Hiya Everybody!

I was wondering if anybody has been successful at getting their debt forgiven for hospital stays due to financial hardship. I just got out of the hospital. I was in for over 20 days. The first hospital I was in was 16 days at $1100 a day. I have a 10% copay and that = way too much for me. The second hospital I was in was for 8 days and I have no idea how much that was per day. Regardless I still have a 10% copay. And I was in the ER twice in that 20 some odd days in order to get admitted to the psych wards. So I have the two ER bills. Huge Sigh...

I work full time but get paid enough to barely make ends meet. I go to school full time too but get financial aid. Anyway, does anybody know how to get debt forgiven? Do I have to give proof I'm having a hardship? Any help would be much appreciated.

Love and Hugs,
Tara

[Perna]

Check with your hospital(s). They have a department for that and there are some state and Federal government aid/laws in effect to help too

http://www.hospitaldebtjustice.org/rights.html

[nicoleb2]

I wish I knew! I have so much debt from hospitals and clinics i'll never see the light of day again

[Fresia]

Many patient account departments at hospitals would rather work with you on setting up a lowered payment type plan that fits in your budget before they will allow for debt forgiveness. If you have a job, it is unlikely you would qualify for debt forgiveness but it depends on your income level. However it is important for your credit that you talk to them to set up a plan than not to pay at all in the interim, very important!!! Call them, it is in both your interests.

Also if you are in a position to know that you can afford a certain amount to pay a month, have an idea what that number is when you call to negotiate. Sometimes you can get payments down to as low as $10 in extreme cases, typically $15/$25/$35 is more common (so as not to be surprised if suggested), or have seen up to $100 a month depending on your income. Your debt is not so much a factor as it is based on your income, like many other financial institutions, unfair, yes. They should be willing to work with you if you work with them in good faith to show you are willing to pay your bill but just need to lower the payment. Call them, explain due the medical you are experiencing hardship, want to make sure you can pay the bill and not get behind, but wanted to see if a lower payment plan could be set up in good faith. Good luck!

[pgrundy]

When my husband was hospitalized multiple times between Oct 2009 and April 2010, we were buried in bills. No one would make arrangements we could afford, let alone forgive the debt. Even making partial payments we were sending out more on medical bills than our mortgage and utilities combined. After 90 days ALL of the different creditors (over 25 of them), sold the debt to collection agencies, even though I was paying more than we could afford every month on each and every one of those bills.

Tomorrow is his bankruptcy court date.

Health insurance in the U.S. is a scam. It's just 'protection money', extortion. It doesn't really protect the person who has it. It makes me angry but I can't dwell on it because then I get sick!

[pgrundy]

P.S. That situation literally DID make me ill--I was hospitalized for being suicidal in January of this year for 8 days. I am paying off the bill at $100 per month. I work 12 hours per week in minimum wage retail. Even so, the psych hospital was the first medical creditor willing to make arrangements for an entire year. So I make sure to make the payment because we can't go bankrupt for another 7 years. I had to learn to let this stress go. It's very hard because it would stress anyone, but if you can't pay you can't pay. It's really that simple. If we get in that deep again I'll ask for help much sooner. Even if it doesn't help with the bills, maybe it will help me stay sane.

Good luck! You are by no means alone.

[Koko2]

The medical business has you going both ways. On the one hand, they advocate a "free market" so they can charge whatever they want and send you into bankruptcy if not paid on time, but on the other hand, they don't want transparent price competition, so you don't know what hits you, in the wallet, until afterwards.

The local clinic here gives a 41% discount if your income is below about $2400 per month. Maybe your clinic would also give a partial discount even though you have a job.

[Rose76]

Different kinds of debt have different kinds of impact on your reputation. I read that hospitals are slow to report unpaid bills to the credit rating agencies. I owe $6000 for an emergency room visit in 2009. Guess what. It has never been reported to the credit reporting agencies. (The radiologist bill was reported promptly when I didn't pay it. A bill collector is contacting me about that. I do hear from a debt collection service that is collecting for the hospital, but they don't bother me very much.)

No debt is fun to have, but I've heard financial analysts say that the least damaging debt you can carry is money owed to a hospital. Now, in your case, we're talking about a copay. I agree with Fresia above that it is unlikely that they will forgive you the debt. Recently, I saw forgiveness of debt extended on a hospital bill, but the patient was very low income and 75 years old and handicapped.

In your case, they are likely to figure that, because you are relatively young (since you are in school, I infer that.) you will eventually have a better income. The hospital isn't going any place, so they can plan on getting more from you down the line.

You have more power now than you might realize. Fresia is right about it being wise to figure out what you could handle before talking with them. I would go a little further than Fresia, in that, they sort of are in the position of pretty much having to take what you give them. In the negotiation over the monthly payment, you have more power than they do. It is good to look at this a bit cynically to see your options. They can't repossess what they sold you, as a car dealer can. It is unsecured debt. You probably don't have assets they could get a lien on. Your job probably isn't so high-paying that a judge is going to grant that much of your wages can be garnished.

So you are in the power seat on this one (at least until you get a higher paying job.) Figure out what you can afford, but offer them less. Then reluctantly agree to pay what you figure would be manageable. Caution: once you agree to a deal, you are under even more pressure to come up with the payments than you are now.

The main leverage they have now is that they count on you being intimidated by the collections department saying things like "This has to resolved today!" and calling you often. NOTHING has to be resolved "today." I strongly advise against trying to evade their phone calls. However, the caller does not have any authority to control the conversation. You can be the one to make them listen to your tale of woe to the point that they will dread calling you more than you will dread hearing from them. I know that sounds smart-alecky, but I'm here to tell you that it works. (I've been through bankruptcy and have dealt with lots of collectors.) Part of what they say to you is stuff they are reading from a script. You don't have to be tied to their script. What I find works is to be very cordial and respectful, but make them listen to the problems of your life in great detail. I get a call once every 2 months now about my hospital bill.

I just got my bill today for the second hospital stay which was 8 days. $19,414! I can't believe it. Insurance pays 80% which leaves me with $3900. I'm still paying off the $80,000 bill I got from Cedars Sinai in 2008! What the heck am I going to do?

I get several calls a day all throughout the day. I can't answer them I have nothing to pay them with...

[Rose76]

(((Tara))) $80,000! Getting "several calls a day."

That's what bankruptcy is for. Just let me ask you to consider it. You're a bright person, so you probably have. I did it, and I did it without the help of a lawyer. It was one of the best things I ever did for myself. First I read everything I could on the subject. I was astonished to find out how forgiving the American legal system is to over-indebted citizens. There is this wonderful concept called "total discharge." People often needlessly fear the long-term consequences. Often those are far less of a burden than spending your life servicing debt that you will never get on top of.

I know lawyers cost money. You might be surprised at how much you can do by yourself. The law says that you can stop any creditor from calling you simply by sending then a letter stating that you do not wish to receive any more calls. Pick up an inexpensive soft cover book on bankcruptcy in the finance section of the book store. Even if you don't want to file for that, you may learn that you have more rights than you know about. I sure did. Our founding fathers were all about letting people have a "fresh start." Most self-made millionaires have declared bankruptcy at least two times. Only you can decide what is best for you, but find out all your options. You may be trying to reach a bar that you've set too high.

Those are really big co-pays. Maybe your insurance isn't worth the premiums. You're trying so hard to improve your life by working and studying full-time. I hope you will consider all your options, and first you have to find out what they are. Keep researching though I understand you only have so many hours in a day.

Hiya Rose!

Thanks for the info and advice. I appreciate it. The $80,000 my portion was $16,000 and I have only $700 more until it is paid off. When I spoke a lawyer about bankruptcy he convinced me it wasn't in my best option. But all things considered, I'm going to start looking into it for myself.

Thanks so much!

Love and hugs,
Tara

[nicoleb2]

I just got a call about $7700 worth of hospital bills (and that's just for one hospital affiliation). I have no way to pay for it and am not eligible for their financial assistance programs. I am so frustrated.

We ask for help and end up punished with these bills. We go to the hospital and sometimes staying longer than necessary, and yet we are billed these ridiculous amounts.

Having these bills and the constant phone calls that come with them just makes my mental health worse, thus making me worried about needing to go in again, and knowing I can't go because I can't afford it.

[Rose76]

Nicoleb, you and I are in similar situations. I am getting calls about a bill I owe that is $6,100.00 for 12 hours in the emergency room.

Unless you own real estate, or a valuable art collection, or expect a big inheritance from your Uncle Joe, you might be in no where near the trouble that it feels like you're in. Your credit rating will take a hit, and that can make a loan cost more if you go to buy a car. That's probably about the worst that is ever going to happen to you over this debt.

I highly recommend accepting every single phone call you get from a collection agency. That's what I do. If I get a voice mail or an automated message asking me to call back, I write down the number and always call back. I calmly and politely tell them that I don't have an income that allows me to pay that now, and I won't have it tomorrow or next week. And "No, there is no one in my family who can help pay the bill." And "No, I can't even afford to pay one dollar per month toward the balance." And, "Who knows - maybe one day my circumstances will greatly improve and I will let you know if that happens and let's hope it does."

When they have called, I have said that "I'ld be so happy to work something out, but right now there is absolutely nothing that I can work out, as much as I really wish there was. And - Oh, before you go, I just want to clarify that amount - now wait till I get a notebook - so tell me the exact amount because I really want to keep track."

It typically takes way less effort than all that to get the collector wanting to say good-bye to me. However, I am prepared to wear that agent out with my truthful tale of woe to the point that the agent, not me, will want to get off the phone. I never try to get rid of them. Also, I am happy to have their name and know that they are assigned to me and "give me your extension number so I can call you if anything changes, and we will keep in touch."

It works. Now, I get one call every 2 months to see inquire if my income has gone up.

My main message: Don't let collection agencies get you to feeling like you're a fugitive on the run. You did not break any law by going into the hospital.

Hiya all,

Rose Thank you so much for your advice. I've done some research and have contacted an attorney who charges a mere $300, compared to the $1500 the attorney last year was wanting to charge me?!

Anyhow, I have done some research and it does look like it is in my best interest. I'm drowning right now. My debt is $12,868 some odd. I think that's way more than I can handle. Most of it is hospital bills. I have an additional $1200 that is not on my credit report.

I think I have to let go of thinking that I am a bad person for not being self-sufficient. My mom ingrained in me the necessity of being self-sufficient when I grew up. Now, it's hard for me to accept help or even fathom the idea that I'm not self-sufficient, but I'm not.

I'm going to let go and let God as they say in 12 step programs.

Love and hugs,
Tara

P.S. Finally, I am feeling some peace about all of this.

[whiteNight]

I will stand by whatever choice you make Tara we can get through it together (((Hugs))))

We were considering bankruptcy but were talked out of it. We have barely any income, yet don't owe that much money. We basically cannot pay our bills. We do the best we can but it's not good enough. Two people can't live on $900 a month! Anyone know if bankruptcy applies if you only can't pay your bills?

[eskielover]

I understand your stress about the debt.....I have similar problems from way back in 1994....had so many hospital bills that couldn't be paid when I lost my career & ended up in & out of the psych hospital & medical hospital.....ended up owing more than $100,000 in co-pays for the hospital bills. I am still on disability from all that. I was in no state to deal with the financial issues & felt at that point it was my husband's responsibility to deal with it & he didn't. I kept having Dr's bills & on top of that, he spent money like I was still working as an engineer....think he couldn't deal with the reality either & was never financially a responsible person.......so.....everything went to collection. No money to pay & because I was home, I got all the calls....trying to explain there was NO MONEY just made my condition worse. Husband talked to a bankruptcy lawyer, but because there were still hospital expenses coming in, they said that what came after bankruptcy wouldn't be forgiven....so he kept waiting. Last time I was in the hospital was in 2005......from 1994.....over 10 years of hospital stays really added up. On top of that, my marriage had been horrible for over 30 years at that point & I was wanting out, but financially had no way to do it.

When my mom died in 2005, I sold her home & finally left my husband in 2007....bought a farm 2100 miles away. Only problem, now it was impossible to file bankruptcy because one can't own 2 homes & declare bankruptcy.....one home would have to be sold & the one in California isn't worth what the morgatge is....so no money in that one & I am not about to sell my farm & end up homeless.

Basically we just walked away from all the debt & the collectors ended up stopping their calls. For the hospitals, it's not like they didn't get the majority of the bill paid through insurance & medicare, so they got most of their money for my time in the hospital.......there was just no money left with bills to pay all that debt. Feel bad that we ended up just walking away from it all, but there was no other option at that point.

I am struggling now because all my money has been put into the farm & I am back to only having my disability income every month to live on. Vet bills have piled up & I am trying to get everything paid off within the time of NO INTEREST because I don't have extra money to throw away on interest or penalties.

It's a horrible place to be in.....when all is ok only when there are no emergencies. I need to have all my teeth pulled & get dentures & I have no money to pay, so I do NOTHING. It's working much better now that I am responsible for myself I financially KNOW where I stand......but even with that, it's always a struggle when anything out of the norm happens because there isn't money for it.

Some things one just has to walk away from without feeling guilty if they have gotten most of their pay from the insurance. They can't get blood out of a turnip....& when we are just getting by basically not being able to even handle our monthly bills we are just the turnips they can't get blood out of......& walking away is sometimes the only possible solution even if it leaves a guilty feeling.

hiya all!

Yeah, so today i got a wage garnishment letter from my employer. A bunch of b.s. if you ask me. I won't go into details, suffice it to say I feel screwed. I feel like I'm drowning and there's no way out, no life boat, no life jacket even. It will be what it will be i guess. I did get my ex to pay the alimony early so I can at least pay some of the bill hoping it won't actually go into wage garnishment. Sigh...i hate life sometimes.

Love and hugs,
Tara

[Rose76]

Oh, Tara, I'm sorry it's got to this point of hassle. If you do file for bankruptcy, that will stop the garnishment. Also, it will stop the phone calls. Once you file, the court notifies every one of your creditors to leave you alone, and they will.

No lawyer is going to do the bankruptcy for you at a fee of $300, unless he is your brother. Beware of getting scammed. The going price is around $1500. The lawyer will probably want cash-on-the-barrel, or at least a good down payment. That is your biggest impediment right now. He/she should promise to get you a Chapter 7 Discharge. (NOT a Chapter 13, which is a debt reorganization.) Even the dumbest lawyer in town will know five minutes after talking to you whether or not you are eligible for a Chap. 7. And even the dumbest lawyer in town can handle getting it for you. (If you owe student loans or anything to the IRS, you can't get rid of that.) So get the least expensive attorney, but the fee is probably standard for a case of your level of complexity, which sounds pretty simple to me. The lawyer isn't even going to do most of the work. It's just filling in the blanks on forms, which one of the assistants at the law office will do.

Our Founding Fathers set this up because they believed people should have a chance at a "fresh start." If you go ahead with it you will be surprised that the reality is not what you hear. In less than a month after being granted a "Full Discharge" (a chapter 7 bankruptcy), your mailbox will be full of letters from creditors wanting to lend you money. That's because they will know that you have no bills from creditors to pay. The only thing is that the interest rates will be high. That won't be any change in your life because you are in that category already.

In the meantime, try to minimize the stress of all this. There is no law that says you have to talk to any creditor on the phone. Sometimes it's worthwhile to talk to them, but if you are just getting badgered, you can write them a letter saying "Don't call me." and, legally, they can't call you again. Most of all, don't feel bad about a problem that happens to the best people all the time. Just think in terms of what is the best you can do to protect your future and your future income. I know all too well the stresses of having debt I can't pay. It's not a crime and it's not a sin. Things happen out of our control. And we're just little people. Look at the millions and billions that goes who-knows-where and those involved live lavish life styles, while being irresponsible with what's entrusted to them. Give yourself credit for how hard you have tried. Let us know how you're feeling.

Hiya all,

Yesterday I found out my school loans may not hit my account for up to 30 more days. I was counting on this money for a various number of things. It sent me into suicidal crisis mode. I survived, thank God. Just called everybody I could and put myself to bed to avoid doing anything stupid. Without my school loans I can't file for bankruptcy and the calls just keep coming. I'm way too stressed to be doing work and school both full time. I'm managing addiction, eating disorders, and severe mental illness. I can't cope anymore. I want to give up.

Love and Hugs,
Tara

P.S. I looked for a different attorney and found one who is supposed to call me today. I took the chapter 7 means test and qualify to file. The average one person household in California makes $44,000. I make about half that...so yeah i qualify. i also have negative disposable income. I was hoping i could get help from the drug companies in buying my Adderall but no go.

[Rose76]

To be working full-time AND going to school full-time . . .
That would be a very, very tough grind for anyone, even a person with no stressful issues going on. For someone who is managing (or trying to manage) a great deal of internal stress and living with financial hardship - well, that is overwhelming, I would think. You would have to be some kind of a non-human super being if you said that you could cope just fine. I don't blame you for being discouraged. Don't give up on you completely. Maybe, you could give up on some of the obligations you have undertaken. Looking into the Chap. 7 could be a sensible start. It is no crime to say, "I am over-committed. I made the commitments in good faith, but now I realize I overextended myself. I will have to reduce the extent of my commitment to what is reasonably manageable, so that I do not endanger my health and sanity and safety." Good luck with working that out; it's not easy making these decisions.

[Perna]

Originally Posted by eskielover

Basically we just walked away from all the debt & the collectors ended up stopping their calls.

I think I've read that hospitals do that after a year or so; my brother-in-law had a liver transplant 20ish years ago and I know they couldn't pay (he has since died and my sister has remarried, and is fine).

http://www.creditcards.com/credit-ca...-tips-1266.php

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/14/health/14patient.html

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/...n1369185.shtml

Hiya all!

It gets worse...

So my license is suspended. Has been since October of last year. I honestly don't have the money to pay for the two tickets that are outstanding. I got the two tickets last year for speeding. I don't speed anymore. I moved three times last year and because it was out of my state where i have my drivers license I didn't update my address as it's not allowed to have an out of state address. Therefore I didn't get the notice in the mail to pay or appear. Thus I have two failures to appear on my record...

Even worse...

Last night I got pulled over. The cop could have given me a $1000 ticket for driving on a suspended, impounded my car, and taken me to jail. I begged him not to and he didn't (the only good part). But he did say he will be watching out for my car and will do all of the above if he catches me driving again.

But the thing is...

The two tickets are in other counties pretty far away from me. Because I have a failure to appear on both I cannot reschedule the court dates. I must appear in person and hope to be able to be assigned to the docket for that day. How the heck am I going to get up there now to take care of all of this?

Needless to say I'm so stressed I have a massive headache that is going to result in me barfing in a few minutes from pain.

Love and Hugs,
Tara

[(JD)]

As for the tickets in other counties, pay a ticket center from each county to go to court for you. you can find them online. They can plead your case, and it will cost you little compared to the travel expense. Your going to jail is something that won't be good for you.

Perhaps you also need to apply for home assistance? You appear to be unable to take care of yourself and your issues of daily living.

[fritter16]

Sorry to hear your financial troubles. I may get slammed for this comment but it a curious question that I have wondered about in regards to U.S medical coverage vs. Canada. In Canada we don't pay for hospital stays or surgeries. If your American do you guys actually have to really pay back for hospital stays? It doesn't seem fair. Isn't there a government program that covers your hospital stay 100%?