or instruct...because a bad one could accelerate the damage already done exponentially.

The data that I've seen says that if it is not addressed by 6 or 7 it becomes very much less like to improve as they age...
I don't want to scare you but he is in a crucial formative time now. He needs to learn restraint before testosterone kicks in.

Best of luck, let me know if you try any of the sports, or maybe even boy scouts as an outlet, I really think it can help

[Rhapsody]

Originally Posted by thelionkinglives

I don't want to scare you but he is in a crucial formative time now. He needs to learn restraint before testosterone kicks in.

Best of luck, let me know if you try any of the sports, or maybe even boy scouts as an outlet, I really think it can help

I agree with the crucial time period before puberty sets in.... as I have raised my own two boys, men now - 24 & 19 so I know what the teen years are like (and) that's why I have been after my niece to do some thing about it now before it gets harder as he grows up.... hence the counseling starting this week.

Mom has been looking into tae-kwon-do as soon as she is able to set some money aside.... keeping my fingers crossed on that one.

My husband and I are trying to do what we can (have been for the last two years) and yet we also want to educate our niece on rearing her boys properly so she may learn in order to take better control of her own household.

Thanks for listening......