[restudent]

Hi,

You guys have such good advice. Can you help me here?

My daughter had limited therapy for a phobia and quit after a few sessions when it was resolved. Then I took my son for social skills and ADHD two years ago. It has been wonderful for him. He doesn't need medicine anymore as he learned to handle his impulsiveness through the techniques. He loves the therapist and the therapist clearly is very fond of him, too. I went to some of the sessions as requested, and after a few months, the therapist noted my stress. Eventually I started going to him separately and it has helped me a lot. I have found my way through big life changes and thrived with his help.

I am grateful but there is tension between the therapist and me when it is just us that is not there when my son is there, probably because we both love my son. I annoy him and he seems to be hot and cold on me but not on my son; he is always warm with him, and it is so helpful. Anyway, I want to stop going to therapy but want my son to keep going. This therapist is very good but he can get angry quickly over things with me and I am sure he will be mad about this. If I stop therapy, I am afraid he will not want my son to go there since I will have to drive him. If I can't do it so my son can stay, I will stay myself. I know that sounds crazy but I learn from the therapy even if I don't love the situation. I won't go elsewhere; I just will be done.

Anyone been through this? Any ideas on how to manage it?

What do I say?

Thank you for your advice.

[growlycat]

Can you ask the T to refer you to someone else for your own therapy? You can be blunt that you feel that T has a bias towards your son and that it would be best if you saw someone else.

[restudent]

Originally Posted by growlycat

Can you ask the T to refer you to someone else for your own therapy? You can be blunt that you feel that T has a bias towards your son and that it would be best if you saw someone else.

Thank you for your reply! I didn't phrase it well, it seems. I apologize. I don't think it is a bias toward my son. He and I both love my son. I just annoy the therapist sometimes. At times he is very, very complimentary but then he gets irritable with me like when he says my body language shows I am still bothered by things with my former husband. I have no idea how to stop that and I think that if he wouldn't bring it up, I'd be fine.

I have ADHD issues I still will work on but I feel capable enough. I don't want to go to any therapist now, but I feel pretty sure he will be offended since he thinks I need to check in with him every two weeks and then won't want me to bring my son to him. And my son likes him so much and has done so well with him that I just can't do that.

How do I say, "I think I'm good even if you don't and I'm sick of you getting irritated with me and then me doing the same to you--I could have stayed married if I enjoyed that--but please still see my son and me when I bring him." Like that?

Thank you for replying! I really appreciate it.

[growlycat]

I think you can just be honest with him and say that you are willing to see him regarding your son but you do not want to pursue your own therapy at this time.

Sounds like your son is being helped by this-I doubt your T would drop him.

[tinyrabbit]

Are you sure he's annoyed with you?

[Favorite Jeans]

Is it worth bringing it up with the therapist?
Eg "sometimes I get the feeling that you're annoyed with me. Are you? When you say X I feel like you're impatient/irritable/whatever. Also I get the feeling that you'd be angry or stop seeing son if I terminated therapy with you. What are your thoughts about that?"
I think it's inappropriate for him to be angry with you or make you feel like you can't stop whenever you want to. But I also think it would be helpful to have him say that in so many words. Sometimes we attribute our own issues to our Ts and we need to give them a chance to say what is really going on for them. But of course sometimes they really are working out their own issues on us...
Could you print out your post or this thread and share it with him?

[FeelTheBurn]

I was thinking that this was just a matter of chemistry, a bad fit, until I read this:

How do I say, "I think I'm good even if you don't and I'm sick of you getting irritated with me and then me doing the same to you--I could have stayed married if I enjoyed that--but please still see my son and me when I bring him."

This made me think, hmm, maybe a little bit of transference? Not the colloquial "I'm in love with my therapist" kind, but the classic, projecting feelings about someone onto your therapist kind. Is it possible that at times the therapist reminds you of your ex-husband, even a little? Like, you both care about your son, and when focused on him all is fine, but individually, you feel his judgement and ambivalence. Sometimes he feels well-disposed toward you, but you sense at other times the same kind of irritation and opposition you felt with your ex. And he makes the observation that your body language shows you have unresolved feelings about your ex.

It sounds like it might be transference, i.e. you are replicating your relationship with your ex-husband in your individual therapy sessions. And it sounds like your T might be thinking that same thing. That is a potential gold mine to explore with the therapist, if you are so inclined. Obviously, if it's just too much, stop your individual appointments. The therapist will not punish your son for it, if he's any kind of therapist at all (and he sounds like he's a professional).

But if I were your friend, I would urge you to tell him what you've told us, and be open to exploring those feelings. It could lead to some really useful and healing work. Just a thought. (and congratulations on being a caring parent and getting your kids the help they need to live healthier lives--you sound like a great mom!)

[restudent]

Originally Posted by growlycat

I think you can just be honest with him and say that you are willing to see him regarding your son but you do not want to pursue your own therapy at this time.

Sounds like your son is being helped by this-I doubt your T would drop him.

You are very kind. Thank you. As you said, the therapist is good to and for my son so it makes sense that he wouldn't dump him just because I leave.

Thank you again. I wish you well.

[restudent]

Originally Posted by tinyrabbit

Are you sure he's annoyed with you?

Hi, and thank you for replying. I am always amazed at the kindness of people on this board to help others figure out solutions to problems.

Yes, I am sure he gets annoyed with me or at least that is how it manifests itself to me. For example, he asks how things are with my former spouse and I say OK, that I try not to get drawn into the former spouse's arguments. Then he shakes his head and says he can tell from how I look that it bothers me and that it drives him crazy and makes him mad that I still let the former spouse get to me. We talked about how I sometimes act as though I feel I am inferior and he says that it is ridiculous that I still feel that way. He isn't being mean; he is exasperated and irritated.

I have made incredible progress in all these areas and he knows and sees that. I don't even bring these areas up because I am working on them and making great progress. To me, they are small blips now. I think it will take time.

He does not get exapserated or irritated with my son regardless. I am not complaining about that and I am not in any upset or jealous about that. My kids are everything to me so I am very, very glad about it.

It is just that the therapist and I get on each other's nerves. I get irritated when he gets snappy like that since I'm telling him the truth about whatever he asks (at least as I see it since who knows what distortions I may have and not realize it) and I follow his suggestions and have used them to improve my life a thousand percent.

I can see, though, that it is annoying when a person continues a bad thing when you have told them how to avoid it. I feel that way with my kids at times, and with myself.

It's not that the therapist is mean or bad; he is kind but truthful, smart, and many good things. I don't see how it helps him or me to do these kinds of tense exchanges. I am not explaining it well but it just is something about me, not about everyone.

When my son is in the room with us, we all get along beautifully, probably since we are concentrating on my son although many topics address me as well as part of the family. The therapist and I joke and laugh then--to each other, too, not just to and with my son--, and he never is irritable with me then nor I with him. It's something about me personally--and I am too childish not to get irritated myself! Funny world.

It's not a big drama but I worry that saying I am going will make him really irritable and he won't let my son continue to go. I will have to drive him there and part of it is me in the room so that is why I worry more. Maybe I should just ride it out. Of course, maybe he will be relieved but I think more likely he will be offended.

If you see things I am missing and have time, please let me know.

I can't see a good way to do this so appreciate your views. I won't get irritated, I promise. I know I have faults I can't see.

[restudent]

Originally Posted by FeelTheBurn

I was thinking that this was just a matter of chemistry, a bad fit, until I read this:


This made me think, hmm, maybe a little bit of transference? Not the colloquial "I'm in love with my therapist" kind, but the classic, projecting feelings about someone onto your therapist kind. Is it possible that at times the therapist reminds you of your ex-husband, even a little? Like, you both care about your son, and when focused on him all is fine, but individually, you feel his judgement and ambivalence. Sometimes he feels well-disposed toward you, but you sense at other times the same kind of irritation and opposition you felt with your ex. And he makes the observation that your body language shows you have unresolved feelings about your ex.

It sounds like it might be transference, i.e. you are replicating your relationship with your ex-husband in your individual therapy sessions. And it sounds like your T might be thinking that same thing. That is a potential gold mine to explore with the therapist, if you are so inclined. Obviously, if it's just too much, stop your individual appointments. The therapist will not punish your son for it, if he's any kind of therapist at all (and he sounds like he's a professional).

But if I were your friend, I would urge you to tell him what you've told us, and be open to exploring those feelings. It could lead to some really useful and healing work. Just a thought. (and congratulations on being a caring parent and getting your kids the help they need to live healthier lives--you sound like a great mom!)

Hi, and thank you very much for your reply. I appreciate it so much because I know you all have many things to do and here you are taking time to help a stranger. Thank you!

I have learned not to dismiss anything out of hand since it often is me not seeing the truth so I thought carefully about what you wrote here.

I’ve read more than I wish I had about transference and have thought again here if that is what it is but he is in no way like my former husband or my father. If he were, I would not returned after the first session. I have learned that lesson at least. He is the opposite of them and is like the people I appreciate and like in my life since I became an adult, same kinds of politics, values, humor, compassion, etc. My husband and father are very similar to each other (did I see that then? Noooo.) and very dissimilar to me (also did not see that then. Alas.).

Our interactions are not like mine with my former husband even over my son, either. (Not arguing--just reflecting.) The therapist is genuinely concerned about my son and genuinely appreciates him. My former husband has until very recently only focused on my son’s faults and how my son is just like me (why is that not a good thing, I ask you? Kidding.).

You are entirely right about these things: “You feel his judgment and ambivalence. Sometimes he feels well-disposed toward you, but you sense at other times the same kind of irritation and opposition you felt with your ex. And he makes the observation that your body language shows you have unresolved feelings about your ex.”

Oh, yes, the irritation and judgment feel the same and I don’t want to be around that anymore, for sure. The reasons for it are different since the therapist has never expected me to be his maid or chef and doesn’t criticize me nonstop--not even for 50 minutes!

So—oh, Lord, I hope not—do you mean I need to come to terms with that? Couldn’t I just head for the hills? Seriously: That is a good thing to do?

I am not arguing but am asking to know: Does it matter that I still am angry at my former husband? I am but I think it will dissipate with time and distance. I only feel that way now when I see him and have to hear more than two sentences from him. That may be why the therapist is irritated?

On transference in general...Once a long time ago, I brought up transference since—well, of course since I must make things more complicated than they need to be—I find him attractive since he IS like the other people I like in my life and naturally he looks like the type of man I find attractive and anyone who loves my kids looks better to me than George Clooney does even. Let me note that although I never intend to date again, I have other people in my life who have the same attributes as the therapist, and who never even get irritated with me. Unless George Clooney drops in and says he adores my amazing kids, I'm done with that!

I said I read about it and that I don’t think I have it and for him to please tell me if it seemed like I did since the last thing I want is to recreate some former spouse/father thing. Have I not suffered enough? Anyway, he got irritated, turned around, and said, “What are you talking about?! Where did you read about that? Of course it’s not and I am not interested! It is not appropriate. We have a professional relationship.” I will need to rest up before I bring that up again.

Still, though, what you said has made ME think. Maybe it’s a form of it and maybe I CAN find a good way to bring it up and work through and around it. And if not, I can just go since I feel better about him not dropping my son. He is a professional, just one with an irritating/irritable client.

You guys will need to send me a bill for all this insight.

Thank you so much.

P.S. You say “If I were your friend” but you FEEL like a friend for helping me. Thank you for that and for saying I seem like a good mom; I try my hardest at that, as I know you and everyone else here tries hard to be a good mom or dad.

[restudent]

Originally Posted by Favorite Jeans

Is it worth bringing it up with the therapist?
Eg "sometimes I get the feeling that you're annoyed with me. Are you? When you say X I feel like you're impatient/irritable/whatever. Also I get the feeling that you'd be angry or stop seeing son if I terminated therapy with you. What are your thoughts about that?"
I think it's inappropriate for him to be angry with you or make you feel like you can't stop whenever you want to. But I also think it would be helpful to have him say that in so many words. Sometimes we attribute our own issues to our Ts and we need to give them a chance to say what is really going on for them. But of course sometimes they really are working out their own issues on us...
Could you print out your post or this thread and share it with him?

Hi! Thank you for your reply. I am so grateful for all of this excellent insight.

The words you use sound so good; I think they could work. I'm going to memorize them. They sound positive and nothing anyone could be irritated over.

I do better writing things but he says I need to say it and that I should write for myself.

With your input and all of the other replies here, I feel new hope that this can get resolved with a positive outcome.

I can't thank you and everyone else here enough.

I wish you the best!

[unaluna]

I don't like him commenting on your "body language". That's intrusive and kind of bullying. It doesnt let you speak for yourself, literally. And that's what I would tell him is one of the reasons you are not going to see him anymore. The fact the he insists in you giving him is reasons is another one. I think you are entitled to be treated as kindly as your son is being treated. That's how my t treats me. I too have had enough of mean treatment. Enough to last a lifetime.

[restudent]

Originally Posted by hankster

I don't like him commenting on your "body language". That's intrusive and kind of bullying. It doesnt let you speak for yourself, literally. And that's what I would tell him is one of the reasons you are not going to see him anymore. The fact the he insists in you giving him is reasons is another one. I think you are entitled to be treated as kindly as your son is being treated. That's how my t treats me. I too have had enough of mean treatment. Enough to last a lifetime.

I am again so appreciative of the different views you all share with me! Are you sure you are all not therapists, too?

What you said here gives me more to think about and assimilate as I figure out what to say and do, and how to address it. I hope for a positive result whatever that is!

I am SO GLAD that you are done with mean treatment; no one needs that and sometimes we don't recognize it. At least I haven't at times. It is very different than how it is with my former husband. This feels rooted in concern for me, maybe, rather than rooted in the surety that I am a bad human being.

I don't feel he intends to be mean to me, more that I get under his skin and then that gets under my skin. I don't think I am saying that to excuse bad behavior as I used to do in my marriage but maybe I am so I am going to think hard about it all with all these new insights. It is helping!

Thank you so much for your help! I appreciate it! I am so glad you have a therapist who treats you well. You and everyone else--me, too--deserve that.