why does the state sometimes remove children from parents who are alcoholics?

Why does the state remove kids from a home where the parents are alcoholics even when there is no abuse to the child? Is it because they fear the child might become an alcoholic because they see their parents doing it to cope with life's problems? Or is it they fear emotional abuse/neglect of the child? And why aren't the kids allowed back sometimes even though the parents are sober and in recovery? That happened to me...

This is a pretty serious question with no concrete answer.

In my personal experience, living with an alcoholic creates an atmosphere of instability. You never know from one day to the next what state the person will be in. I think that if a child is raised in that environment they may not be getting the best care they deserve and need. An alcoholic needs to be intoxicated for whatever reason, coping, to feel normal or perhaps not to feel at all and in that case I do not beleive that a child should be exposed to that. I just dont think that it is fair to the child.

I do beleive in second chances. I think that if a person seeks treatment and has been successful for a respectable period of time then I think that based on a review of the case a child should be allowed back in the residence with the parents.

I am sorry if my opinion offends you or anyone else, but I am speaking from first hand experience, being raised in an environment where someone drank heavily.

Both my parents were alcoholics..but sadly the foster homes I was placed in were much worse. I hope I did not trigger anyone, but it just seems so unfair sometimes.

I 2nd that JMO

Speaking from my own experience as well...Children shouldnt have to grow up with alcoholic "parents" when they are not doing any parenting. They are neglecting and emotionally abandoning their children by being intoxicated.

Being a neglectful parent is a form of abuse in the case of an alcoholic parent(s).

Dubz

here in this state children are allowed back if the parent cooperates with the treatment goals set down but the parents arent allows alot of I'll do that tomorrow kind of attitute because this state also has a law stating any open cases that are open 12 months or more automatically the code do not return to parent and in some cases temination of parental rights is done at that time.

Here in this state at the point where the child protective services are called the parents and the intake caseworker (this person is on the case only the first six months then a permanent caseworker is assigned to complete the following months.) sit right then and there working out the first goal sheet. Then within a weeks time the parents have to appear in court to answer to why the children were put in foster care, and whether or not arrest or commitments are pending. At that time they are represented by either their own lawyer or a court appointed one. During that hearing childrens services submits any further goals if need. That parent then has plenty of time to accomplish the goals set down. While the parent is accomplishing their goals, the children are placed in therapy and treatment goals are also worked up for that child.

for example - my son went into care because I was suicidal and self injury in front of my son (consciously I never did but I have memory pieces that do cut and those were rerunning in front of my son). The intake worker came to my house. before she left with my child I knew what I needed to do -

1.Schedule and see primary physician for depression and possible meds
2. schedule intake for therapy.
3. have a comprehensive psychological evaluation

I had goal 1 complete in one day - my family doctor was able to get me in that next day (the same morning that I called him)

Goal number 2 was completed aalso that next day.

goal 3 took longer because childrens servicies was paying for the evaluation so the intake worker not expecting me to be able to get right in with my doctor took care of my sons side of the case first of placement and getting him the items he needed right away his asthma meds and so on. But the testing part of the evaluation was completed within a month, the report didnt get back for 6 months. But between the intake worker and I by the court date (one week after my son being placed in care) I had a date for the psych testing.

The only other goal set before me was during court - I was mandated to follow any and all recommendations made by the testing psychiatrist. Between the date of court and the psych eval I also registered for parenting and anger management classes and entered a depression management class.

The psych eval recommendations - remain in therapy as my therapist designates, medication at my primary physicians discression and attend parenting classes.

By the time his results and recommendations came through I had been on medication and therapy for 6 months, was just completeing the parenting class and the depression management class and starting the anger management class that I wasn't mandated to take.

We were working the coming home process for my son 9 months from the date he was placed. He was home 5 months when the caseworker decided to put him back in to go through a residential treatment program. At that point the case had been open over a year so the day he was placed back in foster care the case coding of do not return automatically was placed on the case. Which basically meant the state could no longer consider anything on my side of the case, and they could no longer require me to do anything. The case now is based on my son and the things they are doing for him

By the way - an alcoholic getting drunk and passing out when there is no other responsible non drinking adult person around to care for the children is abuse called endangering a minor and neglect. Here they are given the chance to get their children back by completing a psych eval, alcohol rehab/awareness classes, and attending therapy. I know alot of parents from when I was working on completing my set goals and visiting with my son that recieved their children back. Any of those that I do know didn't get their children back (and didn't have the caseworker that got fired for harrassment, and breaking state and federal laws to keep the children) are those that basically said f* the goals. Some at the last minute tried to appear doing the work but by then it was too late.

I personally think that the Child Protective Services are completely unorganized, unethical, and odvisouly overwhelmed with the cases they have to deal with.

The reason I say this is because, lets say for example, the situation you mentioned, were the child(ren), are taken from the home, and placed in state custody because the parents are alcoholics. But there were no signs of neglect, abuse of any form, and the children seem fine. Is it more important to take that child(ren) out of the home, and place them in a home, where space is limited, when there are children in a much more dangerous situation?

I know first come first serves seem to be the basis for alot of situations.....but when it comes to children, I think it should be the more severe and odvisouly dangerous situations that come first.

A emotionally neglected child.....or a hungray, beaten, abondened, and sexually, physically, and emotionally abused child.......who comes first, who's most important?

In my opinion......depending on the exact situation of course.......if the child is safe, has the neccesities, and is not abused or neglected in any serious form....then it is not neccesary to take them out of the home, and take the place a ,cast away and, hurt child's much needed space.

That's just me.......my opinion, no offense to anybody of course.
Desirae

here they dont go by first come first served. since there is a time limit of one year most cheldren that are able to go home are already in the coming home cyle by 8-12 months. So though this state doen't have alot of extra they do have a set amount of funds, the same amount for each case designated for various catagories like therapy, clothing, and so on. This agency here is really good at getting what the children need and alot of times what they want. my son left with one weeks worth of clothes and a couple items from here and he came home with 6 - 30 gallon rubbermaid containers of clothing alone, 3 more of toys, and 2 more with miscelanious keepsakes. plus there was enough left over from his case for the caseworker to buy a new bed, mattress, sheet set and comforter, pillow. a dining room table and chair set, towels, dish towels and some other house hold things for me. The state is able to do this here because of the deadline date makes sure children dont remain in care unless absolutely necessary. I do agree though foster care of bouncing from place to place has done damage to my child. He has been threated of death by an older child (when that happened they moved my son to a better place) I dont know much about the therapeutic foster homes he is in when not in the facilities. But the onle he was in for 9 months the first time he was in care was fantastic and my son loved them so much he wanted contact with them after he came home but the caseworker and the foster parents told him no because they wanted him to accept me again as his primary caretaker and parent.

Many times alcohol becomes the main focus in an alcoholics life including over the needs of their children. That is not in the childs best interest and until the parent can provide an environment of stability and attention it may prove to be benenficial to place them the children in another envioronment. I believe that once the parents prove they are committed to remaining alcohol free I think they should be given the chance to reunite their family. I hope that your family is soon reunited and sorry that it has occurred to you. Good luck.

JMO...I cannot agree with you more. I grew up with alcoholic parents. I used to always compare the households of the other children with whom I played. I used to think..."What's wrong with our family"? "Why Do the other kids treat me differently"? "Why are my parents more focused on drinking than on taking me out to ballgames...etc?" "Why can't I bring my friends into the house?" "Why can't my friend spend the night at my house?"

"Why do my cousins and Aunts & Uncles look down on me....and give me THAT LOOK!!!!!

"And what about the risk of driving with them in our car?"Kids are not stupid!! What about a drunk friend of theirs' coming over and then refusing to leave after "hitting" on my mother!!? (I stood ustairs with a baseball bat. If he did not leave ..I was going to come down the stairs-swingin'!!)

There is NO innocence in alcoholism!! IMHO!!

I would have to say for the safety of the CHILD.... for there are many other ways to destroy a child's life / mind than with physical or sexual abuse.

LoVe,
Rhapsody -

True, Rhapsody. As an alcoholic it's hard to take care of yourself, nevermind innocent children. Say one day you just get too drunk and pass out on the couch, leaving your 5 year old to fend for herself. Lots of horrible things could happen in just that scenerio, even though none of them included physical/emotional abuse.

I can't agree with you more Rhapsody. I wish someone would've helped me out of the alcoholic home sooner..... when it finally happened, I stayed with my dad and it didn't make me much happier, but at least he had a job and was sober, altho emotional and sometimes physical abusive (not sexual), I have always wondered what it would be like if someone would've seen me, tried to understand and listen ...give me a voice. Then I wouldn't have to struggle like this. I hope no one in an alcoholic home will be neglected. Not the kids.....and not the alcoholics either. They all need help.
/hazeleyes

I'm a recovering alcoholic, and I would not have wanted to live with me when I was actively drinking. I also wouldn't want to live with me now, still being in my first year of sobriety and learning about myself and how to live. I don't have any kids so I can't say what kind of parent I would have been in my drinking days. I would hope that I'd be a functioning parent, since I was pretty much a functioning employee and member of society, but there were times that I blacked out and who knows what would have happened to kids had I had them. I know for me, the recovery process is long and consumes every part of me. I can understand there being a period of time before children are placed back with their parents after they've started the recovery process. However, I do believe that the foster homes are in many ways much worse. The whole system needs reforming in my opinion. Are you at least allowed contact with your parents? I wish the system was doing better for you. We're here for you!

Kim - I think the problem you describe is more an issue with the foster care system in this country rather than with CPS. I've heard TOO TOO many stories of abuse while in foster care. Of course, there are great foster parents out there, but there are way too many lousy ones.

Take care. I hope life is better for you now.

em

I'm a fortysomething gal now but I still suffer in some ways from what happened...it's hard for me to form attachments and trust other people, even when it's for my own good...and holidays are horrible with no real family to celebrate with..my staff says 'well make your peers like family' which is hard to do because some of them struggle with their own illness issues such as being emotionally 'flat'(my roommate, due to his schizophrenia) and their own problems...some days when I come home from college I am so stressed out, I try to talk with roomie but because of his illness and being hard of hearing he does not 'get' it...I want to cry sometimes. I feel so alone....and I feel no-one understands or even believes that I struggle with feeling unappreciated, unloved, and unwanted sometimes.

((((((((((((((((((((((Kimthecatlover)))))))))))))))))))))))))))

I was also raised in an alcoholic home - in my case my father. I was blessed with a wonderful mother but my father was also very violent when drinking and physically abused my mother to the point of almost killing her once. This was back in the day where no one ever spoke about alcoholism, no support groups, etc. Also no abused women's shelters.

My father never abused me - but he totally ignored me. I was terrified of him because of his violence so tried the best I could to keep out of his way. I would pull the covers over my head in bed at night and put my fingers in my ears to try to not hear my mother pleading with my father to stop hitting her, and the sounds of slapping. I know living in that situation has impacted my life negatively.

As far as the Department of Family and Children in this state I know they have extremely high caseloads. I used to interface with the caseworkers sometimes when I worked for Hospice. I thought my caseload was heavy at about 30 patients or so, but the state caseworkers average around 100!!!! I'm surprised ANYTHING gets done.

Whether being an alcoholic or living with one and all that entails is a sad situation all the way around.

They tended to put me with really nasty or super strict foster parents....one of which never allowed me to dress like other teenagers dressed or listen to 'sinful' popular music...The best thing that happened to me as a teenager was living in a group home from 1977 to 1980 where I could be a normal teenager and get help dealing with why I was taken from my parents, and only having to go back to the strict foster home on holidays. I honestly think NJ DYFS needs to teach foster parents, especially older parents, that YOUTH CULTURE is not all bad and to let teens dress they way they want to WITHIN REASON, and listen to rock music, and do safe and healthy fun things that their peers do....I wasn't allowed to attend concerts either, those foster homes were so overprotective...

I wonder if they fear that the child, in this case me, would be 'influenced' to become an alcoholic or other type of addict...because of maladaptive coping skills possibly learned in the home?

I don't think having LOVING foster parents matters to state child protective services(DYFS) in New Jersey...which saddens me.