[perpetuallysad]

Ok, I'll try to be brief about this (but I know I won't be!)...

Its summer, I have a 9 yr old son. We have 2 children that live in the house next door, a girl 10 and a boy 8. They play with my son most everyday. The boy is pretty sweet, quiet and generally well behaved as any 8 yr old. The girl is NOT. She is angry, mean, bossy, yells and screams at both boys a lot and generally causes a lot of problems. For a while I was pretty hard on my son because I was under the impression he was causing (or greatly contributing to) these problems. But I have tried to stand back and observe their behavior for a while and its pretty clear the girl is just not very nice.

This leads to many problems. First off, I don't particularly like someone treating my son like this and he really, really doesn't want to play with her. But because she is the boy's sister, its sort of a package deal. The parents are EXTREMELY neglectful of these kids, they are put outside early in the morning and basically aren't allowed back in all day. That is, on the days there are actually adults at home. Most days they are both alone or they just leave the 8 yr old alone outside for like 8-10 hours at a time (no phone, locked out of the house ALONE). I live in a small town. The dad is a cop and they believe this behavior is perfectly acceptable and are completely unwilling to even talk reasonably about the daughter's behavior and do not give one lick about leaving the kids (one or both) alone like this.

Ok, we have a nice, large yard with a fence, inside the fence we have a swing set, pool and trampoline. The kids (of course) want access to these things. So far, I will allow limited access to the swing and occasionally the trampoline, but I have zero intentions of letting them in the pool. Neither of them know how swim, no parents at home, blah blah. I don't want the responsibility of dealing with them and these "dangers". I have specifically told them they will not be allowed to swim under any circumstances, yet they ask CONSTANTLY. We've only been in the pool once so far and they stood on the other side of the fence staring until my son felt pressured and got out to go play with them.

So this is annoying. But it gets more annoying.

This morning my son and boy were playing with cars out front and the boy cut his fingers pretty badly on some glass. They come to me, since I'm closest (or at least that's what I assumed at first). I clean him up the best I can but he's still bleeding and I feel he needs a parents attention. I wrap his hand and take him home. About 2 mins later, he comes back with the sister and they say they cannot wake the mom up because they will get "in trouble" (which this means grounded). So I bring him back in, clean the wounds the best I am comfortable with (if it were my son I wouldn't have been so nervous, but you know your kid best, right??) and bandaged everything up.

So basically I am furious at these ****** *** neglectful parents. I mean, seriously, your kids cannot wake you up when they are BLEEDING? I had a bad feeling that I would end up being the de facto babysitter this summer and it looks like I have ended up that way. I am not cool with this, yet I am not willing to leave a kid outside bleeding out on my yard.

The parents DO NOT CARE what I say. They will not change this behavior. And before everyone tells me to call child services know some things about where I live: (1) he's a cop, so his word will trump mine any day (2) because the kids aren't physically abused and are being fed, child services will not investigate anything (3) in MS there is literally no law about the age a kid can be alone. The basic rule is that you cannot leave a kid under 5 babysitting younger children, but you can essentially leave any kid alone for however long you want.

I am so frustrated about all of this though. I don't know how to deal with it.

[Rhapsody]

When this happens to me - I always try to the best parent I can be to the other kids (as well as my own kids) so maybe just maybe the neglected kids will grow up with some ideal of what a good caring parent is supposed to be like.

Thanks for taking the time to care for another.

[perpetuallysad]

Aw thank you so much Rhapsody. You made me feel a lot better about things.

I do try to be as good to them as my own. Even the girl who drives me bonkers gets treated like I treat my son.

I just checked the boy's bandage and he's still bleeding, though not much now. I changed the dressings and put more antibiotic ointment on it.

[pachyderm]

Originally Posted by perpetuallysad

The boy is pretty sweet, quiet and generally well behaved as any 8 yr old. The girl is NOT. She is angry, mean, bossy, yells and screams at both boys a lot and generally causes a lot of problems... The parents are EXTREMELY neglectful of these kids, they are put outside early in the morning and basically aren't allowed back in all day. That is, on the days there are actually adults at home. Most days they are both alone or they just leave the 8 yr old alone outside for like 8-10 hours at a time (no phone, locked out of the house ALONE).

I assume you see the connection...

[lynn P.]

This is a difficult situation Perpetualysad. I know you said kids in your state can be left at home alone but you said they're locked out - that's not right and I think you could call anonymously childrens services. When they say their mother is sleeping - is she a shift worker?

It's nice to be kind and helpful like you are, but summer is coming and I foresee you might be taken advantage of. What do the kids eat and where do they go to the bathroom? Sorry you're in the awkward position.

perpetuallysad, you have a big heart. Good luck.

[perpetuallysad]

I end up feeding them about 60% of the time and I honestly don't know about using the bathroom. The boy is pretty timid, so he wouldn't ask to go here. He's the only one that gets locked outside. For some reason they don't seem to lock the girl out. Who knows? And yes, pach, I see the connections, but they are frustrating.

The mother came over about 5:30 this evening and made a big to-do about apologizing for me taking care of the boy and said that "he knew he could wake me up" and went on and on about working late (she's a waitress), blah, blah I have very little respect for her. Anyway, the cut was still bleeding at 5:30. It happened around 9:30 this morning. She said she got her husband to bring his emt kit home (from the squad car) and he cleaned the wound and re-wrapped it, but it was still bleeding at that point. So I came inside and got this second skin type bandage stuff and told her to use that. It could have successfully gotten stitches this am, but after waiting so long the skin flap was dying and I'm fairly sure stitches would be effective now. I'm also worried about infection because the glass is dirty.

[NuckingFutz]

I am so sorry you are having to go through all this. I would have called EMS after the kid informed you he would have gotten in trouble for waking up the mother. The EMS crew would have treated the boys wound. Found the boy locked out of his own house watched by a neighbor who wasn't asked to watch him. They could have gotten the info from the kid with you there about his life. They would have had to make a report. You said CPS won't investigate if they are fed. They need to know these kids are being neglected. What if you are not home all day? Screw the dad, cops break the law too. Bet there is physical abuse going on there too. Why not let them swim just once and look for marks. These are some bad breaders you live next to. I am glad you are there for the kids though. Another example of a liar...kids are scared seeing themselves bleed but even more afraid of asking mom for medical help? Sure they haven't been physically abused?

I would behave like a parent towards them and if they play up ie the girl being nasty to the boys I would ask her to come inside the house for a bit and talk to her pointing out how its not nice to behave the way she is.

If the mother does not like it then she can get out of bed and sort it out herself.

[bmx35]

These children may not feel neglected now but it is much possible that when they grow up and become more aware, they would actually resent their parents realizing that they were neglected as children. The little girl seems to be acting out her frustrations already by being mean. It is unfortunate for children to be in such condition. I appreciate your care for them even though they are not your children. The real parents though need to take more active responsibility and if an external agency (like social welfare) is needed to remind them of this, then it has to be done.

[perpetuallysad]

That's a good point, NF. And I seriously know that cops break the law, I've had friends who were cops and well... this dude is very proud of his copness. I am very uncomfortable with letting them swim in the pool. Its just too dangerous and too anxiety invoking for me to deal with it.

I wouldn't let them swim in my pool either (if I had one lol) what if something happened to them !

It is also good of you to feed them, can you start a diary of times they are out and times you feed them ?

Maybe with some type of written work they may believe you if you report them.

You are commended for caring, perpetuallysad,

[lynn P.]

I think it''s totally kind of you to help these children and feed them, but it's not fair to you and your family. You're not their babysitter and their mother shouldn't be sleeping while they're awake. This is neglect. Plus can you afford to feed 2 more kids and watch them all summer? I think you need to set some boundaries and they shouldn't come over unless they're invited.

[perpetuallysad]

I'm doing my best. I have made strict rules about them coming over. At least, I don't allow them in the house very often. Part of it is my son is extremely sweet and generous, so when he gets a snack, he takes one for everyone, same thing for waters, etc. I don't want to discourage generosity. Ug, I don't know. I have an ear infection on top of everything right now, so I am tired and sicky feeling, so none of this may make any sense. And no, I really cannot afford to feed 2 more kids and I most definitely don't want the responsibility. I am manic at the moment and the added stuff has my anxiety levels (which are always high) to levels that even my regular doses of xanax don't touch.

I'll write something more coherent tomorrow.

This link is to Mississippi Children's Home Services: http://www.mchscares.org/New%20MCHSCARES/contactus.html

There is an 800 number to call. You might benefit by calling to find out what if anything they can do to help you. You might mention it is not your responsibility to care for them, but otherwise the children are left to their own devices. Tell them you want to do this anonymously if that is you wish.

Good luck.

[perpetuallysad]

Thanks for the link Byz. I've searched around for a solution myself, but haven't really found something that applicable in this situation.

That place you mentioned's mission is:

What We Do...
The program is designed for youth between the ages of 6 to 17 who are seriously emotionally disturbed (SED) and who are at risk of being removed from their homes or community based placements and placed in more restrictive placements.
The program offers 24 hours a day, 7 days a week access to highly trained and well supported professional staff who have demonstrated specific competencies in responding to and working with the behaviors associated with SED youth.
This Program is designed to be goal directed and relatively short term with an anticipated length of stay of six months. A youth will be discharged once his/her treatment goals are completed and the family unit is stable enough for withdrawal of services.
We focus on interventions that serve an entire family rather than only an individual within the family unit.
The ultimate goal of the program is to preserve the family and prevent out of home placements, as well as support and maintain family reunification for youth who have been placed outside of their homes and are ready to return.

They seem to work with troubled youth. I don't think either of these kids would fall into that category.

Thank you for helping though, I really appreciate it.

[Junerain]

((((((((((((perpetuallysad)))))))))))))))))))))))

Here's to you and your big heart

[Perna]

I would be inclined to put a non-see-through/blockade fence up on their side of the back yard so they couldn't see the pool, etc. I would lay down rules for playing in my yard and if the girl behaved badly, she could go sit in her yard alone as a "time out". But I'd also find an inexpensive YMCA or something day camp for my son to attend for a week or two to give me a bit of time off with watching kid(s).

Originally Posted by Perna

I would be inclined to put a non-see-through/blockade fence up on their side of the back yard so they couldn't see the pool, etc.

The fence thing was what I was going to suggest. That's got to be pretty awkward sitting in your pool and those 2 kids standing there staring. Obviously you wouldn't want 2 kids in your pool that don't even know how to swim.

You can't put someone's kid in "time out". That could really start a war. But why does it have to be a package deal? If the daughter is being a brat then tell her to go home..tell her why she needs to leave and let the brother can stay. What can the parents say or do? Make you watch both the kids?

[perpetuallysad]

Perna and Mocha, that's EXACTLY what we've been looking at yesterday. I would like to get some sort of bamboo fence or something, right now we only have a chain length, and rather than try to replace that, I want something that can be attached to it that is tall enough. We live in a small town and we looked everywhere available yesterday, so I guess I'll be ordering off of amazon or something.

And we are doing the camp thing. He wants to try the swim team, so they have this 2 week conditioning camp thing to see if he likes it enough to commit to doing it competitively.

Oh Mocha I just read your last paragraph. That actually made me laugh out loud. I guess when I was a kid I always had my brothers and sister with me whenever I played with anyone and they (my friends) always had their siblings with them. I know that if one of my brothers or sister wasn't allowed to play with someone, my mom wouldn't have let me play with that person at all. (My mom is a really, really bad example of good parenting, so I could be totally off base with this whole thing.) I have asked a few people with more than one kid and they all agreed that they most likely wouldn't let one play if the other couldn't. I guess this is mostly to spare the parents the trouble of having the other kid being upset and feeling left out (which I don't want to do to her, but I am so freaking tired of her meanness!). I really feel like whatever I chose I am going to screw this situation up.

[AkAngel]

I think your chances of getting the kids help by calling child services on a cop are remote. I think there is a much better chance that the kids will pay for that call at the hands of their parents.

I keep doing what you're doing (minus the stress), keep treating the kids the way you would want your child treated if somehow you weren't able to take care of him. It sounds like you're doing a great job already - but as a bonus you are awarding yourself massive amounts of stress. Stress is optional.

I find for myself that once I make a decision, stress goes down. It seems like everything you're doing is a guess to you, i.e. "Should I be bandaging him up or should I go wake his mom. I guess I'll bandage him up." If you realize and accept the evidence that they're unskilled and perhaps uncaring parents then you are left deciding whether or not to call child services.

If you agree with me that child servies is a bad idea and will cause even more trouble for the children, then operate from those two conclusions. Bad parents, system fails. Now what do you do? The best you can for the kids. They aren't your responsibility but it sounds like you are willing to do some things for them. Great. Do what you're comfortable with and don't feel guilty over the stuff you aren't comfortable with.

Another thought is this: Talk to the other parents in the neighborhood and enlist them to help you feed and entertain these children. This will do two things. First it will let the children know that there are other people in the world who care about them and second, it will raise many peoples attention to the fact that these children are neglected and while 'you against a cop' in front of child servies may not work, a neighborhood against a cop certainly will.

[QUEEN OF WANDS]

be sure to keep helping those kids.if you dont there is nobody to.get help for them.it is hard emotionally and physically you may not want the children around yours,but be sure to speak with your child privately about the behaviour he is witnessing and why it is happening.10 years down the road you may see these children as young adults and that shy neglected boy just may help some lady across the street because he remembers that not all woman are mean...and everyone should be helpful

[purple_fins]

I guess when I was a kid I always had my brothers and sister with me whenever I played with anyone and they (my friends) always had their siblings with them. I know that if one of my brothers or sister wasn't allowed to play with someone, my mom wouldn't have let me play with that person at all. (My mom is a really, really bad example of good parenting, so I could be totally off base with this whole thing.) I have asked a few people with more than one kid and they all agreed that they most likely wouldn't let one play if the other couldn't. I guess this is mostly to spare the parents the trouble of having the other kid being upset and feeling left out

Wow! I've never thought of it before like this! Seems compassionate to consider all the childrens feelings and not want one child feeling left out. I bet this woman couldn't care less if one kid could play somewhere and the other one couldn't........ she sounds VERY familiar to me (as in-- my mother) It didn't matter to my mother how anything affected us kids...... If one could play somewhere and one couldn't-- then so be it. The idea of togetherness and "family" was never taught. (we didn't play together as siblings anyway...... would ALWAYS turn into competition and then fights) I really don't believe the mother ever considered a little ones feelings.....
I wonder if this mother does?....

I applaud your kindness and caring. I sure can understand though the frustrating part of it all! the mean girl and the neglect and everything.....
I wish you much luck with this difficult situation.

fins

[perpetuallysad]

I really appreciate how kind and thoughtful everyone has been on here. And Akangel, I think you are right. I do need to stop second guessing myself. It's really my MO in most situations. I do something then question why I did it forever. I am naturally a stressed person and worrying about all of this does add to it. If only I could figure out how to not worry about it.

And I have talked to my son. He's aware that leaving them alone and all of that is not acceptable and very unkind and uncaring to the kids. He's very generous and would have them living here if he could. The girl really pushes his buttons though and he gets really upset when he deals with her. I feel badly for him because he's never really played with anyone that is so angry and argumentative. He's a super logical kid and he tries to argue back using his logic, which ends up being really frustrating because she doesn't get his logic, nor does she really care. (I know all of this behavior is from her home life.) My basic rule with him is that he is NOT allowed to engage in arguing with her because she will never back down and usually ends up saying mean things to him. He's supposed to come talk to me when he gets feeling overwhelmed by her. This has helped him cope with her better, but obviously, she still engages arguments with him, even though he attempts to avoid them.

Blah blah blah. Sorry, I have this on my mind a lot so I could bore you all with the details all day. Anyway, I won't abandon them, I'm too sentimental and I see myself in them, so I get sucked in. The problem is that a lot of times when I get sucked into situations like this, I end up getting hurt in some way and, well, that's not fun when its added in with all of my other ****. My pdoc/t says I am a black and white thinker (duh!) and that its all or nothing for me. I have no idea how to care about them some and pull back when it gets too painful or too close. I either cut people off entirely (which is what I do 99.9% of the time) or get way to emotionally invested in them. (Which, ironically, is why I cut people off.)

I AM SHUTTING UP NOW.