[GeeN]

Myron's line of "a woman who *slept with everybody* at the post office but me"

Hi, sorry to bother you, but what would that mean? Would that mean that she literally slept with everyone at that the post office but her husband? Would it be a figurative term? Could you please explain it to me? Could someone who say that be angry if they slept with only five people? I don't want to say that having an affair shows a lack of morals or character, which it certainly can, but it does show a lack of judgement and integrity as well because it is a sin. I went to my therapist today and he said that the whole infidelity thing is just a fixation and not about obsessive compulsive disorder. How do I tell the doctor that I actually have it, but I was diagnosed as a bipolar? I find myself losing all train of thought and the OCD does attack the fact that I do tend to take things more literally than I already do. What does it mean for someone who "sleeps or cheats with everybody but me"?

By the way, I would like to change my train of thought. Common sense tells me that even a moral person is a sinner, but what separates a moral person from one who lacks character, but does the same thing? So I cannot say that just because one commits adultery or kills someone means that they are immoral. But killing people and adultery in themselves are immoral acts. To me, it depends on the situation and the people in it. If a person is promiscuous, would they be any less moral than one who has cheated with one other person? No, but promiscuity and adultery are sins. Maybe reading other opinions do not help nor is doing research helpful. So what else should I do? I hopefully would not cheat on anyone.
Would a person who has a series of affairs less moral than one who has had just one affair? The OCD says yes, especially if the person is a woman. But my view is that no! Regardless of the number of partners, it is the same act and it is immoral. But because of the OCD and because it is a woman, it is far more personal. Normally, if a woman cheats versus a man, does it make her less moral than the man? No, because they are both wrong. I tend to wrestle with questions that I cannot answer. Could it be that it is best to leave certain questions unanswered? I could be watching a clean film and I would have a thought. Weird. Has that happened to you?

[Perna]

Interesting questions, GeeN!

As you implied, I think expressions can be literal or just a figure of speech. Sometimes it's hard to know which a particular expression is. Like reading facial expressions, I think you kind of have to know the person as well as what "smiling" is. Context is always important as well as knowledge of all the people involved, including one's self.

I don't think anything "naturally" stays the same but I think your and my wish that it would makes us try to pin things down by seeing things as literal or fixating on them. Think of that word, "fixate". It is very similar in what it does as "literal", or the favorite one people use for me, "concrete" :-)

Being literal/concrete, fixated and having OCD are anxiety problems. We have difficulty with things changing. I think the difference between fixated and OCD is a matter of degree and scope. I would say inability to "change" readily from one thought to another is to be fixated whereas being obsessed is being tangled in the "thing" that is being thought about, itself.

I think your T was saying you were fixated in wanting to know the answer to particular puzzles and keep turning them over and over in your mind. People obsessed don't really "think" but are driven by their feelings. So maybe I'd say if you have a "mental" obsession, it's a fixation :-) Like I say, I think your questions are great.

But, the problem is that you are thinking about questions that don't have anything to do with you and your circumstances? I think normally that would interest someone but they'd be able to get ideas and answers or not and drop the question or move on. The intensity with which one wants to know the answers and tenacity in insisting on getting them is what makes it a fixation. People exhibiting OCD don't know or care about "answers".

"Morality" is not something there is an "answer" to except a personal one. Why one person is "moral" and another not is a personal decision by an individual (I may think you are moral and someone else may think you are not) or a group (society thinking call girls or women who sleep around a lot are not). It's just a rough "estimate" of how to quickly categorize people depending on your own thoughts and values or, those you have been taught but haven't evaluated for yourself.

I don't know what Myron meant by, "a woman who slept with everybody at the post office but me" because I don't know the whole story, Myron's writing and how he felt about those kind of situations. It could be literal, it could be to make the woman look like she slept with a lot of men, it could be making the point that he was hurt because the woman did not think well enough of him to include him in the "group", that the woman was deliberately performing an important personal act to exclude him on the personal level.

It's all right to have stray thoughts, even thoughts about the morality of sleeping with multiple partners when you're watching a clean film. But we have zillions of stray thoughts a day and sticking with any of them that aren't in "context" or useful/enjoyable to us in dealing with our lives or communication with those around us tends to get in the way? I don't think that is so much that you are obsessed with infidelity as that you are fixated on thoughts and questions that aren't useful to you that your therapist is trying to help with? That they are about infidelity and sex can be a bipolar symptom and bipolar mania often includes hypersexual awareness.

Hope I've given you other things to think about :-)

[scott88keys]

Perna, I have OCD and I hate the unanswerable questions that swirl in my head. People who have pure obsessional OCD are miserable with these thoughts. Pure obsessional people need to accept that some questions will never have answers as a cognitive behavior coping skill.

GeeN, you mention morality and sin in your post, so may I assume you have a religious faith? If it's Christian, it's not the amount or degree of sin a man or woman commits that matters--we all fall short of the Glory of God. As Jesus explains, a man who lusts in his thoughts after a woman has committed adultery just like a woman who actually has an affair. In the Christian faith, there is no ranking system--we're all equal in the eyes of God.

I just finished the book, "Tormenting Thoughts and Secret Rituals" by a psychiatrist who himself struggles with obsessions. The author explores many related topics including religion. What does it matter if you have a 'fixation' or 'obsession'? You sound miserable no matter what label you throw on it. You have a therapist. Do you have a psychiatrist? Ask to take an OCD test. I just don't think it is healthy to ask all these questions on the forum because it just reinforces your obsessions or fixation. Focus on the problem (coping) rather than the content (adultery). Just my two cents. . .

[Perna]

I try not to hate anything my mind produces, it is part of me and whether it has a problem or is being a problem I want to be there for it as it's the only mind I've got!

Coping with obsessional thoughts is one, good way to help one's self with the problem. I am reminded though of what professional jingle writers suggest when a tune gets stuck in their head? One either has to "finish" the tune, start to end, get closure on it or has to "replace" it with something else. Focusing on coping rather than content is a replacement response I think. I like to give my answer to questions, "finish" them out. If I were GeeN asking myself what Myron meant, I'd figure out what I, GeeN, felt/wanted Myron to mean and be done with that particular "problem".

I think GeeN is fixated on "adultery" though. I've read some of her/your (GeeN :-) other posts and she does not have this problem in her actual life, has no fears of infidelity in herself or significant other so "adultery" is an off-the-wall topic for her to be thinking about constantly. That being the case, I think it is a screen for some other unconscious problem GeeN doesn't want to face. It is like my telling you to NOT think of pink elephants; what do you immediately see in your mind's eye? Pink elephants :-) Very effective, being fixated on pink elephants instead of worrying about whether your husband is going to leave you or (in my case) what is going to happen when your husband dies and you are "alone", etc.

I don't want to think of how my life is going to be when my husband, who is 7 years older than I am and likely to, dies before I do. But I started being kept up at night worrying about it so I looked at what I could do to "prepare" for that probably happening and have started looking at our complicated finances, we've gone to a lawyer twice working on making our wills and I don't stay awake worrying anymore.